Invasion of Ukraine

[Edward64]

A deal for Ukraine's mineral resources will be signed soon. Zelenskyy coming to the US.

Originally Posted by Edward64

IMO the key is security guarantees. Make sure it's ironclad because I can see Trump getting the rare earth deal; and also trying to help Putin, screw Ukraine. And oh yeah, maybe say the deal is effective after a ceasefire has been negotiated (and buffer zone established)

Okay, you didn't get the security gaurantees. But you didn't "give" the $500B that Trump was asking for either.

https://apnews.com/article/russia-uk...5c5425007060e6

According to one Ukrainian official, some technical details are still to be determined. However, the draft does not include a contentious Trump administration proposal to give the U.S. $500 billion worth of profits from Ukraine’s rare earth minerals as compensation for its wartime assistance to Kyiv.

I have no freaking idea what below mean. I've read several articles and no insights provided, I think MSM is confused too.

Instead, the U.S. and Ukraine would have joint ownership of a fund, and Ukraine would in the future contribute 50% of future proceeds from state-owned resources, including minerals, oil, and gas. One official said the deal had better terms of investments and another one said that Kyiv secured favorable amendments and viewed the outcome as “positive.”

Okay on joint ownership (but I'd think there needs to be one side with 51%).

But what will the fund do or invest in? who will manage it from day-to-day? how long will the 50% contributions be for (e.g. 10-15-20 years)? assume profits will be split proportionately but who determines if profits should be paid out or reinvested? etc.

More to come as the detailed terms come out but I'm thinking this is Zelenskyy's way of saying "no" by not saying "no", giving Trump a "win", and biding for time and see how the NATOexUS plays out.

[Edward64]

Crap is starting to hit the fan. Not unexpected, all things considered.

Just a moment...

President Donald Trump on Monday evening hit pause on all U.S. aid to Ukraine, a show of force following last week’s dressing down of President Volodymyr Zelenskyy in the Oval Office aimed at pressuring him back to the negotiating table.

But Trump also made clear in public comments Monday that the economic agreement Zelenskyy had come to Washington to finalize remains on the table. The carrot and stick approach is about forcing Zelenskyy into a bigger negotiation to end the war with Russia.

One administration official close to the process, granted anonymity to discuss internal matters, said that Trump and his senior team continue to believe that a relatively quick end to the war that Russia started three years ago remains possible and are eager to push Zelenskyy to tamp down his own rhetoric so they can draw both sides into negotiating.

[Atocep]

I don't understand why all the pressure on Zelensky when this war would end by Russia simply agreeing to remove it's forces. I mean, I understand but don't understand.

Putin is the one that ends this war. Not Zelensky.

[Edward64]

It’s the Trump reality show. So it just is what it is

[Edward64]

Just a moment...

“Our meeting in Washington, at the White House on Friday, did not go the way it was supposed to be. It is regrettable that it happened this way,” wrote Zelenskyy on social media platform X. “It is time to make things right. We would like future cooperation and communication to be constructive.”

In his social media post, the wartime Ukrainian president said he and his team are “ready to work under President Trump’s strong leadership to get a peace that lasts,” proposing Ukraine and Russia both release prisoners and agree to a “truce in the sky” and “truce in the sea immediately.”

Not saying it's fair, but IMO it is the right thing to do as it's best for his country & people based on the realities right now.

Zelenskyy is still offering Trump an olive branch, even as top U.S. officials deride his demeanor and country.

“Regarding the agreement on minerals and security, Ukraine is ready to sign it in any time and in any convenient format,” Zelenskyy said on X. “We see this agreement as a step toward greater security and solid security guarantees, and I truly hope it will work effectively.”

Don't think the details of the one from 2 weeks ago were revealed? Wouldn't surprise me if Trump changes it up some and there's some misunderstanding/drama over this.

[Ksyrup]

Trump definitely gets off on groveling, but I feel like the bigger prize is alignment with Russia. I'll be surprised if this happens, or we follow through with anything meaningful in exchange.

[Atocep]

Vance referred to the UK as a random country that hasn't fought a war in 30 or 40 years when talking about them leading peacekeeping efforts.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Vance referred to the UK as a random country that hasn't fought a war in 30 or 40 years when talking about them leading peacekeeping efforts.

Didn't he fuck a couch?

[JonInMiddleGA]

I love the "and in any convenient format" quote.

It's hard to not feel like that's phrased with the Twitter trending suggestion that any eventual agreement be handled via DocuSign (so as to avoid inviting that SOB back to DC)

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I love the "and in any convenient format" quote.

It's hard to not feel like that's phrased with the Twitter trending suggestion that any eventual agreement be handled via DocuSign (so as to avoid inviting that SOB back to DC)

We'd be lucky to have a leader with half the balls Zelensky has. At the start of the war when everyone assumed a steamroll he didn't leave Kiev. Throughout the constant bombings he's stayed as well. Might as well stay and sign whatever it is we think he needs to sign.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by dubb93

We'd be lucky to have a leader with half the balls Zelensky has. At the start of the war when everyone assumed a steamroll he didn't leave Kiev. Throughout the constant bombings he's stayed as well. Might as well stay and sign whatever it is we think he needs to sign.

