WW CLVII - Ghostbusters - Game Over (result in post 1521) - Page 9

Danny · 03-13-2013, 02:15 PM

vote coffee warlord

I dont think Lathum is a wolf.

Danny · 03-13-2013, 02:16 PM

Honestly, I do not like this line of thinking that wolves would risk a late switch from Lathum to DT if both are villagers. In that case I think wolves stick with their vote. I think the late switchers (not necessarily late voters) are less likely to be wolves if Lathum is a villager.

bhlloy · 03-13-2013, 02:21 PM

Yes i agree with that Danny. If Lathum is a villager those late switches look pretty good. I'm more interested in the earlier push that seems to take CW and Mau off the table.

Obviously this is contingent on Lathum not being a wolf in the first place

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 02:22 PM

Well lets do a midday switch since I said I liked two early and one seems to be the favorite of the group.

unvote Lathum
vote Coffee Warlord

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 02:24 PM

Sweet, a few more votes and we can raise the white smoke!

JAG · 03-13-2013, 02:26 PM

Coffee Warlord 4 - Chubby (356), mauchow (390), Danny (401), murra5y (404)
bhlloy 2 - Coffee Warlord (360), Narcizo (363)
Autumn 1 - Lathum (326)
mauchow 1 - bhlloy (386)
Passacaglia 1 - Autumn (378)

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

Well lets do a midday switch since I said I liked two early and one seems to be the favorite of the group.

unvote Lathum
vote Coffee Warlord

You were on me and stayed on me yesterday, too, well after the votes had moved elsewhere. Hmm.

PackerFanatic · 03-13-2013, 02:30 PM

I hate to push him up by 3 at this point, but he fits into my group I was looking at earlier.

VOTE COFFEE WARLORD

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 02:33 PM

That's quite the pile onto Coffee. I think he's a decent candidate - a lot of what he was saying yesterday seemed a bit like he was playing to the gallery. But I can't fault his vote. Given the fact that it was day one I'd have done the same thing.

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 02:34 PM

I'm seriously curious how I fit into this supposed that is leading towards a big run here.

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 02:34 PM

supposed group, that is.

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 02:36 PM

Me, play to the gallery? MADNESS!

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerFanatic

I hate to push him up by 3 at this point, but he fits into my group I was looking at earlier.

VOTE COFFEE WARLORD

Really? And you don't think you could at least push one of your other candidates and make there two from your group on the block? Having any candidate who hasn't been outed by a seer up three at this stage just seems ridiculous, and probably ensures a two-horse race which is a rubbish situation for the village to put itself in.

I'm surprised at how readily Lathum was dropped as a candidate. Looks like finding an easy candidate rather than anything else.

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

Well lets do a midday switch since I said I liked two early and one seems to be the favorite of the group.

unvote Lathum
vote Coffee Warlord

The more I think about it, the less I like this vote here.

D1 - Murray left his vote on me yesterday. He threw his vote on a villager who had a vote or two at that point. As I got a few more votes, more the better - he was in early enough. As the votes shifted, he stayed put - I still had a couple people on me, and odds are the people moving to DT would be scrutinized more. Safe play.

D2 - Middway switch to the same person, who already has several votes, and provide zero insight as to why. Get in early, you can easily defend yourself "he looked bad - look at all the other voters!", keep your defensible voting record.

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

You were on me and stayed on me yesterday, too, well after the votes had moved elsewhere. Hmm.

Yeah, I figured you and Lathum were doing too much stage chatter to be innocent. So it was a coin flip with my D2 vote last night and switched over to you today. Nothing wrong with going with my first guess yesterday again.

And seriously, why are there 2 R's in Starrcade?

Passacaglia · 03-13-2013, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Really? And you don't think you could at least push one of your other candidates and make there two from your group on the block? Having any candidate who hasn't been outed by a seer up three at this stage just seems ridiculous, and probably ensures a two-horse race which is a rubbish situation for the village to put itself in.

Yes yes yes, wtf. Also, bhlloy's vote can move to CW, if he needs to save himself, so it's kind of a 3.5 vote lead.

Let's try to keep three involved.

