Mount Rushmore of Professional Wrestling.

[Axxon]

This is inspired by the Macho Man thread.

I don't want to clutter up his thread with an off topic discussion so I'm doing it this way. I realize that Randy hit his stride during the years that I didn't watch wrestling ( about a 10 year hiatus ) so my attitude reflects that but he was being considered by those who watched him as one of the greatest in his profession and that may well be right. I decided to give my Mount Rushmore and see where everyone is at with this.

My Mount Rushmore of Wrestling:

Ric Flair
Andre the Giant
Roddy Piper
Dusty Rhodes

Dusty is the weak link on my Mount IMHO but if not for the American Dream I would have never given a flip about wrestling and he practically owned Florida when I was growing up. In fact, my hiatus started pretty soon after he left CWF for the Crockett promotions. Also, fact is, IMHO his in ring charisma was the best ever, even topping Ric but of course, that's so debatable since he had the face bump to help him. I would also say he was the best on the mic period but that honor really belongs to Piper and I don't see how anyone can "objectively" dispute that.

Anyway, this is my list; I eagerly await yours.

[Axxon]

dola,

wanted to add some honorable mentions.

Terry Funk
Harley Race
Jimmy Snuka
Bruno Sammartino
The Undertaker
Mick Foley

So many greats that almost get there but I'm solid with my four.

Greatest Personality in Wrestling:

Gordon Solie - to me Gordon WAS wrestling. nuff said.

[PurdueBrad]

Ric Flair
Ultimate Warrior
Sting
The Rock

This was a really tough list to make but I went through several different stages of being interested in wrestling and I think these guys represent each of those. The hardest one to leave off was probably Hulk Hogan, particularly because his career spanned such a long period (like Flair's).

[Chubby]

I just don't see how you can not have Hogan on this regardless of if you like him or not. He took wrestling to a whole new level. Man #4 is hard, I think the top 3 are pretty easy and while I like Piper and Rhodes I just don't see them as influencing as much change in the "sport" as the others. I guess I'll go with Stone Cold for #4 because I feel he had a bigger impact than anyone else I could think of...


Hogan
Andre
Flair
Stone Cold

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I just don't see how you can not have Hogan on this regardless of if you like him or not. He took wrestling to a whole new level. Man #4 is hard, I think the top 3 are pretty easy and while I like Piper and Rhodes I just don't see them as influencing as much change in the "sport" as the others. I guess I'll go with Stone Cold for #4 because I feel he had a bigger impact than anyone else I could think of...


Hogan
Andre
Flair
Stone Cold

Probably would be my four as well. Andre could be bumped if you are looking for more of a technical wrestler. Hogan and Flair did so much for their respective companies I don't see them being moved. Stone Cold likely wins for standout in the next generation, but I could see some others being solid secondary choices. There's a number of really good wrestlers in the next tier down though.

[Atocep]

Hogan
Flair
Austin
Undertaker

Hogan was professional wrestling in the 80s. Nothing really needs to be said about Flair. Austin is an easy selection as well IMO. Deciding who should be the 4th is what's difficult. You have guys like Macho Man, The Rock, Andre, Terry Funk, Mick Foley, Dusty Rhodes, Shawn Michaels, and Piper. I have to go with the Undertaker though. I don't think any one gimmick has had the lasting appeal that the Undertakers has and even though he's well past his prime his matches still get people's attention.

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I just don't see how you can not have Hogan on this regardless of if you like him or not. He took wrestling to a whole new level. Man #4 is hard, I think the top 3 are pretty easy and while I like Piper and Rhodes I just don't see them as influencing as much change in the "sport" as the others. I guess I'll go with Stone Cold for #4 because I feel he had a bigger impact than anyone else I could think of...


Hogan
Andre
Flair
Stone Cold

Don't feel bad. I made my list and was shocked when I left him off myself but I couldn't add him. That change you call a whole new level is what drove me from the sport. I didn't like the direction wrestling was going in because of the type of show he put on and he was a huge part of the death of the territory system so in my mind he killed CWF by doing that and it was Hiro Matsuda that made him so that was uncool.

Can't argue the impact though.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Ric Flair
Ultimate Warrior
Sting
The Rock

This was a really tough list to make but I went through several different stages of being interested in wrestling and I think these guys represent each of those. The hardest one to leave off was probably Hulk Hogan, particularly because his career spanned such a long period (like Flair's).

I'll throw my honorable mentions up there as well:

Hulk Hogan
Bill Goldberg (despite being a one move wrestler he carried WCW for a decent time)
Bret Hart
Road Dog Jesse James (purely for his mic skills)
Rowdy Roddy Piper
Undertaker
Mankind (for ability to sell a match)

[RainMaker]

I agree with Chubby. Hogan made wrestling mainstream. I'd probably go with.

