MUT22 - No Money Spent (Madden Ultimate Team)

[QuikSand]

New weekly program Ultimate Legends started Saturday, wave of 8 guys, half Rams lol but none for any of my teams. Bought up nearly 20 cards rated 95 on a market dip, paying under 90K for each… will hope to sell for 120 or better later this week.

[QuikSand]

I am not in panic mode, but the price dip from yesterday continues… The 95 rated cards from the newly released set continue to sell at around 90 K. That is a training price of about 3.5, crazy cheap. I have bought many, expecting that number to rise… But instead, it looks as though many other card levels are dropping perhaps to match that level. This may be a permanent shift. No huge risk to me if so, some of this will just be cheap training, I can probably sell these cards at roughly break even prices, and just miss what seemed like a good profit opportunity.

[QuikSand]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

New weekly program Ultimate Legends started Saturday, wave of 8 guys, half Rams lol but none for any of my teams. Bought up nearly 20 cards rated 95 on a market dip, paying under 90K for each… will hope to sell for 120 or better later this week.

Got a decent bump that I wanted, I have all these cards for sale now in the 125-140 range, and some are selling. If they all sell, I'd be cool with that, we could clear maybe 400K from the few days of investment.

[QuikSand]

Just unexciting now, to be honest. I'm not enjoying playing much.

Today's promo release includes a 97 CB Byron Jones who looks flawed but will be near maxed on my theme team. Cool. Whatever.


Like, the only thing that semi-intrigues me is taking my pile of cash and starting a new team, and a Lions team built around Night Train Lane as superstar CB and runaround QB. No idea if that would be genuinely interesting, either to build or to play.

A 94 Tyrod Taylor also dropped today, he could be more interesting than the 95 Baker for a Browns team.

[QuikSand]

Today could be interesting, I suppose… Among the new ultimate legends players being released this morning is a very high and Michael Vick at quarterback. They recently just made an endgame change, effectively making it much harder to use a super scrambler type… But if there’s an exception making it still worthwhile, he would probably be it. I expect that card to be in high demand today, and for a while… So, lots of people should be ripping parks in search of Vic cards… Meaning the other stuff they get and don’t want to go into the marketplace, potentially driving prices down overall. I will be bargain-hunting.

[QuikSand]

Two new cards for my MIA team... finally added the top-end 97 CB Byron Jones, and bought the new 95 FS Javon Holland. Jones becomes our #1 CB but he was already a starter as a 94 (so that is an improvement)... I'll have to see whether Holland is a meaningful addition at this point. I really wanted his card, but as a 95, he'll still probably be less effective than FS Minkah Fitzpatrick, so I'll need to decide whether to make him my backup FS, backup SS (to start when Kam Chancellor gets pulled down to play MLB, which is a lot) or what.

Anyway... I continue to have the Dolphins team maxed-out (with the only exception that I have not yet done the full grind to maximize Kam to 99), so there's nothing to want, nothing to buy, nothing to mull over. That's boring.

Have gotten many smaller pieces of a Night Train Lane centered Lions team but don't feel like committing two hours to finishing and refining it. Meh.

No ambition to go back and play the Browns team, even with a 94 Tyrod Taylor at QB.

So... big meh.

[QuikSand]

Medium sized new promo set out today, "Backyard Ballers" and apparently this is some theoretical "what would these guys do at a barbecue" or somesuch. All the players out-of-position, and many appears to be really good. I dislike this, and that it's apparently so popular that EA feels the need to feed the demand for it.

So, apparently my best Dolphins WR is going to now be 255lb Ricky Williams, great. And fun-faux-playmaker RG Robert Hunt now gets a pretty good card to play... safety? And among the best QBs in the game will now be... Stephon Gilmore?

more meh

[QuikSand]

Today's Ultimate Legends (sets of the same player, rated 87, 91, 95 and the 97 boss, with one underling level card out-of-position sometimes absurdly) include LT Bryant McKinnie, a weird choice. But noteworthy since he tacked onto his Vikings career a short stint with the Ravens, and an even shorter one with the Dolphins. So, the power-up card can get Dolphins chemistry - meaning I now get an end-game level LT for my Dolphins theme team, a nice bump.