VOTE MAUCHOW

PackerFanatic · 03-13-2013, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Really? And you don't think you could at least push one of your other candidates and make there two from your group on the block? Having any candidate who hasn't been outed by a seer up three at this stage just seems ridiculous, and probably ensures a two-horse race which is a rubbish situation for the village to put itself in.

I'm surprised at how readily Lathum was dropped as a candidate. Looks like finding an easy candidate rather than anything else.

But I don't like anyone else!

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

The more I think about it, the less I like this vote here.

D1 - Murray left his vote on me yesterday. He threw his vote on a villager who had a vote or two at that point. As I got a few more votes, more the better - he was in early enough. As the votes shifted, he stayed put - I still had a couple people on me, and odds are the people moving to DT would be scrutinized more. Safe play.

D2 - Middway switch to the same person, who already has several votes, and provide zero insight as to why. Get in early, you can easily defend yourself "he looked bad - look at all the other voters!", keep your defensible voting record.

D1 - Well it can be seen as a safe play... or a right play. the guy who had voted for you (according to 206) and jumped on Lathum, then got night killed. Coincidence, maybe but there isn't much else to go off of right now.

D2 - (In 329) I still had you on my short list with Mau and Latham. I think the quote I saw from people was put on some early pressure to see how I squirm. Guess it's time for me to watch for a squirm.

mauchow · 03-13-2013, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Really? And you don't think you could at least push one of your other candidates and make there two from your group on the block? Having any candidate who hasn't been outed by a seer up three at this stage just seems ridiculous, and probably ensures a two-horse race which is a rubbish situation for the village to put itself in.

I'm surprised at how readily Lathum was dropped as a candidate. Looks like finding an easy candidate rather than anything else.

Ding ding ding. I'm not sure I see why increasing a lead is a good thing at this point in the day.

And yes, I too am curious why there are no lathum voters. I think bhlloy was on him early then switched to me for feeling better about lathum after some thinking on the brit kill. Not sure what group of wolves would kill any of the candidates last night... so that logic doesn't sound right at this point.

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 02:56 PM

D2 above was in reference to me being stacked last game. Not this game obviously. I forget who but some stated the last hour votes for me were to see how I'd react.

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 02:59 PM

Well, when you decide to pile onto one candidate in the middle of the day, you're not going to get much squirming.

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 03:00 PM

Besides, I already peed out my morning coffee. No squirming necessary.

mauchow · 03-13-2013, 03:00 PM

unvote CW
vote Lathum

My afternoon is a little busier but I will still be able to check in throughout the evening and I will without a doubt have zero issue being around deadline.

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Well, when you decide to pile onto one candidate in the middle of the day, you're not going to get much squirming.

Depends on how many people move their votes later... Don't expect to see anything this early. Especially if main characters reveal at 10:01 PM like last night.

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Besides, I already peed out my morning coffee. No squirming necessary.

Plus who said the squirm would come from you... I thought there were multiple wolves still alive.

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 03:09 PM

Meh!

I remember why I find werewolf tough now. I don't know what to think. In these circumstances I tend to think it's villager chasing villager, creating havoc and the wolves not doing much of anything. I'm trying to give murrayyyyy some leeway for being new but I'm really not liking his actions today.

Passacaglia · 03-13-2013, 03:11 PM

Wait, what did murrayyyyy do? PF's vote seems like the crazier one.

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 03:12 PM

So...your line of thinking.

You want to encourage movement later by voting me now. I'd rather have discussion all day as much as possible. Doesn't work as well when one candidate has a big lead.

You expect the wolves to squirm. When they already have an advantage right now (with Ray & Winston dead). When they still have their full number and can, theoretically, still convert. I'd totally sacrifice a wolf to look good if need be in this position.

Not a great line of thinking in my book.

Danny · 03-13-2013, 03:17 PM

unvote coffee
Vote packerfanatic

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

Wait, what did murrayyyyy do? PF's vote seems like the crazier one.

Don't like how he came out swinging at Lathum and then switched so early to Coffee without seeing if anyone else was looking at Lathum - didn't even really say why he was switching other than he had two candidates and he was happy to go with the flow. Bhlloy explained his switch more convincingly.

Packers vote is just to crazy to be wolfy.

Of course I'm going to look like crap if Coffee comes up wolf after all this, but what can you do?

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 03:23 PM

Putting my money where my yaks are.

