The price of quality housing

[Vince, Pt. II]

So I'm moving and I don't like it. Currently love my place, but the owners have sold the property and I have no choice in the matter. My deal as it stands now is unheard of. I live in a house in one of the nicest neighborhoods in town, pay extremely (and I mean EXTREMELY) low rent and pretty much have it made. So wherever I move it's going to be a downgrade in size, location and an increase in price. Been looking for a few weeks (I have until the first week of July) and have been terribly underwhelmed by everything I've seen. Everything is tiny, expensive and in a crappy location.

Today, I found a place that I could totally live with. It's a duplex, sized well, in an acceptable location and with almost all the amenities that I'm looking for (it has single paned windows, an electric stove and no washer/dryer, though there are hookups for them). The problem is that it's "out of my price range." I set a goal of $2,000 per month for rent and this place is $2,400.

The kicker is that it's totally doable for me with my current job. The problem being that I've been staring a layoff in the face for 18 months now, and have managed to hold it off thus far. I'm one of the last 8 in my department (started with 17), and there is absolutely no way to predict how long I have until I lose the job. When I get another job, I am almost assuredly taking a massive (40%+) pay cut. Even after the pay cut I could afford the place, but it would be incredibly uncomfortable from a financial standpoint.

The place is so far above and beyond anything I've seen so far that it seems foolish to turn it down. Thoughts?

[molson]

I think you'll be a LOT happier and a LOT less stressed out if you stay in your price range, and ideally, if you can stay on the low end of it. I'd say while you're making good money, you want to bank as much of it as possible, and you'll have all the more options later. Of course, I'm a risk-averse cheapskate.

[Bad-example]

Step 1 - Buy a van.

Step 2 - Find a river.

[digamma]

Can you negotiate?

[Dutch]

Can you just be a renter for a while?

EDIT: Disregard, you are renting...

[EagleFan]

Is buying an option?

Where we used to live they were raising our rent almost $300 a month to put it in the range to the Super Luxury homes near the golf course but without the super luxury home to go with it.

We decided to buy and we're paying $500 less per month now, plus the tax break.

I have used some of that savings to hire someone to take care of the yard this year (will play it by ear starting next year but going from having no yard work over the past 25 years to having an acre of land was a huge jump).

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by molson

I think you'll be a LOT happier and a LOT less stressed out if you stay in your price range, and ideally, if you can stay on the low end of it. I'd say while you're making good money, you want to bank as much of it as possible, and you'll have all the more options later. Of course, I'm a risk-averse cheapskate.

This. 1000x this.

[stevew]

I can't imagine spending that much for housing. I would probably worry to death.

[sterlingice]

$2000?!? per month for rent? I'm annoyed that the 2500 square foot house we're in costs $1250 when we were looking more at a $1000 for a 2000 square foot when we originally moved to Indy but the deal fell through.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by molson

I think you'll be a LOT happier and a LOT less stressed out if you stay in your price range, and ideally, if you can stay on the low end of it. I'd say while you're making good money, you want to bank as much of it as possible, and you'll have all the more options later. Of course, I'm a risk-averse cheapskate.

Ditto

(particularly the last part)

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by stevew

I can't imagine spending that much for housing. I would probably worry to death.

Again, similarly: this!

SI

[chadritt]

Originally Posted by molson

I think you'll be a LOT happier and a LOT less stressed out if you stay in your price range, and ideally, if you can stay on the low end of it. I'd say while you're making good money, you want to bank as much of it as possible, and you'll have all the more options later. Of course, I'm a risk-averse cheapskate.

+1

Im freelance so I've frequently had that "wheres my next job coming from" concern. Moving out of my overpriced but nice old apartment has REALLY improved my entire life.

[Scoobz0202]

I know Vince is a big Giants fan, so if he lives in San Francisco then ridiculous rent doesn't surprise me in the least. At least from what I've read.

[Mr. Sparkle]

Yeah. Bay Area rent prices are cray right now (well, more so than normal).

[kingfc22]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

$2000?!? per month for rent? I'm annoyed that the 2500 square foot house we're in costs $1250 when we were looking more at a $1000 for a 2000 square foot when we originally moved to Indy but the deal fell through.

SI

$2000 is nothing for rent. We're so lucky in the Bay Area.

[molson]

I figured with that rent it was either the Bay area or the International Space Station.

