Front Office Football Central  

Go Back   Front Office Football Central > Main Forums > Dynasty Reports
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read Statistics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-24-2011, 04:30 PM   #1
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
90 pages in 60 days: Norv takes a stab at the Nicholls Fellowship

i was cleaning up my hard drive and found some of my old screenplays and remembered that the nicholls fellowship is coming up. the nicholls fellowship is a screenwriting competition put on by the academy of motion pictures to find up and coming screenwriters. out of thousands of entries they pick 5 winners who receive a one year 30k endowment to work more extensively on their writing.

quite a few writers have gone on to success after winning the competition including bragi schut who wrote 'season of the witch'(it's not his fault the execution sucked) and mike rich who wrote 'finding forrester' and 'secretariat'.

it's a huge opportunity but an insanely competitive one. i've entered the competition before but never made it past the first round. i'd love to chalk that up to poor luck but in truth my scripts haven't been very good.

so in an attempt to keep myself motivated i thought i'd start a dynasty chronicling my progress from notes to final draft. i don't know how compelling it will be (the thread. or my script. ba dum bum) but thoughts and feedback are welcome.

NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2011, 04:42 PM   #2
Young Drachma
Dark Cloud
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Love the idea for a dynasty. You can do it.
__________________
Current Dynasty:The Zenith of Professional Basketball Careers (FBPB/FBCB)
FBCB / FPB3 Mods
Young Drachma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2011, 06:43 PM   #3
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
in reading some of the winning scripts i'd say the 2 most important components are structure and story. which also happens to be the 2 weakest parts of my game. dialogue is important but apparently less so. in fact some of the dialogue is downright cringeworthy.

now, it's not that i don't know how to write structure it's just that i thought i was good enough to break the rules.

i wasn't and i'm not.

in fact breaking the rules is the worst thing an amateur can do. professionals can break the rules because they've proven they can tell a coherent story. amateurs that break the rules come off as,'does this guy even know what the fuck he's doing?'

so this time around structure is priority numero uno. 3 acts, theme, arc, conflict, resolution.

now about that story...

in the past i didn't focus much on story because in my ignorance i claimed my stuff was episodic and character driven like the coens or david lynch. act one had nothing to do with act three because it's all just commentary on the human condition, maaaan.

now that i''m older and wiser i see how dumb that was. screenplays aren't art they're products to be sold. they have to be easy to follow with mass appeal. meet boy. boy meets girl. boy loses girl. boy gets girl back. credits. everything in between is just glue.

that said, i've been working on a story on and off for the past couple years that's engaging, original and completely unexplored by hollywood. it could be huge.

but some asshole stole it
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2011, 07:35 PM   #4
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
so if you've seen jaws you know the basic story of the uss indianapolis. ship delivers the little boy bomb. is sunk departing for further duty. surviving crew stuck in ocean for 5 days and routinely attacked by sharks until rescued.

that's a great story in and of itself but it gets better. the captain of the ship was court marshaled for failing to zig zag to avoid enemy torpedoes. something surviving crew members and other navy officials saw as scapegoating by the higher ups for their own failure to provide an escort. years later. well, i'll just snip it from wiki:
Quote:
On 6 November 1968, McVay committed suicide by shooting himself with his service revolver at his home in Litchfield, Connecticut, holding in his hand a toy sailor given to him by his father. He was found just outside of his back porch by his gardener. Though a note was not left, McVay was known by those close to him to have suffered from loneliness, particularly after losing his wife to cancer. McVay also struggled throughout his life from vicious letters and phone calls he periodically received from grief-stricken relatives of dead crewmen aboard the Indianapolis.
but that's not the story i wanted to tell. the story i wanted to tell was the one seen from the eyes of the twelve year old that did a school project that ultimately got capt. mcvay exonerated. another clip:
Quote:
USS*Indianapolis survivors organized, and many spent years attempting to clear their skipper's name...
Over fifty years after the incident, a 12-year-old schoolboy in Pensacola, Florida, Hunter Scott, was instrumental in raising awareness of the miscarriage of justice carried out at the captain's court-martial. As part of a school history project, the young man interviewed nearly 150 survivors of the Indianapolis sinking and reviewed 800 documents. His testimony before the US Congress brought national attention to the situation.
fucking brilliant right? that's a story that needs to be told. that's MY story. only, like i said, some asshole beat me to it

Quote:
A film about Hunter Scott is to be directed by J. J. Abrams
welp... what else ya got?
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2011, 09:34 PM   #5
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
how about a post apocalyptic movie? those haven't been done to death the past couple years.

