Werewolf XVII: Return of the Wolves

[Raiders Army]

FWIW, everyone who voted for Pass on day 1 was a villager. I was a villager at that time but became a wolf on Night 1.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Like I say, for saldana to have been a wolf would mean I would have had to have been a wolf. Do you think I would have dropped out if I'd had a 'good' role instead of vanilla villager? That's all I'm sayin'.

Maybe I would've, but bein' the bad guy is so much fun that I probably would have at least tried to stay in instead of throwing in the towel.

You aren't getting something here. I knew Saldana was a villager when you quit when I made the vote at the end. The night before RA died someone was converted, it could have only been 1 of 3 people. King, Saldana, or Pennywise. King was killed by the wolves. That leaves 2 people for possible conversion, Saldana and Pennywise. It was a 50/50 chance. Penny played it better at the end so I voted Saldana.

You had no clue if you were cursed or not when you quit. Like I said, read the thread and see what all went into my vote, it had nothing to do with you quiting or anything that Saldana did before the night of the last conversion(THERE WERE 2, 1 ON NIGHT 1, AND ONE TOWARD THE END OF THE GAME WAY AFTER YOU QUIT).

[Raiders Army]

I just wish for once I was a good guy. I think this is four consecutive games where I've been a wolf (or converted).

[dubb93]

it was obvious to everyone including me that nothing i could have said or done would have gotten dubb to vote for penny.

Actually I swung all day. At first I just wanted to get a reaction out of you. That is why I voted you. Then when I switched to Penny I was dead sure I was him, but something made me change toward the end of the day.

as far as casting the last vote for RA goes, i made my availablity for the game public knowledge several times...nothing against anyone in particular, but i am getting a little tired of players holding peoples real life schedules as reason for suspicion when the constraints are advertised...its different if you dont say when you are out of the game, but when it is public knowledge i think it is a little weak.

Call it weak, but the RA vote happened when we had a friday, saturday, sunday, monday weekend to make the vote. Penny came right out of the gate throwing a vote on RA several days early, while you waited untill after RA cast his vote and it was obvious he was the one that was dead. I know it can suck, but availability can impact these games. Read some past things, many wolves are late to the vote, hell Hoops was late to several votes this game.

Penny killed king because King he thought King was the Duke,

and as far as the end game goes, i think what i said about why king was killed was 100 percent correct (comment please pennywise).

Actually I think your chances were better with me than with King. King was one of the first to say he would have voted the same way I ended up voting. And I can say with the above quote you weren't 100% correct since Penny was the duke, not King. But I would be interested in hearing why Penny killed King instead of me.

A case could have been made for both of you, and I think I made a pretty good case for both of you on the last day. It was really a coin flip situation.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

FWIW, everyone who voted for Pass on day 1 was a villager. I was a villager at that time but became a wolf on Night 1.

I think this is an important point. The villagers were so convinced of his guilt that they managed to hang Pass without a single wolf vote. It's a good thing too, since he would have been virtually impossible to kill otherwise; I think that giving the herbalist the blessed ability should have been majorily unbalanced and it was only by dumb luck that it wasn't.

Frankly my ploy was designed to save RA for a couple of days. I don't think he was savable otherwise. If I was the last wolf standing, I was pretty worthless. I figured I had enough credibility to swing it towards dubb. People would then come after me. Guess I overestimated my abilities and underestimated dubb's ability and the wisdom of the other villagers.

This was indeed a very fun game.

[Joe]

any plans for another game?

[SnDvls]

Go Wolves!!!!

Thanks Neon great game

[Poli]

Originally Posted by dubb93

So who the hell all did Ardent view, I bet he was laughing pretty hard as I tried to make sense of his play.

Day 1: Hoopsguy....bad guy.
Day 2: SackAttack/Saldana...good guy.
Day 3: RPI...good guy.
Day 4: Blade6119....good guy/dies the same day.

I knew they were trying to pin this on me, so I tried to "out" hoops at this point w/o claiming to be the seer.

I knew Hoops was bad from the beginning, so any time he said "let's do this" I tried to quietly lead a "Let's do this instead". You'll notice from the beginning I'm trying to have hoops believe I trust him, when I certainly didn't. I wanted to know who he trusted, so maybe I could root out more wolves.

The RPI view was probably a bad idea, since hoops was suggesting him...I realized that a bit too late.

I nearly viewed barkeep both day 3 and 4, but switched both times when RPI and blade concerned me.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast

I wanted to know who he trusted, so maybe I could root out more wolves.

