WW XCIV Group Therapy - Game Over! - Page 66

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autumn

I can be sure at this point that Hoops is not playing us. If you assume Hoops/CR are good, where would you vote, Lathum?

probably PF

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubb93

LOL Now the 3 of you are vouching for each other? You have to be kidding me.

They certainly are not vouching for me. And I am not vouching for them the way they vouch for each other. I'm saying I'm very clear that they are not faking their roles.

saldana · 05-21-2009, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

who you going with?

me and my dad are taking sara with us

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saldana

me and my dad are taking sara with us

nice.

Make sure you take pictures

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 03:26 PM

It's been hard in this game not to discuss our roles, hasn't it guys? I mean for all but the three of us who have never even hinted at having a role.

PackerFanatic · 05-21-2009, 03:27 PM

VOTE HOOPSGUY

He has gotta be pulling the strings behind this.

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 03:36 PM

I feel very good about my vote and my suspect list right now. We should be able to nail a wolf easily tonight if we can all stay on the same page.

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 03:44 PM

Agreed - I'm thinking that the battle lines are being drawn pretty clearly right now.

UNVOTE DADDYTORGO
VOTE PACKERFANATIC

saldana · 05-21-2009, 03:50 PM

since i am getting no traction, i will flop the other way..as long as one of them goes tonight.

unvote lathum
vote hoops

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 03:52 PM

Saldana - do you really think that Autumn, Chief, and I are the remaining wolves?

If not, then why are both of them vouching for me?

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 03:57 PM

It is very discouraging to me that the villagers actually have a COT that they can act on but are choosing not to do so. I would not argue this as fervently if there was not a 3rd party coming in behind me/Chief to suggest that we are on the up-and-up.

Assuming that this is not some really elaborate play by Autumn, with the intent to switch at the last minute, we have a COT that matches the max number of wolves in the game right now. But there are four votes on me, which means that some villagers are falling in line with where the wolves want the vote to go today.

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:02 PM

Hoops, I'm sorry but how do we have a COT.

We have 3 people vouching for each other, none of who were seer cleared, in a game that we are pretty sure there are 3 wolves left.

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:03 PM

dola- I should say 2 vouching for each other and 1 vouching for the other 2

Chief Rum · 05-21-2009, 04:06 PM

VOTE PACKER FANATIC

I guess the die is cast, and we're down to seeing if we can finally convince people of the right move here.

There are likely three wolves left, and those three wolves know the allegiance of the rest of us. None of those three wolves are currently voting PF, from what I can see. Which means of the six remaining, half of them are wolves.

I think people need to think things through. There have been some assumptions made, and if those were followed one step further, people might begin to recognize the precarious situation we find ourselves in right now.

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:08 PM

Lathum, so you believe that all three of us are wolves? I've asked this question a bunch of times and no one has come out and said that they think this is the case.

Why in the world would the wolves be in such a rush to play it this way in a 6-3 game rather than taking their time?

Lathum, do you worry about the fact that people have been setting it up as a you or me = wolf? I know I'm a villager and I think you are a wolf. Big difference between those two. How can others be so certain that one of the two of us is a wolf?

Both DT and Saldana have used this as a reason for voting for us. PF has come pretty close to saying that, but I don't think he has outright said it in the thread.

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 04:10 PM

It is really frustrating not being able to talk about roles.

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:12 PM

Poli, if you are a wolf then you are walking into a great spot.

If you are a villager then you get a chance to make either a really bad vote or ... a vote that I hope is really good but honestly I'm not 100% sure about.

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 04:13 PM

As a matter of record, I can say that my assumptions about The Jackal were proven correct by last night's night kill and role reveal. Perhaps those of you interested in staying in therapy longer could trust my other assumptions based on that.

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autumn

It is really frustrating not being able to talk about roles.

Autumn, Poli had indicated that his bulldog nature on Telle was a combination of gut and other.

You seem to have some insight into your fellow man, based on your assessments. Does the suggestion that Poli had a non-seer role that could potentially have gained an advantage in identifying a wolf early in the game worry you?