(random thoughts and note taking)
  • the idea i keep coming back to is how survivors on the surface of the planet would react to the knowledge that a small number of people saw nuclear holocaust as inevitable and actually 'immanitized the eschaton' or brought about the end of the world to start anew underground.
  • how would you react if your world was destroyed, you were dying of radiation sickness and the people that did it were just a few miles beneath your feet?
  • the subterranean thing is a pervasive idea in pop culture from dr. strangelove and the matrix movies to radiohead and hg wells. it's cliche, but it's also a part of our subconscious. we're all aware of gov't facilities underground.
  • survivors would have to take the high ground to avoid the sea of radioactivity at ocean levels. the rocky mountains make sense. i like the idea of a landlocked island. i also like the idea of a mountaintop as a sanctuary. a massive nuclear exchange is followed by nuclear winter which would make survival at altitude insufferable.
  • most survivors would be women. most men would be killed off in military duty and those that weren't would be consumed by cancer due to the high levels of radiation. cancer affects men more than women. can a matriarchal society be vengeful?
  • i think the theme at this point is individual survival vs. species survival. if your raison d'etre is to take vengeance on the people that destroyed the world but those same people are the best hope to carry on the human race, what do you do?
  • i like the dichotomy of some people being trapped in the clouds and others being trapped underground. like they're at opposite ends of an iceberg. also an obvious heaven/hell metaphor.
  • alcohol thins the blood and lowers your exposure to radiation. many survivors would be drunks.
  • i like the female angle of the post apoc. i think i have a beginning and ending but wanna give it some more thought. also research matriarchal tribal societies and their attitudes toward violence/war.
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2011, 12:03 PM   #6
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
i've been reading scripts the past couple days and i'm feeling a little disheartened.

the line to get in the club is so long and even if i make it to the front there's no guarantee the doorman will let me in. most of the girls are 9's and 10's and i'm at best a 5. these knock off shoes and handbag aren't doing me any favors either. maybe i should just go get a taco. whimper.

little known fact: there has never been a verified matriarchal society in the history of humankind. so, creative license there i guess.

the genesis of my story comes from this picture
tunneler.jpg
what's the air force doing with a gigantic tunneling machine?

aliens.

well, probably not aliens. but i found the pic on a conspiracy website and they chalked it up to subterranean aliens. which got my motor running.

what if the gov't faked the moon landings and the bulk of the nasa program to funnel money to a program designed to create a massive city underground?

toss in a little strangelove and the various rumors surrounding the denver international airport and it's a veritable intrigue potpourri.

Last edited by NorvTurnerOverdrive : 01-25-2011 at 12:08 PM.
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2011, 12:46 PM   #7
chesapeake
College Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Good luck, NTO. I'll be following this dynasty.

Read other scripts for ideas and instruction, not for motivation. Obviously, you'll be reading scripts that were not only sold, but made into films -- and probably very good films. You aren't being fair to yourself if you compare your current project with a recent Oscar nominee.

You have some intriguing story ideas here. Sort of Atlas Shrugged meets Fallout.
chesapeake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2011, 08:38 PM   #8
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by chesapeake View Post
...
thanks. i appreciate the encouragement.
  • i got a lot done today. i sketched out a rough outline on paper. writing things down physically lets me draw timelines and charts and such.
  • i think i have a few good characters etched out but the protagonist needs a lot of work. i have her character arc mapped but i'm still not sure who she is.
  • i'm struggling with getting a lot of exposition out without relying on flashbacks, dream sequences and long narratives.
  • i'm not reinventing the wheel with the story. there's too much background shit going on and i really just want to focus on the characters and trying to invoke emotion.
  • i think i'm going to change the setting from mountaintop to secluded mountain town. it works better and is easier for the reader to visualize.
  • robots! i didn't really wanna go full blown science fiction but i wanted something patrolling the perimeter of the entrance to the underground city and having humans do it was too troublesome to the plot. i'm thinking some iteration of those creepy as fuck darpa dogs-

