Small game - Return of Werewolf Xtreme (Game over! Result in Post 401)

[JAG]

You suddenly feel much safer.

The werewolves have been eliminated. The village wins!

[Shoveler]

Originally Posted by JAG

You suddenly feel much safer.

The werewolves have been eliminated. The village wins!

told you there would be a disappointment.. but nobody would listen.

[timmae]

wait, what? well played vets!

[JAG]

Your cast of characters (though except for one, there won't be too many surprises):

1. Grover - villager
2. timmae - hunter
3. Shoveler - werewolf
4. The Jackal - seer
5. mysfit - villager
6. cheekimonk - sorceror
7. britrock - villager
8. Chief Rum - werewolf
9. Autumn - priest

[mysfit]

Brit?

[cheekimonk]

I was the sorcerer. I figured when I couldn't muster any support for my counter-claim that one of the wolves had already gone down.

[JAG]

Brit did some nice guessing here:

Small game - Return of WW Xtreme

[timmae]

w'sup chief?!

[mysfit]

The wolves killed their own?

Seems like a pretty risky gamble and clearly one that didn't work out too well

[JAG]

I don't think I've ever seen a village as dialed into the wolves on Day 1 as this one was.

[cheekimonk]

Yeah, that's strange! As the sorcerer it certainly didn't help me.

[mysfit]

Thank you for running this and letting me play!

[Shoveler]

The play made sense if we could get past day 2 and I could find the seer which I had. Unfortunately jackal scanned me, but I think I made a compelling argument against him..

Was really hoping for everyone to pile on me this morning so I could use the argument that everyone thinks I am evil so that must be wrong.. but timmae changed his tune and cheeki never voted for me.

[Shoveler]

My only option if we had lynched jackal was to NK cheeki though to try and clear myself going into day 3.. was going to be a mess if it had worked.

[JAG]

It was definitely unconventional. This isn't the only game where it's happened, but it might be the first game where the only player the wolves killed was a wolf. If they had killed Autumn, things might've been interesting, though the other player being discussed to kill was cheekimonk.

It also hurt that both wolves and the sorcerer piled onto the player that Jackal had a N0 scan of as villager. I believe that helped guide his scan / vote to some degree.

[timmae]

lol, I thought for sure mys was hinting seer. That's why I moved... then jackal went for it. Nice play there my friend!

Thanks for running this jag!

[mysfit]

Jacked by a wolf again

[JAG]

mysfit, nicely played game by the way, you were really dialed into the evil folks. Hope you stick around.

[mysfit]

Originally Posted by JAG

mysfit, nicely played game by the way, you were really dialed into the evil folks. Hope you stick around.

My playing style is no doubt going to annoy some folks but I have fun with it

[mysfit]

Originally Posted by timmae

lol, I thought for sure mys was hinting seer. That's why I moved... then jackal went for it. Nice play there my friend!

Thanks for running this jag!

No, I wasn't trying to hint that

I moved so we had a 3 way tie with Autumn off by himself

I wanted to see how people would move their votes

[timmae]

Originally Posted by mysfit

No, I wasn't trying to hint that

I moved so we had a 3 way tie with Autumn off by himself

I wanted to see how people would move their votes

Yeah, figured that out now. I'm a bit slow in game though.

[Autumn]

lol, chief and shoveler that is a ballsy move in a nine player game, holy shit

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Autumn

lol, chief and shoveler that is a ballsy move in a nine player game, holy shit

Seriously.

[The Jackal]

Thanks for running, JAG! I can't recall if I've ever been the seer before.. if so it has been a long time.

[Shoveler]

Trial by fire i guess

[The Jackal]

Like I was saying, the potential for VERY interesting scenarios in this game

[cheekimonk]

Originally Posted by Autumn

lol, chief and shoveler that is a ballsy move in a nine player game, holy shit

If I had known, no way I play that counter the way I did. The only shot I had was if both wolves were still around and, with brit seemingly cleared, I thought they had to be because Chief couldn't be wolf. My last gasp was to draw the lynch to me but the Shoveler boat had sailed and there were too few votes to make it a fight.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Like I was saying, the potential for VERY interesting scenarios in this game

Yes, the first version of this rule set had Danny fake reveal as a wolf. I love that it allows for a lot of different possibilities to consider and possible fake reveals. And unlike a normal game, it's harder to sort out the fake reveal because you don't even know if you guessed right or not.

[mysfit]

If you are a player who ends up wolf, and tend to attract early games scans, then I can see trying something risky like this.

Go out on your terms trying to help your team

[cheekimonk]

Funny thing, Shoveler really was my N0 clear so technically I wasn't lying. I just knew he wasn't the seer...no idea on the wolf bit until Jackal revealed.

[Narcizo]

Well that was interesting. Fun idea to night kill a wolf but the margins weren't there. Sort of made Jackal as the seer as he seemed to be steering from Brit a bit too much. Dunno if I would have had enough confidence to make the night kill on that one though.

[Grover]

Go team village!

[Autumn]

Drawing out the priest and sacrificing a wolf is an interesting play. If it had worked, if I had revealed and been night killed no one could ever have proven it happened. Trouble is it doesn't necessarily help the lone wolf left, they can't get any credit for bussing a wolf, for instance. But it's the sort of crazy play I thought these kind of rulesets could promote, so nice work!

[The Jackal]

I was definitely concerned that if there were two wolves left and we lynched Shoveler, that they'd avoid NKing me to make me look like i lied and we might've ended up losing with no role reveals. I was prepared to counter that, and maybe people would've seen through it - but would've made for interesting endgame. Autumn to the rescue.

