Werewolf XXI - Werewolf goes to Hollywood - Game Over!! Death Eaters win!!

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

We hardly knew ye, EF. That sucks you spent all of yesterday reading this thread and now you're dead. Those DEs are bastards.

Darn, that did suck

At least I had 3 plus hours of work pass quickly yesterday and I helped in some very small way. I'll be following along. I had taken a break from WW because of the many attitudes that can come out during these games, but the games are so much fun that I'll probably start playing again. By the way, I think Saldana has done a very nice job with this game. Now, I'll be quiet since dead people can't talk.

[dubb93]

As for Dubb, someone suggested that he was going back and forth on that vote for a reason, and I like that idea. I think he could be a DE who when it became clear that SnDvls was going to be the lynch victim that night, switched back to him in the last hour to make himself look like he was on the good side of things.

Whatever, I switched to Sun from WVU when it was tied to give WVU a 2 vote cushion. I couldn't have easily just stayed on WVU and you wouldn't be playing this game right now.

As for today's vote, I'm not sure where to go. I'm afraid of voting Ardent, since he has atleast tried to be helpfull. I think I'm going to go the same direction I went yesterday and go for the guy who's name has come up about every single week and continues to not do anything to help.

VOTE JESSE

[Grammaticus]

Well, one thing about Taz, is that he is playing a very quite add nothing to the discussion game. That is how he played when he was a wolf in the first game that I was in. It may not be bad to lynch Taz based on that or just the fact that he is not giving us anything to go by, therefore hurting us at this point.

Also, WVU said that he was not going to role reveal, indicating that he had a role that could help out later in the game. Now you are saying that you have no role? Which is it?

[Raiders Army]

Somehow, I get the feeling that Ardent and dubb are playing us. Maybe that was the "evil" saldana spoke of.

[Superman=#54]

Taz, Ardent, and Dubb are all strong canidates for a lynch vote today. I'm not sure where to go on this? I'll be back after classes and review some more evidence and see who will get my vote.

[Desnudo]

Vote Dubb

We should have done this one a long time ago.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Somehow, I get the feeling that Ardent and dubb are playing us. Maybe that was the "evil" saldana spoke of.

I can't speak for Ardent, but I know that I have played my normal game and tried to be as helpful as I can.

I don't know what else to say, except I'm sure I would be gone by now if you and others hadn't constantly had me on your suspect lists the entire game. If you notice just about everyone taken out in the night actions either had a big role, or their names never came up in discussion for a lynch.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

Well, one thing about Taz, is that he is playing a very quite add nothing to the discussion game. That is how he played when he was a wolf in the first game that I was in. It may not be bad to lynch Taz based on that or just the fact that he is not giving us anything to go by, therefore hurting us at this point.

Also, WVU said that he was not going to role reveal, indicating that he had a role that could help out later in the game. Now you are saying that you have no role? Which is it?

First off, I'm not WVU, so I can't speak to what he may have been thinking at the time. But at that time he said that, he had not yet revealed he had the cloak and there was movement forming to vote him out. Knowing as I do that he had the cloak and how valuable that would have been later in the game, I likely would have said something similar. As he said himself, he was NOT a Death Eater-he was/is still a villager as he put it. He kept the cloak to himself because he would have been an instant DE victim had he revealed he had it.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Whatever, I switched to Sun from WVU when it was tied to give WVU a 2 vote cushion. I couldn't have easily just stayed on WVU and you wouldn't be playing this game right now.

As for today's vote, I'm not sure where to go. I'm afraid of voting Ardent, since he has atleast tried to be helpfull. I think I'm going to go the same direction I went yesterday and go for the guy who's name has come up about every single week and continues to not do anything to help.

Actually had you not moved your vote, it would have put you in the same boat as Ardent, Raiders, and the others who voted for me that day-as potential DE's because you just could not afford to lose SnDvls. How many people cleared you in their posts after you moved your vote to SnDvls? That was a smart thing for a DE to do.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Ardent is a good player. I think a player's skill level has to come into discussion at some point. It is too early to take a chance on a good player when we have several obvious suspects at this point. That is my take on the situation at the moment.