Hogan - As I said, he made it mainstream. He was the guy who broke through into talk shows, movies, etc. Not to mention that he helped completely change the landscape of wrestling by his move to WCW. I can't think of anyone who has had such an impact on the profession.

Flair - Such a long career, so many accomplishments, played the arrogant/rich heel to perfection.

Andre - The first universally recognized "monster" in wrestling. There had been other greats, but he was just so dominating and so big.

Stone Cold - This was the toughest choice and could go so many different ways. I chose him not necessarily for his ring work, but I think he helped change wrestling. The anti-hero role which was rarely used in wrestling became a staple of the show and led to much more diverse characters.

[cartman]

Andre the Giant
Hulk Hogan
Rick Flair
Gorgeous George

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

I'll throw my honorable mentions up there as well:

Hulk Hogan
Bill Goldberg (despite being a one move wrestler he carried WCW for a decent time)
Bret Hart
Road Dog Jesse James (purely for his mic skills)
Rowdy Roddy Piper
Undertaker
Mankind (for ability to sell a match)

Dang, Andre not even an honorable mention. Tough crowd. I like your list pretty much. Solid choices.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Axxon

Don't feel bad. I made my list and was shocked when I left him off myself but I couldn't add him. That change you call a whole new level is what drove me from the sport. I didn't like the direction wrestling was going in because of the type of show he put on and he was a huge part of the death of the territory system so in my mind he killed CWF by doing that and it was Hiro Matsuda that made him so that was uncool.

Can't argue the impact though.

yah I can see that, for me I was a tyke when hogan/wwf was taking off so I was never exposed to the territory aspect of it growing up.

I guess my honorable mentions would be Bret Hart and Undertaker. I think if I had been more exposed to the southern wresting growing up I'd be more likely to put a Sting/Funk/Dusty in there but growing up in NY all you ever saw was WWF.

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by Chubby

yah I can see that, for me I was a tyke when hogan/wwf was taking off so I was never exposed to the territory aspect of it growing up.

I guess my honorable mentions would be Bret Hart and Undertaker. I think if I had been more exposed to the southern wresting growing up I'd be more likely to put a Sting/Funk/Dusty in there but growing up in NY all you ever saw was WWF.

Southern wrestling for me was always more real. I mean, dudes like the Funks, Harley Race, the Von Erichs, Dusty, Ron Bass, etc all looked like dudes you'd see getting drunk in a bar and beating the shit out of each other just like they did in the ring. It was easy to buy the kayfabe with these guys.

It brought such heat to the angles that you wouldn't believe and IMHO, and it's VERY IMHO since I didn't have much exposure to WWF stuff, never went that route and captured that magic. Even in the early days guys like the Iron Sheik were cartoony. Ox Baker and the Koloffs on the other hand, far grittier and more believable villains IMHO but like you I know this opinion is heavily regionally biased.

[Chubby]

ok I'm going to throw a name out there that I think should being discussion and I'm surprised nobody has mentioned. I don't think he's mount rushmore worthy (see below) but could buy an honorable mention on him...

HHH

he was as much a part of the attitude era as austin was but to me, the whole marrying Steph thing just cheapens his whole legacy. All the titles/trying to be the next flair kinda just doesn't seem as great because in my eyes he slept his way to the top. Just my $0.02, curious how others view HHH

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by Chubby

ok I'm going to throw a name out there that I think should being discussion and I'm surprised nobody has mentioned. I don't think he's mount rushmore worthy (see below) but could buy an honorable mention on him...

HHH

he was as much a part of the attitude era as austin was but to me, the whole marrying Steph thing just cheapens his whole legacy. All the titles/trying to be the next flair kinda just doesn't seem as great because in my eyes he slept his way to the top. Just my $0.02, curious how others view HHH

I considered him but I'd put him behind Bret and Stone Cold and probably Rock too from his era. Not mount worthy but not a stretch to include in the discussion.

A couple of noteworthys.

Abdullah the Butcher - next to Andre the greatest monster evah.
The Orton family - ok, I only really like Ace who wouldn't make it on his own but as a family maybe.
Ricky Steamboat.
Jerry Lawler - never a favorite but arguably extremely influential in the sport.

[DaddyTorgo]

I think I'd agree with those who said

Flair
Hogan
Dusty
Stone Cold

If you want to go back older you could sure say someone like Andre the Giant instead of a Stone Cold, but I think you want to put a modern guy in there. Maybe you could swap out Dusty for Andre the Giant or put in say a Bob Backlund or something...if you want to really go old school there's a ton of guys you could use.