Unvote Bhlloy
Vote Murrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrraaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 03:24 PM

One thing I'd like to say is that there's a lot of talk about this group of three or that group of three and them "having" to include a wolf. This is just silly. Pick three names at random and start talking about that group having to have a wolf in it and it stands up just as well.

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Meh!

I remember why I find werewolf tough now. I don't know what to think. In these circumstances I tend to think it's villager chasing villager, creating havoc and the wolves not doing much of anything. I'm trying to give murrayyyyy some leeway for being new but I'm really not liking his actions today.

Well I'm taking a huge assumption that the wolves placed late night kill (within the last 15 mins) because of the large voting crowd for day one. No use in turning in a night kill so early based off D1 chaotic voting that seems to be dart board methods usually.

Here's all the talk I've seen. Lathum declares he is a vanilla villager 4-5 times so far. Then he said if he was a wolf he would do a fake reveal. So if he was a wolf he would do a fake reveal and he said he wasn't a wolf. That's why I voted for him late last night. He's quick to point out when someone else does it but no one sensed it except for me (which may be a bad read on my part)

Plus when I look above, I move to Coffee and Mau follows me with a jump on Lathum. Isn't Mau moving his early vote off someone who is getting stacked on more worrisome than me moving my vote? According to Coffee-logic, Mau is making a defensive wolf move early by getting off him and moving to Lathum to make it's a 2 horse race.

PackerFanatic · 03-13-2013, 03:30 PM

Alright, I need to think on this more. Jumped the gun and made myself look bad, I don't like that.

UNVOTE CW

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 03:33 PM

Damn right! You see! A vote for Coffee is a vote for LUCIFER.

PackerFanatic · 03-13-2013, 03:36 PM

...but in this game, wouldn't we want Lucifer dead? DID YOU JUST REVEAL AS A WOLF?

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 03:36 PM

As of #435

Coffee Warlord 2 - Chubby (356), murra5y (404)
bhlloy 1 - Narcizo (363)
Autumn 1 - Lathum (326)
mauchow 2 - bhlloy (386), Passacaglia (416)
Passacaglia 1 - Autumn (378)
Lathum 1 - mauchow (423)
Packers 1 - Danny (429)
Murrayyyyy 1 - Coffee (431)

Yet to vote: Hoops, fontisan, Zinto, Katylied, Packers

Passacaglia · 03-13-2013, 03:39 PM

Geez. All this posturing. Bad game not to be around at deadline for.

mauchow · 03-13-2013, 03:39 PM

I have a feeling tonights deadline might be a little whackier.

Lathum · 03-13-2013, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

Here's all the talk I've seen. Lathum declares he is a vanilla villager 4-5 times so far. Then he said if he was a wolf he would do a fake reveal. So if he was a wolf he would do a fake reveal and he said he wasn't a wolf. That's why I voted for him late last night. He's quick to point out when someone else does it but no one sensed it except for me (which may be a bad read on my part).

OK, I have read this paragraph 8 times and still have no idea what you are trying to say

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 03:46 PM

Well I need to make some sort of long-term voting decision. Of the candidates out there I feel least worst about voting murrayyyyy. So I shall continue to hitch my wagon to the coffee train. Realising what that could be interpreted as. (*whisper* me being Peck and having coffee as my designated wolfy).

Unvote bhlloy
Vote murrayyyyy

Coffee Warlord · 03-13-2013, 03:48 PM

YOU FOOL!

Narcizo · 03-13-2013, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

OK, I have read this paragraph 8 times and still have no idea what you are trying to say

You wolfishly fake revealed as a non-wolf. I think.

PackerFanatic · 03-13-2013, 03:50 PM

Seems appropriate right now.

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

I'm ok with a vote for me. You wont kill a wolf but at least you wont hit a villager with a role

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

I don't want to vote CW, but will for survival. You will get no fake reveal or anything from me. I am just a villager

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

I'll switch to what ever keeps me alive.

