werewolf LIV! Terror at the country club (GAME OVER WOLVES WIN)

[Raiders Army]

Caught up. I really like how Crim's doing his homework (or at least putting a lot of time into the game). Anyhow, that's good enough for me and he was right on when he did his homework on Neon. MrBug's responses sounds eerily similar to Neon's responses when Crim caught Neon in a lie.

VOTE MRBUG708

[path12]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I can. I think he panicked.

Hmm. Possible.

[path12]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

I echo it. If you're trying to save your skin no matter what your role is, you'll do what you can

I might have faked a role, but I don't know if I would have been specific.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Yes. Why would the wolves continuously leave the admitted Duke alive? Obviously he's alive for a reason which is probably that he's not really who he says he is. The problem that Chief also alluded to was why the real Duke didn't come forward and just have him killed instead....

See, this is exactly why I advocated the DT vote. Would have avoided this argument. Either DT would be FIRMLY in the COT (good for us) or he'd be a lynched liar (good for us), with Neon quickly to follow on Day Three (good for us).

As it is, we don't really know, do we?

sigh.

[hoopsguy]

Chief - no problem with coming up with theories. But that kind of falls into the "new player thinking he has three wolves in a web" school of thought. I'm just hoping I'm not falling prey to a slightly different trap by thinking I have four trusted players (Crim, Torgo, Olie, and Bug - with some variance in confidence levels) in a game where is no seer.

Molson - love the "spiking on the ten" analogy

Path, and other speculating on the goth thing - the reveal came with ten minutes left. The wolves would have had numbers to process their order, but was the bodyguard a good bet to be around and also change his vote? Keep in mind that the real seer (RPI) posted just after Neon's fake reveal, but not again before the deadline. That seems very strange to me, but I had the benefit of reading along after the clock was no longer running since I was out earlier that night. I'm sure it was a pressure-cooker for a lot of people as the votes moved around.

[path12]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

I see your point on a couple of things needing to come together for Neon as the convert - and I'm definitely in the camp that has been discussing this topic. I reached the above conclusion on the way home tonight.

I realize it doesn't matter much in the long run, but sometimes I just get interested in tangents and have to try and figure them out.

Yeah, I'm that guy.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

My essential point was that there is no point debating DT's trust or how we can use him. If he is really the duke, he will very likely soon be dead at wolf hands. If he continues to live, he's probably not the duke. And the combination of him continuing to live and the real duke knowing he's not the duke will lead the duke to "duke" the vote onto him. In other words, either he is the duke and dies by wolf hands, or he is a wolf playing at duke and will soon die at real duke's hands. Either way, he's not long for this game, so what good is it discussing strategy around using him as a point of trust?

Chief, I do see your point, but I just don't agree. If we're stuck on "DT might be a wolf" then the suspicions and support he's posted thus far are useless, or even harmful. The sooner we know for sure, the sooner we'll be able to (somewhat) more confidently move people up and down our list.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by molson

Votes as of Post #759:

Telle - Cronin (683), Hoops (718), Olie (723), Pass (756)
Oliegirl - Telle (715), DNA (752)
Purdue - Eagle (620)
MrBug - Molson (679) DaddyTogo (774)

Apparently, Crim is voting for MrBug as well, so we're at 4-3, for all intents and purposes.
DT - Purdue (732)

Thought I did in my opus magnus. Sorry if not.

VOTE MRBUG708

[hoopsguy]

Wow, who knew there was a 2nd Kathy Griffin fan in the FOFC community?

like Pretty on Kathy Griffin?
like Sober on Lindsey Lohan?
like Skinny on Kirstey Alley?
like Brainy on Jessica Simpson?
the possibilities are endless ...

[molson]

Soooo at the moment, I believe we have a tie.

[path12]

Originally Posted by Crim

Much better worded than my attempt. +1, this is what I had been trying to say, but I doesn't talk good.

I hope you keep playing.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Crim, always nice to see other players go dumpster diving through old posts.

One notion that you called up that I would dispute - I am pretty sure that the wolves would be very familiar with the mechanics of both their role and the Goths. Even if one of them wasn't paying attention, they have teammates who will PM/IM each other to strategize. I would actually, in a reverse sort of way, credit MrBug for making a mistake on the wolf/goth relationship.

I'm wavering, Hoops, mostly because of the esteem you're held in as a villager, and because you were an early supporter of my innocence as well.

But, look, what I'm getting at is that Bug is an experienced (if rusty) player, and I agree a wolf would know the mechanics. I think he's been playing dumb.

BUG: Don't take offense at that phrasing, please, I don't know how else to get my point across, other than that idiom.

[path12]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

C
One notion that you called up that I would dispute - I am pretty sure that the wolves would be very familiar with the mechanics of both their role and the Goths. Even if one of them wasn't paying attention, they have teammates who will PM/IM each other to strategize. I would actually, in a reverse sort of way, credit MrBug for making a mistake on the wolf/goth relationship.

That's what struck me also. I see where Crim is trying to go, but I actually felt a little better about Mr.Bug after that analysis. But I didn't go into it assuming he was bad.