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

dola- I should say 2 vouching for each other and 1 vouching for the other 2

Technically, the vouches work like this (best I can tell).

Hoops - vouched for by Chief and Autumn
Chief - vouched for by Hoops and Autumn
Saldana - vouched for by Autumn

So if you accept that Autumn is a villager we actually have a list of four people in the COT. The fact that Saldana is not following Autumn's lead is a bit troubling for me, since I big-time distrust Saldana myself but I'm trying to keep faith that Autumn is a villager with good information. It is obviously easier for me to do that knowing he is correct about me.

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:20 PM

Here is the thing.

We already had a seer, how much info can Autumn really be privy to?

No one is vouching for Autumn and a good way to gain your trust is to confirm you and CR are both villagers

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:20 PM

Dubb, Lathum, Saldana - is Autumn just throwing Saldana in the vouch lists as an extra added bonus to create additional credibility? How are you explaining that?

Seriously, the remaining villages really need to think long and hard about this vote. And, if they are still leaving it on me (of all people) then keep thinking until you change your mind.

And if they are still not ready to change their mind when the deadline comes then the villagers probably lose this game. I have zero faith in their ability to win it tomorrow based on everything I've seen over the past couple of days.

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 04:20 PM

I'm not sure about that Hoops ... I did forget about that little hint. It would mean, to me, that DT or Lath are a wolf (or that we only have two wolves). But I think it would pay off to wait to answer that question.

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autumn

I'm not sure about that Hoops ... I did forget about that little hint. It would mean, to me, that DT or Lath are a wolf (or that we only have two wolves). But I think it would pay off to wait to answer that question.

what little hint?

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

Here is the thing.

We already had a seer, how much info can Autumn really be privy to?

No one is vouching for Autumn and a good way to gain your trust is to confirm you and CR are both villagers

A good way to gain my trust? MY TRUST???

Why would Autumn be worried about gaining my trust if we are all wolves together? He would be worried about gaining villager trust, which certainly is not working based on the votes right now.

The only way that he is worried about getting my trust is if Chief and I are actually villagers and he is a wolf who wants to lead us to a crappy candidate today. I'm much more worried about that scenario than anything having to do with me and/or Chief.

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 04:23 PM

dola that was in regard to #3269

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

what little hint?

Sorry, took too long to reply. Poli's answer about his votes on Telle suggested that maybe his role had something to do with it.

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

A good way to gain my trust? MY TRUST???

Why would Autumn be worried about gaining my trust if we are all wolves together? He would be worried about gaining villager trust, which certainly is not working based on the votes right now.

The only way that he is worried about getting my trust is if Chief and I are actually villagers and he is a wolf who wants to lead us to a crappy candidate today. I'm much more worried about that scenario than anything having to do with me and/or Chief.

that was my point, MY POINT

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:24 PM

someone give me a number 1-7

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Autumn, Poli had indicated that his bulldog nature on Telle was a combination of gut and other.

You seem to have some insight into your fellow man, based on your assessments. Does the suggestion that Poli had a non-seer role that could potentially have gained an advantage in identifying a wolf early in the game worry you?

Re-direct:

Poli, you seem to have some insight on a wolf earlier, based on your role in voting for Telle. Does the suggestion that Autumn had a non-seer role that could potentially have "cleared" three villagers at this point in the game worry you?

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:25 PM

I mean 1-9

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

that was my point, MY POINT

So if you don't trust Autumn's vouches, then why vote for me? Test them by voting for him, Saldana, or Chief. There are three other options out there besides me to vote for. I'm vouching for one of the other three, but not for the other two.

If he is looking to gain my trust today then the most likely scenario is that Autumn + Saldana are bad guys and his large group of targets with good voting records are actually good villagers.

Notice that he asked me who I would vote for from his list. I put the vote on DT and he put the vote on PF instead.

dubb93 · 05-21-2009, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

I mean 1-9

2

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:31 PM

thanks.

now 1-5 please

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:31 PM

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lerriuqs

I'm beginning to think that the Sympathizer may be onto something ...

