NBA Draft Lottery/Draft/Offseason thread.

[stevew]

Someone will win the chance to take Blake Griffin tonight. I believe its approx 830.

The Draft is June 24th.

[DaddyTorgo]

does anyone really want to win the Blake Griffin lottery?

Don't get me wrong, I think he'll be an okay player, a nice depth guy, but I don't see him as being a superstar.

And before Icy gets here and gets upset - don't forget that the #1 team could also take Ricky Rubio!

[Groundhog]

I'd be happy with Blake Griffin at #1. I think he could be an Elton Brand-level player, which is good value for #1.

Big fan of Rubio though, very interested to see how he handles the transition to the NBA game.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by stevew

Tonight, David Stern will decide who will have the chance to take Blake Griffin tonight. I believe its approx 830.

Fixed. (in more ways than one)

[albionmoonlight]

Bill Simmons and Malcom Gladwell have a chat where they talk about getting rid of the draft all together.

Kind of a neat idea--anyone over 18 can sign an employment contract with any team.

But the NFL and NBA have done such a good job of making the drafts into events that I don't see them going anywhere. Nor would the teams want to have to compete for the young free agents. I'm sure that every company in the world would love to be able to "draft" young talent out of college/grad school and have them work for an artificially depressed wage for 4 years before having to pay them market value. And the unions cares so much more about the current players than the future players (as they should) that they will never push to get rid of the draft.

How do other sports do it in other countries? Does football/soccer allow players to sign contracts at any age, or are the players restricted in some way early in their careers?

[sterlingice]

Sure, Blake Griffin isn't the greatest #1 in the world, but it sure as hell beats picking 10th or 20th in this draft. It's not like the NFL where a bad early draft pick can hurt you cap-wise. They're relatively cheap compared to veterans so it's not a burden to pick too high.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Bill Simmons and Malcom Gladwell have a chat where they talk about getting rid of the draft all together.

Kind of a neat idea--anyone over 18 can sign an employment contract with any team.

Yeah, that's called baseball and international players/transfers. I'd rather have the NBA's system any day and even the NFL's, tho they're going to fix that in a couple of years. The idea of the draft is to be a leveler so the rich don't get richer and if you let any team sign any player, you're talking about a competitive balance mess.

SI

[sterlingice]

I think another good analogy would major college sports where the winners continue to get richer and the poor get poorer.

SI

[stevew]

I might take Rickey Rubio number one.
My favorite part of the lotto show is when a team expecting to pick 8th doesn't see their name there. That means they are in the top 3 and their fans usually go crazy.

This is probably the worst class since the one where KMart went number one.

[Karlifornia]

After Blake Griffin carried my Top Gun team to victory, I have complete faith in him. Come on, Warriors! Make the leap!

[Gary Gorski]

Ok so what are the chances that Oklahoma City gets #1 to keep Griffin there (Westbrook, Durant, Green and Griffin would be a nice young nucleus there) and then New York gets #2 so NY gets their point guard in Rubio who would totally flourish under D'Antoni and would team with Lebron in 2010?

Agreed on the weakness of the draft - after those two its pretty meh. There are some good athletes and some guys that might turn out to be decent players but from Thabeet on down I don't see anyone who looks to be an impact player next season.

[Schmidty]

It sucks that the Pistons finished one spot out of the lottery. They really need some help, and I don't see many enticing players in that spot (15th).

[Fighter of Foo]

James harden will be a good player.

[Gary Gorski]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Bill Simmons and Malcom Gladwell have a chat where they talk about getting rid of the draft all together.

Kind of a neat idea--anyone over 18 can sign an employment contract with any team.

But the NFL and NBA have done such a good job of making the drafts into events that I don't see them going anywhere. Nor would the teams want to have to compete for the young free agents. I'm sure that every company in the world would love to be able to "draft" young talent out of college/grad school and have them work for an artificially depressed wage for 4 years before having to pay them market value. And the unions cares so much more about the current players than the future players (as they should) that they will never push to get rid of the draft.

Worst.idea.ever.

You might as well fold up 6-10 teams right then and there. In the NBA all it takes is one stud to turn a horrific franchise into one that can a) be a playoff contender and more importantly b) sell out the arena and boost merchandise sales - just look at the Cavs. Every top player would go to sign with NY, LA, Boston, Chicago and the other major markets. You'd have the equivalent of college sports - the top guys will go to the top teams until they run out of money (scholarships) and then they have to go look at the next tier of teams until they have no place to go but Memphis and Sacramento.

And if someone wants to draft me and pay me an artifically depressed seven figure wage show me where to sign up and I'm there!

[Gary Gorski]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

It sucks that the Pistons finished one spot out of the lottery. They really need some help, and I don't see many enticing players in that spot (15th).

There's talk of them trading it to Washington along with Rip assuming Washington doesn't land in the top 2 for their pick and maybe Nick Young or something...not that Thabeet and Nick Young would be much help though. The Pistons can get the help they need in free agency (hopefully) - wouldn't hurt to hire a coach who knows what he's doing either.

