The Trump Presidency – 2016

[RainMaker]

I'm also not sure mocking her for standing in the snow plays well in Wisconsin, Minnesota, and Michigan. People have a little pride about that.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Kodos

I think he was just saying someone who is politically similar to Hillary, but not actually Hillary. I don't think anyone wants to see that again.

I think they'll end up running someone who is similar to Hillary in terms of being a 'neutered' candidate who doesn't back any extreme positions and is likely female and has easy areas to be attacked in a manner which will allow a number of Republican voters to excuse their sexism and support of Trump because of her (cough) obvious weaknesses and unsuitability ...

My expectation is Elizabeth Warren - Trump and the Republican media will make a mountain out of a molehill with her prior claim to Native American ancestry ... while turning a blind eye to the millions of lies which Trump issues on a daily basis.

(and I agree if the electorate fall for this they deserve what they get)

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Galaril

I would be truly shocked if he does not run. I believe he would win hands down and as a savvy career politician be able to keep most of the Bernie-ites from sitting out like last time.

We are talking about the guy who couldn't even get to Super Tuesday the last two times he ran for President, right?

I'd be shocked if Biden does even decently well. The left leaners are already seeing him as 2020's Hillary (in terms of policy, not ability to win the primary).

[PilotMan]

Biden should stay far, far away. He's not a solution in my book.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Biden should stay far, far away. He's not a solution in my book.

Yeah, I don't see Biden winning the nomination. I think he'd very likely jump out to an early lead and die off as people learned more about the other candidates.

[Edward64]

Woo hoo. Now let's see what Trump has to say about it.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/11/polit...ity/index.html

Congressional negotiators say they have reached an agreement in principle to avert a government shutdown at the end of this week.

The four lead bipartisan negotiators, emerging from talks Monday night, declined to get into details on how the agreement was struck or the exact parameters of a deal, but when asked whether it included barrier funding and a resolution to the detention bed issue, Senate Appropriations Chairman Richard Shelby said: "We got an agreement on all of it."

[Scoobz0202]

But a Democratic congressional aide told the Daily News that the committee has agreed to tuck away $1.375 billion for the construction of 55 miles of “bollard fencing” — “no wall,” said the aide — while reducing the number of detention beds at the disposal of the Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency by 17.4%, from 49,057 to 40,520.

Republicans and Democrats reach deal without wall cash to avert shutdown, putting all pressure on President Trump - NY Daily News


https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status...49680487485440


Trump won't sign it even if it has both Republican and Democrat support.

[stevew]

I got Biden as 1a and Booker as 1b on my list. I know Biden is a zillion years old and has been wrong about a bunch of shit. But I don’t question his loyalty to the US. I don’t feel he’s compromised. I would hope he’d run with a very competent VP choice and the promise to step aside should his mental/physical abilities begin to erode.

I dig on Booker as well. I probably align more with Warren but that Indian shit is too much to overcome.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Scoobz0202

Republicans and Democrats reach deal without wall cash to avert shutdown, putting all pressure on President Trump - NY Daily News


Igor Bobic on Twitter: "More info on barrier, per a congressional source:

• Prohibitions on use of concrete wall or other Trump Wall prototypes. Only “existing technologies� for border barriers can be built– the same things that were built before President Trump."


Trump won't sign it even if it has both Republican and Democrat support.

He doesn't have to. If it has support from both parties, they can override his veto...

if the Republican caucuses in the House and Senate are willing to risk President Cheeto throwing a temper tantrum.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I will add that Klobuchar may be a decent VP pick. If she can't get the staff to mount a good campaign for the top job, being a prosecutor from the Upper Midwest may be a good balance for a coastal person. Same can be said for Sherrod Brown, but I think Brown may be considered one of the favorites and might be one of the last people standing (generally are less likely to be chosen as Veep).

This sounds like a great prediction.

