2013-14 NBA Season Thread

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I've commented on FB about it.

Likewise

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Apparently the best offer the Rockets received for Omer Asik was Brandon Bass, Courtney Lee and a protected 1st round pick. That would have been interesting.

What a crappy deal. No wonder Houston backed off

SI

[Logan]

I do like that they aren't getting much interest primarily because of that massive salary next year, when that was a reason they were able to get him in the first place.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

What a crappy deal. No wonder Houston backed off

SI

They're not going to get much more for him.

He's a 27 year old big man who is a rim protector. That's quite nice. But he's an offensive liability, has a career PER of 13.6, per 36 minute averages of 13/10 and has one year to run on a contract that costs $15m. He's not an all star and he's not going to command the price of one.

That's not such a bad deal for Houston. Bass isn't great (I don't think he's all that good), but his game would fit in well with Howard's. He's averaging 11/6 this year (per 36 about 14/8) and can play some defense. Lee is a decent off-the-bench shooter and defender. Both guys have reasonable salary numbers. The 1st was probably the Clippers 1st round pick this coming year or a Boston lottery-protected pick in 2015. So two complimentary pieces - one who may even start on the Rockets - plus a 1st.

I doubt the Rockets will get much more than that for Asik. Maybe someone else will come a-knockin' with a better deal, but his value isn't going to increase the longer he sits on that bench and pouts.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Matthean

I find it odd that Kobe is out for 6 weeks, and I'm the first to mention it.

Given what the Lakers were before he came back and the low expectations coming into the season, I don't think that it is that significant event. It is different than Derrick Rose's injury comeback since it affected the third best team in the conference.

[whomario]

The problem for Houston is that they don´t have that definite need anymore that they thought they had. Before the season, a guy like Bass would have been a decent adition, but right now they have multiple options that fit well as stretch/Small Ball 4s (Jones and Casspi in adition to allways having the option to go to Parsons in that role).
Of course they´d propably take a Ryan Anderson, but Brandon Bass ? And while Courtney Lee would be a nice adition defensively, i´m not sure you can justify that being big enough.

If i´m the Rockets, even the off chance that Asik gets his mood under controll and is a perfect replacement in those inevitable foul-trouble plagued games for Howard in the playoffs is worth waiting things out till the offseason.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Welcome to the league

Video: Heat’s LeBron James throws down poster dunk over Kings’ Ben*McLemore | The Point Forward - SI.com

[jbergey22]

The Nets lose Brook Lopez for the year with a broken foot. Is it time to officially stick a fork in the Nets for this season?

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Welcome to the league

Video: Heat’s LeBron James throws down poster dunk over Kings’ Ben*McLemore | The Point Forward - SI.com

Wow, nice! Lebron is supposedly nursing a bad ankle. Would anyone actually believe it after seeing that?

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Wow, nice! Lebron is supposedly nursing a bad ankle. Would anyone actually believe it after seeing that?

I guess it is a matter of defining what a "bad" ankle should limit someone like Lebron from doing. I mean there is footage of him rolling the ankle so we know that he did hurt the ankle. After the dunk, I think we can safely say the ankle is not injured, it just hurts.

[miami_fan]

The NBA's Possible Solution for Tanking: Good-bye to the Lottery, Hello to the Wheel - The Triangle Blog - Grantland

A bit more insight into the thinking of Adam Silver's NBA.

[LloydLungs]

Under that system, if there is a LeBron type talent coming out and a small market has the top pick but one of the sexy large market teams has it the year after, you're going to see that LeBron talent playing a second year in college.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by LloydLungs

Under that system, if there is a LeBron type talent coming out and a small market has the top pick but one of the sexy large market teams has it the year after, you're going to see that LeBron talent playing a second year in college.

And that is a bad thing for who?

And can't a player withdraw from the draft after the lottery becomes final?

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by LloydLungs

Under that system, if there is a LeBron type talent coming out and a small market has the top pick but one of the sexy large market teams has it the year after, you're going to see that LeBron talent playing a second year in college.

Decide the draft order after the declaration period?

[miami_fan]

Actually it looks like the NCAA forces players to declare for the draft by May 8th or lose his eligibility.

[Groundhog]

Eliminate the draft, allow teams to bid on rookies as FAs, make rookie deals non-guaranteed beyond the first 2 years.

Not going to happen of course, but that would be one fair-ish way to do it.

[LloydLungs]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

And that is a bad thing for who?