[Vince, Pt. II]

3 bedroom place, I have one roommate so I'm not on the hook for all of the rent. Buying isn't really an option, especially because my employment situation is far from stable.

I don't know if I can emphasize how bad the rest of the places we've looked at have been. That $400 per month (probably around $200, as if we stagger the rent it won't be by much) is just close enough to the number I'm looking at that I can make a good argument for it.

Edit: Also, finding a 3rd roommate is probably out of the question as well. The value we get per dollar in terms of space, location and quality of housing is huge when you jump from 2 to 3 bedrooms, so we've been looking mostly at those. The 2 bedroom places we've seen have been some of the worst.

And yeah, we're in the South Bay.

[stevew]

Too bad you can't purchase a 4 bedroom and have 3 roomies. You'd probably be living close to rent free.

[Lathum]

It is easy to say you should be financially responsible and look for a place in your range, but if they don't exist then you may need to suck it up and pay the extra.

I would be certain your roommate can also afford the price jump so you wont be left in a lurch.

It really is amazing the prices of housing in certain cities. Our 2 bedroom 1200 square foot condo in Seattle cost almost 400K

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by molson

I figured with that rent it was either the Bay area or the International Space Station.

SI

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by Vince, Pt. II

I don't know if I can emphasize how bad the rest of the places we've looked at have been.

I can not back this up enough. The state of rentals (not all, but, most) in the Bay Area is absolutely horrible at best. The owners do not maintain them at all, yet, expect you to pay for it like it was just built yesterday. The Bay Area is basically full of cheap ass landlords thinking they are renting you a place in the South of France on the beach.

I'm still trying to figure out what is so special about this area that has housing prices so out of whack with reality. Traffic is 3rd worse in the nation, most of the people here are jerks, it's a pain in the ass to get anywhere and that's without traffic and the weather is basically South Seattle. As much as I like my job, this part of California makes it really hard to not want to leave.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by JediKooter

The state of rentals (not all, but, most) in the Bay Area is absolutely horrible at best.

SF rent changes

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

SF rent changes

Beyond ridiculous. The only thing unique about San Francisco is its topography, I will never understand why housing is so expensive here.

I've been lucky for the last two years. My landlord has not raised the rent on my barely 600sqft, 1 bedroom, 1 bath place in Sausalito. Which is 25 dollars cheaper a month than the 3 bedroom, 2 1/2 bath 1400 sqft town home I had in one of the nicest neighborhoods in San Diego.

[Rizon]

Originally Posted by JediKooter

I can not back this up enough. The state of rentals (not all, but, most) in the Bay Area is absolutely horrible at best. The owners do not maintain them at all, yet, expect you to pay for it like it was just built yesterday. The Bay Area is basically full of cheap ass landlords thinking they are renting you a place in the South of France on the beach.

I'm still trying to figure out what is so special about this area that has housing prices so out of whack with reality. Traffic is 3rd worse in the nation, most of the people here are jerks, it's a pain in the ass to get anywhere and that's without traffic and the weather is basically South Seattle. As much as I like my job, this part of California makes it really hard to not want to leave.

A lot of the renters bought the houses in an up-market, causing them to value rent higher than their high mortgage to turn a profit, or at least break even or slightly lose.

I rent my 800sqft townhouse in the ghetto to my friend for $1000/mo, but I could get $1250 if I needed to. Since I'm a slumlord, I do not provide my tenant with any type of bulletproofing of the townhome.

[molson]

No wonder my state is infested with Californians (I use that term lovingly, though the natives hate them).

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by Rizon

A lot of the renters bought the houses in an up-market, causing them to value rent higher than their high mortgage to turn a profit, or at least break even or slightly lose.

I rent my 800sqft townhouse in the ghetto to my friend for $1000/mo, but I could get $1250 if I needed to. Since I'm a slumlord, I do not provide my tenant with any type of bulletproofing of the townhome.

I can understand when they bought a place and how much their mortgage is, would dictate how much they would try and rent if for, but, what's going on in the Bay Area (not in all cases, but, A LOT) and from looking at that chart, is nothing short of price gouging in my opinion.

Well, it is Oakland. Usually bulletproofing and bars on the windows come standard.

[chadritt]

oh its a 2 person rental in SF? disregard my previous statement about looking for a cheaper place.

