COVID-19 - 3/13 - Poll #1 - How's everyone feeling?

[Edward64]

So how's everyone feeling?

Don't think the scale is quite right but wanted to toss something out there.

[MIJB#19]

I would say something between options 2 and 3:
concerned, people are acting too indifferently in trying to help contain it

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by MIJB#19

I would say something between options 2 and 3:
concerned, people are acting too indifferently in trying to help contain it

It did occur to me to use a 10-scale but thought that would be too busy. I can see adding a "concerned" vs worried category but too late to add.

What did you end up picking?

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by MIJB#19

I would say something between options 2 and 3:
concerned, people are acting too indifferently in trying to help contain it

This is where I am. I'm not really sure what to think. I feel like things aren't as bad as they should be for all of these cancellations, but I'm ok with it if it means we contain things.

I'm not going to act like I know more than the experts and say everything is overblown. I'll just the powers that be because there's nothing else I can really do.

[NobodyHere]

About a 1 1/2 right now.

[QuikSand]

I've been talking to a number of knowledgeable people, and my level of concern is toward the later end of that scale. In MD we are still publicly talking about each case, and isolating what travel/exposure it connects to. Public health people are talking in a different way about this. And also about what a "mild" versus "severe" case means, in context.

I'll answer RRW... but considered CtFO.

[ISiddiqui]

I'm between 2 and 3, but can't really vote for either because I think the descriptors aren't accurate for me.

So rather than:
"I'm worried but think people are overreacting
Really worried, lots of deaths coming but not near 1%"

I'd be "I'm worried, but I don't think people are overreacting". Or "I'm worried, but I think the mortality rate will be 1% or less with social distancing". I don't think I'm really worried, I'm cautiously optimistic that the efforts taken by our sports leagues of all things will help significantly.

[Lathum]

I am a mix of 3 and 5. I see a lot of deaths and am concerned. I have also stocked up on certain things.

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

About a 1 1/2 right now.

NOTE: This rambles a bit, but I have a conference call coming up and at least wanted to get some points out there since I have had to deal with death frequently in the last year.

Same, marking 2.

This is going to sound extremely cold, but this is based upon someone in my family going to 6 different funerals since this time last year, all but one were for people over 60 years of age, one was for an 18 year old.

As a civilization, we do a very good job of extending life as compared to previous generations. What kills many elderly people are colds, pneumonia, cancer, diseases that they would survive at an earlier age, but their body can no longer fight off. Many of these people are living lives that they would not have wanted to live even a few years before because their loved ones have passed away or all their friends have. Others are upset that they are dependent upon others and want to be independent.

I was at the funeral for my 88 year old grand uncle 2 months ago. He was completely dependent upon others for his care. His wife was unable to care for him, so they had a nurse come in during the day, and my cousins would take turns each night caring for him. His funeral was attended primarily by friends of the family, not his friends. Most of their friends had already died. The family treated his death as a celebration of life. Even though my aunt had a stroke the night of the wake, and died the day of the funeral, which was a shock, we were still joking about much of it. My uncle was senile and when his wife would leave the room he would constantly ask where she was. "Where is she? where is she?" This was every 2-3 minutes.

So the joke was, he died, went to heaven, and went to God and asked, "Where's Betty? Where's Betty?" God's response, "I'm working on it, she's being stubborn again."

The other one, my aunt's mother died 11 days after her father died. My aunt was one that was always up for a challenge, "Hey ma! It took you 11 days after dad died to follow, I did it in 4!"

The people that are mostly susceptible are those that are elderly and with other underlying issues. I am an asthmatic (as I mentioned in another thread it is normally well controlled) and any respiratory illness hits me much harder than anyone else in the family. Based upon the prevalence of this, the doctors believe me to have this (I was not tested, was told to self quarantine and monitor, provided a albuterol prescription and Z-pak for secondary infections), and it has been a pain in my ass, but no more than the flu would have been (I still tend to believe I had the flu, but the symptoms are so similar maybe I do).

