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Old 01-29-2008, 04:03 PM   #1351
RendeR
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I am a damn good worker and deserve a better label than Schmuck.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:28 PM   #1352
Mr. Wednesday
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I'm willing to revisit the question of how Alan was trying to play as the sole remaining Crew wolf.

I'm sure his plan would have involved winning the night kill this past night, but how would he have been expecting to finesse picking off the other two Cougars in the vote without being unmasked as the final Crew? How realistic is it that he would go into a face-off with Passacaglia where Pass wasn't a wolf, but rather a vanilla worker? How would Alan leverage that to push subsequent votes onto Cougars?

Turning it around the other way, I don't see that I can read too much into Passacaglia's anti-Alan agenda either way. On the one hand, just as advocating too hard for a Cougar could make Alan suspicious, the same goes for a Cougar advocating too hard for a Crew. On the other hand, there are still three Cougars out there, and it would make sense for them to adopt a strategy where one of them is a sort of a throw-away trying to get the last Crew lynched and the others try to blend into the crowd to get the win.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:31 PM   #1353
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Wednesday View Post
I tried to make it a tie, because a tie worked strongly in favor of the golf buddies, and at the time I believe we still had both of the most useful roles in play. When I initially tried to flip, RendeR had a lead of one, so I took my vote off of him and threw it on somebody unrelated (although there was some craziness around me unvoting the wrong guy).

When there was a subsequent vote on Fink, I moved right back onto RendeR, and then the late votes on Fink settled things.

Without knowing RendeR's affiliation, nor the tiebreaking strategy if the apparent tie would have been an actual tie, it's impossible to say if my move was correct.

Actually what you did was...

Vote RendeR (396), which tied him 2-2 with fink

Unvote Schmidty, Vote claphamsa (583) -- Never minding the fact that your vote wasn't on Schmidty in the first place, the tally at this time was 8 for fink, and 5 for RendeR (I included you as one of the 5, since I'm not sure who your vote is actually on at this point), and voting claphamsa does nothing to make it a tie

Unvote claphamsa, Vote RendeR (585) -- So now it's 8-5, because I think either way you interpret this, your vote was meant to be on RendeR. Then after all that is when mau voted to make it 9-5.

It seems to me much more like you were trying to confuse the issue, rather than force a tie.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:34 PM   #1354
Passacaglia
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Originally Posted by Mr. Wednesday View Post
How would Alan leverage that to push subsequent votes onto Cougars?

I don't think that was his plan. I think that his plan was to stay away from the Cougars, make sure the heat stayed off him, and hope that the village could find the other wolves.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:36 PM   #1355
Passacaglia
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Turning it around the other way, I don't see that I can read too much into Passacaglia's anti-Alan agenda either way.

Remember, though, that it was Alan who came after me first. I didn't have an anti-Alan agenda as much as he had an anti-Pass agenda.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:38 PM   #1356
Mr. Wednesday
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Your implication is fact-challenged.

Post 558: CR has a semi-official count with RendeR leading 7-6, at 10:52 pm.
Post 568: You switch from RendeR to Fink, putting it 7-6 the other way, at 10:55 pm.

My flip vote comes in almost simultaneously with Schmidty's Fink vote at 10:57 pm, his in post 578 and mine in post 583.

Regardless, your claim that it was 8-5 is wrong. It was actually 8-6, and effectively 7-6 at the time I attempted the switch. And I thought it was 6-7 because I had somehow missed your vote. Probably a contributor here was that I was on the phone at the time and slightly distracted.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:38 PM   #1357
Mr. Wednesday
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Dola, that's the implication that I was trying to confuse things.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:45 PM   #1358
Passacaglia
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Originally Posted by Mr. Wednesday View Post
Your implication is fact-challenged.

Post 558: CR has a semi-official count with RendeR leading 7-6, at 10:52 pm.
Post 568: You switch from RendeR to Fink, putting it 7-6 the other way, at 10:55 pm.

