Front Office Football Central  

Go Back   Front Office Football Central > Main Forums > Werewolf Games
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read Statistics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-23-2015, 03:14 AM   #751
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Day One

13:31 #80 timmae votes cheeki (1)
13:36 #81 Vaimes votes font (1)
13:36 #82 Eagle votes timmae (1)
13:37 #85 Martin votes Shoveler (1)
13:37 #85 Vaimes unvotes Font, votes Timmae (2) / Timmae 2
13:40 #89 JAG vote Jackal (1)
13:48 #95 Shoveler votes Vaimes (1)
13:51 #99 Grover votes Narcizo (1)
14:32 #104 Cheeki votes Raven (1)
14:56 #106 Raven votes Jackal (2) / Timmae, Jackal 2
15:08 #108 Narcizo votes Zinto (1)
15:35 #113 Britrock votes Shoveler (2) / Timmae, Jackal, Shoveler 2
15:38 #115 JAG unvotes Jackal (1), votes Raven (1) / Timmae, Shoveler 2
16.51 #134 Jackal votes Grover (1)
18:57 #148 JAG unvotes Raven (0), votes Fonti (1)

20:28 #154 Timmae unvotes cheeki (0), votes Jackal (2) / Timmae, Jackal, Shoveler 2
20:00 #163 Zinto votes Vaimes (2) / Timmae, Jackal, Shoveler, Vaimes 2
22:52 #178 Bug votes Font (2) / Timmae, Jackal, Font, Shoveler, Vaimes 2
07:06 #187 JAG unvotes Fonti (1) / Timmae, Jackal, Shoveler, Vaimes 2
07:37 #190 Cheeki unvotes Raven (0), votes Fonti (2) / Timmae, Jackal, Font, Shoveler; Vaimes 2
08:03 #197 Jag votes cheeki (1)
08:14 #202 Grover unvotes Narc (0), votes Fonti (3) / Font 3, Timmae, Jackal, Shoveler, Vaimes 2
09:32 #210 Font votes Grover (2) / Font 3, Timmae, Jackal, Grover, Shoveler, Vaimes 2
10:09 #229 Jackal unvotes Grover (1) / Font 3, Timmae, Jackal, Shoveler, Vaimes 2
10:27 #237 Jackal votes timmae (3) / Font, Timmae 3, Jackal, Shoveler, Vaimes 2
11:54 #264 Autumn votes cheeki (2) / Font, Timmae 3, Jackal, Shoveler, cheeki, Vaimes 2
11:55 #268 Grover unvotes Font (2), votes Martin (1) / Timmae 3, Font, Jackal, Shoveler, Cheeki, Vaimes 2
12.07 #276 Jackal unvotes timmae (2) / Timmae, Font, Jackal, Shoveler, Cheeki, Vaimes 2

12:31 #283 Jackal votes Zinto (2) / Timmae, Font, Jackal, Shoveler, Cheeki, Zinto, Vaimes 2
12:40 #293 Cheeki unvotes Font (1), votes Vaimes (3) / Vaimes 3, Timmae, Jackal, Shoveler, Cheeki, Zinto 2
14:08 #310 Grover unvotes Martin (0)
14:15 #312 Vaimes unvotes Timmae, votes Zinto (3) / Vaimes, Zinto 3, Jackal, Shoveler, Cheeki 2
14:17 #316 JAG unvotes cheeki (1), votes Zinto (4) / Zinto 4, Vaimes 3, Jackal, Shoveler 2
14:18 #317 Britrock unvotes Shoveler (1), votes Jackal (3) / Zinto 4, Vaimes, Jackal 3
14:21 #321 Fonti unvotes Grover (1), votes Zinto (5) / Zinto 5, Vaimes, Jackal 3
14:26 #326 Grover votes Zinto (6) / Zinto 6, Jackal , Vaimes 3
14:26 #327 Shoveler unvotes Vaimes (2), votes Jackal (4) / Zinto 5, Jackal 4, Vaimes 2
14:59 #343 Autumn unvotes Cheeki (0), votes Zinto (7) / Zinto 7, Jackal 4, Vaimes 2
15:52 #358 Martin unvotes Shoveler (0), votes Jackal (5) /Zinto 7, Jackal 5, Vaimes 2
15:57 #363 Zinto unvotes Vaimes (1) / Zinto 7, Jackal 4