[Lathum]

I would love to see the Nets get Griffin, Griffin and Lopez would be a sweet frontcourt.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

There's talk of them trading it to Washington along with Rip assuming Washington doesn't land in the top 2 for their pick and maybe Nick Young or something...not that Thabeet and Nick Young would be much help though. The Pistons can get the help they need in free agency (hopefully) - wouldn't hurt to hire a coach who knows what he's doing either.

Yeah, I heard that rumor too, and I totally agree about Curry. He sucks. Either bring in an experience, or give Lamb a shot, at least he's coached for a few years and has won a lot. Joe seems to really be slipping in his decisions. I hope he gets back to his old self soon.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

There's talk of them trading it to Washington along with Rip assuming Washington doesn't land in the top 2 for their pick and maybe Nick Young or something...not that Thabeet and Nick Young would be much help though. The Pistons can get the help they need in free agency (hopefully) - wouldn't hurt to hire a coach who knows what he's doing either.

Just resign AI and let him run the show.

The Pistons freed up cap space with the Chauncey trade, but I despise their nucleus now. I like Rip and I like Prince (as a third option type of guy), but where do you go from there?

Is it Boozer? Do you think Stuckey will be able to run the show next year? I like his size, but he shot horribly the last three months of the season. (which went into the playoffs) and he's not an especially great playmaker to have an under 45% true shooting clip.

[mckerney]

I'm hoping that the Wolves can win the 3rd pick and get Thabeet, Blake Griffin does nothing for them and I don't want Rubio. Of course with the way Taylor continues to mismanage the franchise they probably won't even have a GM for the draft and McHale will again be able to trade whoever they pick for a worse player drafted a few spots back and absolutely nothing of value.

[RainMaker]

I like Simmons idea better of giving each team in the lottery the same odds. You stop the late season tanking a little and allow a semi-decent team a chance to grab a star. Look what it did for a team like Chicago who was a fringe playoff team and immediately became a pseudo-contender in the East by the end of the year. Maybe you can give a slight advantage to worse teams so that you don't have teams tanking the 8 seed in the playoffs.

I personally would put every team in the lottery. Weight it down so that the worst team has maybe a 10% chance while the best has under 1%. It wouldn't punish teams like the Pistons who run a good organization and finish in the playoffs every year. They never have a shot at top talent in the draft which is a bit unfair while teams like the Bobcats get to squander picks in the top 5 year in and year out.

The other thing I'd do is not just have the lottery for the top 3 picks. It would be for the whole draft. Again, the odds are not in a team's favor to move up a lot, but it can happen. You might see an Orlando squad get a little lucky and pick 8th this year or something. The championship Bulls squads never really got a chance to add good young talent to their teams. Wouldn't it have been interesting to see them grab a top 10 pick one year to play alongside Jordan? Wouldn't it be entertaining to see a Lakers team have a shot at grabbing a Brandon Jennings? Maybe Miami getting Ricky Rubio?

The problem with the current system is that you have these young stars being brought into inept, shitty organizations. It'll take 4-5 years before most of them can even be on a contender. Do we really want to see a talent like Griffin end up in Memphis or Milwaukee? I'd rather see a Utah or New Orleans have a shot at getting that pick and being able to add him to the puzzle. I think it benefits the NBA as a whole as well as stops rewarding horrible organizations for their failures.

Note: I'm of course a little bias on this but curious what other people think. Was Derrick Rose being on the Bulls (market size out of the equation) better for the NBA than him being drafted by Washington where he'd have won 25 games?

[RainMaker]

I don't think Rubio is a true #1. While he's got just about every major skill required to play PG in the NBA, he's just not all that quick compared to the premier guards in the league. With this league being all about speed, I think the safest bet is still Griffin who will be a guaranteed 20/10 guy for years.

[Lathum]

this is why I hate ESPN. If I wanted to watch a pregame show I would watch the pregame show.

[chinaski]

Im just praying OKC gets a bust.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by mckerney

I'm hoping that the Wolves can win the 3rd pick and get Thabeet, Blake Griffin does nothing for them and I don't want Rubio. Of course with the way Taylor continues to mismanage the franchise they probably won't even have a GM for the draft and McHale will again be able to trade whoever they pick for a worse player drafted a few spots back and absolutely nothing of value.

Even ignoring my own personal opinion of Thabeet's pro chances (not good), is he such a good fit? Kevin Love looked good by season's end, and I don't know that a Love-Jefferson frontcourt gives them much of a need to upgrade that spot. Rubio would be great for these guys.

If it's Kings or TWolves at #1, I think both would need to at least consider Rubio at that spot, given their needs.

[Young Drachma]

Ooh...that music is so riveting.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Ooh...that music is so riveting.

lol.

bah, Nets pick 11

[Young Drachma]

I think the real question is whether Oklahoma City will jump to get the #1 pick.