-is it science fiction if the shit really exists? idk.
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2011, 08:27 AM   #9
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
  • a lot of brainstorming. i've written quite a few outlines but not really happy with anything yet.
  • i did come up with an early logline though:
  • 'a woman must decide who lives and who dies in a battle between the old world and the new.'
  • i'm basing the antagonist on savonarola the dominican priest from the florentine renaissance. right now i see the character as kathy bates from misery meets tv evangelist meets savoranola. part conviction, part bs artist, part crazy.
  • still not sure about the protagonist. orphaned at a young age growing up in a post apocalyptic world... right now i kind of see her as a drunken sarah connor. idk. needs work.
  • i've been looking to william wadsworth for inspiration. i like that he doesn't distinguish between the living and the dead in his poems. i'm contemplating naming the the lead lucy after his character in the 'lucy' poems.
  • i feel pretty good about the beginning and ending i just need more dramatic moments that push the story forward
  • the screenplay from 'seven' is a case study in adherence to theme.
  • i have this william blake painting as my desktop bg for inspiration. i'd like to incorporate it somehow but don't think many people are familiar with it. i think it's called 'all religions are one'
    but538_2_welcome.jpg
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2011, 10:11 AM   #10
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
  • screenwriting is a delicate balance of description and brevity. conveying ideas and mental images as concisely as possible while keeping the reader's attention. it's fucking maddening.
  • no 2 writers do it the same. i went back and read true romance and natural born killers because i knew they were spec scripts. tarantino's scripts read just like he talks, fast and laden with pop culture references. if you've ever wondered how he went from video store clerk to directing reservoir dogs in a couple years read the nbk script. it's amazing.
  • then you've got alan ball, the guy that wrote american beauty. his style is slow and uber descriptive. he puts everything in there from camera angles to what the actor is doing with his hands. but there's an elegance in his writing that makes the trivial fucking captivating.
  • so what's the secret? i don't think there is a secret. just make that shit interesting.
  • i'm not the best storyteller. what i do have is an infatuation with symbolism and metaphor... probably to my own detriment. but it's what i want to do. if it's done well it's imperceptible. fitting nicely within the action of the story.
  • so that's my focus. interesting action. i keep streamlining the story into something more simple. although there's still a lot of kinks to be worked out.
  • i've been working on the hook and have most of it plotted out. i should finish it today. here's the rough of the first page or so (spelling and format are guaranteed to be wonky)-
    Picture 1.png
    Picture 2.png
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2011, 09:40 PM   #11
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
i just found out that 'the departed' was a remake of a chinese film called 'infernal affairs'. did people know this?

i've watched jaws probably ten times. not because it's something i can emulate but i really wanted to study the pacing of the film. fucking masterful.

a lot of work, mostly in outline form. my biggest concern was finding an emotional base that readers can relate to. in doing so the theme of the film has changed; it's now about exclusion. i'll explain:

the protagonists outward ambition is vengeance for the destruction of the world. her inward ambition is retribution towards a group that she feels rejected her. as the leader of the group she makes no plans nor has any interest in the future(outside of destroying the underground) which is reflected in the group by their indifference towards death.

the antagonists outward ambition is to repopulate the earth as Gods chosen people. her inward ambition is to live forever as a messianic figure in an updated version of the bible. in the beginning of the script the protag is in charge and has little patience for her religion and she is generally excluded. through a series of prophecies and theatrics she ultimately gains control of the group and the protag is excluded.

and so on and so forth. of course they share the same goal(to destroy the underground) which i hope will be the interesting twist.

those initial pages of dialogue i posted are no longer the beginning of the script but are an important part and are used later in dream sequences. i'll post some more pages after i feel more comfortable with them.

my 2 biggest things right now are:
-am i saying it with my voice?
-is that shit interesting?

i listen to clint mansell when i write/think. it sets the proper mood
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2011, 07:52 AM   #12
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
things are going great. i'm really happy with how it's turning out...

that's a lie. i'm consumed by crippling self doubt. in all honesty the fellowship as a motivational tool to get writing has worked. but i doubt i'll even submit a script as it would be a waste of 50 bucks. i'll still stick to my deadline though.

i'm just about done with the first act. i could probably barrel through it and get it all out on paper in a couple days but i tend to type a few lines, overanalyze them, then hate myself and screw off for an hour. that's why-

i've taken to disconnecting the internet when writing. it works. i still overanalyze and hate myself, but there's nowhere to go.

the pacing and dialogue suck donkey cocks. other than that, i feel pretty good about the structure, which is amazing.

i'd post a page or two, but i don't like any enough to do so. so, in it's place the entire new radiohead:
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2011, 11:35 AM   #13
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
since i'm not doing anything productive with this thread i thought i'd explain movie structure(or any storytelling structure,really)for anyone that's interested. i'll use no country for old men as an example since some people confuse the ambiguous ending(it's not ambiguous. i'll explain that too) for unconventional structure.