Fuck...makes me want to get back into TEW and DOTT. Fuuuuck...if I didn't have such difficulties trying to book in that game...hmmm...might be worth it anyways.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Not necessarily in order after the first one ... and I'm assuming this is "ever" rather than "in my lifetime"

Flair
HBK
Thesz
Gorgeous George

HM to: Harley Race, Road Warriors, Karl Gotch, Sammartino, Dusty, Funk, Inoki, Freddy Blassie, Dick Beyer (The Destroyer), Bret Hart, Austin, Rock, Mil Mascaras
edit to add one more: Arn Anderson, the quintessential pro wrestler that never won the top title

And Gordon Solie gets larger than life statue at the entrance to the Mount Rushmore viewing area, the only person I'd afford that honor.

*Before anyone asks, I could no more bring myself to put Hogan on this Rushmore than I could put FDR on the presidential one. Not trying to be political, that's just the best analogy I can think of to explain my position

[DaddyTorgo]

Okay...I guess the last TEW I bought was 2007...interesting. Does anyone have the 2007 DOTT mod?

[Axxon]

Ahh, nostalgia.

Here's my argument for who was the greatest mic man evah

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Not necessarily in order after the first one ... and I'm assuming this is "ever" rather than "in my lifetime"

Flair
HBK
Thesz
Gorgeous George

HM to: Harley Race, Road Warriors, Karl Gotch, Sammartino, Dusty, Funk, Inoki, Freddy Blassie, Dick Beyer (The Destroyer), Bret Hart, Austin, Rock, Mil Mascaras

And Gordon Solie gets larger than life statue at the entrance to the Mount Rushmore viewing area, the only person I'd afford that honor.

*Before anyone asks, I could no more bring myself to put Hogan on this Rushmore than I could put FDR on the presidential one. Not trying to be political, that's just the best analogy I can think of to explain my position

Agree wholeheartedly about Solie and better said than I did.

I don't like your analogy choice ( I could substitute pretty easily though ) but again,. agreed and said much better than I could have.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Axxon

Agree wholeheartedly about Solie and better said than I did.

Without question, if there'd be no Solie I would never have become the fan I did. He's what drew me in more than any single wrestler.

I don't like your analogy choice ... but again,. agreed and said much better than I could have.

At the risk of a tangent, I hesitated over that choice but in the end what are discussions about moreso than communicating? And analogies are a frequent tool for me, in this case I couldn't think of anything that would make my thought more clear (to those who know me here at least) than the one I chose.

[BYU 14]

Wow, so many good candidates....

Ric Flair - Simply the best...Woooooooooo
Terry Funk - Hardcore icon and as tough as they come, to this day
Shawn Michaels - Could carry about anyone to an A match
Hulk Hogan - Limited, but give him credit..he took wrestling mainstream

The Mount Rushmore tour guide, the greatest voice in wrestling history....Gordon Solie.

Ticket agent, Jim Cornette, could talk an Eskimo into buying ice cubes.

[Comey]

This is way tougher than I thought. I have Hart-Hogan-Flair...but after that, it's awfully tough. If it were for my own personal enjoyment, it'd be Hart-Rock-Piper-Heenan/Macho Man. I can't decide on a fourth for overall, though.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Without question, if there'd be no Solie I would never have become the fan I did. He's what drew me in more than any single wrestler.

Solie was the face of GCW for me and was the perfect foil to some of the zany characters they had. Simple expressions from him contributed more than a thousand words from most announcers could.

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Without question, if there'd be no Solie I would never have become the fan I did. He's what drew me in more than any single wrestler.



At the risk of a tangent, I hesitated over that choice but in the end what are discussions about moreso than communicating? And analogies are a frequent tool for me, in this case I couldn't think of anything that would make my thought more clear (to those who know me here at least) than the one I chose.

Hey, he had me at carotid artery.

In this case I think there really isn't any political aspect to your post. Everyone knows where you stand politically so using a political analogy is an extremely effective one to communicate your point. Since it is obvious that this is exactly why you chose it ( and there was no attempt to apply a political viewpoint TO the subject ) I don't think many would even question if that was political. I certainly didn't.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

Could carry about anyone to an A match

Reminds me of one of my favorite wrestling phrases/quotes/adages.

"... could wrestle a broomstick & make it look good"

Goes alongside other classics like "doesn't know a wristlock from a wristwatch", "it still says wrestling on the marquee", and the grossly underused/under appreciated/overlooked "Facey McFace" or "Heely McHeel" nicknames for generic characters.

