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Old 06-16-2020, 02:43 PM   #1101
Atocep
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I'm not comparing it - a well-respected media bias site did the work. I've never watched it - or MSNBC, for that matter. That site does an aggregate rating comparison of individual articles/videos from each site. Like I said, I'm assuming they are able to somewhat center-balanced the crazy stuff with some fairly straight forward reporting. I've heard Trump name-check them enough and seen the John Oliver piece to know what they are about. But in terms of overall bias of all of their coverage, they aren't that far off MSNBC.

I've never watched them but my understanding is they do try to be a legit (but very right leaning) news network except with their Trump coverage. Their Trump coverage is basically state media, though, to the point that they had an internal policy in 2016 to not post or mention any polls that aren't favorable to Trump.

I'm guessing they knew Trump's personality and saw playing to his narcissism as their path to be a recognized news agency.
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Old 06-16-2020, 03:01 PM   #1102
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Mike Gundy is a woodtick tool. He once fired somebody for wearing an Oklahoma tshirt so this is pure irony.

This is funnier than the "I'm a man! I'm 40!" tirade.

"How dare you come in my house and offend my wife. Get the f&#k off my property!"

Carpenter files suit: Oklahoma State Cowboys' Mike Gundy fired me for OU shirt
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Old 06-16-2020, 03:19 PM   #1103
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This is funnier than the "I'm a man! I'm 40!" tirade.

"How dare you come in my house and offend my wife. Get the f&#k off my property!"

Carpenter files suit: Oklahoma State Cowboys' Mike Gundy fired me for OU shirt

Totally off topic but those Oklahoma State teams from the mid 80's were incredible and never got their glory or will be remembered as great because they shared a conference with Oklahoma and Nebraska and lost to them every year. I went to a Mizzou game in 7th grade against OSU with Mike Gundy, Thurman Thomas, Hart Lee Dykes, and Barry Sanders on the same team. Barry Sanders was the back-up believe it or not!

Not to excuse him being an idiot either but that OU/OSU rivalry in the 80's was Duke/UNC, Ohio State/Michigan levels. Firing the contractor, a bit over the top.

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Old 06-16-2020, 03:22 PM   #1104
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As Ksyrup posted this station apparently has the "right wing" rating equivalent of MSNBC so if you would be fine with a coach being quit on and possibly fired over an MSNBC tshirt than "Yeah first amendment!" I guess?

I'm not even questioning whether it's allowable, or whether I care about it honestly. Again I characterize Gundy as sort of a douche from Mizzou's days in the Big 12 ("I'm a man, I'm 40!") and from playing against him at QB in the old Big 8. I just see this particular brand of cancel culture becoming wearing Trump 2020 shirts, which will eventually add Trump votes (IMO), which I would rather not see.

I think athletes should have the same freedom of movement as most workers, so yeah, if they want to leave, regardless of the reason, they should be able to leave.
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Old 06-16-2020, 04:44 PM   #1105
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I think athletes should have the same freedom of movement as most workers, so yeah, if they want to leave, regardless of the reason, they should be able to leave.

I agree so you dont pay them in advance.
They get a 100% loan for their cost of education, upon services rendered the loan is paid off. If they leave the loan becomes their obligation. The receiving school can choose or choose not to accept responsibility for the loan.
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Old 06-16-2020, 06:34 PM   #1106
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There's no way I'm making them pay back a loan that they didn't use. That's like making me pay back salary for years after I quit.

I'd let people leave, but when they leave they leave the scholarship.
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Old 06-16-2020, 06:38 PM   #1107
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There's no way I'm making them pay back a loan that they didn't use. That's like making me pay back salary for years after I quit.

I'd let people leave, but when they leave they leave the scholarship.

But the AD pays 100% of the year on day 1.
Semester in some cases.
All I'm saying is if the player doesnt finish the semester he is responsible. Each year the contract renews.
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Old 06-16-2020, 06:52 PM   #1108
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We agree. I thought you were talking about being locked in for four years.
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Old 06-16-2020, 06:54 PM   #1109
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If you want a good laugh, I highly recommend looking up @notkdk3 on Twitter and finding the thread of SEC football coaches as women.
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Old 06-19-2020, 06:02 PM   #1110
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23 Clemson players positive. What happens when there’s an outbreak during the season?
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Old 06-19-2020, 06:29 PM   #1111
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23 Clemson players positive. What happens when there’s an outbreak during the season?
If the powers-that-be want a CFB season they'd better get serious about a rigorous testing schedule. Gonna need to do at least three per week.
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Old 06-20-2020, 08:19 AM   #1112
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23 Clemson players positive. What happens when there’s an outbreak during the season?

