NFL Week 13 Thread

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Lathum

At then same cost except I could probably trade Rodgers for a nice haul b

That would be a very good idea or Foles for a good haul. Good situation for you.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Given the new report this morning that Rodgers may be out for the rest of the season, that seems like an easy decision.

Keeper league, meaning you keep the player next year. He has them both this year and is probably past the trade deadline.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Keeper league, meaning you keep the player next year. He has them both this year and is probably past the trade deadline.

Ah, gotcha.

[Atocep]

Someone please take Mel Tucker

[Thomkal]

::facepalm::: at the ending of the Eagles/Cards game

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Someone please take Mel Tucker

We'll throw Conte in along with him, too.

[Coffee Warlord]

Gould was about 2 yards short of nailing a 66 yard FG.

[bhlloy]

Weeden really is a comedy QB. Tough to hate on a guy after a 3TD, 350 yard performance but he makes more boneheaded, unnecessarily stupid plays than any QB I can remember.

[Coffee Warlord]

This Bears Vikings game is just goofy. BS horse collar penalty puts Vikings in FG range, they kick the game winner, called back on a BS 15 yard facemask.

[Atocep]

Wow vikings...

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Wow vikings...

Classic Vikings.



With the Jags winning they just couldn't pass up the opportunity to move up in the draft order.

[BillJasper]

Nice throw Alex Smith!

[Coffee Warlord]

Thanks for the favorable spot, refs.

[Atocep]

They should just rule this game a tie because neither deserves a win.

[bulletsponge]

crap, dammit Vikes your trying to tank

[Buccaneer]

I didn't see any of the game but I am willing to bet that Geno Smith spent the whole second half sulking and pouting on the sideline, completely disengaged from the game.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by bulletsponge

crap, dammit Vikes your trying to tank

Plus if Ponder is done as the starter they might win one or two more games.

[Vince, Pt. II]

The refs are throwing flags like they're going out of style in the SF/StL game. Some extremely ticky-tack calls both ways so far.

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Plus if Ponder is done as the starter they might win one or two more games.

*sigh*

With Jacksonville winning today that gave the Vikings a nice leg up as they had four tough games to finish out the season vs teams like Atlanta and Texans have more winnable games..

Oh, well. I'm just not sure who I'd want for a QB..

Boyd? Bridgewater? Johnny Football?

None seem to be able to start from the get-go..

[Honolulu_Blue]

Good job, Vikes! With the Lions able to lose to any team at any time they will need all the help they can get.

[RainMaker]

Trestman should be fired. Just not cut out to be a head coach at this level. Maybe an OC or something.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Trestman should be fired. Just not cut out to be a head coach at this level. Maybe an OC or something.

6-6 with talent that is 6-6 at best and a borderline miraculous turnaround for the offense is fireable.

Right...

[Galaril]

Wow Manning's arm strength wise looks terrible. I am now wondering if his arm is hurt or the ankles are really affecting him.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

6-6 with talent that is 6-6 at best and a borderline miraculous turnaround for the offense is fireable.

Right...

They have one of the most takented offensive units in the league. And he has turned a good defense and special teams unit into abominations.

They would be a playoff team with good coaching decisions.

[weegeebored]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Trestman should be fired. Just not cut out to be a head coach at this level. Maybe an OC or something.

Apparently you and I are the only ones who feel this way -- too many Trestman lovers. He's going to get a pass because of all the injuries but he clearly -- CLEARLY -- makes too many tactical mistakes and does no self-scouting. His playcalling is bad for an alledged offensive guru. Week after week, he should see that, when the defense is playing the run, the Bears suck running between the tackles especially right up the gut. So, what does he do? On second and third and very short he runs right up the gut for no gain. Simply put, he is overmatched.

I also wonder what the stats say his play calls are after a 1st down incomplete pass. It must be 80% run on 2nd down.

[weegeebored]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

They have one of the most takented offensive units in the league. And he has turned a good defense and special teams unit into abominations.

They would be a playoff team with good coaching decisions.

They would have two more wins for sure.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Trestman should be fired. Just not cut out to be a head coach at this level. Maybe an OC or something.

Originally Posted by RainMaker

They have one of the most takented offensive units in the league. And he has turned a good defense and special teams unit into abominations.

They would be a playoff team with good coaching decisions.

