Airline Miles

[panerd]

I am a teacher and a total amateur here so forgive if some of these questions are really dumb. So some major credit card purchases in combination with a credit card promotion has left me with about 60,000 AMEX points. I figured I would cash out for $600 or whatever or pick up some amazon credit if I couldn't get straight cash. Little did I know the exchanges don't really work that way so it "only" is adding up to close to half of that. Well some online searches have shown 60,000 is pretty substantial in the travel world and I might be able to land a Hawaii or Caribbean flight for the wife and I. The hoops and clubs I would have to join look somewhat daunting though and I am worried I may end up with a bunch of Delta credit and nothing to do with it. Anyone have experience with transferring points? A web search shows some guy in a king sized bed on his way to Singapore for less points but it looks like he also went though a long list of items to get there.

EDIT: Also is the cost of the hotel going to be a wash from what I would get if I did the total air/hotel package through an online site or travel agency?

[cartman]

30,000 miles apiece is going to be on a 'saver' award to Hawaii or the Carribean. There are a lot fewer seats available for saver awards, and usually only available during the week, and also availability follows peak/off-peak tourist seasons. It is doable, you just have to be pretty flexible with your plans.

[panerd]

Aha. So if I tried to plan something next summer and being a teacher was open to leaving at 5 AM on a Tuesday or 10 PM on a Wednesday would a "saver" flight be able to get two seats together. Or are we talking super limited? I figured something with a $400 cash value wouldn't be super open-ended.

Or are we talking I have to be ready to go last minute like next week type "saver" value?

[cartman]

The first set. Mileage seats usually open up about 9 months before the flight date. There is usually an extra surcharge for using miles for a last minute flight (booking within 2-3 days out)

[digamma]

I'd kinda be shocked if you can fin a Delta trip to Hawaii for 30k. I think their base to Hawaii starts at 45k. But maybe they have deals from time to time?

[Pyser]

big fan of thepointguy dot com for all this stuff, good starting point

[panerd]

Originally Posted by Pyser

big fan of thepointguy dot com for all this stuff, good starting point

Thank you for the link. I think this might be the guy (or some variation) that actually gave me the 60,000 point idea. I have tried doing the research but without being able to pull the trigger with dates it's hard to know if it's true or way off. A few test runs on some airline sites look like I incur moderate damage of $200-300 on top of my points but guys like this seem to think otherwise. Have you been able to snag a Hawaiian or international flight for cheap like this guys seems to be able to?

[panerd]

So instead of trying to figure all this out right at 60,000 AMEX points which seems to be the extreme low point. What if I opened one of those Chase cards for like 30,000 bonus miles? Could I book different flights one way with AMEX and the other with Chase? Am I missing something besides the obvious people that get credit cards they can't handle and run up huge debt? If I just do my family's groceries on a new card for 3 months I will definitely pick up the bonus. Somebody stop me if it sounds like I am doing something dumb just to save a few bucks. A small credit hit? Something else? I really don't know that's why I am asking.

[digamma]

No, it's a viable strategy. You just need to know the rules and when points trigger and how they transfer, etc.

[sooner333]

I got the Chase Sapphire Reserve when it had 100,000 bonus points. The sign up (and spend) bonus is down to 50,000 now, however. But the points can be transferred to many partners and can be redeemed for travel at 1.5 cents per point. The annual fee is $450 but you get a $300 annual credit on any travel you purchase on the card so the effective fee is $150. I was able to use the bonus finding a cheap flight to Europe and using the points to buy the flight like cash. I also have transferred other points to Southwest which I usually fly domestically.

[panerd]

Yeah those annual fees could get nasty on my plan. My AMEX card has one but it is only $95. You could cancel it after using the miles right? I wonder how or if they prevent that?

[molson]

You an definitely cancel after you use the points. And if the bonus points are with an airline or hotel loyalty program, you can cancel the card right after you get the bonus, and still keep the points.

Chase has instituted a 5/24 "churn" limit. If you have opened 5 credit card accounts in the previous 24 months (across all card issuers), you're not eligible for a new Chase credit card account. Or at least, your chances of approval in that scenario go way down.

AMEX doesn't have a set rule like that, but there's been a few examples of them shutting users out for churning too much. But that's pretty rare. There are people who are really, really into hoarding points in this manner. You'll probably never hit their level. Getting a 50k bonus on a few cards here and there is nothing.

Check out /r/churning if you're on reddit. Points guy is great too.

[Pyser]

you can also downgrade to a free card and keep the points

[panerd]

Originally Posted by molson

You an definitely cancel after you use the points. And if the bonus points are with an airline or hotel loyalty program, you can cancel the card right after you get the bonus, and still keep the points.

Chase has instituted a 5/24 "churn" limit. If you have opened 5 credit card accounts in the previous 24 months (across all card issuers), you're not eligible for a new Chase credit card account. Or at least, your chances of approval in that scenario go way down.