This is what it's like now for committed theme team players like me... just sit and wait for new cards, get them, and use them. Not really a lot of strategy, it's the "get enough coins so you can get the cards" where the action is, and candidly, I likely have enough coins to buy all the cards yet to come for my two theoretically active theme teams, now.

If/when a huge WR Andre Rison card drops, I'll boost by a few million and be in fat city, plenty of cash to buy whatever I want, basically, if it goes according to plan.

[QuikSand]

The third installment today of Backyard Ballers. All out of position players. I hate it.

Great now the best RB in Chargers history is… Derwin James? The most fantastic pass rusher from Detroit was… Barry Sanders? And to max out your team you need those guys?

Stupid. I hate it.

[QuikSand]

So my Dolphins theme team now needs Brandon Marshall (the tall WR) to be in my MLB rotation. Because the game makers create such cookie cutter cards that the only way to really stand out is via height and weight.

Thus 340lb Robert Hunt as a CB, and so forth. It’s dumb.

[QuikSand]

Haven't been keeping up closely... apparently the newest round of cards are "Free Agent" cards- mostly matching up with players in this offseason's hot stove marketplace. Apparently multiple of the best among them, 98-rated cards, are being offered "with any team chemistry" simulating having your team go out and sign the player.

So, my "Dolphins" team has always felt fairly far removed from the Dolphins, and apparently now if I want to max out the roster I'll need to go get Brandon Scherff and Chandler Jones and Allen Robinson and (I think I have read) Randall Cunningham and just magick them to being "Dolphins." WTAF is this?

[QuikSand]

So it appears there are 5x new “free agent” players who get any team chem. QB Randall Cunningham, WR Davante Adams, TE Evan Ingram, LB Chandler Jones, and S Marcus Maye. All of them appear to be upgrades over what I currently am fielding on my Dolphins theme team, so… I guess I just get them all and put them out there. And then, at some point, if I wanted to play my Browns theme theme, I just play all the same guys. Boring AF.

[QuikSand]

Today is also Randy moss day, he was released as an ultimate legend card today… So lots of people are ripping open packs in pursuit of his cards. That appears to be, predictably, flooding the market with ultimate legends cards that people do not want… The 95 rated cards that yesterday were selling for 130 K, now they are going for something like 80 or 85. I don’t know how much to buy, this might be a permanent price drop, but it feels like a profiteering opportunity.

[QuikSand]

Market dropped a bunch, seemingly across the board, on Saturday and has stayed there... lots of different levels of cards now selling below 3 coins per training. I'm glad I didn't overdo it yesterday when I saw 95-rated cards going for 80-85K (equivalent to around 3.3-3.5)... they are now settled in at 70-75K. Must have been a major factor at work, probably new packs available for coins/training in the store with materially more generous output. market adjust appropriately, training comes down, and nearly everything else moves relative to "cheap training." Okay then.

[QuikSand]

Side quest:

My son and I started fiddling with a side roster, and it has been kinda fun to play with. We call it the GAP team, started by the idea that we'd just use all the various random cards we get from buying a daily super-cheap "get a player" pack. Those mostly garbage players eventually formed a roster, and then our house rule was the only players we can add to that roster are ones we earn (through playing challenges) using only that roster. It starts out as total trash, we played some easy stuff, and now have it up to rated 85 overall, courtesy of some fairly deliberately easy challenges in the game that yield 80+ players here and there, and then some more with even better rewards.

We have several genuinely solid players (95 DT DJ Reader, 93 FS Sean Taylor, 92 RT Dan Deirdorf, 92 MLB Levon Kirkland) and then a tier of guys in the mid 80s and up, but we are still starting several players in their 70s for lack of better options.