Or looking at it another way, my mother died at 64 from breast cancer. Using that as a hard set in stone point, would I rather have my mom die from cancer, or would from Coronavirus? I would obviously pick neither, but if I have to take one, give me Coronavirus, I would much rather have her die without having the 3 years of chemo that entailed and loss of her quality of life. Let her have a full life and only 2 weeks of hell at the end, than the 6 weeks she had. I would be more likely to remember my mom as she was for the first 61 years of her life, rather than the last 1-2 like I do now.

Where I am going with this, is this any different from any other particularly virulent disease? With how virulent it is, we are going to have a bad season or two of it and it won't bother us again because the young people it does not affect or affects in minor ways will have immunity to it.

The only problem with this is those younger people that are susceptible to RSV. What do you do there? I would treat it the same way as the flu. From what I can see on the statistics, children, even those susceptible to RSV, are very resilient to the virus. So I say carry on.

[henry296]

While potentially late, I think we are finally on the right track to get this managed. Whenever the testing catches up and we will be able to quickly identify the sick from the healthy after exposure things will return to normal. Once that happens, the number infected will be reasonable and this could be just like the flu and we possibly see results like South Korea and Taiwan.

It will be bad this year because of the poor initial response. So put me down for #1 but that could change depending on how people follow the social distancing and how long it will take for testing to ramp-up.

[molson]

I think the event-cancellation momentum of a few days changed the whole tone of this, and that the American people are going to act differently regardless of what the inept administration does. Maybe Gobert's immaturity will end up saving many lives.

And because we must always be divided, we're barreling towards an endless debate of whether everyone overreacted, or whether we were spared the worst-case scenarios because we reacted so aggressively.

And I worry about unforeseen collateral consequences of stopping the country for some extended period of time, even if that stoppage was prudent.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I'd be "I'm worried, but I don't think people are overreacting". Or "I'm worried, but I think the mortality rate will be 1% or less with social distancing". I don't think I'm really worried, I'm cautiously optimistic that the efforts taken by our sports leagues of all things will help significantly.

This. My biggest worry is that I am in the high risk group, but it is unlikely that I'll be able to stop working. Most of what I do is outside, so at least that. So much is going on right now, this is just added unneeded stress.

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by molson

And I worry about unforeseen collateral consequences of stopping the country for some extended period of time, even if that stoppage was prudent.

This is what I worry about the most. What is this going to do the the airline industry? What is this going to do to the restaurant industry (and many employees here are living paycheck to paycheck)?

Per my earlier post, I understand the precautions being taken, primarily for the younger at risk groups.

[Edward64]

I picked 3. I'm a little surprised how many 2's there are TBH (but will be glad to be wrong).

I'll do another poll next week (?) and see if much changes. We need more tests to really understand where things are (and be proactive in treating people early).

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by molson

I think the event-cancellation momentum of a few days changed the whole tone of this, and that the American people are going to act differently regardless of what the inept administration does. Maybe Gobert's immaturity will end up saving many lives.

I dunno. Half the people on my timeline or in local groups, etc...are pissed about event cancellations. Heave forbid Billy can't go to lacrosse.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I dunno. Half the people on my timeline or in local groups, etc...are pissed about event cancellations. Heave forbid Billy can't go to lacrosse.

It's all about perspective, man.

My daughter is a junior in HS. She has been playing travel softball since she was 9, the last 3 years of it very seriously. She has dreamed of playing softball for her HS for just as long. She did some pretty cool things as a freshman and sophomore, but this year had potential to be a break out year. She has a good chance to earn some accolades. Now, that chance is pretty much dead. It just sucks. At least she gets another year of HS softball.

I feel for the college athletes who have lost their seasons, especially seniors. So much work goes into preparing and now they don't get a chance for it to pay off.

