2012 Presidential Campaign

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

CNN projects VA to Obama. So all that's left is FL, right? (and Alaska to be an instant Romney call when polling closes there)

Nevada too.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

Start going for guys like Jon Huntsman instead of the Newts and Ricks of the world.

Of course, since going with pseudocons has been working out so well for them for the last 8 years.

[Big Fo]

Puerto Rico chooses statehood

SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico (AP) — Puerto Ricans faced a fundamental question on Election Day: Should they change their ties with the United States?

Citizens in the U.S. island territory cannot vote in the U.S. presidential election, but many were excited to participate in a referendum on whether to push the territory toward statehood, greater autonomy or independence.

Car horns blared and party flags waved after polling stations closed following what election officials said was a high voter turnout. During the day, many voters carried umbrellas against the blistering tropical sun as temperatures neared 90 degrees Fahrenheit (31 degrees Celsius).

The two-part referendum first asked voters if they wanted to change Puerto Rico's 114-year relationship with the United States. A second question gave voters three alternatives if they wanted a change: become a U.S. state, gain independence, or have a "sovereign free association," a designation that would give more autonomy for the territory of 4 million people.

With 243 of 1,643 precincts reporting late Tuesday, 75,188 voters, or 53 percent, said they did not want to continue under the current political status. Forty-seven percent, or 67,304 voters, supported the status quo.

On the second question, 65 percent favored statehood, followed by 31 percent for sovereign free association and 4 percent for independence.

What's the chance of Puerto Rico becoming a state sometime in the next decade or so?

[M GO BLUE!!!]

More nice from BBC...

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Nevada too.

CNN had already called NV for Obama

[JonInMiddleGA]

In other news (and I ain't trying to scan the thread to see if this has already been mentioned) ... Gary Johnson wins a county, Marshall County, KS to be exact. Got about 66.7% of some 4,600 ballots cast.

The little green dot almost dead center of the NYT county map was kind of amusing to see.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

CNN had already called NV for Obama

Aaah. NBC hasn't I guess.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Not to knock your stance, but I think this is the problem with the small government crowd. They tout they want government out of things but always find excuses to interfere in things they care about.

I honestly don't think this is going to matter much. My brother lives there and when I texted him about it the first thing he said was it's pretty much legal anyway.

What I don't get is people who claim they don't want to deal with people driving under the influence of marijuana who refuse to ban alcohol too.

"Small government" means different things to different people, all of which are valid despite CrimsonFox's illiterate hyperbole. And like with any "platform", no one would agree with every single thing (for example, I love anti-smoking laws). To me, any true sense of personal freedoms from the tyranny of government went out the door centuries and then Lincoln proved that pure federal power can be a good thing if done right with effective leadership.

I have not commented much on social policies except that I have consistently said that it comes down to personal responsibilities and morality regardless of what the goverment does or does not do. Regarding financial, I asked that we start thinking more locally and to have the federal govt submit budgets (and to pass legislations) that are smaller and smarter - instead of the usual trend of adding more on top of too much.

[DaddyTorgo]

Romney is now scheduled to speak at 12:55am.

[sabotai]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

Puerto Rico chooses statehood



What's the chance of Puerto Rico becoming a state sometime in the next decade or so?

Depends on Congress. They still have to approve it, but Obama did say he would support statehood for Puerto Rico if they voted for it.

[mckerney]

Not watching it, but the Fox News coverage sounds hilarious from Chris Kluwe's twitter feed.

Chris Kluwe ‏@ChrisWarcraft
Rove doesn't understand why they don't have the Latino vote. Also confused on gravity, why we don't breathe water.

[DaddyTorgo]

Romney concedes - he'll be coming out in a minute.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by sabotai

Depends on Congress. They still have to approve it, but Obama did say he would support statehood for Puerto Rico if they voted for it.

Cool!

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Not watching it, but the Fox News coverage sounds hilarious from Chris Kluwe's twitter feed.

Chris Kluwe ‏@ChrisWarcraft
Rove doesn't understand why they don't have the Latino vote. Also confused on gravity, why we don't breathe water.

Kluwe is great. He should totally go into politics or something. His wit is wasted.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

"Small government" means different things to different people, all of which are valid despite CrimsonFox's illiterate hyperbole. And like with any "platform", no one would agree with every single thing (for example, I love anti-smoking laws). To me, any true sense of personal freedoms from the tyranny of government went out the door centuries and then Lincoln proved that pure federal power can be a good thing if done right with effective leadership.

I have not commented much on social policies except that I have consistently said that it comes down to personal responsibilities and morality regardless of what the goverment does or does not do. Regarding financial, I asked that we start thinking more locally and to have the federal govt submit budgets (and to pass legislations) that are smaller and smarter - instead of the usual trend of adding more on top of too much.

I understand that. I guess I'm saying that there seems like a lot of people who are libertarian or conservative who tout small government and personal freedom. But that only extends to things they want freedom to do, not what others might. I just don't consider that stance much different from the status quo. I mean the quote in your signature contradicts that stance.

[Buccaneer]

RainMaker, people like labels without meaning.

