11-24-2016, 10:04 AM | #1 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
|
FOF8 Game Logs--Oh My!
Pulling this out from the main thread as it deserves its own shout-out as a likely game-changer when it comes to evaluating players' performances.
The logs contain this information on every play, which tells us who effed up to allow the winning TD in this case: 1-10-WAS12 (4Q: 01:03) Harrison Iacuessa pass completed to WR Chris Hillhouse for 12 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Hillhouse gained 2 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. Washington 13, Dallas 13
__________________
The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
11-24-2016, 10:05 AM | #2 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
|
...and at the end of the log, there's this:
Informal Player Pariticipation Grades
__________________
The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
11-24-2016, 10:10 AM | #3 |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Nov 2003
|
I had not scrolled all the way to the bottom of a log yet. Wow.
|
11-24-2016, 10:24 AM | #4 |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Apr 2005
|
Yep, this is a nice addition to the game
|
11-24-2016, 10:37 AM | #5 |
Pro Rookie
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
|
That's awesome...but please tell me that info is stored somewhere (player cards? Maybe when you click into specific season stats to see each game?). Otherwise sounds like it's time for Ben to write a new script!
|
11-24-2016, 10:39 AM | #6 |
High School JV
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
|
The SS doubling the TE is interesting to note.
|
11-24-2016, 10:46 AM | #7 |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Nov 2003
|
|
11-24-2016, 11:14 AM | #8 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Seven miles up
|
No kidding. Wow!
But yeah, that's gotta go on the player card somewhere!!! Please!!
__________________
He's just like if Snow White was competitive, horny, and capable of beating the shit out of anyone that called her Pops. Like Steam? Join the FOFC Steam group here: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/FOFConSteam |
11-24-2016, 11:20 AM | #9 |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Cary, NC
|
Would be great if this could be added to player stats.
If it's per-play data, it may be in the Solevision logs, which also means that either they have new info I have to parse, or it's been there all along and totally missed. I'll try and poke around soon and see what I can extract.
__________________
-- Greg -- Author of various FOF utilities |
11-24-2016, 11:49 AM | #11 |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Cary, NC
|
Solevision has definitely changed. Relative structure is the same, but the individual records are different and need some figuring. The depth chart is longer than it was, and the individual play records are new. Both are expected, but I'm going to need time to figure out what they mean. May need to turn it into a groupthink just to churn through it in a reasonable timeframe - my son is playing Classic-level soccer now so my time is more limited than it used to be.
__________________
-- Greg -- Author of various FOF utilities |
11-24-2016, 05:58 PM | #12 |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Edmonton, AB
|
Am I the only one who's curious about why the LBs in short zones get dinged on a comeback by an outside WR who is supposed to be covered by a CB?
|
11-24-2016, 07:42 PM | #13 |
Mascot
Join Date: Oct 2000
|
SWEET!
I always wondered how you could assess how well everyone was doing...now I can. Possibly my favorite game update since OOTP added doubleheaders! |
11-25-2016, 08:12 AM | #14 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
n00b
Join Date: Feb 2015
|
Quote:
Sorry to be a dud here but the logs generated in my game has nothing like the above. just the normal text with addition of who draws the penaltys. is there an option to turn this on or ...well what am I missing here where did the above come from? |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
11-25-2016, 08:17 AM | #15 | |
"Dutch"
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Tampa, FL
|
Quote:
There is an option to turn it on, it's not by default. Check your game settings. CONTROLS --> Options --> Edit Single-Player Options. There ya go! |
|
11-25-2016, 08:32 AM | #16 |
n00b
Join Date: Feb 2015
|
|
11-25-2016, 08:34 AM | #17 |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Near Cleveland
|
Dutch is correct, in the options you want to put yes for "Add detailed information to game logs".
|
11-25-2016, 08:43 AM | #18 |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Dec 2007
|
Great new info! But wait, who effed up? The two guys in bold? It seems to me those guys might be the players who doubled-teamed a receiver. The play information says the QB threw away from double coverage, so how can two guys get burned in coverage?
|
11-25-2016, 08:50 AM | #19 |
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
|
2 YAC. Maybe missed tackle? Or I suppose it could be a "between the steams" kinda thing and neither helped like they should have.
EDIT: Or also, assuming the engine is similar to the past, maybe they screwed up on their assignments, causing someone else to have to lean in their direction. thus allowing the catch elsewhere? ("the center pancaked the MLB on that sweep and disorganized the defense" and all that...) I mean, my assumption is that every player gets a "did his job"/'did not do his job" dice roll on each play.