My flip vote comes in almost simultaneously with Schmidty's Fink vote at 10:57 pm, his in post 578 and mine in post 583.

Regardless, your claim that it was 8-5 is wrong. It was actually 8-6, and effectively 7-6 at the time I attempted the switch. And I thought it was 6-7 because I had somehow missed your vote. Probably a contributor here was that I was on the phone at the time and slightly distracted.

You're right that it was 8-6 -- I was just looking at your summary post, and didn't see that mauboy had his vote on RendeR at that time. Sorry about that.

Your vote was a minute after Schmidty's, but there was enough time that four other people were able to post in that time. If you're on the phone, I can understand, but
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:46 PM   #1359
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whoops...don't know what happened there.

...but you can see how it looks confusing to us.
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:48 PM   #1360
Mr. Wednesday
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I'm still not sure how I managed to miss your switch, and I'm quite certain that Schmidty's was less than a minute before mine in real-time (my subsequent move back onto RendeR was driven by seeing his vote come up after I did my initial switch, and note that I added a following "tied, right?" query that shows that I had miscounted).
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:51 PM   #1361
Passacaglia
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I think we've argued this to death, especially considering it was five days ago. Any thoughts on The Jackal?
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Old 01-29-2008, 04:59 PM   #1362
jeheinz72
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Well I'm done for the day, so don't count on me to change. I think Pass is the most logical option for a Cougar right now.
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Old 01-29-2008, 05:06 PM   #1363
Passacaglia
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The thing that itches me about The Jackal is that I took heat for my votes for fink on Day 2, and Farrah on Day 3. The Jackal voted the exact same way, but took far less heat -- his name was mentioned passingly, but that was about it. I think that people were more interested in the Pass/mau thing, since mau voted the same as The Jackal and me...just that mau usually did it right around the same time as me, and as a result, The Jackal was widely overlooked -- in a great way for him, since people were content to kill mau on Day 4, then if he turns up good, look at me Day 5, giving him two days for people to forget about him. Then fortuitously for him, we had some eventful days that have put him back under the radar, while I've stayed...uh..above it.
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Old 01-29-2008, 05:09 PM   #1364
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Originally Posted by jeheinz72 View Post
Well I'm done for the day, so don't count on me to change. I think Pass is the most logical option for a Cougar right now.

No problem -- I'm not looking for people to really change their votes. At this point, I'm just giving the duke some options. We're at our last stand here, so it would be a good time to get a cleared villager to help our odds tomorrow. So since you're gone, I hope you're not the duke, or that if you are, you've already put in your order to save me.
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Old 01-29-2008, 05:10 PM   #1365
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That goes for Mr. Wednesday, path, and The Jackal, too. Even though I've been heaping accusations at you guys, feel free to save me if you're the duke.
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Old 01-29-2008, 05:33 PM   #1366
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Old 01-29-2008, 06:10 PM   #1367
oliegirl
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Ok guys, I'm back and caught up...it's been a LONG day! But we've added a puppy, and 2 kitten to our family - yes, you read that right, and yes, we are insane. Anyway...

I think at this point, the most likely scenario is that Pass and AlanT were both wolves, and Alan's attempt to get Pass voted out was so that there was at least SOME chance that he'd be left standing. I just really don't see the logic behind any other course of action/reasoning he might have had. I've ready everything that Pass has had to say today, and I still don't see what Alan would have had to gain by NOT aggressively going after a CougarWolf. If you want to try to explain it again, I'm willing to read it and take it into consideration, but until then...

VOTE PASSACAGLIA
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Old 01-29-2008, 06:30 PM   #1368
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Ok guys, I'm back and caught up...it's been a LONG day! But we've added a puppy, and 2 kitten to our family - yes, you read that right, and yes, we are insane. Anyway...

