Leach Fired!

[Chief Rum]

This whole topic deserves its own thread, and frankly, wasn't really being mentioned in too many others, which surprises me. Where have our standards gone, FOFC?

Just thought I would start a thread for all comments/stories/etc. re: this story, which, IMO, is even bigger than the Mangino story.

[Chief Rum]

Oh, yeah, and as to the thread title, apparently it's being reported that Mike Leach has been fired.

[SirFozzie]

Not surprising, they would have had to pay him 800K if he was the coach tommorrow.

I ahve a feeling with the doctor's note that the dark area would be best for him, they just stepped in the cow patties.

[cougarfreak]

Was there any confimation that he did do anything?

[gstelmack]

What was fun was watching ESPN run this all the time over the last two days, and the only time they ever mentioned "son of ESPN Analyst Craig James" was on the ESPNNewsHD sidebar version of the story.

[miked]

Seems like a ploy to get out of paying him the bonus...especially considering the timing. Also, I heard they just wanted an apology out of him and he wouldn't do it. Seems odd to fire somebody when you would've been happy with an apology just a week earlier.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by cougarfreak

Was there any confimation that he did do anything?

From what I can tell, no one's really denying he put the kid in a shed. It also seems to be more or less confirmed the kid had a concussion.

Everything else lies within the lines of what a coach is able to do a kid on a football team, what is acceptable and what is not.

[MacroGuru]

The story has changed some many times from closet, to shed, to room that I honestly think there is something to it, but because of who the players father is it is being made a bigger story than it should be.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by miked

Seems like a ploy to get out of paying him the bonus...especially considering the timing. Also, I heard they just wanted an apology out of him and he wouldn't do it. Seems odd to fire somebody when you would've been happy with an apology just a week earlier.

My understanding is, that's what the James wanted. They sent him letters asking him to agree to not do it again, and to apologize. It was when he didn't respond/agree that they went public.

Considering one could be seen as usurping Leach's authority as coach and the other could be used as an admission of culpability in a civil trial, I can't say I am surprised Leach didn't agree to either request.

I think TTech was prepared to pay their successful coach any money he deserved. No indications they were trying to get rid of Leach (unlike Kansas with Mangino). It was only with these allegations that they caused them to question, and so then the immediate issue of the bonus money soon forthcoming would be an understandably big thing for the university.

[timmynausea]

[cougarfreak]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

From what I can tell, no one's really denying he put the kid in a shed. It also seems to be more or less confirmed the kid had a concussion.

Everything else lies within the lines of what a coach is able to do a kid on a football team, what is acceptable and what is not.

I just saw a video on on it, collegefootballtalk.com/ has a video of the garage and room James was put in. Evidently he was sent there because he had on sunglasses (which aren't allowed at practice), and complained of concussion symptoms. So coach basically removed him from practice, and kept 3 trainers with him to make sure he didn't have any serious symptoms. What a fucking pussy.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by cougarfreak

I just saw a video on on it, collegefootballtalk.com/ has a video of the garage and room James was put in. Evidently he was sent there because he had on sunglasses (which aren't allowed at practice), and complained of concussion symptoms. So coach basically removed him from practice, and kept 3 trainers with him to make sure he didn't have any serious symptoms. What a fucking pussy.

That's what we're kicking around here at work. What could he have done that was fireable?

We came to the conclusion that it was a situation of something like "kid came to practice, complaining about concussion and he's been milking the injury so his 'practice' for the day was to go clean out the equipment shed since he couldn't be on the field"

SI

[Toddzilla]

Every report I heard on ESPN and ESPNews mentioned the player was the son of ESPN analyst Craig James

Also, TTEch has to pay Leach $400K for every year left on his contract if they fire him, so this isn't a money-saving scheme.

[MacroGuru]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Every report I heard on ESPN and ESPNews mentioned the player was the son of ESPN analyst Craig James

Also, TTEch has to pay Leach $400K for every year left on his contract if they fire him, so this isn't a money-saving scheme.

I doubt they have to pay him anything if he was fired for cause...that will definitely be an interesting thing to find out.

But Leach's lawyer came out this morning and even said he expected the firing to happen today due to the bonus.

[digamma]

They fired him with cause, meaning they believe he breached his contract. Thus, no future contract payments.

The $800,000 payment is another matter. Leach would have a strong argument that this is due regardless (the argument is that you can't fire someone the day before a bonus is due to avoid paying the bonus--there has to be an immediate bad act or something to trigger the firing). I also understand there is a separate contract argument that Leach had time to cure a breach under the contract following notification of the breach.

[sooner333]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Also, TTEch has to pay Leach $400K for every year left on his contract if they fire him, so this isn't a money-saving scheme.

Well the timing of it saves money ($800k if he coached tomorrow). Also, it's significantly cheaper than if they had paid him his contract--the new coach probably will make an amount where $400k per year will be a savings.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Every report I heard on ESPN and ESPNews mentioned the player was the son of ESPN analyst Craig James

Yeah, they have *no* vested interest in blowing this out of proportion

SI

[timmynausea]

The whole thing is a little weird, but it hardly seems fire-able. Can you imagine if this Athletic Department had to deal with a loose cannon Coach like Bob Knight? Oh, wait...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

That's what we're kicking around here at work. What could he have done that was fireable?