__________________
The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! Last edited by Ben E Lou : 11-25-2016 at 08:56 AM. |
11-25-2016, 09:04 AM | #20 |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Dec 2007
|
Yes, the game is weird that way. And I assume you've seen enough logs to rule out that the guys in bold were the ones who double-covered a receiver. I've only see this one and so far.
Edit: Oh, I see you're not going by the bold print but by the minuses. Yes, that makes sense. Last edited by Firefly : 11-25-2016 at 09:04 AM. |
11-25-2016, 09:05 AM | #21 | |
lolzcat
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Annapolis, Md
|
Quote:
I predict this line of questioning is going to get deep, in time. Even if the system is very good, we are bound to have quirks and questions that come up. |
|
11-25-2016, 09:11 AM | #22 |
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
|
Oh, yeah. I bolded them myself; they're not like that in the log. The minuses are the key there.
__________________
The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! |
11-25-2016, 09:16 AM | #23 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Pro Starter
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: At the corner of Beat Street and Electric Avenue
|
Quote:
Yes, this is what I am gathering, the --- looks like they either messed up or were dominated in their assignment. Looking at my own game logs, there are plays where I got positive yardage, but it appears that there were players that still messed up their assignments. In this example, my QB Rivers passed for 7 yards but I am geeked on the info it gives here. While the LT and RB messed up their blocking assignments, the QB had enough time to recognize and throw away from the Primary WR who was double teamed. The Secondary Receiver, who was running a screen, caught the ball 5 yards past the line of scrimmage and got an additional 2 yards. In addition, the NT was not successful trying to rush the passer which may have given Rivers the time to find the secondary receiver: 2-12-SDO41 (1Q: 13:44) Philip Rivers pass completed to WR Dexter McCluster for 7 yards. Tackled by ILB Deone Bucannon, assisted by S Tony Jefferson. McCluster gained 2 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.
In this example, the primary receiver could not get open and 3 of of the 5 lineman appear to have been dominated on the line of scrimmage which Carson Palmer to run for his life: 2-3-ARI42 (1Q: 04:16) Play-Action. Carson Palmer scrambled for 10 yards. Tackled by OLB Jeremiah Attaochu.
Since all this info is in the logs, I can see Solevision being expanded and this is the type of info I have always wanted but we couldn't in previous iterations because of how it was designed.
__________________
"I'm ready to bury the hatchet, but don't fuck with me" - Schmidty "Box me once, shame on Skydog. Box me twice. Shame on me. Box me 3 times, just fucking ban my ass...." - stevew Last edited by Antmeister : 11-25-2016 at 09:27 PM. |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
11-25-2016, 09:35 AM | #24 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2000
|
What's really awesome about that second screen shot is how every defensive player did their job and they still gave up 10 yards. The QB simply made a great play. It happens.
|
11-25-2016, 10:23 AM | #25 |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: San Diego
|
I'll chime in with another thumbs up and agree that it would be very cool to have this tracked in game somewhere.
And as others have noted, I'm not sure this is meant to be a perfect proxy for "whose fault" anything was necessarily, although I'm sure that will often be the case. Trying to figure out which short zones these guys were covering with the offense in a trips formation and receivers running certain routes may very well be a useful exercise, but I'm not quite there yet. I just see it as a very simple coach's grade for how guys did their job on that play. |
11-25-2016, 10:53 AM | #26 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Pro Starter
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: At the corner of Beat Street and Electric Avenue
|
Okay so I was looking at the first play in the thread just to see if they were responsible and it just appears to me they just blew their assignments. It's just that the QB didn't see or take advantage of them.