Zinto (7)-- Narcizo (108), The Jackal (283), Vaimes (312), JAG (316), fontisian (321), Grover (326), Autumn (343)
The Jackal (5)-- Raven (106), timmae (154), britrock88 (317), Shoveler (327), MartinD (358)
Vaimes (1)-- cheekimonk (293)
timmae (1)-- EagleFan (82)
fontisian (1)-- MrBug708 (178)
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 03:55 AM   #752
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Day Two

21:36 #464 Autumn votes Cheeki (1)
22:13 #480 Cheeki votes Martin (1)
08:15 #495 Timmae votes Martin (2) / Martin 2
08:24 #496 Grover votes Cheeki (2) / Cheeki 2
08:38 #500 Eagle votes Martin (3) / Martin 3, Cheeki 2
10:25 #521 Grover unvotes Cheeki (1) / Martin 3
13:05 #572 Shoveler votes Autumn (1)
13:20 #577 Grover votes MrBug (1)
13:22 #579 Martin votes Cheeki (2) / Martin 3, Cheeki 2
13:29 #580 Narcizo votes Autumn (2) / Martin 3, Cheeki, Autumn 2
13:49 #584 Cheeki unvotes Martin (2), votes Autumn (3) / Autumn 3, Cheeki, Martin 2

14:27 #592 Grover unvotes MrBug (0)
14:35 #595 Raven votes Martin (3) / Autumn, Martin 3, Cheeki 2
14:52 #598 Grover votes Autumn (4) / Autumn 4, Martin 3, Cheeki 2
15:22 #608 Britrock votes Martin (4) /Autumn, Martin 4, Cheeki 2
15:31 #611 Cheeki unvotes Autumn (3), votes Martin (5) / Martin 5, Autumn 3, Cheeki 2
15:46 #621 Autumn unvotes Cheeki (1), votes Martin (6) / Martin 6, Autumn 3
15:41 #629 Bug votes Autumn (4) / Martin 6, Autumn 4
15:53 #632 Martin unvotes Cheeki (0), votes Autumn (5) / Martin 6, Autumn 5
15:56 #637 Narcizo unvotes Autumn (4), votes Martin (7) / Martin 7, Autumn 4
15:58 #644 Shoveler unvotes Autumn (3), votes Martin (8) / Martin 8, Autumn 3

FINAL Day Two Vote Tally

MartinD (8) -- timmae (495), EagleFan (500), Raven (595), britrock88 (608), cheekimonk (611), Autumn (621), Narcizo (637), Shoveler (644)
Autumn (3) -- Grover (598), MrBug708 (629), MartinD (632)

No Vote: The Jackal, Vaimes
Unable to Vote: fontisian
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 04:07 AM   #753
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
At the risk of repeating myself - Martin duking to Vaimes rather than Autumn (or not duking at all) is not the work of a villager. Furthermore he hasn't actually offered anything other than attempts at self-survival. No suspicions, no suggestion of who he intended to duke to last Night. I honestly don't think I've seen a clearer case of wolfishness.

If Martin is evil then Font is almost definitely also evil. If Font is a duke, which seems almost certain, then we don't want her alive to duke the vote tonight.

So font needs to be day killed. Preferably by Autumn, Eagle, Timmae, Brit or me (in case she is telling the truth).
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 04:10 AM   #754
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Jackal missed all of yesterday and he still has more posts than any other participant in the game.
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 05:43 AM   #755
cheekimonk
High School Varsity
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Nashville
Quote:
Originally Posted by fontisian View Post
I'm a hunter, Narc. I thought that was obvious as of yesterday?