I think at this point, the most likely scenario is that Pass and AlanT were both wolves, and Alan's attempt to get Pass voted out was so that there was at least SOME chance that he'd be left standing. I just really don't see the logic behind any other course of action/reasoning he might have had. I've ready everything that Pass has had to say today, and I still don't see what Alan would have had to gain by NOT aggressively going after a CougarWolf. If you want to try to explain it again, I'm willing to read it and take it into consideration, but until then...

VOTE PASSACAGLIA

It's not so much what he has to gain by not going after one of the other wolves, it's what he has to lose by doing it. If I were one of the other wolves, and he had gone after me, my teammates would have all gone after him.
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Old 01-29-2008, 06:40 PM   #1369
Chief Rum
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alan t was crew it just hasnt been updated yet

Whoops. It's updated now.
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Old 01-29-2008, 06:47 PM   #1370
Chief Rum
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Day 7 Count (as of Post 1369)

Passacaglia (7)-- Mr. Wednesday (1295), Render (1302), claphamsa (1307), path12 (1312), The Jackal (1316), jeheinz (1318), oliegirl (1367)
Mr. Wednesday (1)-- Passacaglia (1333)

Not Voted: Schmidty


Vote count to this point.
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Old 01-29-2008, 06:52 PM   #1371
oliegirl
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It's not so much what he has to gain by not going after one of the other wolves, it's what he has to lose by doing it. If I were one of the other wolves, and he had gone after me, my teammates would have all gone after him.

I see where you are coming from, but don't buy it. It was really his only choice as the last member of the crew left standing. It's like fighting 10 enemies with one bullet left in your gun and saying "well, I don't want to shoot someone b/c then all the other bad guys are going to come after me". They are going to come after you anyway, so you may as well go down fighting.

My vote stands.
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Old 01-29-2008, 07:13 PM   #1372
Passacaglia
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My vote stands.

Again, I'm not really trying to get people to change their votes -- with three or four wolves out there, I know I don't have a hope of actually getting more votes on someone else today. I'm just giving the duke some options.
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Old 01-29-2008, 07:15 PM   #1373
Passacaglia
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I see where you are coming from, but don't buy it. It was really his only choice as the last member of the crew left standing. It's like fighting 10 enemies with one bullet left in your gun and saying "well, I don't want to shoot someone b/c then all the other bad guys are going to come after me". They are going to come after you anyway, so you may as well go down fighting.

My vote stands.

But to reply to what you've said...if what you're saying is true, villagers would have never been voted off at all, because the wolves would have kept voting after each other. If you look at the voting history, you'll see a few examples of wolves going after villagers, but you won't see any examples of wolves going after other wolves.
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Old 01-29-2008, 07:19 PM   #1374
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But to reply to what you've said...if what you're saying is true, villagers would have never been voted off at all, because the wolves would have kept voting after each other. If you look at the voting history, you'll see a few examples of wolves going after villagers, but you won't see any examples of wolves going after other wolves.

True, but like someone said earlier, things change day to day...what you just pointed out makes sense for a strategy early on in the game, but not for what Alan faced yesterday as last man standing. Hey, if we are wrong and you are good, I'll be the first to apologize and admit that we screwed up, but I don't think we are.
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Old 01-29-2008, 07:23 PM   #1375
Passacaglia
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My mistake -- SnDvls voted for fink on Day 2. But it's not like he pushed hard in the style that Alan pushed for me.
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Old 01-29-2008, 08:56 PM   #1376
Chief Rum
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Wow, quiet deadline.
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Old 01-29-2008, 08:58 PM   #1377
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Wow, quiet deadline.


THats what you get for killing me off.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:01 PM   #1378
Chief Rum
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THats what you get for killing me off.

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Old 01-29-2008, 09:02 PM   #1379
Chief Rum
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Deadline
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I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:06 PM   #1380
Passacaglia
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THats what you get for killing me off.

Just think what happens if I get killed off.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:07 PM   #1381
Lathum
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don't forget about me!
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:08 PM   #1382
Passacaglia
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don't forget about me!