[path12]

Originally Posted by Crim

Six reasons DT could still be alive, even if the wolves are on him like Pretty on Kathy Griffin.

Pumpy is going to be jealous.

[Lathum]

Telle 4- Cronin (683), Hoops (718), Olie (723), Pass (756)
MrBug 4- Molson (679), Torgo (774), RaidersArmy (801), Crim (808)
Oliegirl 2- Telle (715), DNA (752)
Purdue 1- Eagle (620)
DT 1- Purdue (732)

[hoopsguy]

Crim, I'm reading the same posts you are and I think I've played all of one game with MrBug. What I'm getting at is that you should vote where you think you are best served, with or without my permission/approval/whatever.

We're coming up with different conclusions on a guy - it happens. But the fact that there is a tie involving a person I think is good means that I'm going to be locked in on Telle, barring some kind of "Night 1" type of reveal.

[path12]

Yeesh. Not thrilled with the top two. I'll check back a little before deadline and switch to avoid a tie, but I'm going more with my gut.

VOTE PURDUE BRAD

I thought he seemed a little overenthusiastic also.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by molson

I have a hard time getting past that. He didn't have a "need" to reveal when he did. At best (most innocent), he just miscounted the votes and quite humorously revealed himself when he thought he was the leading vote-getter. Not only was he TWO votes away from the lead, but he was only tied for second place with someone else.

It was like a football player spiking the ball when he only reached the 10 yard line.

Sorry for the off-topicness:

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, you have two Crim votes on Bug - should be a four/four tie unless he has a wicked-cool voting power.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Crim

I think this logic is poor, at best. There are several mechanisms for a villager to avoid divulging his entrails on a given night in this game. I am not on board with your statement at all, Chief.

Well, I overreached in saying automatically vote for him. There are few times I actually think like that, usualyl changing as new evidence comes about. But it would be another pebble in the "DT is a duke-faking wolf" theory. Like I said, though, either way, he is likely dead, be it by the wolves or the real duke.

[path12]

OK, the video was hilarious.

[hoopsguy]

Yep, very funny stuff Crim.

[Raiders Army]

I'm not sure about this cronin/hoops thing or why if hoops trusts Crim he's voting for Telle. I don't want a tie so I'll switch my vote so we're sure to get a lynch tonight...but I think Crim laid out the case for MrBug pretty well. Thoughts?

[Telle]

Trying to catch up.. looks like I'm not currently in the lead.. who has yet to vote?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Lathum, you have two Crim votes on Bug - should be a four/four tie unless he has a wicked-cool voting power.

thats because crim voted twice

[path12]

Chief, any thoughts on Telle/Mr.Bug? I'm just not getting it.

[MrBug708]

I'd just as well like to accuse Crim of being it but that would get us no where. Obviously anything I say will ultimately get a response that is backed with "I just had a feeling"

So in the interest of self preservation

Vote - Telle

I have no rhyme or reason for voting for Telle at this point moreso then anyone else (besides spite for missing the boat; seriously Crim, you like to search find out when I last played Werewolf) but I gotta do what I gotta do

[DaddyTorgo]

considering switching from bug to telle. Really i'd be happy with a vote on either of them, although i'm still pondering whether or not to duke to someone else...

[Telle]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

I'd just as well like to accuse Crim of being it but that would get us no where. Obviously anything I say will ultimately get a response that is backed with "I just had a feeling"

So in the interest of self preservation

Vote - Telle

I have no rhyme or reason for voting for Telle at this point moreso then anyone else (besides spite for missing the boat; seriously Crim, you like to search find out when I last played Werewolf) but I gotta do what I gotta do

UNVOTE OLIEGIRL
VOTE MRBUG

Self-preservation right back at ya.

[MrBug708]

I'd get ready to go on the defensive Crim, you seem awful anxious to convict a villager

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by Crim

From post 1:


Seriously? Here's six mechanisms, Bug. Six reasons DT could still be alive, even if the wolves are on him like Pretty on Kathy Griffin.

Originally Posted by Telle

UNVOTE OLIEGIRL
VOTE MRBUG

Self-preservation right back at ya.

Hey, nothjing persona;

[MrBug708]

I'm heading out to a walk; good luck with the decisions

[Telle]

I said before the game even started that I was going to be rather busy and probably won't have my spreadsheets going this game.

I wasn't sure I'd get back on today and needed to vote for someone before I took off.. there weren't any strong candidates, and so I decided to go for someone that hadn't really been on anyone's radar but did make a mistake and thus gave something to think about.

Any other "incriminating" things that anybody wants me to respond to?

[Crim]

Originally Posted by Lathum

thats because crim voted twice

LOL it's molson's fault!!!!!!11!!1

Originally Posted by molson

Votes as of Post #759:

Telle - Cronin (683), Hoops (718), Olie (723), Pass (756)
Oliegirl - Telle (715), DNA (752)
Purdue - Eagle (620)
MrBug - Molson (679) DaddyTogo (774)

Apparently, Crim is voting for MrBug as well, so we're at 4-3, for all intents and purposes.
DT - Purdue (732)

[RendeR]

HRm, I'm in a seriously tough stpo here.