Didn't we have a long discussion about whether font "blatantly claimed duke" yesterday and it was shown that she (not so blatantly) did? There were also post where she talked (joked?) about being a hunter. We don't know because she was saved by MartinD, but Vaimes was village and convinced she was duke. Otherwise, he doesn't take that shot. Something's wonky.
cheekimonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 05:44 AM   #756
cheekimonk
High School Varsity
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Nashville
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheekimonk View Post
Didn't we have a long discussion about whether font "blatantly claimed duke" yesterday and it was shown that she (not so blatantly) did? There were also post where she talked (joked?) about being a hunter. We don't know because she was saved by MartinD, but Vaimes was village and convinced she was duke. Otherwise, he doesn't take that shot. Something's wonky.

DOLA, sorry. I see Narc pointed this out above.
cheekimonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 05:48 AM   #757
cheekimonk
High School Varsity
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Nashville
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
Chief - if a hunter kill on another hunter was blocked by the medic would the shooting hunter die?

We confirmed this yesterday. The shooting hunter will only die if the target is shot and killed. font was shot but not killed. Hence, she could be a hunter and Vaimes still live. But, again, I think we established that she pretty much claimed duke on D1.

EDIT: Had an extra bracket in there around "and"...

Last edited by cheekimonk : 04-23-2015 at 05:50 AM.
cheekimonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 06:33 AM   #758
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheekimonk View Post
We confirmed this yesterday. The shooting hunter will only die if the target is shot and killed. font was shot but not killed. Hence, she could be a hunter and Vaimes still live.

Well, pants then. Missed that bit. Apparently.
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 07:08 AM   #759
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
So, the only motivation I can think of for a wolf attack on Martin is that they assumed he'd be viewed as a cleared villager .. but that's clearly not the case with everyone. And I'd think they'd rather go seer hunting than try and take out a quasi-cleared person. It's weird, right?
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 07:13 AM   #760
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Jackal View Post
So, the only motivation I can think of for a wolf attack on Martin is that they assumed he'd be viewed as a cleared villager .. but that's clearly not the case with everyone. And I'd think they'd rather go seer hunting than try and take out a quasi-cleared person. It's weird, right?

And, even if the wolves did decide to attack him, then why would the bodyguard protect him?
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 07:17 AM   #761
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
But if he's a wolf, what's the benefit for making this up? He could have said nothing and we'd all assume it was either the BG block (and we'd encourage them not to reveal, as they'd likely not learn who the attacker was), or the dreaded cultist conversion.
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 07:22 AM   #762
Grover
Pro Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Lisboa, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
And, even if the wolves did decide to attack him, then why would the bodyguard protect him?

Which leads me to believe that Martin could be the Bodyguard and Medic, but is that possible?
__________________
Come On You Irons!
West Ham United | Philadelphia Flyers | Cincinnati Bengals | Kansas City Royals

FOFC Greatest Band Draft Runner Up
FOFC Movie Remake Draft Winner
FOFC Movie Comedy Draft Winner
Grover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 07:24 AM   #763
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grover View Post
Which leads me to believe that Martin could be the Bodyguard and Medic, but is that possible?

Seems theoretically possible, but unlikely.
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 07:41 AM   #764
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Jackal View Post
But if he's a wolf, what's the benefit for making this up?

Hope for the bodyguard to reveal (explicitly or through reads) in order to brutal them? I've claimed bodygaurd before to do that. Admittedly I was probably slightly more in a hole than Martin is at the moment.
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:25 AM   #765
timmae
College Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
It appears that since there is no counterclaim at this point we can assume that martin and thus font are good. A BG claim by someone other than martin would mean that he is evil but we haven't seen a claim yet. Nor do I want to see one if that is the case. Unless if I am following the wrong lines of thought here. We can let this play out while we look for evil elsewhere.
__________________
Interactive OOTP 15 Dynasty (Single Season) CHAMPION!!
Oh yeah... Happy New York Day everyone!
timmae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:26 AM   #766
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheekimonk View Post
We confirmed this yesterday. The shooting hunter will only die if the target is shot and killed. font was shot but not killed. Hence, she could be a hunter and Vaimes still live. But, again, I think we established that she pretty much claimed duke on D1.

EDIT: Had an extra bracket in there around "and"...