Yeah...this place will be snoozeville without us.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:22 PM   #1383
Chief Rum
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Day 7 Count (as of Post 1369)

Passacaglia (7)-- Mr. Wednesday (1295), Render (1302), claphamsa (1307), path12 (1312), The Jackal (1316), jeheinz (1318), oliegirl (1367)
Mr. Wednesday (1)-- Passacaglia (1333)

Not Voted: Schmidty


Vote count to this point.

Writeup is done, but thought I would bring this up first. No votes since, so this is the official vote.
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Last edited by Chief Rum : 01-29-2008 at 09:22 PM.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:22 PM   #1384
Chief Rum
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After yesterday's close vote, the office seems to prefer to go back to runaway votes--less stress that way.

After a week of haranguing former Crew member Alan around the office, Passacaglia seems set for his own demise. Shortly before sign off, the Boss calls him into the office and closes the door.

The discussion doesn't last. Passacaglia walks to his desk and quietly starts to put his effects in a box.

Passacaglia has been FIRED! And he was a Wolf! A Cougar!

The time for going home comes and goes, but everyone is still in the office. There is one more firing to go.

The Boss seems to be taking his sweet time, though. He makes no move for the phone, nor does he motion for anyone to come into the office. He goes over some paperwork for a few minutes, then he gathers up his coat and shuts the office light off on his way out the door. He's going home!

Did the Cougars not influence the Boss to fire anyone else today? No one knows for sure.

With some confusion, the remaining workers start to shut down for the night.

Just as Mr. Wednesday finishes shutting his computer down, his employment agency adviser shows up. "Oh, Mr. Wednesday," she said in a rush, "I'm so sorry I was running behind, but I had to catch you. I have some grave news..."

She leads him into a side room, where he is told the Boss decided he wasn't up for letting anyone go today personally, so why not let one of his temps go instead?

Mr. Wednesday has been NIGHT-FIRED by the Cougars! He was a Temp!


The next deadline is WED 10 P.M. EST/ 7 P.M. PDT. I will be home after all, so no need to wait for a late deadline.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:26 PM   #1385
Passacaglia
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Yes! I knew Pass was a bad guy!

Good job, village.
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Old 01-29-2008, 09:27 PM   #1386
claphamsa
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no shock here..... Pass knew he was dead a while ago, so im gonna use my powers of deduction to see who he was sparing with.... and figure that is the other couger...
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Old 01-29-2008, 10:19 PM   #1387
RendeR
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2 Cougars
1 fish/wolf
1 comic
1 temps
2 DAMN FINE INDIVIDUALS



ok so here we sit. If this is the way things are we have a pretty solid voting block. Question is, where to start trusting people at this point?

Our real problem is this is a crucial day. If we blow the firing and lose another good guy and they convert, we're done. If we have a comic I'm beginning to think its time for him or her to reveal, it gives us a starting base for trust. If they reveal I'll go with them *barring the expected counter reveal etc etc etc. Blah.

So whats everyone else think? Who should we put on the vivisection table next?
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Old 01-29-2008, 10:20 PM   #1388
Arles
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Jeez, five weeks after I pegged him Pass was finally voted off
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Old 01-29-2008, 10:21 PM   #1389
Alan T
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Jeez, five weeks after I pegged him Pass was finally voted off


I tried to help you out there best as I could!
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Old 01-29-2008, 11:13 PM   #1390
Mr. Wednesday
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Yeah...this place will be snoozeville without us.

And here I'd been trying to keep things active...
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Old 01-29-2008, 11:34 PM   #1391
path12
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Our real problem is this is a crucial day. If we blow the firing and lose another good guy and they convert, we're done. If we have a comic I'm beginning to think its time for him or her to reveal, it gives us a starting base for trust. If they reveal I'll go with them *barring the expected counter reveal etc etc etc. Blah.

