The 2010 FIFA World Cup thread (will contain spoilers)

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by MIJB#19

*sigh*

It was an interesting run for the Netherlands, good to see our country get united in times where we're politically falling apart. I think we lucked into the final, playing un-Dutch football. Tomorrow everybody will talk about the goal being offside, but I don't buy it, that's not where we lost it. We sold our souls to ugly football, sadly the end result is the same as it always has been.

Mission unaccomplished.


In the end football lost once again, with a final between two teams with a defensive first strategy. It was basically 5-4-1 vs 5-4-1, but it prevailed once again over entertaining football. But that's how the game is evolving.

Anyway, congratulations to the new world champions. The Spanish tactic worked wonders and eventually resulted in six straight victories en route to the FIFA World Cup.

Well said!

[MJ4H]

I hope nobody will be talking about the goal being offside. He was onside by several feet.

[ISiddiqui]

Hooray Spain (and congrats Icy!)! They deserved the victory today, though in a very, very chippy game. Perhaps the dirtiest game of the WC so far, which is a shame for the general viewing public.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

I hope nobody will be talking about the goal being offside. He was onside by several feet.

Don't get me wrong here, I'm not saying it was offside, I'm saying it's the wishful thinking that arises after a game. What-if theories will turn to stuff like blaming a referee that, as others said, gave us many chances to stay in the game by not sending off De Jong, Van Bommel or Robben earlier on.

[JPhillips]

More so than the high profile officiating mistakes, I'm shocked at how many routine calls they get wrong. The amount of times they get offside and possession wrong is shocking. Is club soccer like this as well? Why won't FIFA put another pair or two of eyes on the pitch?

[cthomer5000]

The replay showed the goal was quite clearly onside.

I initially thought he was off as well, and though the linesman was out of position, but the replay was clear and decisive.

De Jong' awesome front-kick to the chest of Alonso is one of my highlights of the tournament. LOL.

[cthomer5000]

Also - i never though the Dutch players were complaining about the goal offside... i think they were just furious over the lack of corner kick on the prior play. It was clearly deflected off the wall, but Webb missed it and awarded the goal kick.

[GoldenEagle]

What a boring game. I didn't care who won, I just wanted a good game. Instead, you had whining and flopping. Ugh.

[MJ4H]

[DaddyTorgo]

Dutch played a great game - it's a shame they had to lose it right at the end there.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

He's made no secret of his loyalties, he's nothing more than a devoutly anti-American terrorist sympathizer. And that's a kinder description than the miserable piece of shit deserves afaic.

And before anybody starts bitching about the sidetrack, I'm not the one who brought the bastard up in the first place.

LMAO

you're nuts.

[MikeVic]

This was a boring final match.

[MJ4H]

[Icy]

Watch the interview to Casillas after the game, it gets interesting after a couple of minutes (Spanish language but it doesn't matter at all as it's all about the images)

http://www.marca.com/tv/?v=vO3X00evP20

[MikeVic]

Oh no, her boob is in the way!! I can help her out by keeping it out of her popcorn eating way.

[MikeVic]

Way to go Iker!

[Abe Sargent]

That was a good Wrold Cup, all things told.

[Abe Sargent]

I don't think th eref did too bad a job considering how hard it was to officiate this game in particular. The only issue I had was the yellow for something he didn;t see, but other than that, I think he did about as well as any ref in that game could have done. That game was rough.

[Icy]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I don't think th eref did too bad a job considering how hard it was to officiate this game in particular. The only issue I had was the yellow for something he didn;t see, but other than that, I think he did about as well as any ref in that game could have done. That game was rough.

You really don't think this deserved a red card and would have changed the game that early?

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I don't think th eref did too bad a job considering how hard it was to officiate this game in particular. The only issue I had was the yellow for something he didn;t see, but other than that, I think he did about as well as any ref in that game could have done. That game was rough.

He blew some serious calls. The no red card on the kick ot the chest, no call on the mugging of the Netherlands player that was past the defense, the completely missed corner call, not once but twice. Granted the first time was on a shot and it was a tougher call to see the keeper actually touched it but the free kick off the wall was insane. I would think the only way to miss that would be if he was turned around watching the wrong side of the field.