Can you quote that post? I don't remember anyone explicitly asking Chief about this, but it is key.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:30 AM   #767
timmae
College Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
Autumn leans good due to the fact that he was looking at other avenues for evil (setting aside martin/font/vaimes). The fact that font is pushing autumn doesn't add up to me. Maybe because she believes that he is likely to make that move just to lay cover. I am leaning good on autumn.
__________________
Interactive OOTP 15 Dynasty (Single Season) CHAMPION!!
Oh yeah... Happy New York Day everyone!
timmae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:30 AM   #768
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by fontisian View Post
4. The fact that I'm willing to shoot people without knowing if they're a hunter or not should point towards me being town, just like it points towards Shoveler being town.

I disagree. It shows you have a disregard for your own life in the game, yes, but I don't see that as a villager move. Losing villagers hurts the village. Losing villagers without additional chance at vote history and post analysis hurts the village. Losing possibly two villagers due to a poor targeting choice by a villager hurts the village. Nothing about this is pro-village, so I don't agree it points towards you being town. Why a wolf would take a risk at killing herself, I don't know, but I don't know why a villager would either. Self-voting is not a villager play and neither is this.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:32 AM   #769
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmae View Post
Autumn leans good due to the fact that he was looking at other avenues for evil (setting aside martin/font/vaimes). The fact that font is pushing autumn doesn't add up to me. Maybe because she believes that he is likely to make that move just to lay cover. I am leaning good on autumn.

My guess is she's pushing just to get me to claim a faction. She suggested early on a full reveal, and I'm thinking perhaps her agenda is simply to get more info out. Which to me suggests a Cultist.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:34 AM   #770
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
For sake of hypothesizing, let's say she's the cultist. Let's imagine she's a hunter (though I am unsure on that account). She makes this big deal, pushes me to claim, puts out a kill on me, then it fizzles. She then claims she's an unaware Blank, says she can't possibly be a wolf since she was willing to take a shot and possibly die, however all the time knew that wasn't a possibility. Sounds pretty feasible at this point.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:35 AM   #771
timmae
College Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
I strongly feel that any haphazard shots today is not worthwhile unless there is a very strong likelihood that we are hitting evil. I don't like the idea that we need to shoot someone as we only get 1 shot a day. While vaimes random shot may be a good play to clear 2 villagers it doesn't appear we are at that juncture yet and it is D3. The longer we string this out the more info we have to track down evil.
__________________
Interactive OOTP 15 Dynasty (Single Season) CHAMPION!!
Oh yeah... Happy New York Day everyone!
timmae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:35 AM   #772
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
OK I've reread the thread in light of the apparent information that Font isn't confirmed duke and
a) I'm an idiot for missing that info earlier (although if it's the post I think it is it wasn't really equivocal), and
b) I'm a lot less certain about the correct course of action

Ok. To play devil's advocate. The wolves didn't know who Martin was going to duke to. If they presumed that he was going to duke to a wolf-Autumn then, yeah, they might order a hit on Martin. As Martin would be cleared by duking to a wolf. Suggesting that wolf-Autumn is a hunter. (as they wouldn't bother with a conditional if they knew that duking to Autumn would kill Martin). And there are two villagers who might be bodyguarding Martin.
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:37 AM   #773
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
Hope for the bodyguard to reveal (explicitly or through reads) in order to brutal them? I've claimed bodygaurd before to do that. Admittedly I was probably slightly more in a hole than Martin is at the moment.

Yeah that's the sticky point to me. Claiming bodyguard here or faking a block smacks of desperation, and they can't be desperate yet. Although I know often times wolves feel they're in much more desperate straits than they are. If Martin is a wolf, or especially if Font and Martin both are, maybe they are feeling like they're painted in a corner already with both more likely to be lynched or killed now than a random group, so maybe are trying harder than we would expect. It feels thin though. If it's the case the real bodyguard will eventually claim and we'll know, so it's a theory to put in the possibility box but not to act on, I think.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:41 AM   #774
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
Hope for the bodyguard to reveal (explicitly or through reads) in order to brutal them? I've claimed bodygaurd before to do that. Admittedly I was probably slightly more in a hole than Martin is at the moment.