[RainMaker]

I know science is taboo to them, but the GOP should really spend some money and hire a few math gurus. What Obama did to Hillary in that primary should have been a sign as to what those people can do for how to allocate resources. It really feels like the election was like a moneyball team going up against the old guard in baseball. You just can't compete at some point.

[DaddyTorgo]

Baldwin > Thompson in WI Senate is called by NBC.

[DaddyTorgo]

Gracious concession speech by Romney actually. Kudos to him - thanking everybody and wishing the President (and his family) well, and mentioning all of his staff.

Also like his call for everybody coming together and working for America and put people before politics.

This is what a concession speech should be. No complaints from me.

[SirFozzie]

Agreed.

[MrBug708]

Classy to the end Mitt

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

What I don't get is people who claim they don't want to deal with people driving under the influence of marijuana who refuse to ban alcohol too.

Let's settle this - OUI Olympics. Set it up on a closed course, give them all the necessary safety precautions, then let's all tune in to watch drunk people compete vs. high people on potentially dangerous everyday tasks like driving a car, operating heavy machinery, etc. I bet the high people grade out a lot safer (although the drunk people get to where they are going much faster... when they do get there.) You wouldn't watch? Spike can't find a timeslot and pair this up with Manswers?

[Big Fo]

Originally Posted by sabotai

Depends on Congress. They still have to approve it, but Obama did say he would support statehood for Puerto Rico if they voted for it.

From what I understand, if approved the state of Puerto Rico would probably be a solid blue state. Maybe some Republicans in districts/states with sizable Latino populations could be convinced to vote for PR's statehood. If not it might prove difficult.

[kcchief19]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

In other news (and I ain't trying to scan the thread to see if this has already been mentioned) ... Gary Johnson wins a county, Marshall County, KS to be exact. Got about 66.7% of some 4,600 ballots cast.

The little green dot almost dead center of the NYT county map was kind of amusing to see.

Looks like the intern at NYT transposed some numbers. Romney's and Johnson's vote totals were swapped, Romney took 59 percent and Johnson took 2 percent. NYT had them flipped.

Funny though.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Of course, since going with pseudocons has been working out so well for them for the last 8 years.

Because going socially conservative, or trying to play to that base, has been working as well.

[spleen1015]

At least the state of Indiana will continue to head in the right direction. The United States of America, not so much.

[sabotai]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

From what I understand, if approved the state of Puerto Rico would probably be a solid blue state. Maybe some Republicans in districts/states with sizable Latino populations could be convinced to vote for PR's statehood. If not it might prove difficult.

I've been trying to google this. If PR becomes a state, it gets 2 Senators and 7 Congressmen (it would be the 27th state by population). I always thought it would be a solid blue state too, but what little I can find is that the current legislature of Puerto Rico is conservative. So I'm not sure which side of the aisle it would ultimately fall on.

Whatever side it falls on, I'm sure both parties will want something in return for going along with it. I guess we'll see what happens.

[stevew]

I wonder if they will go all NBA expansion franchise on PR and give them 3 Dems and 3 Rep house members for X Election cycles and a 1/1 senator split.

[Young Drachma]

The political parties of Puerto Rico are different than the mainland and the members within them are often registered to different U.S. parties than other members, so you can have two PDP members, with one being a mainland GOPer and the other a mainland Democrat. Since they don't get a Presidential vote unless they move to the mainland, it doesn't end up mattering except for the dog and pony show that is the nominating process of each party every four years.

The real incentive to statehood is being making them subject to federal income taxes.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by stevew

I wonder if they will go all NBA expansion franchise on PR and give them 3 Dems and 3 Rep house members for X Election cycles and a 1/1 senator split.

From a house fact sheet on the issue.

http://naturalresources.house.gov/ne...umentID=183105

REAPPORTIONING HOUSE SEATS
How would Statehood for Puerto Rico affect the apportionment of House seats?

According to a report by the Congressional Research Service (CRS), if Puerto Rico were to become a state, based on a population of approximately 4 million, they would be entitled to six seats in the House of Representatives. As a state, they would, of course, receive two Senators.

The current number of 435 seats in the House of Representatives was set by the Apportionment Act of 1911. For nearly a century, the permanent number of seats hasn’t changed.

If Puerto Rico were to become a state, Congress would either have to:

Reapportion the 435 seats by giving six to Puerto Rico and subtracting seats from other states;

Temporarily increase the size of the House until the next reapportionment following the next census; or
Permanently increase the size of the House.
Based on current information, a CRS report projects that the states that could lose an existing seat or not receive an expected additional seat after the 2010 Census in order to provide six of 435 seats to Puerto Rico include: Arizona, Missouri, New York, South Carolina, Texas and Washington.

BOTTOM-LINE: If Congress is going to ask Puerto Rico if they want to be a state, as H.R. 2499 does, then Congress has an obligation to address, in advance, the question of apportioning House seats. The public deserves to know whether their state could lose representation to provide six of 435 House seats to Puerto Rico, or whether their proposed solution is that the nation needs more Members of Congress than it has today.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

Because going socially conservative, or trying to play to that base, has been working as well.