Post 1050 btw, defending Ardent from King. Was early, just thought I'd note it for reference.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Post 1050 btw, defending Ardent from King. Was early, just thought I'd note it for reference.

Is that the post where he said AE was a good player and he wanted to wait and voted for someone else instead?

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

Is that the post where he said AE was a good player and he wanted to wait and voted for someone else instead?

Yes. King was on Ardent and Dubb shifted the attention. I don't really know what to think of Ardent. In one way, does his serious analysis of Coder indicate that he's really trying hard to help? Or is it hiding in plain sight, knowing that people will be reluctant to accuse someone who's put in so much work?

One thing, I don't think both RA and Ardent are both DEs unless they decided they would not coordinate voting at all.

[Desnudo]

I also think we need to discuss Taz and Jesse.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Grammaticus

Is that the post where he said AE was a good player and he wanted to wait and voted for someone else instead?

Yes it was, but at this point a players skill level is out the window. Obviously the players that are left aren't as good as some people made us out to be.

[Desnudo]

Who have consistently flown under the radar. At this stage in the game, that's not allowable.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Actually had you not moved your vote, it would have put you in the same boat as Ardent, Raiders, and the others who voted for me that day-as potential DE's because you just could not afford to lose SnDvls. How many people cleared you in their posts after you moved your vote to SnDvls? That was a smart thing for a DE to do.

Would it really be the best move to break a tie and condemn a DE that could hide from the eye of the seer? Had Sun lived and been scanned by Neon he is still around and is staying around to the end. I'm not dumb, and that is what it would be if I was a DE and voted Sun.

[dubb93]

Just went back and looked of the 3 really experienced players left you have Ardent, RA, and I. I know I'm clean but can't vouch for the other 2. I'm starting to wonder why we are all around with the way this game has played out.

Ardent: Early was drawing votes. They aren't killing people that are drawing votes. Later in the game was obviously pushing for the wrong guy(Coder). They wanted Coder to get lynched, so they kept Ardent around.

Dubb: Drew heat early for late switch to Qwik, later was called out by Neon as hopefully a good ally but still a potential suspect. Since that point my name has come up each and every week, including yesterday by RA.

RA: Hasn't drawn a vote since day 1(Coder). His name hasn't come up in anyone's suspect list that I recall. Why the hell is he still around? He would fit the type of player they have been going after this game. An experienced player with no heat on him.

[dubb93]

each and every week

=each and every day. I play too many text sims

[Poli]

I'm still sick. I may stay home from work today. I don't know. I know I'm not going to the gym, as I should already be there. Regardless, I don't plan on being on the computer much as I have four papers due Saturday morning for my labor and employment law class.

I'm sorry, guys. I blew it with Coder. Every one of you saw the evidence I had. I'm guessing the DEs saw it and laughed, knowing Coder was on our side.

As for my voting pattern, I'm not rehashing that. Do your homework. You'll see I had reasons for the way my early votes turned out the way they did.

With that, I'm taking a nap.

[TazFTW]

VOTE RAIDERS ARMY

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Whatever, I switched to Sun from WVU when it was tied to give WVU a 2 vote cushion. I couldn't have easily just stayed on WVU and you wouldn't be playing this game right now.

As for today's vote, I'm not sure where to go. I'm afraid of voting Ardent, since he has atleast tried to be helpfull. I think I'm going to go the same direction I went yesterday and go for the guy who's name has come up about every single week and continues to not do anything to help.

VOTE JESSE

Why Jessie, he voted for SnDvls too? And long with you and Lathum is the only one to have voted for both DEs.