AMEX doesn't have a set rule like that, but there's been a few examples of them shutting users out for churning too much. But that's pretty rare. There are people who are really, really into hoarding points in this manner. You'll probably never hit their level. Getting a 50k bonus on a few cards here and there is nothing.

Check out /r/churning if you're on reddit. Points guy is great too.

Yeah I've been reading a lot of the points guy will have to check out churning. One of the problems I am running into is that St. Louis is no longer a hub for any airline so the awards choices/airlines are pretty limited. (Delta is a big St. Louis airline and from what I have read they are about the worst value, second that with Southwest airlines) Worst case is I can always cash out. Seems like there are a few stores like Home Depot where I can actually get 1:1 credit for my points. Not anything close to what the points guy is getting with his airline stuff but still $600 or so. I spend enough there already so it isn't the end of the world if this vacation stuff falls through. But I am the weird type of guy that would enjoy a Hawaii/Caribbean vacation so much more if I pulled off some sort of 20+ hours of research points steal instead of just telling a travel agent St Louis-Punta Cana, June, all inclusive adults only resort and being done with it.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by molson

You an definitely cancel after you use the points. And if the bonus points are with an airline or hotel loyalty program, you can cancel the card right after you get the bonus, and still keep the points.

Chase has instituted a 5/24 "churn" limit. If you have opened 5 credit card accounts in the previous 24 months (across all card issuers), you're not eligible for a new Chase credit card account. Or at least, your chances of approval in that scenario go way down.

AMEX doesn't have a set rule like that, but there's been a few examples of them shutting users out for churning too much. But that's pretty rare. There are people who are really, really into hoarding points in this manner. You'll probably never hit their level. Getting a 50k bonus on a few cards here and there is nothing.

Check out /r/churning if you're on reddit. Points guy is great too.

I just want to say 3 years later (and about 50 credit cards/bank bonuses!) I wanted to come back and either thank you or curse you for directing me towards r/churning Molson. It has definitely become a side hobby for me and find every major (and some minor) purchase being analyzed for maximum points acquirement. Haven't ever gotten into the manufactured spending... seems like both a quasi-legal grey area and a giant worm hole where I would somehow end up with 100-$100 Vanilla Visa gift cards and/or an IRS frozen bank account containing $100,000 I need to pay bills.

But again seriously my wive loves you on most days for the trips we have been able to go on and the extra side money and shakes her head when I have money sitting in Penfed, Citi, Bank of America, US Bank, Chase, PNC and even some company called Aspiration.

[Edward64]

Tangentially related.

I'm feeling kinda bummed as I haven't been collecting Delta Skymiles or Marriott Rewards for the past 3-4 months,

[cartman]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Tangentially related.

I'm feeling kinda bummed as I haven't been collecting Delta Skymiles or Marriott Rewards for the past 3-4 months,

I am glad that all of the programs I'm on are keeping you at your current status through at least the end of next year.

[molson]

Originally Posted by panerd

I just want to say 3 years later (and about 50 credit cards/bank bonuses!) I wanted to come back and either thank you or curse you for directing me towards r/churning Molson. It has definitely become a side hobby for me and find every major (and some minor) purchase being analyzed for maximum points acquirement. Haven't ever gotten into the manufactured spending... seems like both a quasi-legal grey area and a giant worm hole where I would somehow end up with 100-$100 Vanilla Visa gift cards and/or an IRS frozen bank account containing $100,000 I need to pay bills.

But again seriously my wive loves you on most days for the trips we have been able to go on and the extra side money and shakes her head when I have money sitting in Penfed, Citi, Bank of America, US Bank, Chase, PNC and even some company called Aspiration.

Nice!

I'm siting on so many miles now after we had trips cancelled and haven't been scheduling others. The airlines will probably devalue the miles' value at some point, there's just so many points sitting out there. But I'm also banking on them wanting to get people back in the habit of flying in the shorter term, and that we'll be out there soon enough relative to others to take advantage.

But other people with hoarded miles are definitely hedging by transferring or using some points for things that they wouldn't otherwise use them for, like Amazon purchases with Amex points, or regional hotels for weekend trips.

Currently I've been stacking Amex/Delta bonuses - there's a lot of cards out there, and some of them have very generous non-traveling point earning possibilities (4X for grocery, restaurants, etc, plus all kinds of one-time offers they email you about). Plus companion fares are gold for us since we can split a hotel cost, but flights require two tickets - so I have annual companion fares through Amex and Alaska. And I'll always hold on to my United Select (no longer available to new customers) because it gives me double on home improvement - which is great when you're doing major stuff like replacing your roof.

I'm not expecting any countries to let Americans in in 2020. Hopefully we can ramp up next year, and if not, we'll just have to get to know the good 'ole USA better.

And agreed that manufactured spending is a bad idea. Amex is going after that more and more and taking points away if they catch you doing it. It's enough work to make sure the value of every purchase is maximized, and juggling to minimize annual fees.