Building is always more fun. This team is now more interesting than my base theme team is, for the most part.

[Poli]

Sounds fun. A few years back when players had the game contracts or whatever they were called, I used to play the challenges with different quarterbacks...I could only use one something like 5 or 10 games...and then I had to switch. It turned into me having two squads...one for challenges and one for full games. Challenge squad was mostly empty cupboard type players with the exception of what goal I was trying to accomplish. It was really just to keep my good players out of losing a game on their contract if the challenge was only going to be for a series or so.

It was a wash after they killed that game contract part of the game.

I've enjoyed reading through this, but man, I'm not sure I could do it. I didn't really get into MUT this season when my travel schedule ramped up.

[QuikSand]

Well, if the Browns team carried any allure, there have been a few rapid developments there... they released the 97 OBJ card as a redux, and it will likely drop from $1.2m to far less... and then they dropped two limited edition 98-rated free agent cards for Jadaveon Clowney and Amari Cooper, plus today a 96-rated Nick Chubb.

[QuikSand]

TE Ozzie Newsome is one of this weekend's Ultimate Legends, and now has a dominating card. The Browns team would be fairly fun to play if I have a damn.

[QuikSand]

The more obvious takeaway is that I was a year too early to take on a dual Browns / Dolphins dynasty here. Next year's theme teams for both franchises should be very engaging to play, far more than was the case this year.

[QuikSand]

Waves of new cards landing... the threshold for "good enough" is now rising to 95 or so (anyone on your roster below that feels like a liability). I am not playing much, and not fiddling in the markets much. Just out of momentum.

The last round of Ultimate Legends did include a WR as expected, but they went with Billy "White Shoes" Johnson rather than Andre Rison. Rison getting a big card, eventually, is basically the last thing I am actively looking forward to, to be honest...and for no real reason, since I am not really that motivated to even finish my team.

[QuikSand]

Small change in orientation here. After getting sick of all these out of position players, and the voluminous fake-the-team-chem guys, I’m just done with them both, at least for now. Real life Dolphins only.

That means the roster will still be pretty good, but a shade less complete than before. And my interest in obtaining the latest waves of guys who might add something should grow, and that should be good too.

[QuikSand]

Okay, I got my maxed out Minkah and Ndamukong cards, shuffled things around a bit, and am running with pure Dolphins, past and present. I like it.

Tua in the saddle. He’s not great but it’s kinda fun.

[QuikSand]

They threw out a 97-rated Tua, and I'm happy. More accurate, not a crazy scrambler, feels right. Playing a pure Dolphins roster is a sweet spot for right now.

[QuikSand]

Meanwhile, I flirted with building a Lions team earlier this spring... if I play Madden 23 then it's very tempting to consider the Lions for a theme team to invest in. Good OL, couple young exciting stud players, and some exciting veterans who will surely show up in Megatron, Night Train, and Barry. Could be fun.

[QuikSand]

So, fizzled out mostly on MUT at this point. Tried the obvious... dabbled with Franchise mode a bit.

Played a Dolphins team, a couple seasons, over a few months...mostly didn't like it. Feels like the incoming young players are just SO far worse than experienced players that it's off-putting.

Anyway, fired it up again this weekend a bit. Had a weak roster (bad decisions, on me) and went 2-15 on autopilot. Then loaded up with three young players from the rookie class, and felt like I should try the "play key situations" setting for the upcoming season.

My team was rated low, still. But I won my first two games playing key situations. Played out a lot of autopilot, and slid to 7-7. Then I took over again, played the key situations, and ran the table to win it all.

No point in playing this, I guess. The concept of front-officing a Madden lineup and then playing out the games with it sounded intriguing, but... I can't find the sweet spot.

[QuikSand]

Interesting twist. They’ve started to release a set of endgame caliber “Golden Ticket” players, specially designed to be awesome versions of earlier cards. Lots of stupid out of position stuff that I hate. Close to nothing for my Dolphins team so I had been inclined to ignore.