FWIW, I don't think any wolf would come out and say that they trust other wolves. I only "trusted" known villagers.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

FWIW, I don't think any wolf would come out and say that they trust other wolves. I only "trusted" known villagers.

I figured as much, but I figured that if hoops voted for someone, I'd vote for someone else.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast

I figured as much, but I figured that if hoops voted for someone, I'd vote for someone else.

Funny, I thought the same thing

[Mr. Wednesday]

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast

I figured as much, but I figured that if hoops voted for someone, I'd vote for someone else.

That can be dangerous too. When I'm playing as a wolf, I like to get at least one vote for a wolf in at some point so that I don't end up always on the wrong side.

[Poli]

I was really trying to piece things together overall. Hoops must have really liked it when king, dubb, and mcsweeny were all on the block. His vote "against" king had me believing king was a wolf.

[pennywisesb]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Actually I think your chances were better with me than with King. King was one of the first to say he would have voted the same way I ended up voting. And I can say with the above quote you weren't 100% correct since Penny was the duke, not King. But I would be interested in hearing why Penny killed King instead of me.

Dubb, sorry for the late explanation, but I had to travel down to LA today for a job interview and didn't get back until an hour ago. My reasoning for killing king was simple. I had been trying to throw suspicion on Saldana for awhile before that night, and you seemed to be buying it the most. I don't want to put words in king's mouth, but I'm pretty sure if I had let him live he would have voted for me during the lynch vote. I knew that if I kept you alive, I probably had better than a 50-50 chance of pulling off the win.

Also, before RA converted me, we (you and I) seemed to be agreeing on most points, and I knew that if I threw a vote out for RA right away, that might be the kicker in your final decision.

[kingfc22]

[quote=pennywisesbI don't want to put words in king's mouth, but I'm pretty sure if I had let him live he would have voted for me during the lynch vote. [/QUOTE]
Penny, I think you would have won either way. I had my mind set on saldana since he seemed to be trying too hard to align with dubb. I would have made the same play as dubb as well, voting for both of you at one point during the day.

After we got Barkeep, we had the game in the bag. Then RA had to get lucky and hit the cursed. Very fun game and thanks to NC for running it.

[Raiders Army]

Was it just me, or when the game comes down to the final three and almost everybody's dead, does it seem as if everyone wins?

[Vince]

Originally Posted by pennywisesb

...and I knew that if I threw a vote out for RA right away, that might be the kicker in your final decision.

I think that had a lot of weight behind it -- throwing an early vote on a known wolf is huge.

[hoopsguy]

In the middle of a monster mid-week migration, so this is the first I'm seeing of the end-game.

I had no idea that Ardent had viewed me that early in the game, but I have mixed feelings on the seer hanging onto the knowledge for a few days. Great when it works, brutal if he gets snuffed randomly before that. But props for keeping us in the dark on your role for those first few days.

I'm bummed that not one survivor was willing to accept that I had indeed been a victim of circumstance, but I'm not sure what other argument I could have put out that would have been remotely consistent with my actions when going toe-to-toe with Ardent. And getting both the seer/lovers/lynch victim in one day seemed like a good trade-off for us. And the final vote for Dubb was intended to cast some doubt on him, but that didn't seem to happen at all. I didn't think people would look at my vote as being that transparent, but would think that perhaps I would put the vote on a wolf in order to clear him. I was very surprised this never came up in the Barkeep/Dubb discussion one way or the other.

Ardent, you were exactly right on the three villagers up for vote being a kick for us as wolves. The first few days the votes were very tight between villagers and we were able to lay pretty low while the villagers lynched their own. Particularly the herbalist ...

As far as how we played as wolves, I can't comment on the last couple of days, but in terms of the night actions we were playing for the kill seer/lover/cursed over the sure thing with the witness. We didn't count on there being two of each, however. Our thinking was that if we mauled the seer at night then we were pretty set for the game. If we mauled the lovers at night we were in solid position as well, since we would be making a big move with numbers.

I wish Barkeep had been around to push his fake blessed play earlier in the day. I felt like Dubb really got a lot of momentum that morning and early afternoon when Barkeep wasn't around to rebut his points.

Tons of more stuff that I wanted to discuss when it was closer, but like most WW games those points fade away after you've been hung for a couple of days. But all in all I enjoyed my first time starting as a bad guy. Thanks for putting the game together, Neon.

[Neon_Chaos]

No prob guys. Now go join Barkeep's game.

I, on the other hand, have no time to actually play. Lol.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Was it just me, or when the game comes down to the final three and almost everybody's dead, does it seem as if everyone wins?

it was just you......my corpse doesnt feel like it won at all.