OT: Valedictorian case update

sabotai · 05-09-2003, 05:15 PM

The Bitch won

If she actually gets any money out of this...

EDIT: Posted after I saw Crappy posted a link to a story on this as well...

EDIT 2: Why the fuck do you care so much 11 year ago me? Why so ragey emo at everything?

Craptacular · 05-09-2003, 05:17 PM

pay attention

Following on that Valedictorian Lawsuit

sabotai · 05-09-2003, 05:18 PM

haha, I wrote that edit while you were posting your message...shut up

Fritz · 05-09-2003, 05:18 PM

the final sentence of the article sabotai posted:

'The third case, in Michigan, involves a student who wanted an A changed to an A-plus so he would be more likely to be valedictorian."

WTFO

sabotai · 05-09-2003, 05:20 PM

It's getting too fuckin out of hand...

Craptacular · 05-09-2003, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sabotai

If she actually gets any money out of this...

Hopefully the only money she'll get out of it is an appearance fee to be on Jerry Springer.

sabotai · 05-09-2003, 05:25 PM

From the article Crap posted in the other thread...

"Jacobs said Hornstine had been harassed in the week since she filed the lawsuit. She has received threatening notes, and her house was hit with eggs last weekend, he said."

What the fuck did she expect!?! I hope that at graduation they jeer her when she makes her speach (and from what articles have stated about the student's opinion of her, it's likely)

Oh, I doubt her daddy judge had nothing to do with this either...

Fritz · 05-09-2003, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sabotai

Oh, I doubt her daddy judge had nothing to do with this either...

thats the first thing I thought

when you sue for an honor, it is no honor.

sabotai · 05-09-2003, 05:28 PM

"when you sue for an honor, it is no honor."

Like when you sue to become President.

Fritz · 05-09-2003, 05:29 PM

boot to the head

BFleming · 05-09-2003, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sabotai
From the article Crap posted in the other thread...

"Jacobs said Hornstine had been harassed in the week since she filed the lawsuit. She has received threatening notes, and her house was hit with eggs last weekend, he said."

What the fuck did she expect!?! I hope that at graduation they jeer her when she makes her speach (and from what articles have stated about the student's opinion of her, it's likely)

Oh, I doubt her daddy judge had nothing to do with this either...

Hey sabotai, what are you doing the day of moorestown's graduation??

CAsterling · 05-09-2003, 08:45 PM

Couldn't resist the temptation any longer - must use my favourite phrase.

"Only In America" !!!!!!!!!!

JonInMiddleGA · 05-09-2003, 08:57 PM

I'll probably get ripped for it, but from the articles I read earlier today, it seems I had the same take on this case that the judge did.

sabotai · 05-09-2003, 10:17 PM

"Hey sabotai, what are you doing the day of moorestown's graduation??"

I do not know, but I have a feeling I might be in the area of Moorestown.

Jon, I think the judge is missing the point. I think she and some other people are not looking passed her disability. She has a disability and should be treated as equal to the other students. But that doesn't mean she should be given unfair advantages, like having a GPA calculation that inherently yields a higher GPA than what everyone else. IMO, this steps over the line of trying to level the playing field for disabled students and giving disabled students an advantage over nondisabled students.

BishopMVP · 05-09-2003, 10:18 PM

Even if the other kid would have had a higher GPA had the grade for the gym class (that she did not have to take) been taken out?

clintl · 05-10-2003, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BishopMVP
Even if the other kid would have had a higher GPA had the grade for the gym class (that she did not have to take) been taken out?

That is still not really a completely valid comparison, because presumably, that kid would have had to take something in place of the gym class, and there is no way of knowing how the kid would have done in this hypothetical other class.

I think there are plausible and defensible arguments for both sides, but like I said in the other thread, both sides have acted silly in this matter. It's not something that should have ended up in court, and the only way it could have ended up there is for both sides to have been unreasonable.

If the school's rules are that the student with the highest GPA is the valedictorian, the school should have stuck with that, and not tried to rewrite the rules just before graduation to cover a situation they didn't anticipate.

mckerney · 05-10-2003, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by clintl
If the school's rules are that the student with the highest GPA is the valedictorian, the school should have stuck with that, and not tried to rewrite the rules just before graduation to cover a situation they didn't anticipate.