Last year these cards sold for maybe 400-500k, iirc. This year looks like 2-3m. Not sure why.

[QuikSand]

I seem to have been banned or suspended from all online Madden functions including MUT and the franchise mode (I saved to the cloud, apparently unwisely). Cool cool, just in case I was on the bubble about spending money with these assclowns next year.

[QuikSand]

..it got better, seems like it was a glitch from updating to "season 4" (far too late) and things are settled now

[QuikSand]

Dan Marino was one of the Ultimate Legends players this weekend, and the case for switching to him over Tua is... very strong:

Compare MUT 22 Player Items Ratings and Abilities - MUT.GG

(not sure if that link will work)

Much greater accuracy, lose a little mobility (but not enough tbh)... yeah we're doing that.

[QuikSand]

Months ago I started making moves… “investments”… to get copied of the 90 rated WR Andre Rison. The thinking was, EA is so cheap that they have decided to limit the number of players they buy the rights to use in the game… So any meaningful player who’s in the game is probably going to get us a whole series of cards, so they can maximize their trivial investment in player rights. Rison was a high quality player, and an important position, who has eligibility for multiple different franchises… To me, he seems like a perfect card to focus on. I made a lot of money building his Satz, accumulating the piece is required to complete the set, and otherwise taking that card very seriously. But, the whole Kapstone moment was going to be when they eventually released a high end card for him, making him one of the best receivers in the game, and hopefully triggering demand for the intermediate card that would be required to fully develop his power up card.

Anyway, they announced that tomorrow he is one of the ultimate legend cards being released. It is basically too late in the annual calendar for this to matter a whole lot, but I’m hoping they will at least be a few dozen people who scramble to get the card… Wanting him for their Falcons or packers or browns franchise team. And I have lots and lots of copies of him ready to sell, it will not be a giant payout like I had hope for originally… But at this point I might as well follow through on all the effort I put in months ago.

[QuikSand]

While the 99 Rison card wasn’t the immediate cash bonanza I had envisioned, I have now managed to sell off all 22 copies of the 90 card that I had accumulated. I’m over 5m in coins, with no real plan to do anything much with them.

[QuikSand]

So, they have launched the Rookie Premiere program in MUT 22, mainly as a vehicle to get people interested in buying Madden 23. It's a program designed to get you doing stuff and spending coins/money to get special rookie cards, that are useful this year but then grant you something of value next year (a pretty good version of next year's rookies who can help your MUT team right away).

The thing is, this adds to the silliness of MUT as anything like a historic representation. They gave one rookie card to each franchise so the Dolphins get LB Channing Tindall, ok, fine. But to make that card (or any of these) relevant this deep into the endgame, it needs to be tip-top quality, a 99.

Contrast that with DE Jason Taylor, a longtime Dolphin with a pretty solid HOF case. He was in the game this year but his best card was a 94. So as I built my "best actual Dolphins" roster right now, I end up with DE Taylor as a relative liability while some fourth rounder with a nice 40-yard time is a rock solid build-around sort of guy. Got it.


Anyway... I'm all but resigned to sticking with this franchise, so in all likelihood I will be collecting the rookie cards to get the tokens or whatever it is that propels me to goodies in August. Hooray.

[QuikSand]

The boy and I have found a decent groove with the Franchise game, at the total expense of any time spent with MUT at this point.

[QuikSand]

So, I have more or less decided I'm going to continue playing next year with Madden 23. It has a ceiling for me, but I really enjoy having a side project like this (grinding coins, building the roster, etc) and the boy and I get some bonding time over it (mostly just discussing it).

Anyway... I'm really committed to the "No Money Spent" side. Meanwhile, EA is offering, predictably, two versions of the game for pre-purchase... the higher "All Madden" version includes earlier access and some bonus content. But it costs $30 or $40 more... so effectively that's mostly the same thing as paying money for in-game content (extra cards and currency).

Hmmmmm.

[Poli]

I did that one year, but I didn't particularly enjoy the bonus content for the money.