1. status quo
this is the world before the story's turmoil. ncfom has a narrative prologue. then chigurh kills the deputy. this sets the tone of the film (see: jaws) then we move to the status quo which is moss hunting in the desert. this also sets the theme of the film. hunting and the one that got away.

2.breaking the status quo
moss finds the bad drug deal and takes the money

3. first response to broken status quo
mexicans/chigurh are hired to find the money

4. engagement with first response creates new dilemma
this is usually the 'big mistake' a pretty common plot device. in ncfom moss goes back to the scene of the crime and leaves his truck.

5. second and successive action to status quo and new dilemma
moss has to go on the run

6. point of no return
moss discovers he's being chased and decides to fight back . chigurh murders the mexicans

7. inevitable final action
the showdown. moss ditches the transponder. chigurh kills stephen roots character. this is no longer about business.

8. low point
moss ends up in the hospital. mexicans find carla jean and her mom. chigurh kills carson.

9. resolution
well, there wasn't one. it's a tragedy. the protag doesn't live. but the message was wrapped up clearly and the message was what the movie was really all about.

obviously a lot more happened in between. but that's the basic framework that every movie has.

here's the ending explained if anyone is curious:
Spoiler
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 12:32 PM   #14
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
well, there's a saying about writing, 'don't get it right, get it written.' with that in mind i have in fact been barreling through. i'm at page 50 of what i anticipate will be about 100 pages.

i'd put my satisfaction with it so far at about a 3/10. but metaphorically speaking at least there's a hunk of clay on the potters wheel now.

where i'm at now, the second half of act 2, is going to be the hardest part. moreover it's where most scripts/movies fail. act 3 is a huge action set piece which i've had mapped out from the beginning. getting there, and getting there in an interesting way is going to be a challenge.

it's not high concept but i am trying to screw with convention. for instance themes in movies are always stated in the first 5 minutes (inception: an old man, filled with regret, waiting to die alone) and so is mine, but i hope it's ambiguous enough that people misconstrue it until the end.

also, i'm trying to do a bunch of 'head fakes' before the inciting incident. ie: the tornado hits dorothy's house but instead of going to oz she just wakes up, dusts herself off and goes back to the farm. oh well, just another tornado. it may fall flat but, idk, it's interesting to me. i try to imagine myself as someone who reads scripts for a living and sees the same formula over and over. it must get boring.

and of course the protag and antag sharing the same goal. which, if i don't get act 2 right will be a complete failure.

as always i looked for a page or 2 to post, but hate them all. here's phoebe cates

Last edited by NorvTurnerOverdrive : 02-25-2011 at 12:35 PM.
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2011, 02:10 PM   #15
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
so, the rough first is done. which, like i said, is like having a hunk of clay on the potters wheel.

everything needs an overhaul. particularly dialogue and pacing(beats) beats from wiki:

Quote:
Beats are specific, measured, and spaced to create a pace that moves the progress of the story forward. Audiences feel uneven or erratic beats. Uneven beats are the most forgettable or sometimes tedious parts of a film. Erratic beats jolt the audience unnecessarily. Every cinematic genre has a beat that is specific to its development. Action film has significantly more beats (usually events); drama has fewer beats (usually protagonist decisions or discovery). Between each beat a sequence occurs. This sequence is often a series of scenes that relates to the last beat and leads up to the next beat.

In most American films the beat falls approximately every five minutes.

