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Old 10-09-2018, 11:13 PM   #401
BishopMVP
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Giants releasing Ereck Flowers. Thanks god. What a dreadful pick from the start. Just for fun I decided to see who was picked after him. The next selection was Todd Gurley. Ouch.
Still cracks me up that they went from "he's our starting left tackle" who sucks, to "he's our starting right tackle" who sucks, to cut within 4 games. Maybe he was being a malcontent after being benched, but I just can't imagine the guys who couldn't even get a roster spot over him are actually going to be better as a backup tackle than the guy who started 48 games up through week 2.

At least y'all have Nate Solder signed for $15.5m/y to lock down LT...
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Old 10-11-2018, 09:06 PM   #402
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Maybe a guy named Schurmer just isn’t cut out to coach football.
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Old 10-11-2018, 09:28 PM   #403
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Why can't defensive lineman remember that you're not allowed to sack the opposing QB without his consent anymore?
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Old 10-11-2018, 09:56 PM   #404
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Defense, defense, defense. New Orleans Saints Team Encyclopedia | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Look at that 7-9 stretch from 2012-2016. The Saints ranked 27th, 31st, 31st, and 32nd in defense during that stretch. And they went 7-9 each year. The one year they ranked above 27th, they went 11-5. In 2012, they set a record--teams averaged 440 yards/game against them.

It is, in my mind, what keeps Sean Payton from being among the greatest NFL coaches. For all he can coach an offense, he's always outsourced the defense, generally with bad results. (I'm fascinated to see how McVay handles it when Wade Phillips retires and he no longer has a top 3-DC to compliment his offense).

I agree with what you're saying. Brees doesn't get enough credit for making the Saints competitive despite horrendous defenses.

Should add though that when you make a boatload of money as the franchise QB, it means there is less to go around for a solid defense. It's why winning a championship with a QB on a rookie scale deal is still one of the best ways to go.
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Old 10-11-2018, 10:21 PM   #405
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Football betting is so frustrating.

Everything screamed under tonight. Both offenses sputtering, shitty weather, short week.

So of course they are on pace for 60 points.

Ans what makes it worse is I parlayed the under in this game with the under in the TCU game which has 17 total points in the 4th quarter.
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Old 10-11-2018, 11:17 PM   #406
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the Gettleman/Schurmer era is quickly becoming a disaster.
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Old 10-11-2018, 11:21 PM   #407
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I forgot how awful Buck/Aikman are.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:07 AM   #408
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I forgot how awful Buck/Aikman are.

And all it took to remind you were a couple of Tide ads.
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Old 10-12-2018, 03:15 PM   #409
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Giants are my surprise good team this year.

. . .

I would take the Giants at +650 to win the division.

Once sports gambling becomes legal and easy where I live, I will be poorer for it. I suck at figuring out what's going to happen in sporting events.
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Old 10-12-2018, 03:38 PM   #410
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What's the plan of the Giants? Ride Eli 2 more years and tank it for Tua or Fromm (or Eason maybe)? Even if they get an Oliver or lil Bosa they still won't fix much.
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Old 10-12-2018, 04:16 PM   #411
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Remember when they tried to move on from Manning last year and there was that huge backlash?

That was strange.
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Old 10-12-2018, 04:54 PM   #412
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Eli is gone after this year. No way they bring him back for a 20 million capnhit next year.

They are also going to win 4-5 games and likely don’t have the chance to draft Herbert, who I’m not sold on.

My guess is Eli is gone and they sign a guy like Bridgewater to be a stopgap.
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Old 10-12-2018, 06:16 PM   #413
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That offensive line is a disaster and it doesn't matter who you put behind center.
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Old 10-12-2018, 08:05 PM   #414
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This could ultimately work out really well for the Giants long term. This team needed a multi-year rebuild, which is the argument for taking a QB in the last draft despite how talented Saquon is. But if the Giants are going to shit the bed again this year, good. I'd much rather take a chance on the future with Herbert + Saquon than Darnold/Allen/Rosen without Saquon.
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Old 10-13-2018, 03:01 PM   #415
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Remember when they tried to move on from Manning last year and there was that huge backlash?