It's a bad thing for small markets. It would be great for players coming out of college to have a tiny modicum of control over where they go in the NBA, although it would come at the cost of delaying their paychecks/free agency by a year and pretty much cutting a year off their pro careers. I believe an extremely top flight guy would find it financially worth it, though, to forego, say, the Bucks in order to get to, say, the Lakers a year later.

[miami_fan]

Or the player could wait and get drafted by an Oklahoma City.

[miami_fan]

BTW I am by no means saying that this plan is flawless. I am just happy that the league is at least discussing improving the process.

[Blackadar]

I don't believe the current process can be improved until the core game improves. Any attempt to inject more randomness into the system to try to reduce tanking will likely result in a system where bad teams will stay bad. Any fewer incentives to tank will result in more teams trying to tank. If they improve the rules, refereeing and game so that it's at least slightly less dominated by a few superstars, then that helps the entire process. No, I don't know how to do this. But I'm not being paid by the NBA millions to think of shit like that either.

Zach Lowes "wheel" system linked above is horrid. Let's see...I can go to Milwaukee this year or Miami next year. I know! I'll take out the $20m insurance policy and go to Miami, where I'm going to get 10x the endorsement money, play for a winning team (make playoff money!) and pay no state tax. Talk about a fucking no-brainer. Not to mention the incredible swing of player quality available from year to year in the draft would again help enforce a system of haves and have nots. Sorry there's shit on your turn of the wheel, have fun sucking for another 30 years.

Originally Posted by groundhog

Eliminate the draft, allow teams to bid on rookies as FAs, make rookie deals non-guaranteed beyond the first 2 years.

Not going to happen of course, but that would be one fair-ish way to do it.

Fair to the players, but it would be very bad for the league.

[bhlloy]

Yeah, I'm sure the NBA will love it when half of the league becomes a minor league system, which it inevitably will under the proposal above. It's bad enough already but at least a crappy team that nobody wants to play for gets a chance to build around some rookies for a while. I can't believe anyone would get behind a system that would make the league less equal, that's the last thing it needs.

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Yeah, I'm sure the NBA will love it when half of the league becomes a minor league system, which it inevitably will under the proposal above. It's bad enough already but at least a crappy team that nobody wants to play for gets a chance to build around some rookies for a while. I can't believe anyone would get behind a system that would make the league less equal, that's the last thing it needs.

This.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

Fair to the players, but it would be very bad for the league.

I'm the opposite. I think it would be bad for the players, especially the non-top 5 level guys, but great for the league, as it encourages teams to rebuild via cap space rather than flatout sucking for 3 years and praying you land the #1 pick. Teams will not be punished for putting together a 7th or 8th seed team if they are smart with the way they structure the contracts on the roster.

Basically, the Eastern conference as we know it would not exist.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Yeah, I'm sure the NBA will love it when half of the league becomes a minor league system, which it inevitably will under the proposal above. It's bad enough already but at least a crappy team that nobody wants to play for gets a chance to build around some rookies for a while. I can't believe anyone would get behind a system that would make the league less equal, that's the last thing it needs.

I just think that teams should not be penalised for trying to win games and play entertaining (at times) basketball which, if you're not an elite contender, is exactly what happens with the current system.

[molson]

I really don't think a lot of guys are going to be timing the start of their careers over a draft setup like that. And even if the Bucks have the #1 pick one year, and for some reason, a half-dozen players decide not to go pro over it (which I tend to doubt), then the pool is deeper the year after, not just for the #1 team, but for the next 5. Maybe in the rare case of a LaBron type player, he'd play a year of college to avoid playing for a really small market team (if he'd want to delay his big first free agent contract payday for some reason), but there's no guarantee that the Knicks have the top pick the next year, it might just be the TrailBlazers, then it might be the Bobcats after that. Is he going to delay his career 3 years, and maybe the 4th year he gets the Clippers or something? It all still seems pretty tenuous, and there'd need to be a perfect storm for things to line up in a "negative" way.