[Icy]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

He blew some serious calls. The no red card on the kick ot the chest, no call on the mugging of the Netherlands player that was past the defense, the completely missed corner call, not once but twice. Granted the first time was on a shot and it was a tougher call to see the keeper actually touched it but the free kick off the wall was insane. I would think the only way to miss that would be if he was turned around watching the wrong side of the field.

Agree, he allowed to much hard contact early in the game and it conditioned him for the rest of it. I understand he tried to keep it 11 vs 11 but... it was too much, specially the kick to chest, nobody would have complained about that red card.

Also big mistake in the foul, i wonder how he thought that the ball fly was that way and not hitting the wall.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Icy

Agree, he allowed to much hard contact early in the game and it conditioned him for the rest of it. I understand he tried to keep it 11 vs 11 but... it was too much, specially the kick to chest, nobody would have complained about that red card.

Also big mistake in the foul, i wonder how he thought that the ball fly was that way and not hitting the wall.

I actually didn't see the kick to the chest when it happened, was out of the room at the time. But when I saw the replay I cannot understand how that wasn't a red. I can understand wanting to keep it 11 on 11 but I can't see how anyone could complain if that was called a red.

[MJ4H]

Come on man.

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by HiFiRevival

Horrible. Sport is supposed to be about people applying their best effort within the rules to accomplish a great feat. At the biggest game for the world's most popular sport you had a bunch of fairies and buttweasles making a mockery of everything that real men playing real sports actually accomplish.

This WC was mediocre at best and the final was a freaking atrocity. If both of those worthless teams had their planes go down the world would be better for it.

Here's to rational discussion!

[Crapshoot]

The Spanish tried to play football. The Dutch tried to kick them out of it. It was a disgusting display on the Dutch behalf, and I'm confident that they lost a lot of fans with the idiocy they showed. Mark Van Bommel is a right bastard.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

you're nuts.

Nope, just willing to call a p.o.s. a p.o.s. even if there are fools who have tried to deify him.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Icy

You really don't think this deserved a red card and would have changed the game that early?

What a wuss, that Spanish player is. Totally took a dive right there. Any non-flopper woulda broken Van Bommel's leg.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I think it's the scream that really makes that clip.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I think it's the scream that really makes that clip.

Yup, I tell yeah, that guy really knew how to sell it.

[PilotMan]

In other news, Diego Forlan was a dangerous man, and deserved the award he got. He was a first class stud.

[Groundhog]

A bit of a late night last night stopped me from waking up to watch the game, but the highlights I saw were a combination of missed chances, horrible dives, and fly-kicks.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by HiFiRevival

The Spanish dove, flopped, cried, begged for cards etc. the entire freaking day. Classless little nancy boy estrogen warriors the entire game. If Iniesta went down from a touch on the shoulder like that the Dutch player should have beat him till his sorry little pansy ass couldn't get back up.

Seriously? Let me fucking go studs first into your chest and see you whine about "nancy boys" - could have any more of the "I AM MAN HERE ME ROAR" level of idiocy here?

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by HiFiRevival

Horrible. Sport is supposed to be about people applying their best effort within the rules to accomplish a great feat. At the biggest game for the world's most popular sport you had a bunch of fairies and buttweasles making a mockery of everything that real men playing real sports actually accomplish.

This WC was mediocre at best and the final was a freaking atrocity. If both of those worthless teams had their planes go down the world would be better for it.

The passengers on British European Airways Flight 609 say hi dumbass!

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I think it's the scream that really makes that clip.

I'm pretty sure I'd be yelling out in pain if I got kicked to the chest like that

SI

[illinifan999]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Seriously? Let me fucking go studs first into your chest and see you whine about "nancy boys" - could have any more of the "I AM MAN HERE ME ROAR" level of idiocy here?