Yeah that's the part that isn't lining up - it didn't seem like he was going to be put at risk. Unless he was thinking he'd be a hunter target.
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:41 AM   #775
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
OK I've reread the thread in light of the apparent information that Font isn't confirmed duke and
a) I'm an idiot for missing that info earlier (although if it's the post I think it is it wasn't really equivocal), and
b) I'm a lot less certain about the correct course of action

Ok. To play devil's advocate. The wolves didn't know who Martin was going to duke to. If they presumed that he was going to duke to a wolf-Autumn then, yeah, they might order a hit on Martin. As Martin would be cleared by duking to a wolf. Suggesting that wolf-Autumn is a hunter. (as they wouldn't bother with a conditional if they knew that duking to Autumn would kill Martin). And there are two villagers who might be bodyguarding Martin.

Okay, despite knowing the theory is wrong, I'll look at it from your angle. Pull that kill rather than go for a good special? I guess. But it seemed very likely in thread that Martin was going to duke Vaimes. That had been discussed many times, so it seems like a stretch to predicate a kill on both Martin duking and Martin duking a particular player. If Martin doesn't duke, or dukes Vaimes, they've played a poor kill.

Again, I'm willing to bet someone thought the Medic was repeatable. Or put a kill order in early in the day? How soon was it fairly obvious Martin was a real lynch target? Both of those assume a fairly oblivious wolf team though.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:43 AM   #776
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
So because Martin duked to someone who had garnered precisely zero votes on the day in question. Despite what I felt was consensus opinion about what vote-leading dukes should be looking to do. Because of that we're left with another day of Martin (or Font, by proxy) vs Autumn.
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:46 AM   #777
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
Jackal missed all of yesterday and he still has more posts than any other participant in the game.

Full disclosure, I noticed a few weeks ago that I'm inching closer to 10k posts so I've had that in the back of my head. But only my first few posts in this thread were fluffy.
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:47 AM   #778
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
I don't seem to have any meetings scheduled after 12 EST, so hopefully I'll be able to be much more active leading up to deadline today. Have a few meetings before 12 though so may not be around this morning.
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:48 AM   #779
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Well we still should be able to garner something from vote history. Looking at the day through a wolf Martin lens and a villager Martin lens, what can we see? A wolf Martin would know he was going to duke, and so wolves would be free to vote however they want to look good, they probably would actually vote Martin so that their vote history would eventually look good and to assure they controlled the lynch. Villager Martin, wolves would assume Martin was going to duke but not be sure, especially because he hadn't shown up until close to lynch, and not know where. I don't know when I became the most likely second target, but I have to think Martin would probably be a better hope for wolves, since they would not know if I was a duke or not, who I might duke to if I was. Better to have Martin who they could be fairly sure would duke either me or Vaimes.

This is reminding me too that for a while it looked like Martin might not show up to move his vote or put in a duke order. That might have affected the night kill in some way.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:48 AM   #780
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
I don't see any surefire lynch or kill targets at the moment, which is somewhat concerning. It almost makes me think the BG should reveal if they think they can add clarity to the situation - especially if it shows that Martin is lying. They'd still potentially be able to save themselves for another night, and play with the wolves' minds in terms of who they protect. And the seer would still be out there racking up some scans.
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:49 AM   #781
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
Because without knowing where the items are, we need to get a wolf sooner than later or risk endgame firing up on us quickly like in WoT
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:54 AM   #782
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Particularly if there was a cultist conversion yesterday.
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:58 AM   #783
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Thinking that way, looking at the Martin voters, a lot of them are on my good list. The ones that are not are Raven, Cheekimonk, EagleFan and Timmae. So those are three I'll be looking at closer today.

I don't like that Mr. Bug has two outlier votes in two days.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:02 AM   #784
Narcizo
Pro Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
OK so the bodyguard reveals if he/she didn't protect Martin. If no-one reveals then we have to assume that he's telling the truth. That doesn't actually clear font but it certainly makes her much more likely to be a villager. Where does that leave us? I've wasted most of my day being sure about something because I didn't read the thread closely. I don't want to be hanging around all evening so my presence is going to be sporadic at best.
Narcizo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:05 AM   #785
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
Particularly if there was a cultist conversion yesterday.