Got his attorney to seek a restraining order to allow him to coach the bowl game?

[SirFozzie]

here's the thing. The AD had gone through a contentious resigning of Leach during the off season, where Leach held them to ransom, etcetera. Leach was untouchable due to the heights he had taken the program.

This pissed off the AD, but by not resigning Leach he was basically cutting his own throat, so he just filed this away in the "Awaiting payback" section.

Texas Tech didn't have as great of a year, and suddenly, this pretext came up where he could deliver payback where he wouldn't be risking his own neck to fire him. Payback delivered.

Here's the story from earlier in the year:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=3906227

Basically, Leach saw this coming. I'm shocked he signed the deal, this AD is beginning to look more and more like a vindictive asshole.

[DeToxRox]

Leach was fired because the AD hates him. They have had numerous run ins in the past, he was just looking for a reason.

[digamma]

Fozzie, Texas Tech pretty much outperformed expectations this year. They weren't really in anyone's top five due to the loss of a lot of talent from last year's team. Many people would call it his best coaching job. On field performance has absolutely 0 to do with this.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by digamma

Fozzie, Texas Tech pretty much outperformed expectations this year. They weren't really in anyone's top five due to the loss of a lot of talent from last year's team. Many people would call it his best coaching job. On field performance has absolutely 0 to do with this.

To the alumni, he didn't get them as far as last year, therefore he's not as indispensable.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

To the alumni, he didn't get them as far as last year, therefore he's not as indispensable.

I'll repeat...on field performance had nothing to do with this.

[sooner333]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

To the alumni, he didn't get them as far as last year, therefore he's not as indispensable.

My limited contact with Tech alumni show that they are up in arms about this. One guy had on his facebook "Fire Gerald Myers" and "I am very disappointed in my school". Apparently when the attorney announced that Leach had been fired at the courthouse, one guy in the gathering crowd said "Who is going to buy tickets anymore?" I think it's fair to say that the alumni do not think he is indispensable. In fact, I think there is going to be some backlash at a program that struggles to sell-out the stadium on a regular basis.

[RainMaker]

Most alumni only care about winning. Leach could be found raping babies everyday in his office and it's not a fireable offense if he can get them to a BCS game every other year.

My guess is the story is somewhere in the middle of the two versions. I'm guessing James wasn't a great team guy and I'm sure Leach tried to "teach him a lesson". My guess is he wore the sunglasses, Coach Leach got mad and said "if you want darkness, I'll show you darkness". Made the kid spend a practice or two in a garage that was that.

I think the guy probably deserves to be fired as this doesn't look as innocent as they are trying to make it out to be. On the other hand, this shit probably goes on all the time at schools. Leach's biggest mistake was not going 11-1 this year.

[TexasT]

Originally Posted by cougarfreak

I just saw a video on on it, collegefootballtalk.com/ has a video of the garage and room James was put in. Evidently he was sent there because he had on sunglasses (which aren't allowed at practice), and complained of concussion symptoms. So coach basically removed him from practice, and kept 3 trainers with him to make sure he didn't have any serious symptoms. What a fucking pussy.

+1

[I. J. Reilly]

If James didn't have a concussion, it most certainly will after the next practice. Keep your head on a swivel, kid.

[rowech]

I just love Craig James...as if this dude's some innocent guy. Taking money when he went to SMU, going to the USFL for the $, and then constantly dropping that he was the last white RB in the NFL to rush for 1000 yards. He's always been an arrogant fill in the blank. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if there was illegal recruiting at Tech and James said fire him or I blow the whistle. Cracks me up he even has a job in college sports.

Like someone said, the story is somewhere in between and now that Leach doesn't have to worry about saving his job, I look forward to what he has to say.

[RainMaker]

It is amazing how the NCAA doesn't have a problem with one of the announcers being someone who took money in college during one of the biggest college sports scandals of all time. I know the NCAA doesn't care about cheating anymore (unless you're a small school), but at least give some impression to the public.

[Atocep]

To be fair, Craig James' name was never mentioned in the investigation at SMU and he was never accused of taking money while there.

[RainMaker]

In the reports that came out, wasn't it noted that almost everyone took payments? They didn't name everyone personally but I was under the impression that evidence showed that almost everyone was getting some form of payment.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

In the reports that came out, wasn't it noted that almost everyone took payments? They didn't name everyone personally but I was under the impression that evidence showed that almost everyone was getting some form of payment.

James has always been considered one of the few clean players from that team and there's never been any proof or someone stepping forward to say otherwise.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Yeah, they have *no* vested interest in blowing this out of proportion

SI

Seems like it could very well bite them in the ass if it turns out that he was pushing his kid's exaggeration or was using a personal grudge over him not playing to get the guy fired.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Logan

Seems like it could very well bite them in the ass if it turns out that he was pushing his kid's exaggeration or was using a personal grudge over him not playing to get the guy fired.