Poli · 05-21-2009, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Re-direct:

Poli, you seem to have some insight on a wolf earlier, based on your role in voting for Telle. Does the suggestion that Autumn had a non-seer role that could potentially have "cleared" three villagers at this point in the game worry you?

Having been reprimanded for my hint, I don't believe I'm allowed to answer this.

Out of the realm of talking about the role I have, I believe there is a lot of wolf play going on right now. My problem is trying to figure out who's telling the truth.

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 04:33 PM

Unvote Hoops
Vote Autumn

looking back I just don't see why we should trust him.

He put early votes on wolves each day and didn't move them, something a wolf would do. Except for the day Telle gets lynched when he was on Clap.

Plus he seems to be hinting at all this information and I just don't see a role outside the seer or a wolf that could be that powerful.

Poli · 05-21-2009, 04:34 PM

I'm off to work out/run/kill myself. Assuming I don't succeed in the latter, I'll be back in an hour or so.

Autumn · 05-21-2009, 04:42 PM

That's fine Lathum if you want to go there. I'm sure I've pushed Danny's limits in terms of what I should be saying about my role, and I can't think of any way to make you trust my vouches without going into that.

I think if you go back and look in thread you won't agree with yoru own assessment of my votes. I campaigned very strongly for those wolves, not only leading a charge and voting early but pushing others to consolidate their votes on wolves. If you're a wolf I'm sure you'll sit with this vote, but if you're a villager I think it's worth a look back to see if you really agree with yourself on this. I certainly have put my neck out pushing for things the last few days. That's only because I've been able to piece together more as the list of players dwindles. If you're a villager you could piece together some of what I have as well.

Go back and you'll see I vouched for Jackal as well, correctly assessing his role as an independent and was backed up by Saldana there.

Shit, my kids are screaming and I realy ahve to go. I'll try to make it back by deadline.

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 04:44 PM

Well, I'll be around some between now and deadline but not a ton. I'm on kid duty alone tonight so she will more or less determine if I'm around the PC.

OK, one last exercise for people. I'm guessing that the wolves have been paying pretty close attention to what Chief and I have said for the past couple of days. I would really like for the remaining villagers to go re-read Chief Rum's posts from yesterday and today.

At that point, please revisit your voting strategy on me even if you do not believe that I am a villager. Just go grab another person that you think might be a wolf along with me.

This is the last time that I will make this request.

dubb93 · 05-21-2009, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Well, I'll be around some between now and deadline but not a ton. I'm on kid duty alone tonight so she will more or less determine if I'm around the PC.

OK, one last exercise for people. I'm guessing that the wolves have been paying pretty close attention to what Chief and I have said for the past couple of days. I would really like for the remaining villagers to go re-read Chief Rum's posts from yesterday and today.

At that point, please revisit your voting strategy on me even if you do not believe that I am a villager. Just go grab another person that you think might be a wolf along with me.

This is the last time that I will make this request.

So even if we think you are a wolf we should vote CR or Autumn? That is one crazy ass idea. Would this have to do with you either being the The Wannabee Therapist and thus you think you can't be caught by special roles? Or would it have to do with you being the Criticizer and you want to have that ability still on your side going further?

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 05:14 PM

vote count?

dubb93 · 05-21-2009, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

vote count?

Not really sure but off the top of my head I think it is 3-3-1, might be 4-3-1 if I have missed a PF or Hoops vote somewhere.

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 05:17 PM

doing one now

dubb93 · 05-21-2009, 05:20 PM

PF 4 - Autumn (3183), DT (3220), Hoops (3258), CR (3264)
Hoops 3 - Dubb (3240), PF (3256), Sal (3259)
Autumn 1 - Lathum (3288)

Yet to Vote: Poli

Lathum · 05-21-2009, 05:21 PM

PF -4 Autumn (3183), DT (3220), Hoops (3258), CR (3264)
Hoops-3 Dubb ( 3240), PF ( 3256), Saldana ( 3259)
Autumn-1 Lathum (3288)

no vote: Poli

dubb93 · 05-21-2009, 05:23 PM

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubb93

So even if we think you are a wolf we should vote CR or Autumn? That is one crazy ass idea. Would this have to do with you either being the The Wannabee Therapist and thus you think you can't be caught by special roles? Or would it have to do with you being the Criticizer and you want to have that ability still on your side going further?