1-10-WAS12 (4Q: 01:03) Harrison Iacuessa pass completed to WR Chris Hillhouse for 12 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Hillhouse gained 2 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. Washington 13, Dallas 13
To illustrate, here is what that exact play look like: What I love about the new game is that I can just design the exact play above easily in the play designer. As you will notice it is 113t which is the equivalent of 1 running back, 1 tight end, 3 receivers and it is weighted on the strong side of the formation (trips). In the above each of the CBs did their assignments well which is why they don't have a negative. Here is what an eagle 3/4 Nickel roughly looks like: Since this is a trips formation on offense, that means that slot (SL) receiver moves to the strong side of the formation (where the TE is). In addition, since this is Bump and Run Coverage, that means all 3 CB were up at the line of scrimmage. Looking at the above and comparing it to the play, it is most likely the SLB (the O above the TE) covered the TE in the zone and the Safety helped to double team him. That leaves a RB open and their was most likely confusion on who to cover which made them blow their assignments but the QB didn't go that direction. So what I am saying is that the Touchdown happened due to a well executed play that was well defensed. Now it can be sort of be indirectly involved, I guess, since there were two blown assignments, but I am leaning towards the former. The reason I am leaning towards this conclusion is because I see other entries in the logs in which there is a passing TD not due to blown coverage. In the example below, the CB was not successful on the blitz. While we can conclude that not getting pressure on the QB helps the offense, we cannot say he is directly at fault for the TD. A well executed play (good route running, good pass) plus good personnel can still win out. Example: 2-3-CAR03 (1Q: 07:57) Joe Flacco pass completed to WR Keenan Reynolds for 3 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Baltimore 6, Carolina 0
By the way, I highly suggest downloading those PDFs off the site. They help explain a lot and get me a bit giddy every time I play. Here is an example of what the routes are (strong side of formation, flip when it is on the weak side): Heck, if you just use that when viewing the game logs, it will help you see the routes each receiver is taking with just the number alone. Example when you see this in the game log - Secondary, 7 Corner (19-26) - you are just looking at number 7 on the graph to get a visual of the route.
__________________
"I'm ready to bury the hatchet, but don't fuck with me" - Schmidty "Box me once, shame on Skydog. Box me twice. Shame on me. Box me 3 times, just fucking ban my ass...." - stevew Last edited by Antmeister : 11-25-2016 at 09:33 PM. |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
11-25-2016, 11:19 AM | #27 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Pro Starter
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: At the corner of Beat Street and Electric Avenue
|
Oh and I found one play with no --- that went for a touchdown:
1-10-LAS25 (1Q: 15:00) Case Keenum pass completed to WR Kenny Britt for 3 yards. Tackled by S J.J. Wilcox, assisted by CB Brandon Carr. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.
Ooops....wrong play. The above was a standard play for short yardage. Here is the one I was referring to: 1-10-HOU17 (3Q: 08:29) Colin Kaepernick pass completed to WR Keshawn Martin for 17 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Martin gained 18 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. San Francisco 15, Houston 0
__________________
"I'm ready to bury the hatchet, but don't fuck with me" - Schmidty "Box me once, shame on Skydog. Box me twice. Shame on me. Box me 3 times, just fucking ban my ass...." - stevew Last edited by Antmeister : 11-25-2016 at 11:33 AM. Reason: Initially put in the wrong play from game log. |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
11-25-2016, 11:53 AM | #28 |
n00b
Join Date: Jun 2015
|
Thanks for explaining the numbers on the route tree corresponding with info in the log. That's so cool. Really will help visualize the game log.
|
11-27-2016, 12:09 AM | #29 |
FOFC's Elected Representative
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: The stars at night; are big and bright
|
I am spending enormous amounts of time parsing these logs. There is gold in them hills....
__________________
"i have seen chris simms play 4-5 times in the pros and he's very clearly got it. he won't make a pro bowl this year, but it'll come. if you don't like me saying that, so be it, but its true. we'll just have to wait until then" imettrentgreen "looking at only ten games, and oddly using a median only, leaves me unmoved generally" - Quiksand |
11-27-2016, 03:43 PM | #30 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: May 2006
|
I've spent a 'very' little time with FOF7 and that's about it, but this feature has pretty much guaranteed I get this once a couple of issues are sorted. Very impressive.
|
11-29-2016, 04:51 PM | #31 | |
"Dutch"
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Tampa, FL
|
Quote:
I want this in the Exports...we see all these future columns just waiting for info and this player data on game +++ and --- would be perfect. |
|
11-29-2016, 05:49 PM | #32 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2000
|
What is your worst defensive/offensive play you have seen? I had a 14 yard run go against me where the safety made the tackle. There were negative grades for 2 DL, 2 LB and 1 CB (all on the side the run took place) Essentially, the entire left side of my defense exploded.
|
11-30-2016, 07:38 AM | #33 | |
H.S. Freshman Team
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Quote:
Tom Brady musta been lead blocking over there on that side.
__________________
"REDICULOUS PLAYER HOMETOWN ERROR" - ich22 "REDICULOUS :D" - MalcPow "To diculous again." - larrymcg421 |
|
11-30-2016, 10:39 AM | #34 |
Mascot
Join Date: Mar 2012
|
Too bad none of this is kept track of in the player cards. I'm going to have to have several notebooks to keep track of how well everyone is doing. Yuck...writing.
|
11-30-2016, 11:46 AM | #35 | |
Pro Starter
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Newbury, England
|
Quote:
An extra stat along the lines of '% cock-ups' would be great. Stat name might need some refining I guess.