Gotta protect his grift. Easier to steal money if you're not already on the run.
Even easier when you've got suckers begging to send it to you.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Gotta protect his grift. Easier to steal money if you're not already on the run.
Even easier when you've got suckers begging to send it to you.

Yup, he's stolen all the money given to his country and despite all of that they have managed to basically fight Russia to a deadlock. Them Ukrainians and their knucksandwiches. No wonder they have so many Heavyweight boxing champions.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by dubb93

We'd be lucky to have a leader with half the balls Zelensky has. At the start of the war when everyone assumed a steamroll he didn't leave Kiev. Throughout the constant bombings he's stayed as well. Might as well stay and sign whatever it is we think he needs to sign.

Are you telling me Zelensky isn't a draft dodger and didn't start a crypto con? I'm sure Zelensky is mocking the people dying for his country or at least the POWs. Or is he spending $10 million a month in taxpayer dollars to golf? Wait, I know he has to be signing people who donate to him up for recurring payments without telling them. If none of that he absolutely has to be signing legislation to give himself massive tax breaks.

[Atocep]

I figured it out. Zelensky is the guy that started a fake college and a fake children's cancer charity. That's where his grift is.

[dubb93]

You guys remember that video of the Russian tank rolling through a village and Big Babushka disabling it with an uppercut? Those were good times.

[JonInMiddleGA]

The ineptitude of the Russian military has nothing to do with the glorious resistance of the sainted Ukrainians.

Is that better?

If Trump was pro-aid, 99.8% of the current Zelensky fanboys would suddenly call the guy the anti-Christ.

[flere-imsaho]

Careful Jon, at this rate you're going to sound as unhinged as RainMaker.

[GrantDawg]

I see arguements all the time, Jon, but no, they wouldn't. That would be the least expected of a President of the United States, and at best, there would be criticism of either too much or not enough funding, depending. His pro-Russian stance has been just bizarre. Standing against Putin used to be a bipartisan postion that there was general agreement.

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[RainMaker]

Very unhinged to not want to light hundreds of billions on fire for an unwinnable war.

Like I'm sorry you all didn't want the peace deal back in 2022 when Ukraine had leverage. You all ended up being wrong which is sort of a repeating theme.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Very unhinged to not want to light hundreds of billions on fire for an unwinnable war.

Like I'm sorry you all didn't want the peace deal back in 2022 when Ukraine had leverage. You all ended up being wrong which is sort of a repeating theme.

Russia wasn’t making peace in 2022 so the thought is irrelevant.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

I see arguements all the time, Jon, but no, they wouldn't. That would be the least expected of a President of the United States, and at best, there would be criticism of either too much or not enough funding, depending. His pro-Russian stance has been just bizarre. Standing against Putin used to be a bipartisan postion that there was general agreement.

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Most people here did a complete 180 on Gaza the minute Trump took office.

If Trump offered a ton of aid and a more aggressive approach, he'd be criticized for trying to start WW3.

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Most people here did a complete 180 on Gaza the minute Trump took office.

If Trump offered a ton of aid and a more aggressive approach, he'd be criticized for trying to start WW3.

He's going to start WW3 anyways, just fighting on the wrong side.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Russia wasn’t making peace in 2022 so the thought is irrelevant.

They absolutely were when they were losing. Boris Johnson was sent to Kyiv to talk Zelensky out of accepting it. It was a big story in Europe at the time while American media were focused on propoganda like the "Ghost of Kyiv".

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

They absolutely were when they were losing. Boris Johnson was sent to Kyiv to talk Zelensky out of accepting it. It was a big story in Europe at the time while American media were focused on propoganda like the "Ghost of Kyiv".

I have a bunch of shit for sale if you honestly think Russia wanted peace instead of time in any of those negotiations. I once again say that peace in 2022 wasn’t an option because, I’ll rephrase myself slightly here, Putin wasn’t capable of peace in 2022.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

They absolutely were when they were losing. Boris Johnson was sent to Kyiv to talk Zelensky out of accepting it. It was a big story in Europe at the time while American media were focused on propoganda like the "Ghost of Kyiv".

I'm not convinced Russia ever wanted peace. They sabotaged the first round of peace talks with Bucha and then used the next round of peace talks so that his army could catch its breath and train up their conscripts to buy time to get them to the front line.

[RainMaker]

Just going on what was reported out of Ukraine. Russia was doing really bad at the beginning before they made deals with China and re-worked their military strategy.

Redirect Notice

Redirect Notice

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Just going on what was reported out of Ukraine. Russia was doing really bad at the beginning before they made deals with China and re-worked their military strategy.

Redirect Notice

Redirect Notice

They were definitely in some shit and I'm sure peace was being discussed by some in the Putin regime, but the Russian mindset isn't surrender and Putin would have likely been forced out or assassinated if they had. He was likely going to sabotage any peace talks, even if they were initiated by his side.

[Lathum]

Little Marco heading to Saudi Arabia today to talk peace deal with Ukrainian officials.

I put it 50/50 that he resigns by the end of the week after Trump destroys all his work with one tweet from the shitter.

Even Marco can only take so much.

[cuervo72]

Nah, I think Marco can take an awful lot.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Nah, I think Marco can take an awful lot.

They are really just a bunch of cucks...

[JPhillips]

Trump really did get the mark of him. Lil Marco forever and always.