I've gone no money spent outside of the game purchase the past year or two.

[QuikSand]

Pre-purchased the basic version. I have a number of tokens from M22 stuff that will get me some of these spiffy rookie cards in M23, that will have to do.

My aim is to spend roughly half the amount of time and energy on this that I did last year. I want to build my team, and I like fiddling in the auction houses (I really do) I don't like button mashing and want to reduce the time I spend just grinding stuff to get better cards. Will try to be focused and increase the weight I give to my time in the equation.

Anyway, tally ho next month.

[QuikSand]

Madden 23 is out. Some glitches, but it's live and running.

Spent a few hours with the boy fiddling around, and then some time today doing a few things... got my two sell-able high end cards from finishing stuff in M22, and sold them...didn't truly max out the market in retrospect, but pulled nearly 300K from them. That has fueled most of my early escapades thus far.

I think I will continue to update this thread, but... maybe with more structure and less prose.

[QuikSand]

MUT 23 - No Money Spent Update
Cash on hand: 246,000
Player level: 6 (not paying all that many games, really)
Main Team: Off 80, Def 78, Overall 79
Roster style: "Best Overall" but supported by 25x Dolphins chem
Top rated players: 86 MLB Channing Tindall, 84 QB Tua Tagovailoa
Current profit methods: building and buying team items
Cards I covet: 87 WR Tyreek Hill (duh) and 86 CB Xavien Howard

Basically I have ground out coins with some easy methods...early on a lot of people are fiddling around with themes, and want to go get the coach, stadium, uniforms, and gameplans for other franchises. I've found an easy exploit to take advantage of the lazy ones - I can create the aforementioned items with an investment of under 1500 coins, and then selectively create items that are short-term scarce. No copies out there of the Texans stadium? I'm on it, spend 1500 coins, and now it's up for sale for 8,950 with a solid shot to go at that price. Easy money.

Tyreek has 87 speed, game-changing at this point... I want him but he's going for as much as I have in total. Will have to wait, I guess.

For now the main team is powered by Dolphins, but there are lots of deep holes there filled by various BPA guys. In time, I will try to push to 50 dolphins, I reckon.

Playing games is not a thrill. Building a thing over time, kinda is.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Madden 23 is out. Some glitches, but it's live and running.

Spent a few hours with the boy fiddling around, and then some time today doing a few things... got my two sell-able high end cards from finishing stuff in M22, and sold them...didn't truly max out the market in retrospect, but pulled nearly 300K from them. That has fueled most of my early escapades thus far.

I think I will continue to update this thread, but... maybe with more structure and less prose.

Kid bought M23, first iteration in a couple (3?) years.

I gave it a spin, inspired largely by your past posts + my MLBTheShow experiences.

So far, I've yet to get the buggy p.o.s. to give me my coins earned in challenges. Makes it rather tough to buy cards or do anything other than play the game, which is its least enjoyable aspect.

[QuikSand]

If you are playing on PS4/5, apparently that version is the most broken. So there's hope for improvement soon, I hear.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

If you are playing on PS4/5, apparently that version is the most broken. So there's hope for improvement soon, I hear.

XB1 actually.

I've seen talk of the issue with the (lack of) coins being overwhelmed servers but if that's it, how come not everybody gets bitten by it? (kid hasn't had that issue, nor the "game registers as practice game but when you quit it produces a 0-0 tie" bug either)

So far, this has been the most broken sports game experience I've ever had and among the most broken gaming experiences period ... and I'm a Bethesda Day One guy most of the time, so it's not like there isn't fierce competition for that sort of crown

[QuikSand]

yikes

[QuikSand]

Okay, so... I remember an in-school filmstrip from around 6th grade. The theme was "life skills" of some sort, and thinking back, it easily could have been produced by Junior Achievement, or John Birchers, or whomever. Not the point.