All asymptomatic.
The seasons hinges on 80+% infection rate I fear
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Old 06-20-2020, 11:55 AM   #1113
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The asymptomatic thing is such a blessing and a curse.

On the one hand, getting the virus, getting immunity, and having no ill effects is great.

On the other, asymptomatic spread makes it almost impossible to contain.
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Old 06-20-2020, 12:11 PM   #1114
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What happens when a college football player or prominent athlete actually dies from COVID? 2nd question - how many confirmed asymptomatic cases with full recovery happen before people start questioning why we can't let athletes play sports even knowing they will likely get infected? (Or younger people live normal-ish lives.)

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Old 06-20-2020, 01:34 PM   #1115
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What happens when a college football player or prominent athlete actually dies from COVID? 2nd question - how many confirmed asymptomatic cases with full recovery happen before people start questioning why we can't let athletes play sports even knowing they will likely get infected? (Or younger people live normal-ish lives.)
Here's another to ponder: what about those that get infected, don't die but have some serious long-term complications (as the virus has proven to do)?

What about when an infected player passes it on to a staffer or facilities person that dies from it?
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Old 06-20-2020, 02:23 PM   #1116
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What about when some of the dozens of 60+ year old coaches inevitably gets it? Nick Saban is 68. He's in the danger zone.
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Old 06-20-2020, 03:00 PM   #1117
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30 LSU players quarantined.

And yeah, older coaches are a big issue. (Not related to this thread, but same thing with schoolteachers...)
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Old 06-21-2020, 02:07 PM   #1118
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Here's another to ponder: what about those that get infected, don't die but have some serious long-term complications (as the virus has proven to do)?

What about when an infected player passes it on to a staffer or facilities person that dies from it?
I'll confess I haven't dug into whether the long term complications happen to a statistically significant portion of "asymptomatic" cases, or it's like when the media finds one person under the age of 20 who dies from if and goes "See, it CAN kill younger people!!!!!!", but I assume we'd just treat it like players who get rhabdo, or brain damage, or any of the other various long term debilitating injuries you can get from playing football and ignore it if sweep it under the rug so we can keep watching it.
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And yeah, older coaches are a big issue. (Not related to this thread, but same thing with schoolteachers...)
Wait, are you saying we should be more restrictive and protective of older/vulnerable people instead of kids who don't contribute economically in the short term or vote? That's crazy talk.
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Old 06-21-2020, 03:49 PM   #1119
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I'll confess I haven't dug into whether the long term complications happen to a statistically significant portion of "asymptomatic" cases, or it's like when the media finds one person under the age of 20 who dies from if and goes "See, it CAN kill younger people!!!!!!", but I assume we'd just treat it like players who get rhabdo, or brain damage, or any of the other various long term debilitating injuries you can get from playing football and ignore it if sweep it under the rug so we can keep watching it.
I'll be rather surprised if asymptomatic folks develop any long-term complications. I'm more responding to a general argument I see all over the place about how few folks in the player age range die from COVID. That's true, but how many survivors are suffering lingering effects?

Another practical matter to consider: large numbers of players testing positive and having to sit out a couple weeks is going mess with cohesiveness, player development, learning the playbook, assessing the status of the depth chart, etc. With existing time limits on fall camps that leaves not much margin for error. If I'm a coach, I'm telling my team in no uncertain terms to not be stupid and put yourself at heightened risk of getting infected by going to parties, etc.
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Old 06-21-2020, 04:02 PM   #1120
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I'll be rather surprised if asymptomatic folks develop any long-term complications. I'm more responding to a general argument I see all over the place about how few folks in the player age range die from COVID. That's true, but how many survivors are suffering lingering effects?

I'll re-link this from the COVID thread, but we simply don't know. There's enough evidence that it very well could cause underlying, long term damage in asymptomatic carriers to warrant further research, though.