Yeah, they could play off the Romney loss by claiming he wasn't a Real Republican, but hopefully the Senate collapse is the wake up call they need. I suspect it won't be, and it'll take something even more drastic (losing the House and having total # of Senators drop below 40?) Oh well, a lot can happen in 4 or 8 years, so it's probably foolish to make any long-term predictions about parties.

Originally Posted by sabotai

I've been trying to google this. If PR becomes a state, it gets 2 Senators and 7 Congressmen (it would be the 27th state by population). I always thought it would be a solid blue state too, but what little I can find is that the current legislature of Puerto Rico is conservative. So I'm not sure which side of the aisle it would ultimately fall on.

Whatever side it falls on, I'm sure both parties will want something in return for going along with it. I guess we'll see what happens.

Hmm... is Guam conservative enough? DC's too democratic. Could we pull in Alberta (oil and water!)? Would you try to go full 1820 compromise and break up an existing state? NorCal and SoCal (both would go dem though), Texas (I know they have the right to split into 5 states, not sure where you would split them to break them into two), Upstate and Downstate New York might make the most sense. What about reversing the compromise, give Massachusetts back Maine and stay at an even 50? There could be a really fun debate there.

[SirFozzie]

I like Obama's speech. Not spiking the football, not gloating, but reaching across the aisle to get america moving forward.

[MrBug708]

No vast shortage of incredible hyperbole in this amazing speech by the bestest president EVAR

[SirFozzie]

Want a napkin to clean up some of the sarcasm? It'd dripping...

[MrBug708]

Actually, it's hyperbole

[SirFozzie]

Looks like Allen West will lose.

Florida Congressional District 18 election results

and looks like Michelle Bachmann will JUST hold on..

Minnesota Congressional District 6 election results

[Tigercat]

Over the top nationalism has been the main ingredient in presidential speeches since the founding fathers. Our generation has learned from those before them.

[SirFozzie]

Oof. Ok, now maybe referring to the Seal Team Six mission IS spiking the football a bit.

edit: And there's a ACA reference too.

I like it, but I'm sure there's teeth grinding on the other side right now.

[mckerney]

Robin Thede ‏@robinthede
No Obama, you know what would make this country great? If that LADY TOOK THE FLAG OUT OF HER DAMN HAIR

[Scoobz0202]

Nate Silver looking good in postseason

[Scoobz0202]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

and looks like Michelle Bachmann will JUST hold on..

Minnesota Congressional District 6 election results

I don't know, this one is close as hell. Please be the cherry on top..

[SirFozzie]

Nate Silver. 51-51. So that's what, 100.75-102 over 2008 and 20012?)

(Missed one state and one district in NE in 2008, and NOTHING in 2012)

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Yeah, they could play off the Romney loss by claiming he wasn't a Real Republican, but hopefully the Senate collapse is the wake up call they need. I suspect it won't be, and it'll take something even more drastic (losing the House and having total # of Senators drop below 40?) Oh well, a lot can happen in 4 or 8 years, so it's probably foolish to make any long-term predictions about parties.

The reality is that Romney, at least in my opinion, gave the GOP the best chance to win out of their rather crappy pool of candidates (Huntsman has an impressive record, but just wasn't "sexy" enough). Romney trying to play both sides killed him, among just his mediocre candidacy.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Nate Silver. 51-51. So that's what, 100.75-102 over 2008 and 20012?)

(Missed one state and one district in NE in 2008, and NOTHING in 2012)

Looks like he probably missed a bit in the senate. Heitkamp looks like she may win in North Dakota, though there was only one poll that had her leading that that was back in June, making it a pretty big upset if it holds.

[mckerney]

It looks like the Voter ID amendment is likely fail in Minnesota with only 46.5% of the vote and 84% of precincts reporting. Backers of the amendment are saying they can't win.

An amendment to ban gay marriage is closer but still behind with 48% of the vote.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

The reality is that Romney, at least in my opinion, gave the GOP the best chance to win out of their rather crappy pool of candidates (Huntsman has an impressive record, but just wasn't "sexy" enough).

Truth. I love the idea of a smart, accomplished moderate like Hunstman as President (on the other side, Dick Gephardt's probably the closest comparison in the last couple primaries), but those guys are just completely unelectable as the head of a ticket. They'd have to win as VP and then slide in when a President dies/resigns.

[mckerney]

The state senate candidate in Maine who was attacked for her WoW habits has won.

Maine's "World of Warcraft" candidate Colleen Lachowicz appears to win State Senate seat

[SirFozzie]

She should camp the guy and make him take rez sickness..

(kidding)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

Because going socially conservative, or trying to play to that base, has been working as well.

We haven't seen it tried in November for at least 8 years.

2 worthless lightweights have accomplished nothing except to insure 8 years of the (currently) second worst president in history.

If you're gonna lose anyway then why not at least do so with a chance of actually gaining something?

[mckerney]

The AP is reporting the constitutional amendment to ban same sex marriage in Minnesota has been defeated!

It's still not legal, but it won't take changing the constitution to become legal, and supporters of the amendment saw it as one of their last chances to keep it illegal. The DFL took back both the state house and senate, so hopefully progress can be made next year.