I live with Telle, sleeping on teh couch if I get her lynched does not sound particularly apealing

But the case against Bug while circumstantial, really isn't swaying me. he just seems like he's been away from the game and needs to refresh himself on how things roll.

Can we lynch someone besides those two so I don't have to pick between a villager and my wife?

[DaddyTorgo]

maybe i'll duke to crim to thank him for that video :-P

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

I'm not sure about this cronin/hoops thing or why if hoops trusts Crim he's voting for Telle. I don't want a tie so I'll switch my vote so we're sure to get a lynch tonight...but I think Crim laid out the case for MrBug pretty well. Thoughts?

Just because I think one person is a villager doesn't mean that I absolutely support their conclusions.

I'm less confident that Telle is good than I am that Bug is good. So I'll stick on Telle. If Bug (or other players that I semi-trust) is not in the tie then I would consider moving off of Telle over to PurdueBrad as the only other candidate who has multiple votes.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by RendeR

HRm, I'm in a seriously tough stpo here.

I live with Telle, sleeping on teh couch if I get her lynched does not sound particularly apealing

But the case against Bug while circumstantial, really isn't swaying me. he just seems like he's been away from the game and needs to refresh himself on how things roll.

Can we lynch someone besides those two so I don't have to pick between a villager and my wife?

we could lynch you

[DaddyTorgo]

UNVOTE BUG

[path12]

Originally Posted by RendeR

HRm, I'm in a seriously tough stpo here.

I live with Telle, sleeping on teh couch if I get her lynched does not sound particularly apealing

But the case against Bug while circumstantial, really isn't swaying me. he just seems like he's been away from the game and needs to refresh himself on how things roll.

Can we lynch someone besides those two so I don't have to pick between a villager and my wife?

Look at the bright side -- if she's really a wolf she might be very impressed by your mad deductive skillz......

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

we could lynch you

You could, but I've already wasted a kill shot on a villager by mistake, why compound it by taking out another villager?

I mean you can, go for it, but its another wasted night if you lynch me.

[DaddyTorgo]

more of a joke render

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by path12

Heh. Right after I say I think the opposite. Gotta love WW.

Chief, can you ever imagine making a move like that day 1 if you're a wolf?

Actually, Pass and I made exactly that move in the last game.

But there was some things in our favor. No items to throw things off. And we already knew Lathum was the BG and could use our past experience with him to guess on whether he would be "sly" and not protect himself after a reveal. Finally, we knew we had a conversion in a relatively small game, as well as a sympathizer (Telle hadn't bought it yet). So it was a decent ploy to be bold there. Plus, I was convinced (rightly, as I was "seer" outed a day later) that I am often one of the first people scanned, so I was going to be caught soon anyway. We had already set that I would do the killing. We also knew by the rules that Lathum wasn't a lock to stop us or recognize us.

So there were a lot of mitigating circumstances. I think there was far more of a chance we could pull it off, then the wolves had here. I think going for NC (if they chose to do that) was beyond "bold", and well into "rash". Since groups of players usually don't make rash decisions like that, but talk it through, I am guessing they didn't choose to do that.

All of which means NC was an original wolf who made a panic play.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Crim

LOL it's molson's fault!!!!!!11!!1

I blame hoops.

[Crim]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

I'd get ready to go on the defensive Crim, you seem awful anxious to convict a villager

Yah, I'm aware I've hitched my trailer to you pretty securely, Bug. I hope like hell I'm right if you go down tonight. Not so much because of worrying about the village turning on me, but more because I'd feel bad about it. Maybe that's stupid, I don't know. So please please please be hairy?

[Raiders Army]

I'd be willing to go for RendeR tonight as well. I can't remember where someone else said it, but I think it's a distinct possibility that he's the goth.

[Telle]

Originally Posted by RendeR

HRm, I'm in a seriously tough stpo here.

I live with Telle, sleeping on teh couch if I get her lynched does not sound particularly apealing

But the case against Bug while circumstantial, really isn't swaying me. he just seems like he's been away from the game and needs to refresh himself on how things roll.

Can we lynch someone besides those two so I don't have to pick between a villager and my wife?

It's a game.. I wouldn't make you sleep on the couch. Actually.. I'd sleep on the couch and make you sleep with the baby

And you're not just picking between a villager and your wife.. your picking between a villager and a villager... or at least a villager and whatever MrBug is.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by path12

Hmm. Possible.

lol, all my posts expounding on things when if I move a couple more posts on, I see you have already acknowledged at least the possibility of my suggestion. Heh, sorry if I overdid it.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by molson

I blame hoops.

Gee, I never hear that in one of these games

[Telle]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

I'd be willing to go for RendeR tonight as well. I can't remember where someone else said it, but I think it's a distinct possibility that he's the goth.

I'll go with it if it gets my neck off the chopping block