Originally Posted by weegeebored

Apparently you and I are the only ones who feel this way -- too many Trestman lovers. He's going to get a pass because of all the injuries but he clearly -- CLEARLY -- makes too many tactical mistakes and does no self-scouting. His playcalling is bad for an alledged offensive guru. Week after week, he should see that, when the defense is playing the run, the Bears suck running between the tackles especially right up the gut. So, what does he do? On second and third and very short he runs right up the gut for no gain. Simply put, he is overmatched.

I also wonder what the stats say his play calls are after a 1st down incomplete pass. It must be 80% run on 2nd down.

You two are crazy. Bears are 6th in total yardage, and 6th in points. This is while playing the past 4-5 weeks with a marginal backup at QB. Last year they were 16th in the NFL in both yardage and scoring.

As far as tactics, he may be messing some things up but Lovie still didnt grasp that part after 10 years of coaching. Perhaps, he will learn? Bill Bellichek didnt have success right away either.

They were an old stale team that needed a fresh start. Trestman has given them that. They now know they have a great offense and can focus on the defense in the offseason. Any coach would have been lucky to have this team playing 500 ball.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

They have one of the most takented offensive units in the league. And he has turned a good defense and special teams unit into abominations.

They would be a playoff team with good coaching decisions.

The defense is inexperienced in some areas and over the hill in others. It doesn't have the same talent Lovie worked with. Peppers is a shell of his former self, Briggs was having his best year before getting hurt, Melton is gone, Tilman is a shell of his former self, Urlacher gone. You can go on and on.

Mel Tucker does need though to go and I'm interested to see how Trestman handles that situation, but calling for a coach to be fired 12 games into his career when he's done at least what would have been reasonably expected of him is laughable.

The bears have been a team stuck in the late 80s to mid 90s for more than a decade. You don't think it's going to take a little bit of time to change the entire direction of a franchise?

Lovie was a terrible gameday coach with no clue how modern offenses work and was paired with a bad GM. The team lucked its way into a Super Bowl and took advantage of a bad division for a few years.

What did you expect from this season? Seriously.

[kingfc22]

Niners going with their customary FG only offense.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by Galaril

Wow Manning's arm strength wise looks terrible. I am now wondering if his arm is hurt or the ankles are really affecting him.

Well his arm is strong enough to throw 50 yards downfield but man outs towards the sidelines look like shit.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by weegeebored

They would have two more wins for sure.

I'll ask you as well, what did you expect before the season started?

What would have expected with Cutler out, Briggs out, and Melton gone for almost the entire season? Do you really think Lovie is winning any games without Cutler?

[claphamsa]

so 2 WRs go go for 250... and both lose

[Neuqua]

I'm with Atocep, I can't help but laugh at the Trestman hate. All factors considered, he's done a solid job.

[kingfc22]

Crabtree with a 60+ yard reception off of a double move. Glad to have him back.

[kingfc22]

Down 10...fake punt from inside your own 30. Whoops.

Thanks for handing the game over to the Niners Fisher.

[kingfc22]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Down 10...fake punt from inside your own 30. Whoops.

Thanks for handing the game over to the Niners Fisher.

TD to Vernon on the very next play.

[weegeebored]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

You two are crazy. Bears are 6th in total yardage, and 6th in points. This is while playing the past 4-5 weeks with a marginal backup at QB. Last year they were 16th in the NFL in both yardage and scoring.

As far as tactics, he may be messing some things up but Lovie still didnt grasp that part after 10 years of coaching. Perhaps, he will learn? Bill Bellichek didnt have success right away either.

I knew that you would chime in, so I will try my best to keep this civil. You can't look at just one side of the ball. That's like saying that Lovie was great because the defense had been so good no matter what the offense was doing. And with that 16th rated offense they went 10-6 -- in an offensive-minded league! So, tell me the difference? Offense > Defense? Trestman > Lovie? By your viewpoint, yes, but in reality...um...no. (And btw, I hated Lovie. He was smug beyond belief for someone so incompetent at the head coach level.) Lovie was a terrible gameday coach, but Trestman is equally as bad. So that means that there has been exactly zero improvement in the head coach. And I would argue that both the DC and the special teams coaching has been decidedly worse.

Originally Posted by Atocep

I'll ask you as well, what did you expect before the season started?

That point is irrelevant; making predictions or telling you what my expectations were has absolutely no bearing on the tactical errors that Trestman makes. If I thought that they would be 4-12, 8-8 or 11-5 does not matter. So while no one can know for sure, I will contend that the Bears -- without those Testman blunders and stupid playcalling-- would have two more wins. That's what matters.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I'll ask you as well, what did you expect before the season started?

