werewolf LIV! Terror at the country club (GAME OVER WOLVES WIN)

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Even if Neon is the convert, there are a couple of possibilities:

1) bodyguard block
2) his tray did something useful

I'm having a hard time imagining the wolves NOT going after Neon last night, BUT in the last game Barkeep described going after Lathum the day he revealed as a "ballsy play" so there may be some people who see it differently.

At any rate I'd like to hear from Neon about his night before casting my vote.

What if RPI was the target and we killed him anyways in a lynch?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

Guys, I didn't use the serving tray.

I am NOT the convert. The Bodyguard must have successfully blocked the attack.

I have the Golf Club and the Serving Tray now.

You guys can feel free to lynch me. I'll probably pass these along to whoever wants it.

Well, that's not convincing.

vote Neon_Chaos
vote nightfall

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Not a bad idea. If you are telling the truth you've outed yourself. If we vote you, you can prove your powers by voting out NC and you've become a friend to the villagers for a bit. You're obviously a person of interest now too, like NC was and it bit him in the ass.

A few possibilies

1) We all vote for NC
a)He's a wolf, yay for us
b)He's a villegar, we've reduced our numbers again
**********This is where it gets fun***************
2) We all vote for Daddy Torgo
a)He is who he says he is and changes votes to NC.
b)He's lying as well and we've killed a wolf
3) We vote for someone else which I don't think is an option

Now, I like #2 myself. Say DaddyTorgo is also lying and he's a wolf. We basically killed another villager (NC) by voting for him and have no way to prove that Torgo is who he says he is. He's already saying he's a certain character so it's kind of out there already. We have nothing to lose by voting for DT because if he's telling the truth we still kill NC. If he's lying he gets lynched himself and we can all at least vote for Neon the next day.

I'm not saying I think Neon is innocent. He lied and obviously got busted for it big time but now we can someone else for sure in daddy torgo and we could possibly still find out who NC is...

stupid near the bottom post

[MrBug708]

vote - daddytorgo

Use your powers before you're eventually eaten

[EagleFan]

If DT was a wolf I'm not sure that he would be asking us to vote him out,unless that whole reverse psychology comes into play and then he would think that we wouldn't but if we were thinking that then we wouldn't which would be just what he wanted which means that.... uh, nevermind...

[st.cronin]

I would rather DT save his ability. It may be needed later.

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by Crim

Oh. this makes more snese than what I was thinking. I just thought he was a wolf, but it would make more sense your way. Since (as I understand it) the wolves would have to put their night kill PM in before knowing thte results of RPI's lynching, they wouldn't have known that Neon wan't the seer.

Kind of a good play then, by N-C, if ya think about it. As the Goth, he knew the wolves' identltiy, so he'd be able to pretend-scan good players, and build some trust. Even after the wolves converted him, he could still play the same fake role, never letting on that he had secret hair in secret places.

I conclude that Neon DID make a ballsy move, but not in a villager-friendly way. In a weird sense, us lynching the seer saved us from Neon possibly getting a chance to work against us for a few more days, I'm thinking.

I wish I WERE the convert. I'd be all smug right now.

As it is, I have to anti-wolf items, and everyone is planning to lynch or kill me tomorrow. At least let me pass them to someone.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

If DT was a wolf I'm not sure that he would be asking us to vote him out,unless that whole reverse psychology comes into play and then he would think that we wouldn't but if we were thinking that then we wouldn't which would be just what he wanted which means that.... uh, nevermind...

Welcome to Hollywood.


Err, welcome to Werewolf.

[DaddyTorgo]

i'd rather save it too cronin, but i'm outed now, thanks to my boneheadedness, so might as well use it fore the wolves kill me.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

If DT was a wolf I'm not sure that he would be asking us to vote him out,unless that whole reverse psychology comes into play and then he would think that we wouldn't but if we were thinking that then we wouldn't which would be just what he wanted which means that.... uh, nevermind...

*shrugs* I might be misguided in the logic, but I'm assuming he'd just figured that we'd all be up in arms and vote for NC just because he lied.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

i'd rather save it too cronin, but i'm outed now, thanks to my boneheadedness, so might as well use it fore the wolves kill me.

There's still a bodyguard out there, and I don't think anybody really suspects you. I don't see the point in voting for you.

If somebody else IS the club member, they should move the vote off Neon on to you.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

There's still a bodyguard out there, and I don't think anybody really suspects you. I don't see the point in voting for you.