[Scarecrow]

Ric Flair
Arn Anderson
Ole Anderson
Tully Blanchard

Mount Rushmore = 4 Horsemen

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Scarecrow

Ric Flair
Arn Anderson
Ole Anderson
Tully Blanchard

Mount Rushmore = 4 Horsemen

A man after my own heart!

Although I did have to give a nod to others in my Mt. Rushmore...shoulda had the stones to just say this.

[Hammer755]

Hogan & Flair have to be the top 2 ... no questions asked. If you're talking wrestling and not just wrestlers, then Vince McMahon is #3. Regardless of whether you love him or hate him, the combo of him and Hogan took pro wrestling from a regional endeavor to a national one. Beyond that, #4 is kind of a crapshoot - could be anyone from Gorgeous George to the Horsemen to the Ultimate Warrior to the Road Warriors to Bret Hart to Shawn Michaels to Steve Austin or maybe even a dozen more names. But in the end, I'd probably go with the Undertaker. He's been the one consistent big-time name that spans each of wrestling's last few eras.

Hulk Hogan
Ric Flair
Vince McMahon
Undertaker

[DeToxRox]

For me:

Rock
Flair
Austin
Funk

[Sun Tzu]

Alright...here goes.

Hulk Hogan - For those of you who left him off of your personal Mt. Rushmore, consider this: This thread, and wrestling as we know it today, wouldn't exist if it weren't for Hulk Hogan. There is no other wrestler in the history of the business that you can absolutely say that about.

Vince McMahon - Ruthless and brilliant. A dangerous and once in a lifetime combination for a wrestling promoter. You could make the same argument about this thread not existing without Vinny Mac.

Andre the Giant - Andre was the first true "larger than life" wrestler, and it wasn't just because of his stature. He was, and still is, mythical.

Ric Flair - The Nature Boy captured the hearts and minds of those who didn't buy into the whole "eat your vitamins & say your prayers" bit. The Flair piece of the pie was significantly smaller than Hogan, but without him wrestling would have undoubtedly lost out on generations of fans.

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Alright...here goes.

Hulk Hogan - For those of you who left him off of your personal Mt. Rushmore, consider this: This thread, and wrestling as we know it today, wouldn't exist if it weren't for Hulk Hogan. There is no other wrestler in the history of the business that you can absolutely say that about.

I agree that he had a huge impact on where wrestling is today. I just happen to like where wrestling came from better than where it went so it's not really palatable to include someone who had a detrimental effect on mount rushmore.

As for wrestling itself existing, there's no doubt in my mind it woulc still be here. It wasn't ever the moneymaker it became it did pay the bills and there wasn't a loss for wrestlers willing to work for the money. The territories actually allowed there to be many more ( though less luminous ) stars and with the internet following heels moving between the territories feuding with the various over faces would really go over well. I'm probably underestimating the casual wrestling fans who wouldn't follow the sport enough to follow it like this so who knows.

[SirFozzie]

Hogan
Flair
Sting
Savage

[digamma]

Hogan
Flair
Verne Gagne
Antonio Inoki

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Scarecrow

Ric Flair
Arn Anderson
Ole Anderson
Tully Blanchard

Mount Rushmore = 4 Horsemen

+4

[molson]

Hulk Hogan
Gorgeous George

.....

Those are the big 2 to me. Can I have a 2-man Mt. Rushmore? Ya, that's not allowed. I have to have two more. So I have to say:

Ric Flair

.....

and then another drop off...


Steve Austin.

The last one was tough, but Austin was the man in what was perhaps the most profitable era of wrestling ever, a time where wrestling really cracked the mainstream, and from that era, Austin was far more important than Rock, so:

Hulk Hogan
Gorgeous George
Ric Flair
Steve Austin

[molson]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Okay...I guess the last TEW I bought was 2007...interesting. Does anyone have the 2007 DOTT mod?

DT, I just got home and am too boozed up at the moment to figure out the necessary files, but I will hook you up tomorrow if at all possible. I have my TEW 07 game intact so I'm sure I have that mod intact as well.

[CrimsonFox]

Rowdy Roddy Piper
Andre the Giant
Hulk Hogan
Mick Foley

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by molson

DT, I just got home and am too boozed up at the moment to figure out the necessary files, but I will hook you up tomorrow if at all possible. I have my TEW 07 game intact so I'm sure I have that mod intact as well.

Sweet - sounds good to me!! WOOO

[stevew]

Chris Benoit

[Terps]

Hulk Hogan
Ric Flair
Randy Savage
Bret Hart

[Abe Sargent]

Anybody who does not choose Gorgeous George has no appreciation or understanding of the history of Professional Wrestling.