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Old 06-21-2020, 08:58 PM   #1121
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I'll be rather surprised if asymptomatic folks develop any long-term complications. I'm more responding to a general argument I see all over the place about how few folks in the player age range die from COVID. That's true, but how many survivors are suffering lingering effects?

Another practical matter to consider: large numbers of players testing positive and having to sit out a couple weeks is going mess with cohesiveness, player development, learning the playbook, assessing the status of the depth chart, etc. With existing time limits on fall camps that leaves not much margin for error. If I'm a coach, I'm telling my team in no uncertain terms to not be stupid and put yourself at heightened risk of getting infected by going to parties, etc.

Which is exactly how KState just got shutdown.

They're gonna put the NBA in a bubble but expect college athletes to live on campuses and not be a 20 year old?
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Old 06-21-2020, 09:16 PM   #1122
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Which is exactly how KState just got shutdown.

They're gonna put the NBA in a bubble but expect college athletes to live on campuses and not be a 20 year old?

That's just it. I can come up with a way that classes might work, but once the students are in the dorms and off campus, there's no way to maintain safe practices.
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Old 06-21-2020, 09:30 PM   #1123
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You know this comes down to the all mighty dollar. You think Athletic departments are going to let the cash cow die?

Something dramatic will have to happen before we dont have football.
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Old 06-21-2020, 10:03 PM   #1124
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I'll re-link this from the COVID thread, but we simply don't know. There's enough evidence that it very well could cause underlying, long term damage in asymptomatic carriers to warrant further research, though.

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I do agree with this, I just think that the possibility of long term COVID damage to the lungs or whatever wouldn't be in my top 5 of long term reasons football is bad for young people.
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Which is exactly how KState just got shutdown.

They're gonna put the NBA in a bubble but expect college athletes to live on campuses and not be a 20 year old?
This is what I agree strongly with! I don't agree with CUTiger that some 80% positive threshold needs to be achieved, but in order for college sports to be played we basically need to say we're fine with any specific athlete or person under 23 getting COVID. If we say that (and we're clearly trying to) then there is no reason to quarantine if a specific player or team gets it, and there can be a season. And colleges and K-12 schooling can happen this fall/until a real vaccine is developed.

I spent the weekend in South Carolina coaching kids because Charlotte won't allow us to officially do it. And we yelled at our parents and players over email, and in person, to avoid congregating or watching in groups, and
surprisingly to me the parents at least did a pretty decent job... meanwhile there is a youth baseball jamboree happening where parents are shoulder to shoulder & 3 deep in places because it was 90 & there was little shade, on the same day South Carolina posted their highest 1-day total and those 21 Clemson football players results were announced. We've made our decision subliminally, there isn't any going back, can we please adapt & understand that our whole policy should be about protecting vulnerable people instead of preventing the horse from getting out of the barn?

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Old 06-21-2020, 10:18 PM   #1125
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The vulnerable = 33%-50% of the population. How do you protect them without impacting the rest of the population?
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Old 06-21-2020, 11:07 PM   #1126
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The vulnerable = 33%-50% of the population. How do you protect them without impacting the rest of the population?
There's a DEFCON 2 level, and a DEFCON 4 level, and they should not have the same levels of restrictions. (Nor is DEFCON 2 33-50%, and I'd argue even DEFCON 4 isn't but that would be a sidebar.)

We've decided as a society that keeping our economy going at 80% & letting 100% of people have the option to have a social life is more important than 1% of people dying. I actually agree with that side, and I've been pointing out since week 1 of lockdown that people weren't going to accept this without a definitive end point, but the bigger point is that it doesn't matter which side you or I come down on, because the decision has already been made by society. The theoretical arguments are over, the cat is not going back in the bag, and we can pretend we're a virtuous person because we're opposed to the fact the country is opening, or we can try to focus our efforts on making sure 500,000 old people die instead of 1,000,000.

How many more died in New York alone because of Cuomo's EO that nursing homes couldn't turn away COVID positive patients? How many more have died since because we're not focusing on that? (The county Charlotte is in has had a spike in deaths this past week mostly because there were outbreaks at 2 separate nursing homes.) Most importantly, how many more will die because the only age segregation we'll even discuss is once that limits the least vulnerable people instead of the most vulnerable ones?
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Old 06-22-2020, 01:07 PM   #1127
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This is what I agree strongly with! I don't agree with CUTiger that some 80% positive threshold needs to be achieved, but in order for college sports to be played we basically need to say we're fine with any specific athlete or person under 23 getting COVID.