__________________
'A song is a beautiful lie', Idlewild, Self Healer. When you're smiling, the whole world smiles with you. Sports! |
|
11-30-2016, 11:49 AM | #36 | |
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Oct 2003
|
Quote:
This was my thinking too. It if could be done add 2 columns to the player's individual game stat screen, I can figure the percent on my own. |
|
11-30-2016, 11:52 AM | #37 |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Near Cleveland
|
|
11-30-2016, 12:29 PM | #38 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
College Benchwarmer
Join Date: Oct 2003
|
[quote=Antmeister;3131569]Oh and I found one play with no --- that went for a touchdown:
1-10-LAS25 (1Q: 15:00) Case Keenum pass completed to WR Kenny Britt for 3 yards. Tackled by S J.J. Wilcox, assisted by CB Brandon Carr. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.
1-10-HOU17 (3Q: 08:29) Colin Kaepernick pass completed to WR Keshawn Martin for 17 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Martin gained 18 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. San Francisco 15, Houston 0
I used Antmeister's post to highlight something I would like to see in the game log. The play result in a contrasting color to the detailed player performance section. Too me it would make it much easier when reading through a game log breaking it up a bit lessening eye strain. Last edited by Sweed : 11-30-2016 at 01:00 PM. |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
11-30-2016, 12:38 PM | #39 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: North Carolina
|
|
12-06-2016, 10:54 AM | #40 |
Mascot
Join Date: Mar 2012
|
What does everyone think is a good threshold for negative ratings? Not that negative is good. Maybe, what's acceptable. 80%, 75%, 70% and below?
|
12-06-2016, 11:40 AM | #41 |
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
|
I'm thinking "acceptable" is probably around 90% and "good" is 95%. I've been meaning to copy/paste some logs from maybe 20 wins and see what the average is in those.
__________________
The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! |
12-06-2016, 11:47 AM | #42 |
Mascot
Join Date: Mar 2012
|
Thanks Ben. Looks like my boys need to step it up a bit. Too many guys 85% and below.
|
12-06-2016, 12:03 PM | #43 |
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
|
At first quick glance even that is too low. it looks like somewhere around 91.5% is an average performance score.
__________________
The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! |
12-06-2016, 12:15 PM | #44 |
Mascot
Join Date: Mar 2012
|
Well, there's going to be some guys getting familiar with the bench if they don't pick it up. Thanks again.
|
12-06-2016, 05:11 PM | #45 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2000
|
Quote:
One thing of note here. . . don't forget to take in the amount of HUGE plays a guy makes or the amount of horrible plays a guy makes. My first game of the season, I have a lineman rotation battle going on. Both guys got between 35 and 40 plays. One guy had a 96% rating, the other guy 75%. The 75% guy also had 1 sack, a forced fumble and generated 4 QB hurries. The 96% guy had zero explosive plays. Obviously, there is more information to see and one game doesn't make or break a guy. . . but if the numbers stayed the way they are, I'll gladly take Mr. 75% in exchange for the game changing plays. |
|
08-29-2018, 01:16 AM | #46 |
n00b
Join Date: Jul 2014
|
Did we find a way to get this data consolidated using some sort of utility? Or, is the combined data stored somewhere? If I knew where to easily access the data, I suppose I could use a spreadsheet to combine it...
Also, did we determine how useful/important the data was to the player's value? |
08-29-2018, 08:25 AM | #47 | |
High School Varsity
Join Date: Jul 2012
|
Quote:
You can use excel to compile it, you need to know a little bit of advanced formulas though. |
|
08-29-2018, 09:00 AM | #48 |
n00b
Join Date: Jun 2006
|
does this only display on fof8 but not on 7 as I cannot find it
|
08-29-2018, 09:58 AM | #49 | ||
n00b
Join Date: Jul 2014
|
Quote:
Yeah, I can do it, but do I need to copy and paste the data off of the html from each individual log? Or is there a way to get all the information for each player into one place easier? Quote:
I can't remember if it was added near the end of fof7 (before fof8 came out) or not, but there is an option to turn on detail logs somewhere. Let me know if you can't find it and I will take a looksie myself. Last edited by SocratesJC : 08-29-2018 at 09:59 AM. |
||
08-29-2018, 12:01 PM | #50 |
n00b
Join Date: Jun 2006
|
I cannot find it, it only offers you a chance to show formations and not player contributions to a play
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
Thread Tools | |
|
|