[dubb93]

While I still feel Jesse is a DE from his actions I think someone has been running the show at night. Jesse hasn't thrown his ideas out there or anything of the such to actually help the villagers. Heck, even when he has been voted he has shyed away from defending himself. I feel if we can get the guy that has been helping him tonight we can greatly increase our chances of winning this thing. With that said, from what I've seen of RA, he fits the type of guy exactly that would be gone if he weren't the one running the show. He even has an awful voting record to boot.

UNVOTE JESSE

VOTE RAIDERS ARMY

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Why Jessie, he voted for SnDvls too? And long with you and Lathum is the only one to have voted for both DEs.

I unvoted it. I don't know, Jesse is just a feeling I have, and in every game I've played I've had to go with my feelings. I'm much more convinced that RA is bad based on evidence. With the way the game has played out my name has been brought up each day as the potential vote that day or the next. RA hasn't. And he has the crappy voting record to boot. If he isn't the one running the show why he is around?

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by dubb93

I unvoted it. I don't know, Jesse is just a feeling I have, and in every game I've played I've had to go with my feelings. I'm much more convinced that RA is bad based on evidence. With the way the game has played out my name has been brought up each day as the potential vote that day or the next. RA hasn't. And he has the crappy voting record to boot. If he isn't the one running the show why he is around?

I like your image of RA as Tony Montana. I picture him with a fat cigar in his mouth and a Panama suit. I do agree that at least one of the DEs would have to be somewhat talkative, meaning that it's not a Taz and Jesse combo. Why Jesse instead of Taz though? Taz has a horrific voting record.

[Desnudo]

Who's left

Known wizard

Gramm
Desnudo (to me)

Probably a wizard

Thomkal (invisible cloak)
superman (deciding vote on SnDvls)

Neutral, but known to be devious

AE
RA
Dubb

In the running for the quiet as a titmouse award

Taz
Jesse

Looking at that list, I think one from the Neutral and one from the quiet. If it's three DEs, then the situation is more challenging by an order of magnitude.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

I like your image of RA as Tony Montana. I picture him with a fat cigar in his mouth and a Panama suit. I do agree that at least one of the DEs would have to be somewhat talkative, meaning that it's not a Taz and Jesse combo. Why Jesse instead of Taz though? Taz has a horrific voting record.

I really don't know why Jesse. I mean, look back at my previous games. Last game everyone was telling me Sun was innocent and I used my 1 time night kill on him and he turned out to be a demon.

In a previous game Mr. Bug had nothing on him at all. One day I just came out, "I can't explain it, but I have a feeling Bug is mafia." And I voted him. He turned out to be mafia. Jesse is probably the first guy I've done that to this game that hasn't had any evidence against him. Like I said it is just a feeling a have.

Also Des, remember Jeeber is still in this game. I'm guessing Saldana hasn't found a replacement for him yet, but he hasn't been sacrificed yet. And strangely Jesse saw me call him out and backed out of the thread without saying a word. RA has been in here a while too. Either he's trying to think of a way to cover himself or he's just going to ignore this too.

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Who's left

Known wizard

Gramm
Desnudo (to me)

Probably a wizard

Thomkal (invisible cloak)
superman (deciding vote on SnDvls)

Neutral, but known to be devious

AE
RA
Dubb

In the running for the quiet as a titmouse award

Taz
Jesse

Looking at that list, I think one from the Neutral and one from the quiet. If it's three DEs, then the situation is more challenging by an order of magnitude.

Don't forget Jeeber, has not been replaced yet.

[Desnudo]

Damn, I forgot about Jeebs. I do believe his work schedule though, so it would be hard for him to be "the fixer."

[Desnudo]

I would class Jeebs in the quiet as a titmouse category. I'd also vote for the assisted suicide option if a replacement isn't found soon.

[Raiders Army]

Why Jesse? Because I voted for Jesse yesterday and he thought I would do so again today. Hmmmm...maybe I'm a little too close in guessing that you are pulling the strings?

Damn, this window was open forever. My boss was talking to me. One sec.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Why Jesse? Because I voted for Jesse yesterday and he thought I would do so again today. Hmmmm...maybe I'm a little too close in guessing that you are pulling the strings?