Wannabe Therapist, in theory, should not have any extra value with the seer gone.

Criticizer is a legitimate concern, I suppose.

But I've really done about all that I can today. If we didn't get a wolf yesterday and don't get one today I have no reason to think that we are going to get one tomorrow either.

hoopsguy · 05-21-2009, 05:34 PM

Dubb, if you have anything at all that you want to ask me between now and deadline I would suggest doing it in the next ten minutes.

05-21-2009, 03:27 PM	#3256
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	VOTE HOOPSGUY He has gotta be pulling the strings behind this. __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

05-21-2009, 04:06 PM	#3264
Chief Rum Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Where Hip Hop lives	VOTE PACKER FANATIC I guess the die is cast, and we're down to seeing if we can finally convince people of the right move here. There are likely three wolves left, and those three wolves know the allegiance of the rest of us. None of those three wolves are currently voting PF, from what I can see. Which means of the six remaining, half of them are wolves. I think people need to think things through. There have been some assumptions made, and if those were followed one step further, people might begin to recognize the precarious situation we find ourselves in right now. __________________ . . I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.

05-21-2009, 04:34 PM	#3289
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	I'm off to work out/run/kill myself. Assuming I don't succeed in the latter, I'll be back in an hour or so. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

05-21-2009, 03:26 PM	#3255
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	It's been hard in this game not to discuss our roles, hasn't it guys? I mean for all but the three of us who have never even hinted at having a role.

05-21-2009, 03:36 PM	#3257
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	I feel very good about my vote and my suspect list right now. We should be able to nail a wolf easily tonight if we can all stay on the same page.

05-21-2009, 03:44 PM	#3258
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Agreed - I'm thinking that the battle lines are being drawn pretty clearly right now. UNVOTE DADDYTORGO VOTE PACKERFANATIC

05-21-2009, 03:50 PM	#3259
saldana Pro Starter Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bethlehem, Pa	since i am getting no traction, i will flop the other way..as long as one of them goes tonight. unvote lathum vote hoops

05-21-2009, 03:52 PM	#3260
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Saldana - do you really think that Autumn, Chief, and I are the remaining wolves? If not, then why are both of them vouching for me?

05-21-2009, 03:57 PM	#3261
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	It is very discouraging to me that the villagers actually have a COT that they can act on but are choosing not to do so. I would not argue this as fervently if there was not a 3rd party coming in behind me/Chief to suggest that we are on the up-and-up. Assuming that this is not some really elaborate play by Autumn, with the intent to switch at the last minute, we have a COT that matches the max number of wolves in the game right now. But there are four votes on me, which means that some villagers are falling in line with where the wolves want the vote to go today.

05-21-2009, 04:02 PM	#3262
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	Hoops, I'm sorry but how do we have a COT. We have 3 people vouching for each other, none of who were seer cleared, in a game that we are pretty sure there are 3 wolves left.

05-21-2009, 04:03 PM	#3263
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	dola- I should say 2 vouching for each other and 1 vouching for the other 2

05-21-2009, 04:08 PM	#3265
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Lathum, so you believe that all three of us are wolves? I've asked this question a bunch of times and no one has come out and said that they think this is the case. Why in the world would the wolves be in such a rush to play it this way in a 6-3 game rather than taking their time? Lathum, do you worry about the fact that people have been setting it up as a you or me = wolf? I know I'm a villager and I think you are a wolf. Big difference between those two. How can others be so certain that one of the two of us is a wolf? Both DT and Saldana have used this as a reason for voting for us. PF has come pretty close to saying that, but I don't think he has outright said it in the thread.

05-21-2009, 04:10 PM	#3266
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	It is really frustrating not being able to talk about roles.

05-21-2009, 04:12 PM	#3267
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Poli, if you are a wolf then you are walking into a great spot. If you are a villager then you get a chance to make either a really bad vote or ... a vote that I hope is really good but honestly I'm not 100% sure about.