The story was a kid mowing lawns, and the plot was around his financial planning. He wanted to earn enough money to buy a better, gas-powered, super-cool lawn mower available nearby for a fixed price. He worked out the math, saying that once he got to the magic point of getting that lawn mower, then he could finish lawns in half the time and massive improve his productivity, making for a better summer, etc.

Anyway... the kid is now me, and the law mower is Tyreek.

87 Tyreek Hill has 87 speed, the fastest in the game right now. Most guys covering him will have maybe 82-84 at best. In a game where lots of ratings are effectively by tiers and thresholds, speed kills. I will surely be able to fly past a CB in many a challenge for a one-play TD, saving me a ton of grind time... once I get the game wrecker Tyreek.

He's selling for nearly 300K, so it will take a lot. But it feels obvious to me that is the next real move for us.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Just a quick fwiw: my coins finally appeared in MUT, only took about 36 hours for that to happen

[QuikSand]

Glad your situation got resolved, albeit belatedly.

[QuikSand]

87 Tyreek Hill now aboard. Gggggiddyup.

[QuikSand]

MUT 23 - No Money Spent Update
Cash on hand: 53,000
Player level: 11
Main Team: Off 81, Def 81, Overall 81
Roster style: "Best Overall" but increasingly supported by 40x Dolphins chem
Top rated players: 87 Tyreek Hill, 88 DT Sam Adams
Current profit methods: building and buying team items
Cards I covet: 86 CB Xavien Howard, 87 FS Bobby McCain, 87 SS Eric Rowe

So, low on cash but the team is more effective now... some formerly challenging opponents now become butter for Tyreek's hot knife.

[QuikSand]

More grinding today, have cash around 80K but that's after some decent purchases. After playing MUT 22 right from the start last year, I am WAY more efficient and knowledgeable now. In a few days of work, I have basically put my MIA theme team up to a place that became really familiar to me last year as a NMS style guy: I have pretty much everyone I can reasonably afford, and then a few more on top of that due to cleverness, persistence, or whatever.

Right now, early in the cycle, I think these are the players/cards that I do not yet possess who would benefit my MIA theme tam:

87 SS Eric Rowe (~250k)
87 FS Bobby McCain (~250K)
84 MLB Jerome Baker (could do set for ~40K)
84 RE Ndamukong Suh (~25K)

...and that's really it. If I want to stay within the "pure theme team" I just got to the magic number of 50 players tonight - that grants each MIA chem player a +2 in basic ratings, including most notably SPEED. That's the in-game benefit of pushing the roster this way, and it's meaningful.

Anyway...I sorta dove into this after feeling sorta meh at first... feeling ill made the opportunity cost lesser by far. Maybe I will lose interest day by day, but I am back at the app in my spare moments here and there looking for cards to snipe and sell, or gaps to fill in, etc.

[QuikSand]

Okay. After a flurry of too-fast roster assembly, I think I see how this is gonna go.

I’m gonna use the “I’m just a theme team guy” to beg out of a lot of grinding out challenges and that crap. M23 continues the trend of handing out special awards in the form of non-sellable cards, this year called “account bound.” They usually also have deeply reduced quicksell value. So…if you grind through a big series of game challenges and receive, say, an Antonio Gates card… then it’s great if you’ll use him, but nearly useless if you won’t.

[QuikSand]

Big Legends promo dropped today. No Dolphins. I’m tryna flip cards for profit a bit, but the ability to sell via the app is disabled and that sucks.

As always, a big new batch of cards creates arbitrage between those who understand how the market house works, and those who don’t. If you search for a selection of players that totals more than 100 copies, the system narrows your search [i]to the 100 copies closes to expiring on their clock.[i] it’s hard to overstate how big a deal this tiny fact is. But, since tons of people don’t know it… right now I can search on just one specific 85 card and see all 80 copies, with prices down as low as 30k. But the naive searcher is pulling 8x80 cards, and by filtering to only those coming due in the next 22 minutes (or whatever) he’s missing all the low prices, and sees 39k as his best value. It’s absurd.