If somebody else IS the club member, they should move the vote off Neon on to you.

Valid point. I guess the wolves would be gunning for DT anyways, if not tonight then tomorrow night

[path12]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I vote it's not positive and RendeR was the evil convert and has been converted.

And we're in a bad bad way

Huh? Why Render?

[Crim]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

I wish I WERE the convert. I'd be all smug right now.

As it is, I have to anti-wolf items, and everyone is planning to lynch or kill me tomorrow. At least let me pass them to someone.

Tell ya what. You're a villager? Okee, you don't need our permission, go ahead and pass them to whoever among us you deem most trustworthy. We'll go ahead and kill ya, but at least the items are safe.

But, as a wolf, I'm guessing you're either not passing them (don't wanna help the village) or, more likely, you'll just pass them to one of your wolf pals, hoping to stir up confusion (while still not helping the village). Either way, we kill ya (or, more accurately, DT kills ya).

Another option, you (wolf) pass one item to a villegar, hoping to cast aspersions onto him/her.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by path12

Huh? Why Render?

I thought someone mentioned that idea earlier as I was catching up on stuff that I missed in the early-evening. But maybe it was neon that brought it up?

[Crim]

Originally Posted by Lathum

note:

if you possess a golf club or a serving tray it will be automaticaly activated, you do not need to submit an order to use those items

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

I still have my item. It's a 25% chance to save me from the wolves. I'm not using it tonight, guys. Will reserve it for tomorrow.

Another lie.

[st.cronin]

Good catch, Crim.

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by Crim

Tell ya what. You're a villager? Okee, you don't need our permission, go ahead and pass them to whoever among us you deem most trustworthy. We'll go ahead and kill ya, but at least the items are safe.

But, as a wolf, I'm guessing you're either not passing them (don't wanna help the village) or, more likely, you'll just pass them to one of your wolf pals, hoping to stir up confusion (while still not helping the village). Either way, we kill ya (or, more accurately, DT kills ya).

Another option, you (wolf) pass one item to a villegar, hoping to cast aspersions onto him/her.

Man. I screw up ONE time, and you're all so damn hard on me.

Are we allowed to pass items before we die, though?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Crim

Another lie.

nice catch crim

[MrBug708]

It could just be ignorance though. I didn't realize it either and obviously NC is not a good player this time around

Ok, I'm done defending NC, I don't want to be guilty by association

[st.cronin]

MrBug you are not allowed to edit posts in werewolf.

[MrBug708]

No? Ok...

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by Crim

Another lie.

i actually forgot that it's was a perpetual item. wow, you really are on my case now. I wish you were here earlier today when all the shit was hitting the fan.

I can pass the two items to whoever (granted if i can pass them before i get lynched/killed).

Lathum, can I pass items out before I die?

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

i actually forgot that it's was a perpetual item. wow, you really are on my case now. I wish you were here earlier today when all the shit was hitting the fan.

I can pass the two items to whoever (granted if i can pass them before i get lynched/killed).

Lathum, can I pass items out before I die?

Two items?

[path12]

Hmmm. Neon is obviously my choice, but I think DT has an interesting argument about his role -- if we can at least get him cleared by him using his power (which if he holds on to will certainly make him a big target for the wolves) that gives us at least the beginning of some trust.

Subject to change.

VOTE DADDYTORGO

[MrBug708]

Hmmm

[Neon_Chaos]

Two items?

I have the serving tray, that's from the start.

Last night, someone passed me the golf club.

BTW.

Does that mean that the serving tray did it's job last night, perhaps? I got not PM about being attacked. The only one I got from Lathum was receiving the golf club.

[Crim]

Alan said he gave the gold club to Neon. I can't imagine Lathum starting the game with two defensive items in enemy hands, so I tend to put some trust in Alan for this.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Crim

Alan said he gave the gold club to Neon. I can't imagine Lathum starting the game with two defensive items in enemy hands, so I tend to put some trust in Alan for this.

That makes the most sense IMO.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Crim

Alan said he gave the gold club to Neon. I can't imagine Lathum starting the game with two defensive items in enemy hands, so I tend to put some trust in Alan for this.

I imagine it being totally random. I have no reason not to trust Alan, but that doesn't seem like a good reason TO trust him.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

So the bodyguard better keep my ass protected.

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

I still have my item. It's a 25% chance to save me from the wolves. I'm not using it tonight, guys. Will reserve it for tomorrow.