If the schools rules are that students have to take gym classes that count on their GPA and she didn't take any gym classes, the school should not consider her for a GPA based award.

JonInMiddleGA · 05-10-2003, 01:23 PM

mckerney -- I think you've just hit on the problem here -- the school system established the IEP, not the student, establishing the curriculum established the guidelines and they don't seem to have addressed this at that time. And only when they realized they'd goofed somewhat by not anticipating this did they try to change the rules in mid-game. And that seems to be where she won in court, changing the criteria only after she was in front just screamed discrimination.

If they'd like to change them in some way in the future, I don't think that would be stopped, it's just that you can't change them in middle just because you don't like who's winning.

NevStar · 05-10-2003, 01:54 PM

But it wasn't like they were taking valedictory honors away from her, they wanted her to SHARE WITH TWO OTHERS!

It wouldn't hurt her at all to share the award... she could still put on college applications & resumes she was valedictorian. Hell, in 5 years nobody will care what you did in high school anyway.

The only purpose of this lawsuit was to try to ruin the chances of the two other people that deserved valedictorian as much as she did.

ISiddiqui · 05-10-2003, 04:48 PM

Quote:

And that seems to be where she won in court, changing the criteria only after she was in front just screamed discrimination.

Yeah, this is what I took away from the case as well. It screams discrimination when you change the rules because a handicaped person is going to win out. HOWEVER, this should still be reversed on appeal, because there was a rational basis for this classification (handicap isn't a suspect classification).

sabotai · 05-10-2003, 04:49 PM

I think she did much more harm to herself by sueing that sharing the award.

She's already decided to go to Harvard. So college isn't an argument. And as NevStar said, she still puts valedictorian on her future applications if she shares it or not.

Now, the students don't like it, parents don't like it. She's not going to get received well at graduation when she makes her speach, IF she does. Everyone at Harvard is going to know she was the one that had to sue to me named sole valedictorian. (Note: one of the guy swho would have been named co-valedictorian is also going to Harvard).

She's going to put herself through all this grief and embarrisment...just so that she didn't have to share valedictorian honors.

Craptacular · 05-10-2003, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NevStar
Hell, in 5 years nobody will care what you did in high school anyway.

Replace years with months. The day she starts at Harvard, do you honestly think anyone will give two craps about her H.S. career, other than knowing she sued. The same goes for any level of education past HS ... once you get in somewhere, your HS accomplishments mean jack squat.

clintl · 05-10-2003, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sabotai
I think she did much more harm to herself by sueing that sharing the award.

I agree with that, but it was still the school that screwed up in the first place.

sabotai · 05-10-2003, 06:14 PM

I agree that the school did screw up. Which is why if they tried to take valedictorian away from her (his GPA would have been higher), then I would have agreed with sueing (IF it was the ONLY option). But the fact that they were still going to give her valedictorian makes me wonder exactly what she would have lost.

I just don't get what the big deal is. The only thing that I see is that nothing happens to her and the people who really got screwed (the kid(s) that would have graduated higher than her) get what they would have gotten if the school didn't mess up. She's acting like they were trying to take it away, when all they were doing was acknowledging the accomplishments of the other students.

05-09-2003, 05:18 PM	#4
Fritz Lethargic Hooligan Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: hello kitty found my wallet at a big tent revival and returned it with all the cash missing	the final sentence of the article sabotai posted: 'The third case, in Michigan, involves a student who wanted an A changed to an A-plus so he would be more likely to be valedictorian." WTFO __________________ donkey, donkey, walk a little faster

05-09-2003, 05:29 PM	#10
Fritz Lethargic Hooligan Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: hello kitty found my wallet at a big tent revival and returned it with all the cash missing	boot to the head __________________ donkey, donkey, walk a little faster

05-09-2003, 08:45 PM	#12
CAsterling High School JV Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Herndon, Va	Couldn't resist the temptation any longer - must use my favourite phrase. "Only In America" !!!!!!!!!! __________________ The funniest comedy duo I have ever seen - www.magaga.com/