[larrymcg421]

Booker has been my #1 for a long time. I like his pragmatic moderate-to-liberal sensibility and his strong, charismatic image. However, he hasn't really gained the traction I thought he could and I don't really see a path to victory for him right now.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Scoobz0202

Republicans and Democrats reach deal without wall cash to avert shutdown, putting all pressure on President Trump - NY Daily News


Igor Bobic on Twitter: "More info on barrier, per a congressional source:

• Prohibitions on use of concrete wall or other Trump Wall prototypes. Only “existing technologies� for border barriers can be built– the same things that were built before President Trump."


Trump won't sign it even if it has both Republican and Democrat support.

They tired of winning yet?

[bronconick]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

This sounds like a great prediction.

Brown for President is fine, VP would be idiocy considering Brown is the last Democrat likely to win statewide in Ohio in the near to intermediate future.

[QuikSand]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

With so many candidates throwing their hats into the ring, will the Dem nomination process turn into a repeat of R-2016, meaning will it simply be a matter of the loudest mouth gaining the most attention?

That's a fairly likely scenario, and I think it favors Bernie Sanders. His supporters from last time are carrying around a sense of righteous indignation, which is a powerful motivator. I think he would be a weak general election candidate, but a multi-way primary layout with a variety of considerable candidates doesn't require that you carry an impressive share of the vote. Sanders could win the Iowa caucuses comfortably with 30% or so, and we know he's capable of getting that much support on paper.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Scoobz0202

Republicans and Democrats reach deal without wall cash to avert shutdown, putting all pressure on President Trump - NY Daily News


Igor Bobic on Twitter: "More info on barrier, per a congressional source:

• Prohibitions on use of concrete wall or other Trump Wall prototypes. Only “existing technologies� for border barriers can be built– the same things that were built before President Trump."


Trump won't sign it even if it has both Republican and Democrat support.

I predict he'll sign it. He's a huge coward, and without McConnell able to protect him here, he'll fold like a damp paper towel while claiming victory.

The only reason he's lasted as long as his has with anything like a "tough guy" image is because Ryan and McConnell were able to work together to keep him from having to actually govern.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

That's a fairly likely scenario, and I think it favors Bernie Sanders. His supporters from last time are carrying around a sense of righteous indignation, which is a powerful motivator. I think he would be a weak general election candidate, but a multi-way primary layout with a variety of considerable candidates doesn't require that you carry an impressive share of the vote. Sanders could win the Iowa caucuses comfortably with 30% or so, and we know he's capable of getting that much support on paper.

See what you're saying, but Bernie was able to amass that support in 2016 as the only "progressive" candidate. I'm not sure he will have the same effect when Warren, Harris and Booker, and maybe others are veering into his lane. His ground game there should definitely be an advantage.

It's a fascinating scenario though. Bernie wins Iowa and New Hampshire. Who puts up the fire wall in Nevada and South Carolina? At that point, Harris may be the best option.

[bronconick]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I predict he'll sign it. He's a huge coward, and without McConnell able to protect him here, he'll fold like a damp paper towel while claiming victory.

The only reason he's lasted as long as his has with anything like a "tough guy" image is because Ryan and McConnell were able to work together to keep him from having to actually govern.

President Hannity dislikes it, so who knows. I assume President's Coulter and Limbaugh think the same.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I predict he'll sign it. He's a huge coward, and without McConnell able to protect him here, he'll fold like a damp paper towel while claiming victory.

I'll take that bet - I predict another shutdown because Hannity etc. will demand he not cave in ... he'll run around ranting about how the Democrats are dishonest and have forced the shutdown by not caving into his demands.

It'll be interesting to see how things play out for sure - because they came to an agreement he's in a no-win situation now, if they hadn't then he might have been able to push blame onto the Democrats (at this point I think the Republicans are also thoroughly fed up with Trump tbh).

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by bronconick

Brown for President is fine, VP would be idiocy considering Brown is the last Democrat likely to win statewide in Ohio in the near to intermediate future.

I think Brown/Booker would be my choice at the moment.

But an Al Franken / Jill Stein ticket would still get my vote just for the name alone.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I predict he'll sign it. He's a huge coward, and without McConnell able to protect him here, he'll fold like a damp paper towel while claiming victory.