[Rizon]

Originally Posted by JediKooter

I can understand when they bought a place and how much their mortgage is, would dictate how much they would try and rent if for, but, what's going on in the Bay Area (not in all cases, but, A LOT) and from looking at that chart, is nothing short of price gouging in my opinion.

Well, it is Oakland. Usually bulletproofing and bars on the windows come standard.

Yeah, rent is way over priced ATM. Much better to buy than rent.
Those prices in SF are insane. I've been to some of those areas; they are nice, but it is sardine-housing and 0sq ft yards. I couldn't live like that. Yeah, your commute is 20 minutes and you have easy access to clubs, but where my wife and I live her commute to SF is only 45 minutes and we are within walking distance of everything we could need (grocery store, food, banks, etc) and pay 1/2 the price, plus have a large yard (for the area).

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by Rizon

Yeah, rent is way over priced ATM. Much better to buy than rent.
Those prices in SF are insane. I've been to some of those areas; they are nice, but it is sardine-housing and 0sq ft yards. I couldn't live like that. Yeah, your commute is 20 minutes and you have easy access to clubs, but where my wife and I live her commute to SF is only 45 minutes and we are within walking distance of everything we could need (grocery store, food, banks, etc) and pay 1/2 the price, plus have a large yard (for the area).

Yea, I just have a very very hard time justifying paying 700K so I can live in a 100 year old, 1200sqft, no yard, no garage, earthquaked out house, just so I can brag that I live in the city. Oh, and then drive around (if you can afford a car on a 700K mortgage) for 45 minutes to an hour, trying to find a parking spot.

It's too bad there's a big body of water in the way of getting back and forth from the East Bay to the city in 10 minutes. I think they should drain the bay, pave it, then you can get just about anywhere here in about 20 minutes.

I say all this, but, I have been lucky that my rent has not been raised at all since I moved into the place I'm currently in.

[DaddyTorgo]

I see people talking about how cheap their housing is and it makes me wish I lived someplace cheap.

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I see people talking about how cheap their housing is and it makes me wish I lived someplace cheap.

Me too, but, the problem is, usually the wages are also lower in those places, so you're never going to get ahead in the game. I would love to live somewhere cheap and doesn't snow, but, make as much as I am now.

[JonInMiddleGA]

http://blog.sfgate.com/ontheblock/20...-the-east-bay/

Since the link doesn't carry the headline, it's a recent article talking about how there are at least two cities in the U.S. where renting makes more sense than buying: Honolulu and San Fran

[chadritt]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I see people talking about how cheap their housing is and it makes me wish I lived someplace cheap.

If we ever get to the point where I can do my job remotely I will move out of LA. My friends back home in Atlanta can get such nice houses for less than the rent on my 1 bedroom apartment.

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

http://blog.sfgate.com/ontheblock/20...-the-east-bay/

Since the link doesn't carry the headline, it's a recent article talking about how there are at least two cities in the U.S. where renting makes more sense than buying: Honolulu and San Fran

I believe it. Plus there's really not much incentive to live in the suburbs here in the Bay Area. You'll just go from paying 700K for a house in the city, to 675K for a house in the suburbs. Or, you could move even further away, say 30 miles away and pay 600K, but, now you have a hour and a half to two hour commute because there's usually only one way in to the city from where you're coming from. It's just a vicious cycle. I'm really glad I have no roots or commitments here other than work, so when the time comes, I can pack up and get the hell out of this area at a moments notice.

[Pyser]

has there ever been a thread here for what people pay on their mortgage or rentals? i think that'd be really interesting to see, to get a quick snapshot of the nations prices.

(I'm too lazy to search myself, yes)

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by JediKooter

Me too, but, the problem is, usually the wages are also lower in those places, so you're never going to get ahead in the game. I would love to live somewhere cheap and doesn't snow, but, make as much as I am now.

The biggest problem isn't so much the wage disparity as it is the (lack of) volume of jobs in other areas. If you have a comparable job in another area, you probably don't make much less but you certainly have less options if you lose it (or want to leave it).

The whole Silicon Valley, SF, etc. areas are such a good example of the impact of real estate when its driven up by (LARGE) investors. The market is no longer affordable to its workers.

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by Pyser

has there ever been a thread here for what people pay on their mortgage or rentals? i think that'd be really interesting to see, to get a quick snapshot of the nations prices.

(I'm too lazy to search myself, yes)

Good question. Or maybe where people have moved from one place to another and see (percentage wise maybe) if they are actually saving money and/or getting ahead.