Just for the sake of clarity, I wasnt suggesting (or at least not intending to) we needed an artificial threshold of 80%.

My larger point is I dont see a scenario where infected players are allowed to compete. I think we will only have a season if enough players are on the backside of this.
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Old 06-22-2020, 02:13 PM   #1128
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I think what happens with pro sports will affect college sports. If pro sports struggle with containing outbreaks and have to shut down, even temporarily to "reset," I don't see how college sports can continue. That's exactly what happened with the NBA shutdown in March - college basketball was forced to stop playing mainly due to the optics of amateurs playing sports for free while professionals were being protected.
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Old 06-22-2020, 02:59 PM   #1129
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it doesn't matter which side you or I come down on, because the decision has already been made by society. The theoretical arguments are over, the cat is not going back in the bag, and we can pretend we're a virtuous person because we're opposed to the fact the country is opening, or we can try to focus our efforts on making sure 500,000 old people die instead of 1,000,000.

I think this is correct in terms of where we are now. The difference is I don't think it stays that way indefinitely. There is a point - the question is only on where - that society will reverse course again. I don't think a thousand a day dying will be enough to make people want to shut down again. But there's a number where that would happen. 2-3 thousand? 5 thousand with multiple major cities having to turn people away at the hospitals? Seems inevitable to me that we will hit that tipping point at some stage, and regret some - not all - of the actions being taken now.

Interestingly, I can't find any polls more recent than a month ago - at which time there was still strong support for continuing restrictions. I think the needle has moved more since then, but the question is how much. That's as much as I'll say in this thread because I'm sure a lot of people want to talk about football not the virus here.

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Old 06-22-2020, 05:55 PM   #1130
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Patriot League (FCS) likely going to have to cancel non-conference games due to return-to-play protocols.

The Patriot’s slate of games against FBS opponents: Colgate at Western Michigan and Bucknell at Army on Sept. 4; Lafayette at Navy and Fordham at Hawaii on Sept. 12; Colgate at Syracuse Sept. 19.

Patriot League football non-conference games in danger - Sports Illustrated
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Old 06-23-2020, 01:19 PM   #1131
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Got this from Navy yesterday as they are still planning on giving it a go

Good Afternoon,

This press release spells out the decision as it pertains to our previously scheduled contest in Dublin against Notre Dame on August 29th of this year (click here to read press release). The NAAA , along with Anthony Travel and other partners, are working to refund those who bought tickets and made travel reservations. I expect that information has been effectively disseminated and all refunds are being currently addressed.

The purpose of this note is to provide you with some information as it pertains to the Navy/Notre Dame game, now scheduled for Annapolis. Although there are still many uncertainties which include actual game date (it will be Labor Day Weekend), kick off, and size of the crowd, we do know that we will play the contest for the first time in history in Navy-Marine Corps Memorial Stadium here in Annapolis. Obviously, some of the conditions under which the game will be conducted have yet to be determined by state, local, and governmental agencies. We will release definitive information as it becomes available. I expect that all game related details will be finalized at the latest by the middle of July. This reason, of course, revolves exclusively around the effects of COVID-19 and the parameters dictated to us affecting related decisions.

With the game being played in our historic stadium, we expect a requirement to restrict the size of the crowd to a lesser percentage of what the stadium would normally accommodate. Regulating the crowd with the appropriate safety and social distancing guidelines will mean that many will not be able to attend due to the limited ticket distribution. For those who will not secure a ticket(s), the game will be nationally televised and available in a prime time slot to be determined by ABC/ESPN.

I would like to share some expectations regarding specifics that are known to date.

a. I expect this will be the only time we will play Notre Dame football in Annapolis. Therefore, the game is of historic significance and most likely a once in a lifetime opportunity for those who will be in attendance.

b. The cost for limited tickets available to our fans will be at a premium. Losing the Dublin event is of significant financial detriment to the NAAA and consequently affects our ability to support all 33 varsity sports at the championship level. Therefore, with an expected socially distanced environment and "capped" attendance, the cost of this ticket will be an exception to the norm. Obviously, there will be many who choose not to attend for personal health considerations, cost of attendance, travel challenges, etc., but be reminded the contest will be nationally televised.

c. Priority access to tickets and distribution will be based on availability and first to those who are Margin of Excellence contributors in support of The Fund for Athletic Excellence in any of our 33 varsity intercollegiate programs, and our physical mission capital projects. In addition, I anticipate the opportunity to purchase tickets will also be available to those who are members of our Blue & Gold who are football season ticket holders and then Blue & Gold at large. We are establishing a priority list now, and once we know what our attendance limitations are, we will be sharing specific information with those who qualify for the first opportunity to purchase.