That being said there will be no last minute reveal from me. I am just a villager. No great loss.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

no, but if I was a wolf at the very least I would be fake revealing

So you declare you are a villager at least 3 times last night and no night kill on you. Then you state if you were a wolf then you would fake reveal. So how would a villager reveal 3 times yesterday (not counting your I'm a villager and won't read the rules statement earlier) and somehow not get voted off. Simple answer would be because he was a wolf who fake revealed. (not saying it's right but you are the one who made the above statements the most)

In the past 2 games (one in which I was a wolf) you have voiced public opinion on why we left someone who claims to be a vanilla villager isn't night killed. By that logic, how did a night kill not happen to you?

I've talked myself out of Coffee now...

unvote coffee warlord
vote Lathum

Lathum · 03-13-2013, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

So you declare you are a villager at least 3 times last night and no night kill on you. Then you state if you were a wolf then you would fake reveal. So how would a villager reveal 3 times yesterday (not counting your I'm a villager and won't read the rules statement earlier) and somehow not get voted off. Simple answer would be because he was a wolf who fake revealed. (not saying it's right but you are the one who made the above statements the most)

In the past 2 games (one in which I was a wolf) you have voiced public opinion on why we left someone who claims to be a vanilla villager isn't night killed. By that logic, how did a night kill not happen to you?

Your logic is flawed

early in games it isn't uncommon that wolves woud rather hunt for a rolled villager than kill a vanilla villager.

The biggest thing is I was under so much pressure yesterday, and am still unknown today, so why would the wolves waste their time night killing me when there is a high liklihood I will be a lynch target today?

PackerFanatic · 03-13-2013, 04:10 PM

Let's ramp it up and make this a four-horse race...for no good reason other than I can!

VOTE AUTUMN

murrayyyyy · 03-13-2013, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

The biggest thing is I was under so much pressure yesterday, and am still unknown today, so why would the wolves waste their time night killing me when there is a high liklihood I will be a lynch target today?

Why would you be a lynch target today? I've been doing more D1 reading than today but have you jumped to the lead in votes? You just said that early on they try for specialty characters. If you are truly vanilla then why target you? Why wouldn't they leave you around for a few days and take you out then?

Autumn · 03-13-2013, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autumn

I've had a lot of school work the past couple days, so been out of it a bit. I'm hoping to be more involved today.

Or instead maybe my day will turn into a disaster. I'll catch up now, but then will be scarce until about 9 EST.

Autumn · 03-13-2013, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

And seriously, why are there 2 R's in Starrcade?

Quote:

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Seriously, no one called him on this?

03-13-2013, 02:30 PM	#408
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	I hate to push him up by 3 at this point, but he fits into my group I was looking at earlier. VOTE COFFEE WARLORD __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

03-13-2013, 03:30 PM	#434
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	Alright, I need to think on this more. Jumped the gun and made myself look bad, I don't like that. UNVOTE CW __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

03-13-2013, 03:36 PM	#436
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	...but in this game, wouldn't we want Lucifer dead? DID YOU JUST REVEAL AS A WOLF? __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

03-13-2013, 03:50 PM	#444
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	Seems appropriate right now. __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

03-13-2013, 04:10 PM	#447
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	Let's ramp it up and make this a four-horse race...for no good reason other than I can! VOTE AUTUMN __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

03-13-2013, 02:15 PM	#401
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	vote coffee warlord I dont think Lathum is a wolf.

03-13-2013, 02:16 PM	#402
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	Honestly, I do not like this line of thinking that wolves would risk a late switch from Lathum to DT if both are villagers. In that case I think wolves stick with their vote. I think the late switchers (not necessarily late voters) are less likely to be wolves if Lathum is a villager.

03-13-2013, 02:21 PM	#403
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	Yes i agree with that Danny. If Lathum is a villager those late switches look pretty good. I'm more interested in the earlier push that seems to take CW and Mau off the table. Obviously this is contingent on Lathum not being a wolf in the first place

03-13-2013, 02:22 PM	#404
murrayyyyy College Benchwarmer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Las Vegas	Well lets do a midday switch since I said I liked two early and one seems to be the favorite of the group. unvote Lathum vote Coffee Warlord

03-13-2013, 02:24 PM	#405
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	Sweet, a few more votes and we can raise the white smoke!