Let's look at possibilities. If there was a conversion, then Martin is certainly a wolf. However, I think that's a thin possibility, because i don't think any of us would have suspected that a target or bodyguard would have been told if they were attacked. Wow, now that I think of that, if Chief confirmed that targets will be told they're attacked I think that's a huge point. Let me continue thinking out loud about this.

Before last night, wolves would have no reason to suspect targets would know they were attacked. So if they got a conversion, they still would not know, and it would not, I think, occur to them to have Martin fake a block and claim he knew he was attacked. I think we can rule out that possibility, and therefore rule out a conversion.

So that suggests either the wolves forgot a kill order or were indeed blocked. So if they were blocked, they may have become aware that the target would know they were attacked. In which case i can't see why Martin would fake it, because the wolves would know the real target and the real bodyguard both know he's lying. A cultist Martin might fake it, but would not know to do so because he wouldn't know that targets are informed.

If there was a forgotten kill order, again, no one would know to fake the target knowing.

So I have talked myself into 100% believing Martin. I can't see how the wolves would know that targets would be told they were attacked without having experienced a block. I guess the wrinkle here is that the night 1 kill might have suggested that to them. That seems really unlikely. I'm going to go back and check that Chief confirmed Martin's point about being told.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:08 AM   #786
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Rum View Post
No one will get shot and not know it.

Okay, turns out this is the only response to that idea, and I don't think it's convincing.

Chief: Are night kill targets told that they were targeted, even if they survive?
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:18 AM   #787
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
I'm going to wait on a few of these Chief answers before rendering any judgments today. But it occurs to me that if Font is a wolf, she may have hoped that a dead villager Martin would clear up the question of what happened between the two of them. Until we killed one of them, the question would remain if they were both wolves, so she may have targeted Martin hoping that we would then move on to other lynch targets. I can't think of a better reason for a Martin kill. If a villager Martin really did protect a wolf Font, then they would be worried that, as Font has claimed we should have done, we will lynch Font to find out Martin's alignment. A kill would avoid that.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:29 AM   #788
timmae
College Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
Quote:
Originally Posted by Autumn View Post
Thinking that way, looking at the Martin voters, a lot of them are on my good list. The ones that are not are Raven, Cheekimonk, EagleFan and Timmae. So those are three I'll be looking at closer today.

I don't like that Mr. Bug has two outlier votes in two days.

Who is the 4th person that was added to your list above? You mention those are the 3 you will be looking at. 4 names.
__________________
Interactive OOTP 15 Dynasty (Single Season) CHAMPION!!
Oh yeah... Happy New York Day everyone!
timmae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:35 AM   #789
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmae View Post
Who is the 4th person that was added to your list above? You mention those are the 3 you will be looking at. 4 names.

Oh I don't know why I said three. I kept flipping back and forth from my good/bad list to the voting record, so I may have realized I forgot one after writing that.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:37 AM   #790
cheekimonk
High School Varsity
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Nashville
Quote:
Originally Posted by Autumn View Post
Can you quote that post? I don't remember anyone explicitly asking Chief about this, but it is key.

My post #'s are screwed up because I'm viewing latest on top, but this was from 4/21 7:54pm Central. Emphasis mine:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Rum View Post
Hunters can't shoot and kill other Hunters without dying, and Dukes can't Duke to other Dukes without dying.
cheekimonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:37 AM   #791
MrBug708
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Whittier
Quote:
Originally Posted by Autumn View Post
Thinking that way, looking at the Martin voters, a lot of them are on my good list. The ones that are not are Raven, Cheekimonk, EagleFan and Timmae. So those are three I'll be looking at closer today.

I don't like that Mr. Bug has two outlier votes in two days.

Who should I have voted for on the first day? That is essentially a crapshoot vote. I stand by my second day vote as a vote that didn't lynch someone.