05-09-2003, 08:57 PM	#13
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	I'll probably get ripped for it, but from the articles I read earlier today, it seems I had the same take on this case that the judge did. __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis

05-09-2003, 10:17 PM	#14
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	"Hey sabotai, what are you doing the day of moorestown's graduation??" I do not know, but I have a feeling I might be in the area of Moorestown. Jon, I think the judge is missing the point. I think she and some other people are not looking passed her disability. She has a disability and should be treated as equal to the other students. But that doesn't mean she should be given unfair advantages, like having a GPA calculation that inherently yields a higher GPA than what everyone else. IMO, this steps over the line of trying to level the playing field for disabled students and giving disabled students an advantage over nondisabled students. Last edited by sabotai : 05-09-2003 at 10:18 PM.

05-09-2003, 05:17 PM	#2
Craptacular College Starter Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: The Mad City, WI	pay attention Following on that Valedictorian Lawsuit

05-09-2003, 05:20 PM	#5
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	It's getting too fuckin out of hand...

05-09-2003, 05:25 PM	#7
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	From the article Crap posted in the other thread... "Jacobs said Hornstine had been harassed in the week since she filed the lawsuit. She has received threatening notes, and her house was hit with eggs last weekend, he said." What the fuck did she expect!?! I hope that at graduation they jeer her when she makes her speach (and from what articles have stated about the student's opinion of her, it's likely) Oh, I doubt her daddy judge had nothing to do with this either...

05-09-2003, 05:28 PM	#9
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	"when you sue for an honor, it is no honor." Like when you sue to become President.

05-09-2003, 10:18 PM	#15
BishopMVP Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Concord, MA/UMass	Even if the other kid would have had a higher GPA had the grade for the gym class (that she did not have to take) been taken out?

05-10-2003, 01:23 PM	#18
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	mckerney -- I think you've just hit on the problem here -- the school system established the IEP, not the student, establishing the curriculum established the guidelines and they don't seem to have addressed this at that time. And only when they realized they'd goofed somewhat by not anticipating this did they try to change the rules in mid-game. And that seems to be where she won in court, changing the criteria only after she was in front just screamed discrimination. If they'd like to change them in some way in the future, I don't think that would be stopped, it's just that you can't change them in middle just because you don't like who's winning. __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis

05-10-2003, 01:54 PM	#19
NevStar High School Varsity Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Raleigh, NC	But it wasn't like they were taking valedictory honors away from her, they wanted her to SHARE WITH TWO OTHERS! It wouldn't hurt her at all to share the award... she could still put on college applications & resumes she was valedictorian. Hell, in 5 years nobody will care what you did in high school anyway. The only purpose of this lawsuit was to try to ruin the chances of the two other people that deserved valedictorian as much as she did. __________________ I can't think of a clever signature.

05-10-2003, 04:49 PM	#21
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	I think she did much more harm to herself by sueing that sharing the award. She's already decided to go to Harvard. So college isn't an argument. And as NevStar said, she still puts valedictorian on her future applications if she shares it or not. Now, the students don't like it, parents don't like it. She's not going to get received well at graduation when she makes her speach, IF she does. Everyone at Harvard is going to know she was the one that had to sue to me named sole valedictorian. (Note: one of the guy swho would have been named co-valedictorian is also going to Harvard). She's going to put herself through all this grief and embarrisment...just so that she didn't have to share valedictorian honors.

05-10-2003, 06:14 PM	#24
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	I agree that the school did screw up. Which is why if they tried to take valedictorian away from her (his GPA would have been higher), then I would have agreed with sueing (IF it was the ONLY option). But the fact that they were still going to give her valedictorian makes me wonder exactly what she would have lost. I just don't get what the big deal is. The only thing that I see is that nothing happens to her and the people who really got screwed (the kid(s) that would have graduated higher than her) get what they would have gotten if the school didn't mess up. She's acting like they were trying to take it away, when all they were doing was acknowledging the accomplishments of the other students.

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