[Daimyo]

Just wait until you have kids and have to worry about the schools. Going from a bad school to a good one adds $600/month on the East Bay (not sure about the rest of the Bay Area).

We just moved to the East Bay in March and feel lucky to have found a decent three bedroom (+ office) house in a 10-rated elementary school in Kensington for $2600/month. Everything comparable we looked at was further out (i.e, Orinda/Lafayette/Maraga or Walnut Creek) and $3000+.

We came from Chicago, which isn't known for cheap housing, where we had a nicer four bedroom house with a huge yard for $1850/month. IMO, though, living here is totally worth the premium.

[Daimyo]

You should also definitely try negotiating with the landlord over the rent. When we were looking most of the places we looked at had been on the market for at least a month. We were looking at houses and most of the places we looked at were landlords with just the single rental property. They seemed picky about what they were looking for in tenants as far as tenant stability and care of the place.

We got our landlord to come down $100 and probably could have gotten a bit more but didn't want to start off the relationship too aggressively especially since we considered it to already be under-priced relative to the market.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Pyser

has there ever been a thread here for what people pay on their mortgage or rentals? i think that'd be really interesting to see, to get a quick snapshot of the nations prices.

(I'm too lazy to search myself, yes)

I'll start. I pay $2650 for a 1 bedroom in a co-op building on E 57th St in NYC, which the owner converted into a 2 BR a few years back. Great location, plenty of space, tons of closets, etc. We moved in 6 months ago and have no intention of leaving until we actually move out of the city. Once I saw it I knew we had to take it...it would probably go for $3200/month on the open market but the owner wanted responsible tenants and no hassle.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Monticello, GA rents an older 2 BR/1.5 BA standalone in the city limits for about $500/month.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Pyser

has there ever been a thread here for what people pay on their mortgage or rentals? i think that'd be really interesting to see, to get a quick snapshot of the nations prices.

(I'm too lazy to search myself, yes)

I torrent my house.

[chadritt]

1 bedroom in Burbank CA, 675 square feet for 1320 a month. Was 1200 when I moved in a year ago. It includes an in unit washer and dryer which I was willing to pay extra for and the location works really well for where my friends live and where most of my jobs are. Of course once i reupped for another year I got a job with an hour long commute each way but my next gig should be right around the corner.

Have previously paid 1500/month for slightly more space but no washer dryer in the same area, the rent got raised a few times over the years and they offered a significant reduction when they found out i was leaving, as well as 2650 for a 3 bedroom 2100 square foot duplex I shared with 2 roommates in the Miracle Mile area.

[SteveMax58]

3-bed, 2-bath, 2-car garage, 1700 sq ft, Single Family home in Tampa, FL for $1275/mo.

[JediKooter]

1 bed, 1 bath, 600sqft in Sausalito, $1575/mo apartment. At least I drive the opposite way of traffic getting to and from work and I only go to the city if I have to drop off my rent check or go work at the office on the Presidio.

[Pyser]

just bought a 4 bed, 2 bath 1500 sq ft house in encino, ca (valley of los angeles). 30 year mortgage is $1875 not counting taxes or homeowners insurance.

before that i was in a 1 bed, 1 bath 1000 sq ft side by side duplex with a private yard and washer dryer in west la. was 2k a month.

[lcjjdnh]

Could be worse--A 1BR in Northwest North Dakota goes for $2300!!!! these days:

http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/Atlan...0U/story01.htm

Supply-and-demand at work.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Pyser

has there ever been a thread here for what people pay on their mortgage or rentals? i think that'd be really interesting to see, to get a quick snapshot of the nations prices.

(I'm too lazy to search myself, yes)

$1650/month for an 800sqft 1br 13-miles outside of Boston (my rent just went up $100/month this month actually).

Of course my commute to work is 10 mins each way, but it's more than I feel like I want to be paying.

[Autumn]

We rent a 3 bedroom, 1.5 bath house with a big yard here in Maine for $975/month. Of course there are no jobs in Maine. Luckily our business is not tied to our location.

[stevew]

There's no jobs here worth a shit, but I'm paying like 505 on a 3 bedroom with full basement. If I ever can get it fixed up enough to refi, i'm hoping I've been able to add 20-30 grand to the value. i think we paid like 58K. Hermitage PA.