It is a tough pill to swallow when you have dedicated the last 8-12 years to something.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

I've been talking to a number of knowledgeable people, and my level of concern is toward the later end of that scale. In MD we are still publicly talking about each case, and isolating what travel/exposure it connects to. Public health people are talking in a different way about this. And also about what a "mild" versus "severe" case means, in context.

I'll answer RRW... but considered CtFO.

Same. I also don't like answering the same as Quik. This doesn't provide me with any reassurance.


SI

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

It's all about perspective, man.

My daughter is a junior in HS. She has been playing travel softball since she was 9, the last 3 years of it very seriously. She has dreamed of playing softball for her HS for just as long. She did some pretty cool things as a freshman and sophomore, but this year had potential to be a break out year. She has a good chance to earn some accolades. Now, that chance is pretty much dead. It just sucks. At least she gets another year of HS softball.

I feel for the college athletes who have lost their seasons, especially seniors. So much work goes into preparing and now they don't get a chance for it to pay off.

It is a tough pill to swallow when you have dedicated the last 8-12 years to something.

Never said it wasn't. But there is a difference between being disappointed about it and outright claiming the move is idiotic, overreacting, etc...

Like you said, perspective.

[Brian Swartz]

I'm worried (2), but I think the economic disruptions and panic are likely to actually cause more deaths than the coronavirus itself.

Originally Posted by Molson

unforeseen collateral consequences of stopping the country for some extended period of time, even if that stoppage was prudent.

This. I think the actions were prudent for the most part. . At the same time, a lot of the public behavior isn't, and it's not often appreciate how delicate this complex machine of the modern world really is. I think we're going to get a relatively small but most definitely painful taste of that, and we aren't going to like it one bit.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

I've been talking to a number of knowledgeable people, and my level of concern is toward the later end of that scale. In MD we are still publicly talking about each case, and isolating what travel/exposure it connects to. Public health people are talking in a different way about this. And also about what a "mild" versus "severe" case means, in context.

I'll answer RRW... but considered CtFO.

that in a way makes me more concerned than before, actually. No idea how much worse the medical facilities in the USA are ( from the sound of things in the other thread: worse than overhere), but this is the opposite of encouraging.

[tarcone]

This is the Boomer killer. The Earth realizes there are too many Boomers, so it has released this virus to thin the herd. Social security saved. Medicare saved.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I will anecdotally note that restaurants in/around Athens appear busier than usual, and that a chat with the owner of tonight's dinner place said he expected next week to be exceptionally busy based on what he's seeing.

That is all in spite of the fact that the town is short about 20k-25k of population that'd normally be here with the university going on extended spring break this week.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I will anecdotally note that restaurants in/around Athens appear busier than usual, and that a chat with the owner of tonight's dinner place said he expected next week to be exceptionally busy based on what he's seeing.

That is all in spite of the fact that the town is short about 20k-25k of population that'd normally be here with the university going on extended spring break this week.

I wonder if people have the mentality that they are going to go out before things get really bad ad they cant?

[Brian Swartz]

So far our business held at 'normal' this past week, but I'll be really surprised if that lasts another. Foot traffic at the local Meijer (where my brother works so its easy for me to keep a bead on it) was the highest since Christmas and they are handing out overtime like its candy which they don't do, ever, regardless of how short it makes them under 'normal' conditions. I'm sort of just in 'wait and see' mode really myself.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I wonder if people have the mentality that they are going to go out before things get really bad ad they cant?

Probably because most of them fall in the .2% fatality category.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by tarcone

This is the Boomer killer. The Earth realizes there are too many Boomers, so it has released this virus to thin the herd. Social security saved. Medicare saved.

... and Millennial and Gen X saved with premature wealth distribution !!

[GrantDawg]

The year of "OK, Boomer", has become "You ok, Boomer?"

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

The year of "OK, Boomer", has become "You ok, Boomer?"

or KO Boomer

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I wonder if people have the mentality that they are going to go out before things get really bad ad they cant?

I honestly don't think you could find double-digit percentage around here who think there's anything more than a remote chance of things getting "really bad". There's more sense of concern over an annual round of stomach virus than I'm hearing/seeing about this.