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

God, I hope not. With the BG busy keeping my ass safe...

well, at least we'll know if a conversion occurs, right?

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

True. But the hidden convert wouldn't have an item to help block wolf attacks now, would he?

Originally Posted by Alan T

So Neon likely was the convert as someone else (Forget who) suggested.. and they attacked him last night thinking he was the seer and ended up converting him.

Umm, just thinking out loud...

Neon was almost certainly protected by the BG, though, right? I mean, we had no counter-reveal, thus no reason to think he was lying. Maybe if he was the Gothic, and wolves did come for him, and the BG protected him, so no conversion. He gets lynched tonight anyway, so maybe the point is moot.

For that matter, even if Neon really is a (tragically unwise) villager, we'd still have gotten the same morning-after message from Lathum, right? Wouldn't the BG have protected him?

Actually, now I'm thinking about it, as the convert, why would Neon be calling multiple times for BG protection? This just results in a wasted night-kill attempt for the wolves, right? It would make more sense to me if Neon is a wolf, than if he were the convert...


Just spit-balling, here. Feel free to poke holes/ridicule as you see fit.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I imagine it being totally random. I have no reason not to trust Alan, but that doesn't seem like a good reason TO trust him.

Sure, as far as that goes, it prolly is random. But at 4ish bad guys vs 16ish good guys, totally random means it's less likely that 2 bad guys got items. That's all I meant, not that Lathum was handpicking item recipients.

[st.cronin]

Crim, I think a bodyguard block is certainly possible - on Neon, or on somebody else. But I don't think it really changes our best play today, which is lynching Neon. If the bodyguard recognized the wolf, he can wait a day to come forward.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Crim

Sure, as far as that goes, it prolly is random. But at 4ish bad guys vs 16ish good guys, totally random means it's less likely that 2 bad guys got items. That's all I meant, not that Lathum was handpicking item recipients.

You're also assuming that Neon does, in fact, have the serving tray. Its possible he was lying about that.

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by Crim

Umm, just thinking out loud...

Neon was almost certainly protected by the BG, though, right? I mean, we had no counter-reveal, thus no reason to think he was lying. Maybe if he was the Gothic, and wolves did come for him, and the BG protected him, so no conversion. He gets lynched tonight anyway, so maybe the point is moot.

For that matter, even if Neon really is a (tragically unwise) villager, we'd still have gotten the same morning-after message from Lathum, right? Wouldn't the BG have protected him?

Actually, now I'm thinking about it, as the convert, why would Neon be calling multiple times for BG protection? This just results in a wasted night-kill attempt for the wolves, right? It would make more sense to me if Neon is a wolf, than if he were the convert...


Just spit-balling, here. Feel free to poke holes/ridicule as you see fit.

I know there's no way of defending myself or my status as a villager, and almost everyone is basically resigned that I should probably die within the day.

What I did was balls to the walls and stupid... but hey, I didn't want to go out on day 1.

Man. I never realized how much I truly suck at this game. Bah. I probably won't be able to convince anyone to look elsewhere.

Good luck guys!

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

You're also assuming that Neon does, in fact, have the serving tray. Its possible he was lying about that.

Why the hell would I lie about having the tray!?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

Why the hell would I lie about having the tray!?

Beats me, I can't really figure out your play at all. You were obviously lying about being the seer, which makes everything you've said somewhat suspect.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Beats me, I can't really figure out your play at all. You were obviously lying about being the seer, which makes everything you've said somewhat suspect.

what he said.

[hoopsguy]

Well, a lie about the serving tray could serve as a reason that the wolves would go in another direction rather than coming after one of their own.

And it is going to be hard to come up with another candidate without night information that creates a more appealing target. It would certainly be frustrating if Neon ends up being pro-country-club, but that seems hard to fathom after Day 1.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Crim

Actually, now I'm thinking about it, as the convert, why would Neon be calling multiple times for BG protection? This just results in a wasted night-kill attempt for the wolves, right? It would make more sense to me if Neon is a wolf, than if he were the convert...

Does the person who is the BG get revealed to the wolves if they attack a "protected" person? If so, that could be the motivation, to out the BG to the wolves.

If this is the case then it would be a great play for him if he were the convert as the BG protects him, the wolves find out the BG and get him next and then go after Neon still thinking he is the seer and he gets converted after getting the BG outed.

Okay, maybe I am thinking way too much. Of course, this is all moot if the wolves can't discover the BG when he defends.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Does the person who is the BG get revealed to the wolves if they attack a "protected" person? If so, that could be the motivation, to out the BG to the wolves.