I don't think we want the comic to reveal. If they come out, they can be killed at night since we don't have a bodyguard.
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Old 01-29-2008, 11:50 PM   #1392
path12
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The thing that really sucks right now is that my trust list looks like:

Trust -- path
Lean Trust --
No Read -- The Jackal, Mr Wednesday, RendeR, oliegirl, claphamsa, jeheinz, Schmidty
Lean Distrust --
Distrust --

No read might be a little harsh. I have tiny reads, but not enough to do much with. Bear with me while I free associate my thoughts on everyone left.

Schmidty -- hasn't been around for a couple days. either not a cougar because stuff is still happening or his partner is very involved in the game.

The Jackal -- keeping his cards close. One thing I agreed with Pass on was that his non-vote a couple of days ago was pretty odd.

Oliegirl -- seems good but always does. more in and out in the thread, following along more than digging.

Mr W -- was right on Pass. always plays same game, hard to read. would he toss under the bus?

RendeR -- I've suspected you as fish the entire game.

claphamsa -- really has been different this game. was louder as wolf. buddy?

jeheinz -- actually almost forgot he was in the game. that's different too. really no read.

Sigh. Reading that back reminds me how poorly I've been playing lately.
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Old 01-30-2008, 12:40 AM   #1393
Schmidty
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Location: Early, TX
Sorry everyone. My daughter had a snow day today, and I layed down with her for a nap early afternoon. My wife came home at 4 and didn't wake me up. Apparantly I was really, really tired because I finally woke up at 10 pm. and have to go to work at 11.

Like I told CR via PM. I'll try to get a vote in before I go to sleep tomorrow, and will definitely set my alarm in case I fall asleep in the afternoon.
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Old 01-30-2008, 12:41 AM   #1394
Schmidty
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Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Early, TX
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Originally Posted by path12 View Post
I don't think we want the comic to reveal. If they come out, they can be killed at night since we don't have a bodyguard.

Yeah. That was a weird thing for him to suggest, since it's obvious that without the bodyguard it would be insanely stupid for a big role like that to reveal.
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Old 01-30-2008, 06:12 AM   #1395
Chief Rum
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Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Where Hip Hop lives
Off to work. ANyone needs to reach me, please email me at [email protected]. I should be there until arounf 3:30 p.m. PDT/
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I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.
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Old 01-30-2008, 06:29 AM   #1396
oliegirl
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Caught somewhere between Raising Hell and Amazing Grace...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schmidty View Post
Yeah. That was a weird thing for him to suggest, since it's obvious that without the bodyguard it would be insanely stupid for a big role like that to reveal.

I lost connection last night at 10:10, just as I was going in to see results...we had some pretty heavy rain last night and it knocked out cable for a little bit...I just gave up and crashed.

Glad Pass was a wolf, but it sucks that ...I'm heading back to sleep for a little while, but will be going over voting records and such when I get back.
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Old 01-30-2008, 06:56 AM   #1397
claphamsa
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: non white trash MD
I am baffled by the hours some of yalls work.....
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Old 01-30-2008, 07:04 AM   #1398
oliegirl
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Caught somewhere between Raising Hell and Amazing Grace...
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Originally Posted by claphamsa View Post
I am baffled by the hours some of yalls work.....

My going back to sleep has nothing to do with work, just the fact that a 12 week old puppy and 2 8 week old kittens kept me up all night. Why do they always decide 2 am is a good time to play????
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Old 01-30-2008, 07:48 AM   #1399
jeheinz72
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Fresno, CA
Woo! Caught us a Cougar. I love it. Looks like the others hid themselves pretty well though. I'm going to pour back over that manifesto post of past votes here in a bit and see what I can dig up.
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Old 01-30-2008, 07:57 AM   #1400
jeheinz72
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Fresno, CA
Oh even better now that I've read my PM's folks. We've caught ourselves another Cougar!

See, I'm the Fish. I guess no one bothered to actually try me until last night when I was told The Jackal came to see me. He was told that I wouldn't convert since the Crew was taken out so well and I was told he's a COUGAR!


Vote TheJackal
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