[Lathum]

The Griz move up

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Lathum

lol.

bah, Nets pick 11

Yeah. I didn't expect they would jump high and I'm fine with that. The 11th pick in a weak draft isn't too bad.

[Lathum]

lol.

Kings get fucked

[Young Drachma]

The Kings sent Chris Webber? Interesting.

[Young Drachma]

I wish they'd do this thing like a regular lottery. Even if it was more "boring" that way...it's hard to watch and think "c'mon did they really not rig this?" Make a reality show out of it.

[Young Drachma]

I can't believe OKC won't try to move up.

[Lathum]

Poor Blake

[Big Fo]

Ouch, the two interesting players in the draft could go to the two biggest joke franchises in the league.

[Young Drachma]

Donald Sterling is already paying Baron Davis too much money. I'm sure he can be convinced to move down two spots in exchange for say, OKC's 1st round next year and a player or two.

[DeToxRox]

So who got #2, OKC or Memphis? What the hell even happens now besides a trade. Those two teams drafted PG's top 5 the last few years no?

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

So who got #2, OKC or Memphis? What the hell even happens now besides a trade. Those two teams drafted PG's top 5 the last few years no?

Memphis #2, OKC, #3

The 2009 lottery draft order goes as follows:
1. L.A. Clippers
2. Memphis
3. Oklahoma City
4. Sacramento
5. Washington
6. Minnesota
7. Golden State
8. New York
9. Toronto
10. Milwaukee
11. New Jersey
12. Charlotte
13. Indiana
14. Phoenix

[stevew]

Griffin needs to smoke weed or refuse to workout. The clippers will ruin your life.

[RainMaker]

I was hoping OKC would get #1. They'd have a real fun team with Griffin.

[stevew]

I'm glad Hijack City didn't win.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by chinaski

Im just praying OKC gets a bust.

You stay classy, prick.

[RainMaker]

Not OKC fault that their owner and David Stern are shitbags.

[Warhammer]

Memphis is very interested in Rubio. If they get him, Conley will be shipped out or turned into a backup PG.

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

How do other sports do it in other countries? Does football/soccer allow players to sign contracts at any age, or are the players restricted in some way early in their careers?

In Europe, it's pretty much a free market. Some countries have restrictions on when a player can sign a 'professional' contract, but those countries simply see their players scooped up by other countries who don't.

A 17 year old made his debut for Manchester United (pretty much biggest/best team in world) late in the season this year and scored a few massive goals.

He left Italy to sign with Manchester United because he couldn't sign a pro deal in Italy until he was 17... whereas he signed with Man U at 14/15.

Wayne Rooney made his debut for Everton when he was 16, then was sold to Man U in a massive deal (£25.6 million) when he was like 18.

Some exceptional talents break into teams around 16, but they're already collecting money being part of the reserves/youth teams.

I'm sure someone even more familiar with the details can provide a bit more insight into the details of what players are compensated for being parts of academy programs.

The bottom line is that instead of adding players to your team in the 18-23 range like teams do in the NBA/NFL... you're literally getting them into your academy programs when they're like 10, grooming them to be a part of your team, then signing them to pro deals from there.

The other huge difference is that players have a lot of power there. Pretty much enough sulking or talking to the press can get you transfered (sold) to another team if that's what you really want. Guys are bought and sold for crazy amounts regularly.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I was hoping OKC would get #1. They'd have a real fun team with Griffin.

You really wanted the Oklahoma City Thunder to just happen to win the lottery so they could just happen to pick a Oklahoma Sooner? 25 years after the Patrick Ewing Conspiracy to the Knicks?

[Big Fo]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

The other huge difference is that players have a lot of power there. Pretty much enough sulking or talking to the press can get you transfered (sold) to another team if that's what you really want. Guys are bought and sold for crazy amounts regularly.

And you can't trade for a player's contract like you can in the big North American sports. You can buy a player's registration and then must agree to a new contract with the player.

[Groundhog]

I can't wait to see if the Thunder continue their string of drafting bigmen projects that don't pan out by selecting Thabeet.

My quick mock of the lottery now would be:

1. Clippers - Blake Griffin
2. Grizzlies - Ricky Rubio
3. Thunder - Hasheem Thabeet (Harden would be the wise choice)
4. Kings - Brandon Jennings
5. Wizards - Jordan Hill
6. Timberwolves - James Harden
7. Warriors - Tyreke Evans
8. Knicks - Stephen Curry
9. Raptors - Demar DeRozan
10. Bucks - Ty Lawson
11. Nets - DeJuan Blair
12. Bobcats - Earl Clark
13. Pacers - Eric Maynor
14. Suns - Gerald Henderson

[RainMaker]

Grizzlies will take Thabeet. They need size real bad.

I like the Curry to New York pick. Perfect fit for that style. He'll need to put on some muscle but will be a great outside threat for Lebron to kick the ball out to in 2010.

[stevew]

This is the Clippers 20th trip to the lottery. LOL.