If this is the case then it would be a great play for him if he were the convert as the BG protects him, the wolves find out the BG and get him next and then go after Neon still thinking he is the seer and he gets converted after getting the BG outed.

Okay, maybe I am thinking way too much. Of course, this is all moot if the wolves can't discover the BG when he defends.

It varies from game to game, I didn't see it spelled out in the rules. No matter what, unless the bodyguard guarded himself last night AND recognized a wolf, he should stay silent for today.

[Chief Rum]

Wow, great start to the game, Matt.

This has happened once or twice before--game starts at the perfectly awful time for me (about two hours after I leave for work), and then something gets in the way all day (such as other job or, in today's case, Internet issues) where I can't check in. I knew the game might start today, but I didn;t think we would have a deadline so soon. Ugh. Sorry, folks.

I am still reading through the thread and catching up. I'll respond to things as I go along. Fortunately, already saw I didn't get lynched, so I know I won't be posting in vain.

And, BTW, smooth nailing the seer on day one.

[Chief Rum]

Oh, I'm a villager.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

I see that of the folks who haven't checked in, most are newbies or returnees who I don't want to vote on Day 1, except Chief Rum.

VOTE CHIEF RUM

You're just voting for me because our wolf experience in the last game has given you a heightened sense of "Chief Rum is a wolf"-itis.

It's just Munchausen, though. I'm not a wolf. Of course, I'm not the smooth mover who lasted to the end of that game, am I?

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Pass, I'm pretty sure that I recall Rum saying the start time was tough for him (double shift, or something like that?) - it resonated because I knew I was going to have some timing issues with this game as well. For better or worse, I decided to leave him out of voting consideration today because of that.

Disclaimer - this thread should not be construed as any kind of defense of Chief Rum, other than to suggest that I've paid attention to previous posts in this thread. Past performance does not guarantee future results. Batteries not included. Voting for Hoopsguy as a result of this post may cause lung disease.

Yes, my usual schedule will apply. Mondays and Tuesdays are awful (two job days). This Saturday, because of a scheduling quirk (rare OT shift), I have another two day.

Otherwise, I am generally not available in the daytime hours (FOFC blocked at work), and then post mucho at night.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Voting CR is unwise. He is, in my opinion, the best villager around.

Unvote Telle
Vote Pass

And I think Pass agrees, or at least thinks similarly. I also don't like the RPI voting since the man's just come back to WW. Let him make Day 2 at least.

Well, heck, thanks, BK! You're pretty damn good yourself.

As of page three, though, not ready to follow on Pass. I think he's just following a bad gut instinct.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by MrDNA

Just home from tilling the fields, like all good villegars should do. And if you mofos vote me off the first night, I am totally going to turn into a wolf and rip your asses up.

Er... perhaps I've said too much.

lol...newbie humor. What newbie doesn't realize is such humor is often turned into a Day One reason to lynch, with little else to go on.

Well, at least you survived Day One, MrDNA.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by molson

Last time I played, CR was barely around the first 3/4 of the game, so no one suspected him. He was a wolf. It's more likely that his schedule is the consistent thing, rather than the role, but it's something I'll keep in mind.

Heh, which game was that? I don't play that way on purpose, although, as you note, sometimes the schedule forces me into that.

If it makes you feel any better, lately I seem to have been targeted early as a wolf by people who want to clear me, so I have been unveiled by early scans. So if I am around after Day Three, I am probably good.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

I agree with your statement about RPI. As for CR, I don't know what to tell you. I'm not over here screaming for his lynching or anything. Anyway, I always thought the consensus was that hoops was the best villager around.

There are several candidates for best villager in my mind. Hoops is one. So is Barkeep. And st.cronin. Even Blade, when he can be trusted. Many others I haven't mentioned. I think I play adequately, but I would put those ahead of me, too.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

You've mentioned this in this game and earlier games and I just don't see it. Can you delve a little deeper into why you believe this?

Not sure yet if this blossomed into a full discussion, but I tend to agree with cronin on this. I fully expect votes to hop around on Day One. We don't know much. It doesn't take much for us to switch. Without much evidence, there isn't much to root us to anything except instinct, which we all know is eminently fallible.

That said, I am fully willing to look back for (and have found) evidence of wolfish tendencies in the vote later in the game. By itself, the switching means nothing. But it can have much more meaning as we get to know better who is good and who isn't.