The only reason he's lasted as long as his has with anything like a "tough guy" image is because Ryan and McConnell were able to work together to keep him from having to actually govern.

Someone noted that he might already be laying the groundwork for caving and just insisting that he didn't. From his speech last night:

Just so you know. We are building the wall anyway... I've got to take care of my people from Texas. I don't even want to hear about it.

So, if he insists that we built the wall, then who's to say no? I see Hannity, Coulter, etc. falling in line with that.

(Of course, I've been wrong about everything Trump related ever since I was sure that making fun of John McCain's war service was going to sink him. So who knows?)

[QuikSand]

I definitely agree that Trump is already spinning his retreat on the wall. I think it will turn into the way he talks about steel mills, where he keeps saying that we are building new US steel mills, one after another, due to his great leadership. There's not even a whisper of truth to it, but it kills at the rallies, so he just sticks with it, and even expands the lie every so often to keep it fresh.

At some point, he will talk about how much of the beautiful wall has already been built, measured in miles and miles, and how he is doing a great job with it. They may test out various ways to message it, but that seems like the plan now.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Marc Vaughan

I'll take that bet - I predict another shutdown because Hannity etc. will demand he not cave in ... he'll run around ranting about how the Democrats are dishonest and have forced the shutdown by not caving into his demands.

It'll be interesting to see how things play out for sure - because they came to an agreement he's in a no-win situation now, if they hadn't then he might have been able to push blame onto the Democrats (at this point I think the Republicans are also thoroughly fed up with Trump tbh).

I do agree there is a good chance that Trump will turn down the deal. He's a confrontational type of guy. I'd put it at 50-50 right now.

[JPhillips]

Fox and Friends was selling hard that Trump won. If Hannity comes along, as I expect he will, Trump will sign. Coulter will still throw a fit, but her constituency now is Bill Mahar and some liberals on Twitter.

Some in the GOP are already openly talking about how Trump can steal money from disaster relief funds to build an actual wall rather than fencing. As long as he can build enough to get a shot of him and the wall he'll be happy.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

That's a fairly likely scenario, and I think it favors Bernie Sanders. His supporters from last time are carrying around a sense of righteous indignation, which is a powerful motivator. I think he would be a weak general election candidate, but a multi-way primary layout with a variety of considerable candidates doesn't require that you carry an impressive share of the vote. Sanders could win the Iowa caucuses comfortably with 30% or so, and we know he's capable of getting that much support on paper.

Well remember the Democratic Primary has, in addition to culling Superdelegates, culled a number of caucuses turning them into straight primaries instead. Bernie's best showing was in the caucuses. Losing them will hurt him.

So he may start out strong, but then he's got some issues. And he could lose New Hampshire this time considering he's going against Warren (who has the same policy positions as Bernie, but has actually done a few things).

Originally Posted by digamma

It's a fascinating scenario though. Bernie wins Iowa and New Hampshire. Who puts up the fire wall in Nevada and South Carolina? At that point, Harris may be the best option.

Booker will win SC, I'm sure.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

At some point, he will talk about how much of the beautiful wall has already been built, measured in miles and miles, and how he is doing a great job with it. They may test out various ways to message it, but that seems like the plan now.

Just said it.

Also just said doesn't think there will be a shutdown, but if we do it's the democrats fault.

Not sure how that is possible considering both sides have agreed to the deal.

[mauchow]

Isn't Booker pretty much in the pocketbooks of pharma and Corp, big time?

[Lathum]

Fox NEws are such cowards.

Trump presser just finishes where he basically says he is going to have to take the deal and they haven't touched it and instead are doing El Chapo and Omar.

Guess they need time to let their army of blondes find a way to spin doctor things for the mindless base so they think he won.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Fox NEws are such cowards.

Trump presser just finishes where he basically says he is going to have to take the deal and they haven't touched it and instead are doing El Chapo and Omar.

Guess they need time to let their army of blondes find a way to spin doctor things for the mindless base so they think he won.

They'll just say that Trump got a down payment for the wall in these negotiations and he'll get the rest later.