[cheekimonk]

So, for my future reference (since I'm still learning the game) as sorcerer I pretty much HAD to counter Jackal's claim, right? If I let it go, everyone has to buy his claim, and no wolf is going to counter him. Best case people believe me not Jackal. Acceptable case is people lynch me somehow.

[Chief Rum]

It was a brilliant scheme. And it woulda worked, too, if it wasn't for those crazy kids!!!

Way to sniff it out, guys.

I think the issue we had is that, for whatever reason, Shoveler draws attention from the village as a potential wolf. It was disappointing to see after my "reveal", everyone move to Shoveler as the new option with britrock (thanks for saving us there, brit!).

The idea was to pretty much make it impossible for the priest to come out and sound legit. That didn't work out, unfortunately, because no one really bought Shoveler as a villager. I don't think that was a play thing, but more a meta "Shoveler seems like a wolf" thing. Reminds me abit of the impression Lathum was always a wolf (back when he played).

With The Jackal choosing to scan Shoveler that first night, we were more or less toast. The plan really depended on getting through Night Two at least without Shoveler being discovered.

It was definitely a longer odds play, and I wouldn't have suggested it to Shoveler if I hadn't been up for the lynch. But it was fun to try!

Thanks for the game, JAG! Pretty much the easiest game for a moderator to run ever!

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by cheekimonk

So, for my future reference (since I'm still learning the game) as sorcerer I pretty much HAD to counter Jackal's claim, right? If I let it go, everyone has to buy his claim, and no wolf is going to counter him. Best case people believe me not Jackal. Acceptable case is people lynch me somehow.

That's what I woulda done, I think.

Obviously, it would have been better if you had found him before and revealed him yourself.

That would have been the fun reveal. "I'm the Sorcerer... and The Jackal is the Seer!!"

Then the village gets to decide if they will lynch you or not, and the wolves sharpen their knives to prepare to kill the seer.

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by mysfit

Brit?

Hey hey!

[britrock88]

Pretty weird to be a N0 clear, take the D1 lynch in the wolves' stead, be able to finger 2/3 evil, and maybe somehow contribute to the village figuring this one out?

Good job, team!

[britrock88]

(Heck, double-cleared after Autumn checked me.)

[britrock88]

And yeah, I'm of the mind that the N1 play could have worked out well if Chief's wolf buddy wasn't already drawing attention. Could have made for a confused/conflicted real priest, some incorrect inferences by players in subsequent days, so on.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Drawing out the priest and sacrificing a wolf is an interesting play. If it had worked, if I had revealed and been night killed no one could ever have proven it happened. Trouble is it doesn't necessarily help the lone wolf left, they can't get any credit for bussing a wolf, for instance. But it's the sort of crazy play I thought these kind of rulesets could promote, so nice work!

Out of curiosity, how long were you going to wait to reveal as priest if Jackal hadn't come out and say you weren't in any voting danger? (though you were of course)

[Narcizo]

Originally Posted by cheekimonk

So, for my future reference (since I'm still learning the game) as sorcerer I pretty much HAD to counter Jackal's claim, right? If I let it go, everyone has to buy his claim, and no wolf is going to counter him. Best case people believe me not Jackal. Acceptable case is people lynch me somehow.

The Sorcerer in this ruleset is probably the hardest role in any game I know. I was the sorcerer in the last game and honestly, what can you do? If you clear someone you might be clearing a villager, finger someone they might be a wolf. The best you can hope to do is cause FUD and try to make sure your lynched rather than night killed.

In this case Jackal was solid on his reveal. On your part I think clearing Shoveler was probably unnecessary and suspect. Honestly though I don't even think Hoops would be able to turn the village on Jackal in this particular case. You were on a sinking ship.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by cheekimonk

So, for my future reference (since I'm still learning the game) as sorcerer I pretty much HAD to counter Jackal's claim, right? If I let it go, everyone has to buy his claim, and no wolf is going to counter him. Best case people believe me not Jackal. Acceptable case is people lynch me somehow.

It's rough being sorcerer when you don't know the wolves. Claiming there was a good move, especially since I was convinced we had already found the sorcerer, so if the game hadn't ended we would have lynched you and wasted a day.

I think often the best move for a sorcerer though is to be ahead of the curve and reveal before anyone else. IN a ruleset like this finding the seer and revealing it can be good. But if you fake claim and call a wolf hit, you can waste two days of lynches and possibly give the wolves the win.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by JAG

Out of curiosity, how long were you going to wait to reveal as priest if Jackal hadn't come out and say you weren't in any voting danger? (though you were of course)

I figured I would reveal the next day. I didn't seem to be in danger of being night killed since i had drawn some heat, and didn't really have any info to pass along yet. When Jackal revealed I still was going to wait, as it seemed the vote was going to go well, and I figured the wolves thought they had killed the priest.

[Narcizo]

Originally Posted by Autumn

I think often the best move for a sorcerer though is to be ahead of the curve and reveal before anyone else. IN a ruleset like this finding the seer and revealing it can be good. But if you fake claim and call a wolf hit, you can waste two days of lynches and possibly give the wolves the win.

You just have to make sure that your wolf hit isn't an actual wolf. That's what makes it hard to play - the uncertainty.

The thing I tried to do was survive to day three and try to get some prompt as to whether there are two wolves - some sort of fake scan. If there are two wolves then you self vote. Unfortunately in that game my wolf read was way off and one of them had been lynched, and I had benn voting for the other wolf all game.

[mysfit]

FUD?

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by mysfit

FUD?

Fear-Uncertainty-Doubt

[mysfit]

thank you