Following is a beat example from The Shawshank Redemption:

• At 25 minutes: Andy talks to Red and asks for rock hammer. - Decision
• At 30 minutes: Andy gets rock hammer. - Event
• At 35 minutes: Andy risks his life to offer financial advice to Mr. Hadley. - Decision
• At 40 minutes: Andy notes ease of carving his name in the wall. - Discovery
• At 45 minutes: Mr. Hadley beats Bogs severely. - Event

After each beat listed above, a significant series of results takes place in the form of the sequence, but what most people remember are the beats, the moment something takes place with the protagonist.

i've been listening to john updike and cormac mccarthy on audiobook to help get my vocabulary synapses firing so i can punch up the dialogue. i don't wanna go over the top with it as the characters aren't educated. i just want to add a little flavor.

i've had to reel things back quite a bit. my ambition was met with the harsh reality that i don't have the writing skills to pull off everything i wanted to do. it's probably for the best.

that said, i am pretty satisfied with the shape it's taken. if i can get to a point where i feel decent about it in a couple weeks i'll upload it to triggerstreet. if i get decent reviews there i may go ahead and enter it in the nicholl's. shitty or not, it's still better odds than the lottery.

it's silly to post anything as it'll undoubtedly change but in interest of the 'dynasty'
Picture 1.pngPicture 2.png
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2011, 02:47 PM   #16
JediKooter
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: San Diego via Sausalito via San Jose via San Diego
Very interesting man. Didn't even know about the fellowship award thing.

What I've seem to have found out about writers is, they have a tendency to over think things which clogs them up. Keep it simple and let it flow.
__________________
I'm no longer a Chargers fan, they are dead to me

Coming this summer to a movie theater near you: The Adventures of Jedikooter: Part 4
JediKooter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2011, 03:39 PM   #17
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by JediKooter View Post
Very interesting man. Didn't even know about the fellowship award thing.

What I've seem to have found out about writers is, they have a tendency to over think things which clogs them up. Keep it simple and let it flow.
yep, there's a bunch. sundance, slamdance, sxsw, disney etc. etc. nicholl's is obv. the most prestigious and financially rewarding.

and i overthink things to death. but i have a baby with the bathwater mentality where if one thing is wrong the whole thing is fucked. can't help it.

Last edited by NorvTurnerOverdrive : 03-17-2011 at 03:39 PM.
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2011, 04:18 PM   #18
JediKooter
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: San Diego via Sausalito via San Jose via San Diego
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive View Post
yep, there's a bunch. sundance, slamdance, sxsw, disney etc. etc. nicholl's is obv. the most prestigious and financially rewarding.

and i overthink things to death. but i have a baby with the bathwater mentality where if one thing is wrong the whole thing is fucked. can't help it.

Ah man. Just scrap the one thing that is wrong and see how the rest of it stands without that part. I do understand that old habits die hard though.

Out of curiosity, have you entered a script into any competition?
__________________
I'm no longer a Chargers fan, they are dead to me

Coming this summer to a movie theater near you: The Adventures of Jedikooter: Part 4
JediKooter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2011, 05:07 PM   #19
NorvTurnerOverdrive
College Benchwarmer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by JediKooter View Post
Ah man. Just scrap the one thing that is wrong and see how the rest of it stands without that part. I do understand that old habits die hard though.

Out of curiosity, have you entered a script into any competition?
nicholl's and slamdance a few years ago. bounced in the first round of nicholl's. never got a notification from slamdance but i can't imagine i fared much better.

tbh, i was naive and thought high concept meant breaking every screenwriting rule possible. looking at that stuff now... yeesh.

it's a silly endeavor. and a statistically fruitless one. hell, pulitzer prize winning authors fail at screenwriting. but it's a challenge and i enjoy it.
NorvTurnerOverdrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2011, 06:33 PM   #20
JediKooter
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: San Diego via Sausalito via San Jose via San Diego
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive View Post
nicholl's and slamdance a few years ago. bounced in the first round of nicholl's. never got a notification from slamdance but i can't imagine i fared much better.

tbh, i was naive and thought high concept meant breaking every screenwriting rule possible. looking at that stuff now... yeesh.

it's a silly endeavor. and a statistically fruitless one. hell, pulitzer prize winning authors fail at screenwriting. but it's a challenge and i enjoy it.

Dang that sucks. Hopefully your next one fares much better.

I took a screen writing class about 3 years ago and the instructor was very adamant about sticking to the format. A pretty good class actually, but, a total pain when half the room thinks they are Mickey Spillane and had the next great American screen play.

Keep it up, I'll definitely be checking in on this dynasty.
__________________
I'm no longer a Chargers fan, they are dead to me

Coming this summer to a movie theater near you: The Adventures of Jedikooter: Part 4
JediKooter is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:05 PM.



Powered by vBulletin Version 3.6.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.