ETA: or they'll just distract and run articles like this

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/kam...hey-made-music

[digamma]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Booker will win SC, I'm sure.

I'm not. Harris is a viable contender there, as is, quite frankly, Biden. If Harris is in the top 3 in Iowa and wins Nevada, I think she'd easily be the favorite in South Carolina. Lots of ifs there, but I think that's a better path than Booker has at this way too early point in time.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by mauchow

Isn't Booker pretty much in the pocketbooks of pharma and Corp, big time?

He's a politician from New Jersey, so his base of donor support (and a lot of his constituents' employment) is going to come from the industries important to New Jersey. So he's done what is right for his donors and voters.

And that's going to hurt him in a national election where the Dem base is energized against large corporate interests.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by digamma

I'm not. Harris is a viable contender there, as is, quite frankly, Biden. If Harris is in the top 3 in Iowa and wins Nevada, I think she'd easily be the favorite in South Carolina. Lots of ifs there, but I think that's a better path than Booker has at this way too early point in time.

James Clyburn, the king of the SC Democratic Party, is very close with Booker.

I'm also predicting that Booker inherits a lot of Hillary Clinton's apparatus in the Southeast (if you recall she rolled in the Dem primaries in the South).

Booker has already hired two operatives for his SC campaign who worked for Clyburn and were in charge of Clinton's primary campaign in SC.

Cory Booker staffs up in South Carolina | Raleigh News & Observer

[digamma]

Totally understood. Just not sure I buy the outcome or that Booker is or will be as strong as Hillary going into South Carolina (if you recall she pulled out a win in Nevada just before). Lots of time to ponder this and the point is there's really nothing to be sure of at this point. Tons of fun to speculate though.

[I. J. Reilly]

I’m curious to see how much of a role new Democratic voters will play in these primaries. Most of the news coverage has centered on how energized the left wing of the party is, and the midterms showed they certainly are. I can’t help but believe there are going to be a lot of former Republicans voting in these primaries too though.
It just seems like the party is in a really weird place, they are the centrist party by default but desperately want to be seen as radical. The states with open primaries are going to be fascinating.

[kingfc22]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Fox NEws are such cowards.

Trump presser just finishes where he basically says he is going to have to take the deal and they haven't touched it and instead are doing El Chapo and Omar.

Guess they need time to let their army of blondes find a way to spin doctor things for the mindless base so they think he won.

Their lead "story" on their website is hilarious as well:

"CHRONIC MEMORY PROBLEM: Kamala Harris' claim about smoking pot while listening to Snoop, Tupac, goes up in smoke" while displaying a photo of Harris in front record covers for Tupac and Snoop.

[ISiddiqui]

Apparently Trump is "extremely unhappy" with the deal, but still is optimistic that there will be no shutdown.

Oh boy.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Apparently Trump is "extremely unhappy" with the deal, but still is optimistic that there will be no shutdown.

Oh boy.

He does not like it, but he's too much of a coward to veto it. So he's putting it off and hoping that a better option will present itself. It won't, and he'll sign it.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Their lead "story" on their website is hilarious as well:

"CHRONIC MEMORY PROBLEM: Kamala Harris' claim about smoking pot while listening to Snoop, Tupac, goes up in smoke" while displaying a photo of Harris in front record covers for Tupac and Snoop.

Ok, that's pretty funny. Why make something like that up when it's so easily to verify as false??? Especially when she's already hearing whispers that she has been tool of a prison-industrial complex of sorts when she was the Cali AG. Sure, this sort of stuff is just fun giggle-worthy fodder for the right, but already some of the more hardcore/militant black voices (who are at best skeptical of her) are picking this up as more evidence that she's "not one of us." It could legit hurt her in the primaries.

[Schmidty]

Interesting news day.

[Lathum]

Fox News is currently doing a segment about Booker being a vegan. The title is Bookers beef with beef, and all the hosts are eating various types of meats and yucking it up.

This is where roughly 1/2 the country, including POTUS, gets news in 2019.