I'd prefer it, at least until they put asterisks in the standings so I can know for sure what teams are trying not to win, so I can know who fucks up by winning too many games. It's just so stupid now. And unless I missed something, the Milwaukee Bucks aren't exactly super-protected in the current system (nor should they be, for the better of the NBA as a whole). Maybe in a different setup they'd have a chance for a top pick even if they could put together a young playoff team, whereas now, they basically fucked up if they make the playoffs with a 3-8 seed, or in any season where they're not a championship contender. So the second they put together a decent roster that can be a middle-of-the-road playoff team, they have to blow it all up for some pipe dream about scoring big in a lottery that rarely delivers. Maybe it'd be better if that middle-of-the-road playoff team actually tried to get a little better, added a few veterans, and then maybe were lucky enough to have a #3 pick right in the middle of it all. The lottery has become a tool for mediocre GMs to keep their jobs for another year or two because it's easy to believe in the unknown. For those GMs, the goal is literally to build a bad team. I think that holds back small market teams as much as anything else. With a completely random lottery setup (do the lottery after players declare, if that's so important), a 45-win-type Bucks team doesn't have to blow up and start over, their GM would actually have to try because they'd have as much a shot as anyone to build on their success with a top 5 pick. I think that's make for a much more interesting league.

[sterlingice]

I really like Zach Lowe's stats articles- he's one of the best sports journalists out there when he's doing that. But he's been stepping outside of that sphere into the Bill Simmons "here's a wacky off the wall idea" type of articles lately and they just aren't very good.

SI

[Fidatelo]

What about a lottery system that weighs recent previous high picks against overall record? So sucking still gets you more balls, but sucking repeatedly starts to take some away.

[nol]

My first thought on the wheel was wondering how they'd ever start implementing it when teams always have these protections on their traded draft picks for 5-6 years, but I guess that would be the case for any potential changes.

[whomario]

Dirk Nowitzki now the 13th leading scorer all time. Pretty neat. Imo, he still has one amazing playoff run in him this year or next. Can´t sustain it for a whole season as a 38+ mpg guy carrying the offense, but for a playoff run i can see him doing a ton of damage and if a couple guys next to him get hot, you never know. Ideally, the Mavs try to make some sort of move to get some semblance of defense on the roster. If by some miracle they get a decent rim protector ...

Manu Ginobili is still awesome btw



also:



spurs need to figure out a way to rest their big 3 enough while maintaining home court advantage. Then i would´t bet against them getting back to the finals. And yeah, i realize they struggled against the leagues top teams so far.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

The NBA's Possible Solution for Tanking: Good-bye to the Lottery, Hello to the Wheel - The Triangle Blog - Grantland

A bit more insight into the thinking of Adam Silver's NBA.

I liked it a lot. I think it'd create lots more possibilities. As for people hellbent on restriction player movement, the whole draft is a bit of a scam anyway and so...anything that subverts it by disincentivizing the need to be bad is okay in my book.

[kingfc22]

These unis are atrocious.

[mckerney]

I just want a lottery system that well give the Timberwolves get the #1 pick in a year that is worth having it in, cause Kevin Love to actually decide to put an effort into playing defense for once and make Ricky Rubio stop being terrible. I don't think that's too much to ask for.

[korme]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

These unis are atrocious.

So terrible. Jason Terry looks insane

[miami_fan]

I know this is just Tibs being Tibs but damn Noah and Gibson still in a 20 point game with 90 seconds left?

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

These unis are atrocious.

+3

[whomario]

Durant could have scored 60 tonight if he wanted to ...

and the eastern teams are now a combined 43-93 against the West.

[miami_fan]

Man, I felt soo bad for Tyson Chandler in that game. He played 1 on 5 defense the whole game.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I really like Zach Lowe's stats articles- he's one of the best sports journalists out there when he's doing that. But he's been stepping outside of that sphere into the Bill Simmons "here's a wacky off the wall idea" type of articles lately and they just aren't very good.

Don't think you can blame this one on that - this article was pretty clearly a trial balloon from someone in the NBA office or leaked by a front office who wanted to try and drum up public support for the plan they're pushing behind the scenes.

Originally Posted by whomario

The problem for Houston is that they don't have that definite need anymore that they thought they had. Before the season, a guy like Bass would have been a decent adition, but right now they have multiple options that fit well as stretch/Small Ball 4s (Jones and Casspi in adition to allways having the option to go to Parsons in that role).
Of course they´d propably take a Ryan Anderson, but Brandon Bass ? And while Courtney Lee would be a nice adition defensively, i´m not sure you can justify that being big enough.

Boston would definitely be the bigger winner in the deal, but I do think it would improve Houston. Bass is basically the consistent veteran version of what they're hoping to get out of Terrence Jones (he's on my fantasy team - he had a great game today, but I know how inconsistent he's been ), and Lee adds a solid perimeter defender who can shoot if he's open and can drive past a guy coming out of control at him off a Harden/Lin slash and kick, but doesn't need shots or the ball in his hands.