The overwhelming #1 sentiment seems to be irritation with the panic shopping, I'd say that would be the greatest concern for a plurality. Economic impact is probably 2nd. Well, actually, push those down a spot.

THE overwhelming top concern around here is "this shit better be over by football season".

edit to add: "around here" could be loosely defined as the non-campus side of Clarke County and the adjacent suburb county of Oconee. That's really "my side of town" 99% of time so for all I know the campus/downtown area are in full panic mode.

[Fidatelo]

I'm in the really, really worried camp. We took too long to react, and shit is going to hit the fan in a week or two. The stories out of Italy are sad as hell.


This morning I'm reading locally of huge lines for tests, and people with non-corona walk-in issues are being turned away. Our medical system is already in shambles at the best of times, I don't see how it is not going to buckle in a week or two as the spread compounds.

[Qwikshot]

Here in the Lehigh Valley, they just closed schools for two weeks which doesn't burden us because my wife works from home.

My oldest is returning from a trip to the Dominican, her college has extended spring break a week and may go virtual.

My parents are returning from a Hawaiian cruise, so far so good. They're in their 60s, I'll know more when they reach state side.

I work for a pharma company, business as usual, but a lot of restaurants are sparse, and the grocery stores are raided.

We're stocked, we have plenty of blu rays, board games, books, and computer/Switch games to keep us occupied should the internet load crap out.

All in all, I'm feeling good.

[ISiddiqui]

So the wife needed to run out to get some vegetable oil (we were basically out). So instead of the Kroger, I suggested she go to the Whole Foods 365 as the lines would likely be less - apparently I was a genius because barely anyone was there, but they had plenty of food (out of TP and some frozen stuff, but aside from that, stocked). No lines to check out as well.

So if you need to run out, the specialty grocery stores may be the ticket.

[PilotMan]

I went to our locally owned catch-all drug store 2 days ago and got everything I needed, and when I walked in I didn't know I needed any of it!

[tarcone]

I have been all over the map on this.

But Ive come to the opinion that this is an over reaction. Old people will suffer, as they do with any virus.

The panic is unjustified IMO.

This is a virus. We better get used to it. Because this is the new normal. Viruses will always win.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by tarcone

I have been all over the map on this.

But Ive come to the opinion that this is an over reaction. Old people will suffer, as they do with any virus.

The panic is unjustified IMO.

This is a virus. We better get used to it. Because this is the new normal. Viruses will always win.

Yes, but how fast are you willing to let it spread, and what measures are you willing to go to to treat the ill?

[Vegas Vic]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

So if you need to run out, the specialty grocery stores may be the ticket.

I can vouch for that. The big chains are overrun with folks who are treating this like an Extinction Level Event.

Man in hazmat suit standing in line at Costco

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Yes, but how fast are you willing to let it spread, and what measures are you willing to go to to treat the ill?

A calm reaction and, I hate to say this because it really pains me, let big pharma fix it.

OUCH

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by Warhammer

NOTE: This rambles a bit, but I have a conference call coming up and at least wanted to get some points out there since I have had to deal with death frequently in the last year.

Same, marking 2.

This is going to sound extremely cold, but this is based upon someone in my family going to 6 different funerals since this time last year, all but one were for people over 60 years of age, one was for an 18 year old.

As a civilization, we do a very good job of extending life as compared to previous generations. What kills many elderly people are colds, pneumonia, cancer, diseases that they would survive at an earlier age, but their body can no longer fight off. Many of these people are living lives that they would not have wanted to live even a few years before because their loved ones have passed away or all their friends have. Others are upset that they are dependent upon others and want to be independent.