They might be outlier votes but votes on the first two days aren't that insightful, especially in this game. But I really am just digesting much of the info here as its been 2 years since I've played.

I can't offer up much more than that as a defense
__________________
Richard Karstark - Ruler of Karhold - Bannerman of House Stark

KKiTTLeS21: UCLA r0x d00d, #1
MrBug708 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 09:51 AM   #792
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Bug, I understand that legit voting can end up leaving you on outliers. I'm just pointing it out as a trend--if it continues it begins to look like a way to avoid any bad reads.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:02 AM   #793
timmae
College Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
Here's where I am at.

Good - Font/martin (until proven otherwise with CC or ?), brit (content, hunting tone), ef (responses are similar to good ef weird D1 but more normal now)

Neutral - shoveler (active with content but not sure on reads), narc (pushing font/martin wagon), autumn (mentions looking elsewhere for evil but keeps going back to font/martin)

Slight evil - jackal (didn't like his D1, liked D2, now not sure), raven (looking for more content here), cheeki (seems to be all over the place), grover (need content/reads)

No read/absent - mrbug
__________________
Interactive OOTP 15 Dynasty (Single Season) CHAMPION!!
Oh yeah... Happy New York Day everyone!
timmae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:05 AM   #794
Chief Rum
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Where Hip Hop lives
Morning folks!

It was a hard shift at the night job, so I haven't looked at a thing yet since I left the office yesterday.

So I am going through things and responding to questions or PMs now.

I'll get a vote count up, too.
__________________
.
.

I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.
Chief Rum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:08 AM   #795
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmae View Post
autumn (mentions looking elsewhere for evil but keeps going back to font/martin)

I think that's a bit of a stretch. I spent the morning looking at the font/martin thing, and still have probably posted less about it than most people in the game. I spent all of yesterday actively looking elsewhere, and have probably posted more reads than anybody. That seems like an easy brush to try to paint me with given my morning's posts.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:09 AM   #796
Autumn
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Bath, ME
I would love to hear critique of my theories this morning. At this point I'm having a hard time not seeing Martin as village, and not seeing Font as cultist or wolf. But I'd love to hear other takes on it, show me where I'm wrong.
Autumn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:13 AM   #797
The Jackal
Coordinator
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: New Hampshire
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmae View Post
Slight evil - jackal (didn't like his D1, liked D2, now not sure)

just chuckling that you liked my D2 when i didn't make a post.. kind of curious
The Jackal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:20 AM   #798
timmae
College Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Jackal View Post
just chuckling that you liked my D2 when i didn't make a post.. kind of curious

Tuesday night is the beginning of D2, right? I know that the afternoon lynch throws people off.
__________________
Interactive OOTP 15 Dynasty (Single Season) CHAMPION!!
Oh yeah... Happy New York Day everyone!
timmae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:21 AM   #799
cheekimonk
High School Varsity
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Nashville
A) I don't want to spend another day sorting out the font/MartinD/Vaimes situation...but the attempted NK on Martin kind of forces the issue.
B) It's really confusing that font could claim Duke enough to convince Vaimes (and me & Narc when Narc picked out the D1 post as evidence), then come back after silence screaming, "Hunter!!"
C) The targeting of Martin for NK is either noob mistake or wolf strategy, and I really doubt the former. The best possible explanation I've read so far is Autumn's recent post. But I was suspicious of Autumn yesterday and that hasn't gone away.

I'm watching others including timmae & Raven. I still can't stop talking myself into holes (hurting my teams in my first 3 games) so I should shut up, but I'll put one on the board:

vote fontisian
cheekimonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 10:25 AM   #800
Chief Rum
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Where Hip Hop lives
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narcizo View Post
If they thought you were a cultist then none of the wolves are paying attention because were you a cultist you would have been lynched. You wouldn't be able to duke the vote.

Chief - are there any condition whereby the cultist could duke the vote if they were duke faction?

A Duke Cultist would have all the appearances and effects of Stuttering Sam.
__________________
.
.

I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.
Chief Rum is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:29 AM.



Powered by vBulletin Version 3.6.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.