What's the worst that happens (to the network)? They fire James & play the victim of being hoodwinked by someone they trusted. The world will largely shrug in that scenario.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I think TTech was prepared to pay their successful coach any money he deserved. No indications they were trying to get rid of Leach (unlike Kansas with Mangino). It was only with these allegations that they caused them to question, and so then the immediate issue of the bonus money soon forthcoming would be an understandably big thing for the university.

As Fozzie linked to, the AD has been trying to get rid of him since at least last offseason. What a bunch of pussies in the Big 12.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Every report I heard on ESPN and ESPNews mentioned the player was the son of ESPN analyst Craig James

The night this broke, I saw several mentions on ESPNNews with no info (at first they weren't even identifying the player). Later that night the scrolling ticker did not mention the connection. It was only when the sidebar story on the HD channel came up with more details that it mentioned Craig James.

[JPhillips]

An honest question. If you're okay with a coach doing this, would you also support other university employees doing the same thing? Would this be acceptable behavior for an English professor?

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

An honest question. If you're okay with a coach doing this, would you also support other university employees doing the same thing? Would this be acceptable behavior for an English professor?

Let's see an English professor who gets judged on what English Bowl the school gets invited to, and also one where English majors regularly show up with concussion symptoms.

I think the doctor's note pretty much puts Leach in the clear.

[cougarfreak]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

An honest question. If you're okay with a coach doing this, would you also support other university employees doing the same thing? Would this be acceptable behavior for an English professor?

Classroom behavior and punishments is a whole, and I mean a WHOLE different world. I did both for 18 years........and it is. Not even close. I wouldn't make a kid run wind sprints for being late to class, but I might a student athlete for the same thing. The other thing people forget is, football is an extracurricular activity. It's voluntary. That doesn't mean a kid can be abused, but from the above video, it seems that is far from the case. This seems like nothing more than a spoiled brat with a high profile daddy bitching and kicking.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by cougarfreak

That doesn't mean a kid can be abused, but from the above video, it seems that is far from the case. This seems like nothing more than a spoiled brat with a high profile daddy bitching and kicking.

This has become increasingly my perception as well. And I was initially inclined to figure Leach might be stupid/batshit crazy enough to be trying some sort of weird ass darkness therapy or simply thinking he could get away with some abusive punishment. But the more that slowly comes out, the more it looks to me like he wasn't doing anything particularly bothersome.

[timmynausea]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

An honest question. If you're okay with a coach doing this, would you also support other university employees doing the same thing? Would this be acceptable behavior for an English professor?

It seems about the same as saying "go sit in the hall" to me. Except they were outdoors in December, so they sent him to a nearby shelter with trainers.

[terpkristin]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

I think the doctor's note pretty much puts Leach in the clear.

What doctor's note? (if it was in the YouTube video, I've been having issues getting YouTube to load)

/tk

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by terpkristin

What doctor's note? (if it was in the YouTube video, I've been having issues getting YouTube to load)

/tk

Tech suspends Leach after complaint | FROM STAFF REPORTS

[Ted] Liggett said it’s “ridiculous” to characterize the building adjacent to the team’s practice fields as a “shed” or an “electrical closet.”

“Because of the fact that he had a concussion and he was extremely limited in the physical activity he could undergo, Mike felt like that was the best place for him and still be close to and part of the team,” Liggett said.

Liggett said while James was secluded on two occasions, he was not treated inappropriately and had a doctor’s statement attesting to that.

“There’s much, much more than meets the eye,” Liggett said. “The diagnosing doctor has signed a note stating that Adam James was in no way injured by the actions coach Leach took. In fact, he was better off in the building than he would have been outside.”

[Galaxy]

I know Tech fans/alumni are saying that Adam was a borderline Division 1 player (nevermind the Big 12) and the only reason he got to Tech was due to his name/daddy. Any truth to that?

[Galaxy]

Dola...

I like how ESPN pull James from broadcasting Saturday's Alamo Bowl.

[terpkristin]

Thanks for posting, Foz.

Still sounds like either a) the whole story hasn't come out or b) the AD was getting his much-desired revenge (as Fozzie pointed out).

But I still think he looks creepy and am most looking forward to this being resolved so that they don't keep showing him on ESPN.

/tk

[Senator]

This is AD driven, pure and simple.

[miami_fan]

I will ask the obvious question. Is this standard operating procedure for dealing with concussions on the football field? I know things will be specifically different at different schools but why wouldn't he go to a medical facility and be monitored? Why the equipment room/shed/ I have not followed this story very closely so if it has been reported just point me in the right direction. This is especially in light of the increased sensitivity to head injuries today.

[RainMaker]

The AD could also be looking out for the program. Do you guys realize how much this will be used by other schools in recruiting? The story was probably overblown but it's still insane how they treated the kid with a concussion. If the doctor prescribed treatment for dealing with concussions is locking someone in a garage in the dark, then he should keep his job. Seems to me he was pissed off at the kid and wanted to punish him.

Anyway, maybe Tech hires a coach who isn't a pussy with scheduling.