[RainMaker]

Didn't they make a big deal when Obama asked for mustard on his burger?

[bronconick]

Dijon mustard, like any dirty Frenchie.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Ok, that's pretty funny. Why make something like that up when it's so easily to verify as false??? Especially when she's already hearing whispers that she has been tool of a prison-industrial complex of sorts when she was the Cali AG. Sure, this sort of stuff is just fun giggle-worthy fodder for the right, but already some of the more hardcore/militant black voices (who are at best skeptical of her) are picking this up as more evidence that she's "not one of us." It could legit hurt her in the primaries.

I just saw the video of the interview and boy is this being reported incorrectly.

[albionmoonlight]

The national debt has just topped $22 trillion for the first time.
It's increased $2,065,536,336,473 since the day President Donald Trump took the oath of office two years ago.

— Steven Dennis (@StevenTDennis) February 12, 2019

Is there anything more predictable than conservative pundits breaking a two-year silence on caring about the debt as soon as the Democrats take a house of Congress?

Sure, he's being careful to be even-handed by noting that a lot of this was the GOP's fault. But the past is the past, man. Can't put that genie back in the bottle. What we can do going forward is make sure that the Democrats are completely hamstrung in doing anything by hanging the GOP's debt around their necks. You know, because we care about fiscal responsibility.

[Edward64]

Didn't know about this. Seems as if some sort of "wall" is going up now.

Butterfly Center Files For Restraining Order Against Trump's 'Unconstitutional' Border Wall | HuffPost

Other construction is slated to soon begin at two other wildlife refuges.

A federal judge ruled last week that the government can begin surveying land owned by a small Texas Catholic church, which would also be cut off from the rest of America on a strip of land along the river. The local diocese has said it will battle any land confiscation by the federal government as a violation of the constitutional right of free expression of religion.

The Center for Biological Diversity and other environmental advocacy groups late last year also sued the Trump administration over planned construction in the Rio Grande Valley, including at the National Butterfly Center, and other areas. The suit argued that the administration’s decision to waive environmental regulations to speed construction was an “unconstitutional” power grab. The center has estimated that 93 endangered species will be further threatened by the barriers. The case is pending.

Funding to build a massive barrier along 33 miles of the Rio Grande Valley was allocated by Congress last year. Money was pointedly not to be used to construct President Donald Trump’s wall — only for fencing or levees. The final product, however, looks suspiciously similar to an image Trump has tweeted of a version of his imagined wall.

[Atocep]

It's impossible to put a number on the lives saved by putting a wall through a butterfly sanctuary. I'm sure that was El Chapo's pipeline to the US.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

The national debt has just topped $22 trillion for the first time.
It's increased $2,065,536,336,473 since the day President Donald Trump took the oath of office two years ago.

— Steven Dennis (@StevenTDennis) February 12, 2019

Is there anything more predictable than conservative pundits breaking a two-year silence on caring about the debt as soon as the Democrats take a house of Congress?

Sure, he's being careful to be even-handed by noting that a lot of this was the GOP's fault. But the past is the past, man. Can't put that genie back in the bottle. What we can do going forward is make sure that the Democrats are completely hamstrung in doing anything by hanging the GOP's debt around their necks. You know, because we care about fiscal responsibility.

Is there more to his tweet than you're showing? It appears to.me he is laying at Trump's feet.

[ISiddiqui]

Yeah, he seems to be blaming Trump. The subsequent tweet makes that even more clear.

[Edward64]

What was he thinking ...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/13/polit...ler/index.html

Paul Manafort "intentionally" lied to special counsel Robert Mueller's office, breaking the plea agreement that made him the star cooperator in the Russia probe, a federal judge found on Wednesday.

Manafort "made multiple false statements to the FBI, the OSC and the grand jury concerning matters that were material to the investigation," including his contacts with his Russian associate during the campaign and later, Judge Amy Berman Jackson wrote on Wednesday.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Edward64

What was he thinking ...

Pardon

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Pardon

Possibly but hard to believe he would rely on Trump after he had "cooperated" to a large extent.