What would have expected with Cutler out, Briggs out, and Melton gone for almost the entire season? Do you really think Lovie is winning any games without Cutler?

A 10-6 team that dramatically improved on the offensive end in the talent department? That is playing in a much weaker division? What should fans have expected?

I don't know why there was this belief that the Bears were shit. The offense has a ton of talent on it and the defense was coming off a solid season.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

You two are crazy. Bears are 6th in total yardage, and 6th in points. This is while playing the past 4-5 weeks with a marginal backup at QB. Last year they were 16th in the NFL in both yardage and scoring.

That's a great improvement and if Trestman was our offensive coordinator I'd be happy. But he's not, he's a head coach who is responsible for making tactical decisions during a game. Something he has been comically bad at and has cost them a game against the Lions and a game against the Vikings today. Two games which would have handed them the decision. These are decisions almost all NFL head coaches make properly.

[cuervo72]

35-21. TroyF must be PISSED.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by weegeebored

By your viewpoint, yes, but in reality...um...no. (And btw, I hated Lovie.

Ummm, No.

By my viewpoint for the last 3-4 years you have had a very stale offense that should have been better and an untalented defense that looked better than it was because of conservative game planning. I never once said nor would I say that offense is more important than defense. What I would say is to give a guy a chance to clean up the mess that was left behind before judging.

NFL players get old so changes need to be made. The defense needs to get younger. I suppose Trestman could have continued with the same method as Lovie and tried to hide this wart by calling a conservative gameplan but that wont get you closer to winning another Super Bowl.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Lovie was a terrible gameday coach with no clue how modern offenses work and was paired with a bad GM. The team lucked its way into a Super Bowl and took advantage of a bad division for a few years.

This is flat out wrong. He definitely didn't grasp modern offense, but the defense was always good and the same goes for special teams. He was almost always smart with timeouts and tactical decisions late in games.

That Super Bowl team had nothing to do with luck. They had a dominant defense and special teams. And somehow made Rex Grossman look competent. They also did it after losing their best player to a season ending injury in the middle of the year.

Remember he went 10-6 with a less talented version of this team that played in a much tougher division.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

What I would say is to give a guy a chance to clean up the mess that was left behind before judging.

The Bears mess is a horrendous defense and special teams. Two things that didn't exist last year. Trestman created that mess, he isn't cleaning it up.

Originally Posted by jbergey22

NFL players get old so changes need to be made. The defense needs to get younger. I suppose Trestman could have continued with the same method as Lovie and tried to hide this wart by calling a conservative gameplan but that wont get you closer to winning another Super Bowl.

The old guys on defense aren't the problem. They have actually played really well. It's the young guys who look like shit and have either taken huge steps backwards or look woefully unprepared to be out there in an NFL game.

[RedKingGold]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Down 10...fake punt from inside your own 30. Whoops.

Thanks for handing the game over to the Niners Fisher.

It worked for the Rams last year at Candlestick, but clearly the 49ers expected it this year.

[Danny]

KC receivers are awful

[RedKingGold]

Also, assuming the Rams do not score in the next few minutes, the 49ers will not have allowed a touchdown over the last ten quarters.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

The Bears mess is a horrendous defense and special teams. Two things that didn't exist last year. Trestman created that mess, he isn't cleaning it up.



The old guys on defense aren't the problem. They have actually played really well. It's the young guys who look like shit and have either taken huge steps backwards or look woefully unprepared to be out there in an NFL game.

Really well?

The Bears have 3 barely above 0(average) rated defenders.(courtesty of PFB Focus) and they are barely above average.

Paua
Briggs
Ozougwu

[Danny]

Go start a Marc Trestman thread

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Really well?

The Bears have 3 barely above 0(average) rated defenders.(courtesty of PFB Focus) and they are barely above average.

Paua
Briggs
Ozougwu

A lot of those guys magically looked good last year. Wonder what the difference was.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by weegeebored

That point is irrelevant; making predictions or telling you what my expectations were has absolutely no bearing on the tactical errors that Trestman makes. If I thought that they would be 4-12, 8-8 or 11-5 does not matter. So while no one can know for sure, I will contend that the Bears -- without those Testman blunders and stupid playcalling-- would have two more wins. That's what matters.

And I can also contend that without trestman the bears offense is where it's been for the past decade plus (bottom 5) and this team would be 8-8 with a game either way depending on Luck. Without Trestman and with Cutler, Briggs, Melton, and Tilman missing the time they have this team would be lucky to be 6-10.