[CrimsonFox]

I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I'm all out of bubblegum.

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

Anybody who does not choose Gorgeous George has no appreciation or understanding of the history of Professional Wrestling.

Or isn't over 50

The problem with that is that if you want to you can go all the way back and pick guys who the guys you really wanna pick, patterned themselves after. Knowing what they did but picking them sight unseen isn't likely to happen. Do guys like Thesz or Gotch deserve to go in over Flair? How do you separate Funk from Brisco from Gagne etc etc.

I think Hogan and Austin are easy choices, they both transcended the business and were the lead guys during the two booms. I think those two are the only MUST guys. Flair would be my third and I can't really see how anyone could leave him out but I'd understand if there was a debate. As for the fourth, there's probably about 50-100 guys who I wouldn't blink an eye at for being mentioned. I'd probably go with Dusty out of personal preference with guys like Piper, Savage, Micheals very close.

I love thinking about things way too deeply late late at night.

[Senator]

If you missed the Von Erich brothers run, I feel sorry for you.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Hulk Hogan - For those of you who left him off of your personal Mt. Rushmore, consider this: This thread, and wrestling as we know it today, wouldn't exist if it weren't for Hulk Hogan. There is no other wrestler in the history of the business that you can absolutely say that about.

Not to Godwin this thread....
But I agree. To the same end 60s era Germany wouldn't be what it was without Hitler. To say in short he killed it, to me. Also see: McMahon, Vincent

In no particular order:

Flair. Not a whole lot needs to be said.

The Road Warriors, The Legion of Doom, Hawk and Animal. - They nearly invented the walk over. Heck Goldberg's whole run was an attempt to mimic a day in the life of the Road Warriors. Despite a couple of short individual pushes, worked together for 20+ years in the NWA, AWA and even the WWF/WWE.

Roddy Piper - Master of the mic...and unlike Hogan could actually you know, work a wrestling match.

Georgeous George - Many have imitated..but a true pioneer.


Honorable mention to: Sgt Slaughter (how many wrestlers crossed over to GI Joe?), Ricky (pre steroid created dragon) Steamboat, Jimmy "Super Fly" Snuka, Abdullah The Butcher, Bockwinkle (doesnt get the writing credit he deserves), Funk, Howe, Fritz Von Erick, Lou Thesz, Randy Savage, Lex Luger, Brett Hart, Terry Allen Magnum TA, Gene/Arn/Ole Anderson

[Johnny93g]

I haven't watched wrestling for a long time, and my top 4 will obviously show the era I remember.

Randy Savage- easily my favorite.
Hulk Hogan- He's Hulk Hogan, how could he not be here.
Ted Dibiase- As good a bad guy as i ever saw.
Bobby Heenan- Funny, entertaining, brilliant

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

Vince McMahon - Ruthless and brilliant. A dangerous and once in a lifetime combination for a wrestling promoter. You could make the same argument about this thread not existing without Vinny Mac.

I'm surprised it took so long to get Vince McMahon on the list.

My four would be:

Vince McMahon-Arguably he brought wrestling mainstream more than anyone else. He made the WWF into the first world-wide promotion. He survived "Billionaire" Ted's WCW. His business sense has evolved with the times (albeit only when he has had to).

Shawn Michaels-While Hogan was charismatic, arguably Shawn Michaels was just as good. Behind the scenes, Shawn Michaels did so much more than Hogan. I would place him on this list instead of Hogan or Flair due to his performance in the ring.

Kevin Sullivan-Great wrestler and even a greater booker. He created storylines which worked for their times. He was also a professional, even when Chris Benoit stole his wife.

Antonio Inoki-He founded New Japan Pro Wrestling and was the first Japanese wrestler to be inducted into the WWE Hall of Fame. Not only was he a wrestler, but he was a great promoter as well.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Senator

If you missed the Von Erich brothers run, I feel sorry for you.

I feel sorry for anyone who missed the heyday of World Class. From what I saw (as it aired at 11am Sat in Atlanta), the Sportatorium was the greatest wrestling atmosphere ever to that point.

I'd say ECW crowds would eventually surpass them but at the time, that was the best combination of talent & crowds ever assembled. And yes Nashville & Memphis, I know you're gonna be upset by that.

[General Mike]

If we are just going by the time period we watched, then for me it's Best Hart, Shown Michael, Steve Austin and The Rock. Honorable mentions for Sting, Undertaker, Kurt angle and Benoit. there, I said it. Someone had to.

If I was doing an all-time Rushmore, it would be Flair, Austin, Hogan and then either Brunt or Thesz