05-21-2009, 04:13 PM	#3268
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	As a matter of record, I can say that my assumptions about The Jackal were proven correct by last night's night kill and role reveal. Perhaps those of you interested in staying in therapy longer could trust my other assumptions based on that.

05-21-2009, 04:20 PM	#3271
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	Here is the thing. We already had a seer, how much info can Autumn really be privy to? No one is vouching for Autumn and a good way to gain your trust is to confirm you and CR are both villagers

05-21-2009, 04:20 PM	#3272
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Dubb, Lathum, Saldana - is Autumn just throwing Saldana in the vouch lists as an extra added bonus to create additional credibility? How are you explaining that? Seriously, the remaining villages really need to think long and hard about this vote. And, if they are still leaving it on me (of all people) then keep thinking until you change your mind. And if they are still not ready to change their mind when the deadline comes then the villagers probably lose this game. I have zero faith in their ability to win it tomorrow based on everything I've seen over the past couple of days.

05-21-2009, 04:20 PM	#3273
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	I'm not sure about that Hoops ... I did forget about that little hint. It would mean, to me, that DT or Lath are a wolf (or that we only have two wolves). But I think it would pay off to wait to answer that question.

05-21-2009, 04:23 PM	#3276
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	dola that was in regard to #3269

05-21-2009, 04:24 PM	#3279
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	someone give me a number 1-7

05-21-2009, 04:25 PM	#3281
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	I mean 1-9

05-21-2009, 04:31 PM	#3284
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	thanks. now 1-5 please

05-21-2009, 04:31 PM	#3285
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	5

05-21-2009, 04:33 PM	#3288
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	Unvote Hoops Vote Autumn looking back I just don't see why we should trust him. He put early votes on wolves each day and didn't move them, something a wolf would do. Except for the day Telle gets lynched when he was on Clap. Plus he seems to be hinting at all this information and I just don't see a role outside the seer or a wolf that could be that powerful.

05-21-2009, 04:42 PM	#3290
Autumn Head Coach Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bath, ME	That's fine Lathum if you want to go there. I'm sure I've pushed Danny's limits in terms of what I should be saying about my role, and I can't think of any way to make you trust my vouches without going into that. I think if you go back and look in thread you won't agree with yoru own assessment of my votes. I campaigned very strongly for those wolves, not only leading a charge and voting early but pushing others to consolidate their votes on wolves. If you're a wolf I'm sure you'll sit with this vote, but if you're a villager I think it's worth a look back to see if you really agree with yourself on this. I certainly have put my neck out pushing for things the last few days. That's only because I've been able to piece together more as the list of players dwindles. If you're a villager you could piece together some of what I have as well. Go back and you'll see I vouched for Jackal as well, correctly assessing his role as an independent and was backed up by Saldana there. Shit, my kids are screaming and I realy ahve to go. I'll try to make it back by deadline.

05-21-2009, 04:44 PM	#3291
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Well, I'll be around some between now and deadline but not a ton. I'm on kid duty alone tonight so she will more or less determine if I'm around the PC. OK, one last exercise for people. I'm guessing that the wolves have been paying pretty close attention to what Chief and I have said for the past couple of days. I would really like for the remaining villagers to go re-read Chief Rum's posts from yesterday and today. At that point, please revisit your voting strategy on me even if you do not believe that I am a villager. Just go grab another person that you think might be a wolf along with me. This is the last time that I will make this request.

05-21-2009, 05:14 PM	#3293
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	vote count?

05-21-2009, 05:17 PM	#3295
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	doing one now

05-21-2009, 05:21 PM	#3297
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	PF -4 Autumn (3183), DT (3220), Hoops (3258), CR (3264) Hoops-3 Dubb ( 3240), PF ( 3256), Saldana ( 3259) Autumn-1 Lathum (3288) no vote: Poli

05-21-2009, 05:34 PM	#3300
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Dubb, if you have anything at all that you want to ask me between now and deadline I would suggest doing it in the next ten minutes.

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