One incident does not excuse the fact that after nearly every foul, a Spanish player was rolling around on the ground like he just had his leg chopped off while Xavi and Puyol went to ear-rape the ref.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I'm pretty sure I'd be yelling out in pain if I got kicked to the chest like that

You'll see worse than that at a middle school football game in August.

[ISiddiqui]

Apparently in middle GA they can't afford pads .

And to those who called it a boring final, WTF? It was messy and dirty, but boring is not what I'd call it... plenty of chances on both sides. Very tense finale.

[Mac Howard]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Apparently in middle GA they can't afford pads .

And to those who called it a boring final, WTF? It was messy and dirty, but boring is not what I'd call it... plenty of chances on both sides. Very tense finale.

I must admit that was my reaction to it, ISiddiqui. Not classic stuff by any means but I found it fascinating and never lost interest. There was a lot going on in that game even if it wasn't squeakey-clean stuff.

[Neon_Chaos]

That was a fun WC final. Tense, hard-fought, physical. Me likey.

[Icy]

I hate diving as much as you, i admit Iniesta dived in the second yellow card play but... I know it's not an excuse, but the problem is how the game is called, and there is an explanation about why they dive:

- No falling down = no foul given: for example look at Robbens play, he didn't dive so no foul was called, when I admit it should have as Puyol impeded him.

This should be changed but there is also a reason and it's the advantage rule, that says that if a foul is made but the fouled player can keep the play, then the ref should not call it and let the play end, as it could end on a goal that is a better prize than a foul. But if the ref thinks the play will continue and it ends not, then he must call the foul even later. The problem comes form applying that rule on the fly, at the speed the game is played, and with all the things happening at same time. We could enter in another debate here that is the non usage of replays or technology by the refs or not having more refs on the field etc.

- If players like Iniesta don't jump and/or dive when an opponent is comming to hit them, all the small skilled players would have to retire from pro football after 1 season. Did you see the amount of hits Iniesta took? the more skilled the player, the more hits he gets from other players who are not skilled enough to steal the ball without hitting them, and remember hitting is not allowed in soccer, so the ref should protect them more without them having to dive.

People is comparing it to football or basketball or hockey, but in all those sports is not allowed and is not usual to hit the legs when planted on the floor (you can't tackle at the knees in football if i'm not mistaken). In soccer, most of the fouls are on the legs, and a kick on your leg while planted, with the aluminum claws inside the grass, means your knee is broken and your career is over (as have happened a lot of times) so a lot of times they jump to avoid that. Also it's a natural thing to fall down when your legs are hit and you are at full sprint, even if it's an small touch.

Of course there are a lot of divers do it on purpose to fake the foul, and they should be yellow carded for doing it as the rules say (yes, there is a rule that says that but barely applied).

I hope you can understand what i wrote and don't extract from this post that i support diving, i think you are smart enough.

[whomario]

As for "getting routine decicions wrong" : One shouldn´t forget that the game is far less structured than basketball/hockey (not to talk about american football) and happens on a much bigger field. Offsides for example is ridiculously tough to get right, especially in instances where the defense moves up the field. Take a replay and pause it half a second before and half a second after the pass, there´s a chance that 1 shows the player 5 meters onside and the next 5 meters offsides.

@ Icy

- If players like Iniesta don't jump and/or dive when an opponent is comming to hit them, all the small skilled players would have to retire from pro football after 1 season. Did you see the amount of hits Iniesta took? the more skilled the player, the more hits he gets from other players who are not skilled enough to steal the ball without hitting them, and remember hitting is not allowed in soccer, so the ref should protect them more without them having to dive.

People is comparing it to football or basketball or hockey, but in all those sports is not allowed and is not usual to hit the legs when planted on the floor (you can't tackle at the knees in football if i'm not mistaken). In soccer, most of the fouls are on the legs, and a kick on your leg while planted, with the aluminum claws inside the grass, means your knee is broken and your career is over (as have happened a lot of times) so a lot of times they jump to avoid that. Also it's a natural thing to fall down when your legs are hit and you are at full sprint, even if it's an small touch.