That was strange.
To be fair a lot of the in season backlash was because they didn't bench Eli for a prospect, they benched him to start Geno Smith, who clearly also isn't a long term answer.
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Old 10-13-2018, 04:10 PM   #416
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To be fair a lot of the in season backlash was because they didn't bench Eli for a prospect, they benched him to start Geno Smith, who clearly also isn't a long term answer.

I think a lot of the backlash also had to do with the consecutive games streak that Eli had going on. If he had missed a few games at any point in his career, fans might have been more open to seeing a different option.
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Old 10-13-2018, 06:41 PM   #417
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I think a lot of the backlash also had to do with the consecutive games streak that Eli had going on. If he had missed a few games at any point in his career, fans might have been more open to seeing a different option.

I think it may have been a combination of the two. Even with the streak if they benched him for a player that anyone could see was the potential future of the team I think the fans would have been less upset. But Geno Smith...
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Old 10-13-2018, 06:47 PM   #418
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Except no matter how good Saquon is, he’s never going to be worth the draft capital and whatever second contract they have to give him, at the position he plays. Saquon plus a QB also doesn’t address the terrible line, which could have been the pick this year (I have no idea if there are any franchise LT in this years draft but you usually get at least a couple)
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Old 10-14-2018, 04:13 PM   #419
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I wasn't very optimistic for the Bengals/Steelers game today, but it's good to know that I will be surrounded by miserable Bengal fans for another few weeks.
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Old 10-14-2018, 04:37 PM   #420
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Why? Marvin Lewis is now 2-16 against the Steelers in Cincinnati? That's a virtual sure thing. Obvious OPI notwithstanding, when you outgain a team by 200 yards you shouldn't need a last minute TD to win.

Steelers still have their issues to work out.
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Old 10-14-2018, 04:42 PM   #421
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The Bengals are the same old Bengals until proven otherwise.
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Old 10-14-2018, 04:50 PM   #422
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Old 10-14-2018, 06:21 PM   #423
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Why? Marvin Lewis is now 2-16 against the Steelers in Cincinnati? That's a virtual sure thing. Obvious OPI notwithstanding, when you outgain a team by 200 yards you shouldn't need a last minute TD to win.

Steelers still have their issues to work out.

Oh. No doubt. This team is not one I enjoy. Same problems as last year. No real solutions. I have minimal faith in any success except making the playoffs.
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Old 10-14-2018, 07:35 PM   #424
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Saw most of the Bears/Dolphins OT. Bears loss is squarely on the coach. Dolphins fumble at the goal line, Bears take it 40 yards with no problem, then decide to run it up the middle from the 40 to set up the routine 53 yard FG to win. I mean, WTF? They ran the ball to set up the kick like they were in the red zone. They deserved to lose that game.
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Old 10-14-2018, 08:01 PM   #425
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Saw most of the Bears/Dolphins OT. Bears loss is squarely on the coach. Dolphins fumble at the goal line, Bears take it 40 yards with no problem, then decide to run it up the middle from the 40 to set up the routine 53 yard FG to win. I mean, WTF? They ran the ball to set up the kick like they were in the red zone. They deserved to lose that game.

I was so happy for Drake at the end. That scene of him just laying face down with relief was wonderful.
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Old 10-15-2018, 08:41 AM   #426
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I was so happy for Drake at the end. That scene of him just laying face down with relief was wonderful.


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Old 10-15-2018, 08:48 AM   #427
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There was 1 punt in last night's game.
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Old 10-15-2018, 02:33 PM   #428
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Patriots ban fan who threw beer on Chiefs' Tyreek Hill

Fan banned.

Case also turned over to prosecutors. Hope they charge the knucklehead with something.

Last edited by Lathum : 10-15-2018 at 02:33 PM.
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:33 PM   #429
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I think it may have been a combination of the two. Even with the streak if they benched him for a player that anyone could see was the potential future of the team I think the fans would have been less upset. But Geno Smith...