03-13-2013, 02:26 PM	#406
JAG Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: St. Paul, MN	Coffee Warlord 4 - Chubby (356), mauchow (390), Danny (401), murra5y (404) bhlloy 2 - Coffee Warlord (360), Narcizo (363) Autumn 1 - Lathum (326) mauchow 1 - bhlloy (386) Passacaglia 1 - Autumn (378)

03-13-2013, 02:33 PM	#409
Narcizo Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2006	That's quite the pile onto Coffee. I think he's a decent candidate - a lot of what he was saying yesterday seemed a bit like he was playing to the gallery. But I can't fault his vote. Given the fact that it was day one I'd have done the same thing.

03-13-2013, 02:34 PM	#410
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	I'm seriously curious how I fit into this supposed that is leading towards a big run here.

03-13-2013, 02:34 PM	#411
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	supposed group, that is.

03-13-2013, 02:36 PM	#412
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	Me, play to the gallery? MADNESS!

03-13-2013, 02:56 PM	#420
murrayyyyy College Benchwarmer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Las Vegas	D2 above was in reference to me being stacked last game. Not this game obviously. I forget who but some stated the last hour votes for me were to see how I'd react.

03-13-2013, 02:59 PM	#421
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	Well, when you decide to pile onto one candidate in the middle of the day, you're not going to get much squirming.

03-13-2013, 03:00 PM	#422
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	Besides, I already peed out my morning coffee. No squirming necessary.

03-13-2013, 03:00 PM	#423
mauchow Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Murfreesboro, TN	unvote CW vote Lathum My afternoon is a little busier but I will still be able to check in throughout the evening and I will without a doubt have zero issue being around deadline.

03-13-2013, 03:09 PM	#426
Narcizo Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2006	Meh! I remember why I find werewolf tough now. I don't know what to think. In these circumstances I tend to think it's villager chasing villager, creating havoc and the wolves not doing much of anything. I'm trying to give murrayyyyy some leeway for being new but I'm really not liking his actions today.

03-13-2013, 03:11 PM	#427
Passacaglia Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Big Ten Country	Wait, what did murrayyyyy do? PF's vote seems like the crazier one.

03-13-2013, 03:12 PM	#428
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	So...your line of thinking. You want to encourage movement later by voting me now. I'd rather have discussion all day as much as possible. Doesn't work as well when one candidate has a big lead. You expect the wolves to squirm. When they already have an advantage right now (with Ray & Winston dead). When they still have their full number and can, theoretically, still convert. I'd totally sacrifice a wolf to look good if need be in this position. Not a great line of thinking in my book.

03-13-2013, 03:17 PM	#429
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	unvote coffee Vote packerfanatic

03-13-2013, 03:23 PM	#431
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	Putting my money where my yaks are. Unvote Bhlloy Vote Murrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrraaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy

03-13-2013, 03:24 PM	#432
Narcizo Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2006	One thing I'd like to say is that there's a lot of talk about this group of three or that group of three and them "having" to include a wolf. This is just silly. Pick three names at random and start talking about that group having to have a wolf in it and it stands up just as well.

03-13-2013, 03:33 PM	#435
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	Damn right! You see! A vote for Coffee is a vote for LUCIFER.

03-13-2013, 03:36 PM	#437
Narcizo Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2006	As of #435 Coffee Warlord 2 - Chubby (356), murra5y (404) bhlloy 1 - Narcizo (363) Autumn 1 - Lathum (326) mauchow 2 - bhlloy (386), Passacaglia (416) Passacaglia 1 - Autumn (378) Lathum 1 - mauchow (423) Packers 1 - Danny (429) Murrayyyyy 1 - Coffee (431) Yet to vote: Hoops, fontisan, Zinto, Katylied, Packers

03-13-2013, 03:39 PM	#438
Passacaglia Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Big Ten Country	Geez. All this posturing. Bad game not to be around at deadline for.

03-13-2013, 03:39 PM	#439
mauchow Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Murfreesboro, TN	I have a feeling tonights deadline might be a little whackier.

03-13-2013, 03:46 PM	#441
Narcizo Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2006	Well I need to make some sort of long-term voting decision. Of the candidates out there I feel least worst about voting murrayyyyy. So I shall continue to hitch my wagon to the coffee train. Realising what that could be interpreted as. (whisper me being Peck and having coffee as my designated wolfy). Unvote bhlloy Vote murrayyyyy

03-13-2013, 03:48 PM	#442
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	YOU FOOL!

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