I was at the funeral for my 88 year old grand uncle 2 months ago. He was completely dependent upon others for his care. His wife was unable to care for him, so they had a nurse come in during the day, and my cousins would take turns each night caring for him. His funeral was attended primarily by friends of the family, not his friends. Most of their friends had already died. The family treated his death as a celebration of life. Even though my aunt had a stroke the night of the wake, and died the day of the funeral, which was a shock, we were still joking about much of it. My uncle was senile and when his wife would leave the room he would constantly ask where she was. "Where is she? where is she?" This was every 2-3 minutes.

So the joke was, he died, went to heaven, and went to God and asked, "Where's Betty? Where's Betty?" God's response, "I'm working on it, she's being stubborn again."

The other one, my aunt's mother died 11 days after her father died. My aunt was one that was always up for a challenge, "Hey ma! It took you 11 days after dad died to follow, I did it in 4!"

The people that are mostly susceptible are those that are elderly and with other underlying issues. I am an asthmatic (as I mentioned in another thread it is normally well controlled) and any respiratory illness hits me much harder than anyone else in the family. Based upon the prevalence of this, the doctors believe me to have this (I was not tested, was told to self quarantine and monitor, provided a albuterol prescription and Z-pak for secondary infections), and it has been a pain in my ass, but no more than the flu would have been (I still tend to believe I had the flu, but the symptoms are so similar maybe I do).

Or looking at it another way, my mother died at 64 from breast cancer. Using that as a hard set in stone point, would I rather have my mom die from cancer, or would from Coronavirus? I would obviously pick neither, but if I have to take one, give me Coronavirus, I would much rather have her die without having the 3 years of chemo that entailed and loss of her quality of life. Let her have a full life and only 2 weeks of hell at the end, than the 6 weeks she had. I would be more likely to remember my mom as she was for the first 61 years of her life, rather than the last 1-2 like I do now.

Where I am going with this, is this any different from any other particularly virulent disease? With how virulent it is, we are going to have a bad season or two of it and it won't bother us again because the young people it does not affect or affects in minor ways will have immunity to it.

The only problem with this is those younger people that are susceptible to RSV. What do you do there? I would treat it the same way as the flu. From what I can see on the statistics, children, even those susceptible to RSV, are very resilient to the virus. So I say carry on.

Sorry that I missed this post earlier. I think it offers a different insight on the situation. Not sure (yet) I agree (or disagree) here.

In a way it feels that a virus like this is Mother Nature telling us to take more care for the earth, force some of the causes of global warming come to a bit of a pauze and do something about overcrowding the planet by taking out some of the older and weaker.


All in all, I see indifference and overreaction going awkwardly hand in hand here. Hence my earlier comment: I am concerned, because I see that indifference despite how fast this thing is spreading. At the same time, I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out this virus has gone around for much longer than 2 weeks, that I've already picked up this virus and unknowingly already recovered.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by MIJB#19

Sorry that I missed this post earlier. I think it offers a different insight on the situation. Not sure (yet) I agree (or disagree) here.

In a way it feels that a virus like this is Mother Nature telling us to take more care for the earth, force some of the causes of global warming come to a bit of a pauze and do something about overcrowding the planet by taking out some of the older and weaker.


All in all, I see indifference and overreaction going awkwardly hand in hand here. Hence my earlier comment: I am concerned, because I see that indifference despite how fast this thing is spreading. At the same time, I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out this virus has gone around for much longer than 2 weeks, that I've already picked up this virus and unknowingly already recovered.

Not only global warming but over population. It only kills the old and sick. This the herd and fix the pollution and the Earth feels better.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Not only global warming but over population. It only kills the old and sick. This the herd and fix the pollution and the Earth feels better.

That's what I meant with "overcrowding".

[miami_fan]

I went with trout because none of the options really fit.

I am not worried about myself at all. I am in good health and with a wife and son in the school system, I have long accepted that the possibility is high I would catch it. That is increased exponentially coaching Little League. I have always been a person who isolates himself when I get sick so that would not issue either. Based on the science, I will be fine. And not to be morbid, I have made peace with me dying years ago.