Damn, this window was open forever. My boss was talking to me. One sec.

Whatever you think. I voted Jesse yesterday too, it was my intention all along yesterday. I'm not trying to say I didn't buy Coder as a DE, I just wanted to get a reaction out of Jesse, which I didn't so I left my vote there. I think you thought Jesse was going today and your plan yesterday was to get a DE vote b/f that happened, then you switched off him early to make sure Coder was going yesterday.

I ask you again, why the hell are you still around? You've never been suspected. You've only got 1 vote, and it was on night 1. You are an experienced player. Why are you still here?

[Raiders Army]

Here is what I would look at when deciding whether I'm a DE or not:

1. I threw the first vote out there numerous times (something wolves don't do).
2. I'm somewhat vocal and not afraid to call someone out.
3. I will switch my vote so that it counts if need be (beyond the first day). I think I proved that the past four or five voting cycles. I threw out a vote to see what would happen but changed it so it would affect the outcome instead of sitting back and "playing it safe."

One vote deserves another.

VOTE DUBB

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Whatever you think. I voted Jesse yesterday too, it was my intention all along yesterday. I'm not trying to say I didn't buy Coder as a DE, I just wanted to get a reaction out of Jesse, which I didn't so I left my vote there. I think you thought Jesse was going today and your plan yesterday was to get a DE vote b/f that happened, then you switched off him early to make sure Coder was going yesterday.

I ask you again, why the hell are you still around? You've never been suspected. You've only got 1 vote, and it was on night 1. You are an experienced player. Why are you still here?

You voted Jesse after I did, and to answer your question, maybe because I'm a wizard???

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Here is what I would look at when deciding whether I'm a DE or not:

1. I threw the first vote out there numerous times (something wolves don't do).
2. I'm somewhat vocal and not afraid to call someone out.
3. I will switch my vote so that it counts if need be (beyond the first day). I think I proved that the past four or five voting cycles. I threw out a vote to see what would happen but changed it so it would affect the outcome instead of sitting back and "playing it safe."

One vote deserves another.

VOTE DUBB

1. You've been a "wolf" enough to know they throw out first votes from time to time. Heck, I don't really remember Barkeep not jumping the gun when he is a wolf. And if you are using this as a defense and calling me out, you are dead wrong, I've thrown the first vote out several times this game as well.
2. Neither am I, or anyone else left in the game at this point.
3. I've switched my vote several times. Including breaking the Sun/WVU tie throwing the vote on Sun late in the day. Yesterday there was no reason to take your vote off of Jesse, he never defended himself. How can you justify voting someone and then unvoting them with no new evidence being provided?

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

You voted Jesse after I did, and to answer your question, maybe because I'm a wizard???

There are plenty of dead wizards. And most of them experienced players with no heat on them. You fit that category. I on the other hand have had my name brought up several times each day this game. Including by you several days ago, but when you saw it was going nowhere you didn't want to put yourself in the spotlight and you dropped it. Again, why are you still here? It is b/c you are the one pulling the strings.

[Raiders Army]

1. I voted first quite a few times in this game. I'll have to look it up to be sure exactly how many.
2. Really. I can think of quite a few quiet people the whole game.
3. Look it up. I said I switched to Coder because I read what EF quoted. It was good enough for me the second time around.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

3. Look it up. I said I switched to Coder because I read what EF quoted. It was good enough for me the second time around.

Of course. You were swayed by a couple day old post that you had already read.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by dubb93

There are plenty of dead wizards. And most of them experienced players with no heat on them. You fit that category. I on the other hand have had my name brought up several times each day this game. Including by you several days ago, but when you saw it was going nowhere you didn't want to put yourself in the spotlight and you dropped it. Again, why are you still here? It is b/c you are the one pulling the strings.

If I were pulling the strings and a wolf and you were a villager, you would be dead a long time ago my friend. Like others, I consider you very dangerous. Remember you know how I think and I know how you think since we were wolves together (can't remember what game it was exactly).