Of course there are a lot of divers do it on purpose to fake the foul, and they should be yellow carded for doing it as the rules say (yes, there is a rule that says that but barely applied).

was thinking about stating that exact same thing.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by whomario

As for "getting routine decicions wrong" : One shouldn´t forget that the game is far less structured than basketball/hockey (not to talk about american football) and happens on a much bigger field. Offsides for example is ridiculously tough to get right, especially in instances where the defense moves up the field. Take a replay and pause it half a second before and half a second after the pass, there´s a chance that 1 shows the player 5 meters onside and the next 5 meters offsides.

My question is why doesn't FIFA put more eyes on the pitch? Are soccer fans generally accepting of so many demonstrably wrong decisions?

[whomario]

Would more eyes help, though ? I mean, most top class referees and assistant are positioned really good and those onside/offside calls imo don´t get solved by more or less eyes.

And on those i am against using cameras because of one general thing : Offside is in the game to keep attackers from just standing in or running into great scoring position and gain an advantage over the defense, in my book (and trust me, many coaches tell the same) if now the defense actively tries to put an attacker offsides i have very little sympathy for them if a close call goes against them.
You know of the risk, you are taking it (to not have to defend the situation straight-up) and sometimes you pay the price. Deal with it.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Icy

In soccer, most of the fouls are on the legs, and a kick on your leg while planted, with the aluminum claws inside the grass, means your knee is broken and your career is over (as have happened a lot of times) so a lot of times they jump to avoid that. Also it's a natural thing to fall down when your legs are hit and you are at full sprint, even if it's an small touch.

Bingo. I mean small touches on the back of your legs can easily, easily trip you up. It's not a flop if someone falls as a result of that.

[oykib]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Bingo. I mean small touches on the back of your legs can easily, easily trip you up. It's not a flop if someone falls as a result of that.

Absolutely true. But I think it would be easy to go back to video of games and punish real divers. There's no way the officials can really stay on top of it. They are really hanging them out to dry by not helping them out afterward.

The Scottish Premier League, I think, tried to put a rule like that in a year or so ago. But FIFA, or maybe UEFA, put a stop to it. I don't see how that even fits in with most of the arguments about video (i.e. it would disrupt the flow of the game).

That seems to me the only way to keep diving under control. I thin most fans want more open play and less dubious free kicks. It's easy to pick out too. Every time a player goes down faking an injury to a part that has had no contact, he's treated as though he's committed the unsporting act he's just pulled. Then you just have yellow and red accumulation applied as per the competitions rules as far as suspensions.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

Also - i never though the Dutch players were complaining about the goal offside... i think they were just furious over the lack of corner kick on the prior play. It was clearly deflected off the wall, but Webb missed it and awarded the goal kick.

Very true.

Next point of discussion would be Iniesta for not getting sent off. But then you get back to my earlier comment, somehow we managed to end the game with as many as 10 men on the field, instead of the 8 that we deserved to have around at the end (I'll excuse Heitinga for his two soft offenses, compared to the horrible ones from those mentioned above).



It was good to know our guys were willing to go all the way at any cost, but we didn't have to set a record for number yellow cards. That might be the best example of why we shouldn't have abandoned our own playing style. Four years after that game against Portugal, we did it again. And frankly, the Spanish team isn't all that dirty compared to the Portugese, it wasn't even a case of 'playing along', we actually set the tone. * sigh*

With some luck, we'll just go into the history books as 0-for-3.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SteveBollea

Middle school football is played in shorts and a t-shirt these days?

Doesn't have to be, in terms of the amount of contact.

If that's considered some sort of devastating collision (or whatever the hell people are on about), then yeah, I'd say the complaints about the Nancy nature of soccer players may deserve more attention than I usually give it. That's not usually one of my arguments against the unwatchability of soccer, but if that's considered a really big deal in terms of contact, then maybe I should include it.

But if the 12 y/o football comparison disturbs people, feel free to substitute "there's more violent contact than that in the average WNBA game". And that I suspect Sylvia Fowles is only one of several players who could make most soccer players cry like, well, a little girl.