I am worried about elderly family members and weirdly my elderly neighbors. If I can avoid doing something that may cause them to get sick and possibly die, I will do my best accommodate. It is the same reason I wipe down a piece of a equipment I use at the gym.

I believe there is a certain amount of "do as I say not as I do" when it comes to the reaction. In my area, I heard and continue to hear most people saying it is not a big deal and "people" is overreacting. Yet, the local store has empty shelves all over the place, people on Facebook are tracking when the next delivery truck is going to arrive and people who are outside are using Purell every 500 feet. Who is doing the overreacting if everyone is complaining about people overreacting?

[QuikSand]

Move me to a 5

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Move me to a 5

any reason why?

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Move me to a 5

I've always thought you were a 10

[QuikSand]

We are not listening. We are Italy. We are not doing enough. New York is going to lose control of this really soon. Instead of "who was at this exact meeting room with this exact guy" it's going to be "anyone who was in midtown the last four days" and so forth.

People are amused by the run on toilet paper. How about when we run out of ventilators? The ways to prevent that are, apparently, beyond our ability.

Good heavens I hope I am totally wrong, and we can all play a fun little game of "alarmist libtard" after the fact.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

We are not listening. We are Italy. We are not doing enough. New York is going to lose control of this really soon. Instead of "who was at this exact meeting room with this exact guy" it's going to be "anyone who was in midtown the last four days" and so forth.

People are amused by the run on toilet paper. How about when we run out of ventilators? The ways to prevent that are, apparently, beyond our ability.

Good heavens I hope I am totally wrong, and we can all play a fun little game of "alarmist libtard" after the fact.

I am starting to agree with this as well.

It doesn't take spending a lot of time on social media to see just how screwed we are.

[Brian Swartz]

I don't think we're quite Italy, simply due to demographics. But I do think we'll end up with similar problems as they have just on a lower proportional scale, and probably by the end of the month. I.e., doctors having to triage who gets a ventilator and who doesn't by whatever impossible criteria one uses.

At times I've verged on feeling physically ill for those who have the misfortune to be particularly susceptible to this. And then I want to slap myself for my personal relatively minor economic concerns. But none of that is nearly enough to put me in panic mode. We've survived worse than this as a species and a culture, and we'll make it through this also. It's just going to be ugly with a capital U for a while.

[sterlingice]

It's something our generation has never seen before. We have no model for how to react to it



SI

[Racer]

I went with 4 though I'm not very worried from a personal health standpoint. I seem to have a better immune system then most person my age, am not overweight, don't smoke, and have no underlying health issues aside from seasonal allergies, and in my mid 30s.

I'm more concerned for other people in the world after seeing articles like this one:

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coron...e-f4d3d9cd99ca

Assuming this article's conjectures are mostly correct, are nations willing to continue to take the necessary steps long term if need be to slow the growth of this virus to keep death rates in the 0.5% to 1.0% range or will they do nothing which could result in death rates in the 3% to 5% range?

Obviously, I think nations need to continue to take the necessary steps to slow this down and guessing they will.

However, I think this pandemic will likely greatly impact the airline, tourist, restaurant, sports, and entertainment industries and the people who work for them for both as long necessary actions are in place to slow the spread of the virus as well as long as people are scared of potentially getting it. There are a lot of people who make a modest living whose incomes could be severely impacted by this. That could do long term damage to these industries which most people enjoy.

If the virus isn't negatively impacted by humidity and higher temperatures like the flu and the common cold, then I think this could be a tough couple of years for the human population due to the virus itself, the fear of the virus, and the consequences of slowing its spread. Hopefully it's seasonal.

Also a few people mentioned global warming. While I don't believe Mother Nature purposely gave it to us, I do think that's a bigger issue to the human population then this virus.

[sterlingice]

I think the economic problems that follow are going to be pretty bad. It's also going to be yet another consolidation of wealth at the top - the smaller competitors will go under and the large will just control a bigger and bigger piece of the pie. It will be yet another time of wealth consolidation and something's going to break in this generation.



SI