Do not hesitate to contact the Ticket Office today at [email protected] and let us know the desired amount of tickets you would like to request for the game. We will note your request and get back to you with definitive game related information when available. There will be no penalty to cancel your reservation right up until kick off.

d. Tailgating will be governed by state regulations as they pertain to social distancing guidelines and the appropriate size of gatherings in effect on the first of September.

e. Those who have suites will be allowed to utilize their suite, but limitations on group size may also be regulated (TBD).

f. We will have special accommodations in Akerson Tower for those who qualify for that facility. Supplemental seating to allow for social distancing will extend into the stadium adjacent to the Tower.

g. Parking at the stadium for the game will be accommodated only for those who are ticket holders specifically for this single game.

h. This contest is not included in the 2020 season ticket package. It is a stand alone event and will be made available only as a single game.

Finally, this opportunity today is being extended exclusively to our closest friends of Navy Athletics. Loyal contributors in support of the NAAA will have first opportunity to purchase tickets. Although we realize the expense for this ticket will be significant, the proceeds will be used to sustain our broad-based championship programs. Our financial challenges due to COVID-19 have never been greater, but this is an opportunity for us to maintain consistent support for our midshipmen and continue to allow them to successfully compete as representatives of the Brigade, alumni, Naval Academy, and our community.

Do not hesitate to contact our Ticket Office today at [email protected] with any questions you may have.



Be Healthy, stay safe.

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Old 06-23-2020, 08:29 PM   #1132
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PING ATOCEP!

Return of Gibby?
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Old 06-24-2020, 12:24 AM   #1133
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PING ATOCEP!

Return of Gibby?

What a mess

I tend to side with the players on these things, but Kerry Martin needs to grow up a bit. One of his claims was refuted by his High School coach and he's admitted Coach Koenning has gone out of his way to check in on him and make sure he's doing well and is eating during COVID.

It's pretty clear Vic Koenning needs to tone it down and be more aware of his audience, but nothing I've seen suggests he should be fired. An apology, more awareness, and willingness to change should be enough enough to save us from Gibby 3.0.

In all seriousness, if he's let go we're probably looking at Jordan Lesley moving to DC and Casteel 3.0 taking over the D-Line.
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Old 06-24-2020, 03:41 PM   #1134
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What a mess

I tend to side with the players on these things, but Kerry Martin needs to grow up a bit. One of his claims was refuted by his High School coach and he's admitted Coach Koenning has gone out of his way to check in on him and make sure he's doing well and is eating during COVID.

It's pretty clear Vic Koenning needs to tone it down and be more aware of his audience, but nothing I've seen suggests he should be fired. An apology, more awareness, and willingness to change should be enough enough to save us from Gibby 3.0.

In all seriousness, if he's let go we're probably looking at Jordan Lesley moving to DC and Casteel 3.0 taking over the D-Line.

I think I'm on the same page. The total package is much different to look at now that his high school coach is coming out and clearly stating that he ever said the piece about the "slave owner" mentality. I work a fair amount with young adults and adolescents and can see how Martin feels like this is in the same neighborhood as some of the other things popping up across the country and how he wants to advocate for change, but without the backing of the high school coach it seems more about political and religious ideology rather than race-related.

I think the political and religious things can be navigated and it can be made clear that coaches need to have better boundaries about their personal beliefs. But accusing a coach of racism, and having a chunk of the team already bought in on it, makes it real sticky. It seems hard to envision Koenning returning. I thought the defense looked pretty good given the mass exodus and transition, but I'm not overly attached to him. Still, it seems like Brown dropped the ball if Martin brought this to him and he did not get out in front of it. Probably the first demerit most anyone could give Brown in his time at WVU.

I had forgotten about Casteel being on retainer. I'd be alright with him coming back, if he is willing to drop the 3-3-5.
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