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

1. I voted first quite a few times in this game. I'll have to look it up to be sure exactly how many.

I don't think "voting first" really matters at this point. Like I said, I've seen it done before, namely by Barkeep. So that defense isn't going to work.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Would it really be the best move to break a tie and condemn a DE that could hide from the eye of the seer? Had Sun lived and been scanned by Neon he is still around and is staying around to the end. I'm not dumb, and that is what it would be if I was a DE and voted Sun.

Yes it would have been the best move. There was about 45 mins left when you made your move to SnDvls and several people hadn't voted yet. And at the time I don't think we knew SnDvls could hide from the seers I think? Breaking the tie in favor of a DE at the time made you look good in the eyes of many at the time and should have made you a DE target. Same with Superman. Since you haven't it could be because you are a wizard and the DE's are hoping we vote you out at some point. Or it could be because you are a DE. I haven't made my mind up yet.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

If I were pulling the strings and a wolf and you were a villager, you would be dead a long time ago my friend. Like others, I consider you very dangerous. Remember you know how I think and I know how you think since we were wolves together (can't remember what game it was exactly).

And I could say the same thing about you.

[dubb93]

And at the time I don't think we knew SnDvls could hide from the seers I think?

No, we didn't know that. But I'm fairly confident the DE's knew he could hide from the seer. After all Sun made the ploy and it was his role, I'm sure he told his fellow DE's about his role.

That is why I've said the DE's probably took chances on that vote and did everything they could to keep Sun alive.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

I also think we need to discuss Taz and Jesse.

I completely agree with you Desnudo. Taz to just vote for someone without an explanation and leave at this point is not acceptable. You, Jesse, and even Superman need to participate more in the discussion and in the case of Taz and Jesse at least, give us reasons why we shouldn't vote for you. Because I'll move my vote to one of you and ask others to do it too if only to get you talking.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by dubb93

I don't think "voting first" really matters at this point. Like I said, I've seen it done before, namely by Barkeep. So that defense isn't going to work.

Not a defense, just an indicator. The fact that you're willing to go this far on me confirms my belief you are a DE.

I only hope that if I am lynched tonight and it's revealed that I am a wizard that you will be next tomorrow.

[dubb93]

Keep in mind Thomkal, unlike villagers and wizards the DE's and wolves of the games can talk to each other outside the game about the game.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Not a defense, just an indicator.

I don't get what you are saying? You have been the 1st to vote several times, each time starting a potential bandwagon against a wizard. And this is somehow supposed to clear you?

Saying "I was the first to vote such and such" doesn't work when your voting record is as bad as yours is.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by dubb93

And I could say the same thing about you.

Really. I really don't think so. I'm not an MVP type guy for the villagers (and hardly one for the wolves )

I still believe that the DEs are going to be people who are pretty quiet and that's the only doubt in my mind about you.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by dubb93

I don't get what you are saying? You have been the 1st to vote several times, each time starting a potential bandwagon against a wizard. And this is somehow supposed to clear you?

Saying "I was the first to vote such and such" doesn't work when your voting record is as bad as yours is.

You took one thing and blew it up. In my mind, it's an indicator, not something to clear me. How do you know I started a potentional bandwagon against a wizard? It could've been against a DE. Also, it was more to gauge reactions. I thought that when I voted for Pass yesterday that would bring him out. It obviously didn't. I thought that when I voted for Jesse, it would bring him out, like it had the other times his name has been mentioned. Instead you joined the bandwagon on a "wizard". So who looks bad now?

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Keep in mind Thomkal, unlike villagers and wizards the DE's and wolves of the games can talk to each other outside the game about the game.

Yep I've played a couple of the early Werewolf games here, so I know what they can do.

[Desnudo]

I believe there's still time to get the other if the first vote fails. I believe that either RA or Dubb should get the vote today.

My favorite result (aside from winning) would be if RA and Dubb both turned out to be wizards and we lynched them both. I think Neon's head would explode.