When I said it would have been interesting, I meant more in terms of what it meant for Ainge's motives. It'd be a pretty clear repudiation of any tanking and a sign he was trying to make some sort of playoff run this year.

[whomario]

Kings coach Mike Malone speaking his mind:

http://www.news10.net/video/default....=2967792418001

as a fan of brutally-honest coach interviews, this is right up there.

[molson]

What difference does it make, the Kings are one of the teams that are trying to lose, right? Is it really "honest" when there's an implication that the team is trying to be competitive? Things are going according to plan for them, in the modern NBA, this should be considered a good season. A team that's having a "bad" season would be someone like the Celtics, because they're getting great coaching and are winning too often. That should be a semi-fun story but the way things are setup, more people believe they're setting themselves back.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by molson

What difference does it make, the Kings are one of the teams that are trying to lose, right? Is it really "honest" when there's an implication that the team is trying to be competitive? Things are going according to plan for them, in the modern NBA, this should be considered a good season. A team that's having a "bad" season would be someone like the Celtics, because they're getting great coaching and are winning too often. That should be a semi-fun story but the way things are setup, more people believe they're setting themselves back.

Actually, I would argue that teams "trying to lose" don't trade bit parts to Toronto for Rudy Gay.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Actually, I would argue that teams "trying to lose" don't trade bit parts to Toronto for Rudy Gay.

That's part of the problem. It's really impossible to know for sure which teams are trying to win and which aren't, and whether that trying or lack of trying is consistent or inconsistent between the levels of player, coach, GM, and ownership. I'd rather not have to research all that and try to make an educated guess before determining whether the random basketball game I'm watching is actually a competitive contest where both franchises, top to bottom, hope to score more points than the other team. How many teams' fans are literally rooting against their team in every game? You can have extreme examples of this in the NFL sometimes down the stretch in the final meaningless games, but in the NBA, it seems like it's a third of the teams, and it's all year long, because there's only 4 or 5 teams that can win the whole thing and every game not involving them is deemed meaningless.

Also, by the prevailing philosophy about what NBA teams are supposed to do, the Kings did poorly in that trade if it makes them any better. Everything's backwards. If the Celtics made some shrewd trade that made them a much better team, I would supposed to be upset about that as a Celtics fan. I just find it all a pain in the ass. I just like my sports to have teams trying to win games and trying to improve their teams.

Edit: the equivalent of the Celtics in the NFL might be if someone like the Jaguars went on a big run to go to 8-7 and had a chance to have a winning season and to maybe get into the playoffs on the final week. Jaguars fans would be elated with such a surprising season. For Celtics fans, that would be a catastrophe. Which is just no fun.

[whomario]

At some point you need to stop loosing, otherwise you´ll just start over and over and over. Is there really going to be a player with more talent than Cousins landing in their laps ? (more mental capabilities, sure. But talent ? Either you think Cousins can be fixed in the right environment, than you create it. Or you don´t, than you trade him.)

Just looking at the current contenders, is it that more likely to get to/close to contending status by tanking than by trying to win while weading out your bad seeds ? I don´t think it´s wise to make treadmill moves that hurt your flexibility, but try to actively make your team loose ? The latter is much less common than people think, imo. And a ton less successfull. Sure, if you suck anyway and for 1 year or 2 decide to just stand pat it might work (Thunder), but do it year after year ?

Rather have my team do it like the Pacers or Blazers. Or the Rockets.

after you get your center piece, you simply need to draft well, not just early.

Again, not saying you can´t help your chances with a high pick. But you also need to make use of the players you have in some way. What keeps the Kings from winning 30 games, having the 7th pick and trading up to 3rd using players they showed can win some games ? (the other team, of course, i know But still, why wouldn´t it be possible ?)

[korme]

The Blazers and Pacers are perfect examples of ways to be successful by means of savvy GMing without a top pick.

[JPhillips]

I think it's really just the Pacers. The two best players on the Blazers are #2 and #6 picks.

[nol]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I think it's really just the Pacers. The two best players on the Blazers are #2 and #6 picks.

To be fair, the Lillard pick was acquired from the Nets. Their own pick was 11th that year.

[miami_fan]

Bryant Westbrook is out after the AS break after knee surgery

[korme]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Bryant Westbrook is out after the AS break after knee surgery

who

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by korme

who

Oops thinking of cornerbacks

Russell

[Chief Rum]

Man, when it rains it pours. Westbrook had been like an iron man before last year's injury, and now he can't stay healthy.