This was exactly it. Damn near every one of my friends is a Giants fan and none of them had a problem with benching Eli in a lost season. The backlash was all because of Geno.

It was completely moronic of the front office to bring in, as the backup, a guy who had already failed with the team you share a stadium with. And the hatred of Geno locally wasn't even just for the on field struggles which made the whole thing even dumber.
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:42 PM   #430
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Patriots ban fan who threw beer on Chiefs' Tyreek Hill

Fan banned.

Case also turned over to prosecutors. Hope they charge the knucklehead with something.

I saw that live and thought that Hill (and whoever ran in to calm him down - Watkins?) did a really good job of not escalating the incident.

Also, if that was in Philly it would be front page on every sport site. Glad they are taking care of it.
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Old 10-15-2018, 03:59 PM   #431
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Patriots ban fan who threw beer on Chiefs' Tyreek Hill

Fan banned.

Case also turned over to prosecutors. Hope they charge the knucklehead with something.

I wonder if anyone was ever charged in this incident?

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Old 10-15-2018, 04:34 PM   #432
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This was exactly it. Damn near every one of my friends is a Giants fan and none of them had a problem with benching Eli in a lost season. The backlash was all because of Geno.
.

Exactly.

Would have been fine if he was benched so they could see what Webb could do. Instead its Geno, and Webb is gone and Eli is backed up by a rookie from Richmond and a guy with zero experience.

The way it was all handled was dreadful.
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Old 10-15-2018, 05:42 PM   #433
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Geno was still young and was fairly decent the previous times he had played the year before. Was handled horribly but it's a defensible look.

Last edited by stevew : 10-15-2018 at 05:43 PM.
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Old 10-15-2018, 07:18 PM   #434
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Geno was still young and was fairly decent the previous times he had played the year before. Was handled horribly but it's a defensible look.

No he hadn't and no it wasn't.
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Old 10-15-2018, 07:34 PM   #435
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Geno was still young and was fairly decent the previous times he had played the year before. Was handled horribly but it's a defensible look.

Umm ... he only played in 2 games the year before. And only 1 the year before that (the broken jaw season). In both of those years AND his stint with the Giants, his QBR was lower than Eli's is in 2018, as was his completion % and his TD:INT ratio.

Sorry, but no, at no point in his entire NFL career did Geno Smith ever reach -- in a single season nor cumulative -- being as good as 2018 Eli Manning. THAT is how bad Geno Smith sucked as a QB.
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Old 10-15-2018, 07:44 PM   #436
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I'm looking back at the reaction, the articles about the tweets from old Giants players and the fans, and the rage was broader than just being about Geno Smith. That's at least how it was played nationally. That Manning deserved the opportunity to finish the season, for all he's done for the Giants. The one common rallying point though was an opportunity to vent against McAdoo, who they were obviously done with by then. Maybe more Giants fans would have been fine with it if it was Webb, but, damn, that backlash was huge and I don't think it goes from that to zero if it was Webb and not Smith.

The QB of the future is probably not on the Giants now too, so, does that mean it's Manning until the end no matter what?

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Old 10-15-2018, 07:51 PM   #437
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They don't have a viable alternative and the Giants suck far beyond just Manning, so I think they'll stick with him. Or, if they switch, it won't be to see what they have, it'll just be to throw something new out there to try to win a game/appease fans before the year ends.
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Old 10-15-2018, 08:50 PM   #438
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The Giants schedule has been one of the most brutal opening 7 game runs you will ever see. Once they get past Atlants it gets much easier. I suspect they win a few games in that stretch vs SF, Was, TB, Chi, Tenn, and they ride it out with Eli. Then Eli gets released, and they bring in Bridgewater as a stop gap.
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Old 10-15-2018, 09:07 PM   #439
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Gruden loves old QBs and the Giants need to move on from Eli.

Carr for Manning straight up this offseason :-)?
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Old 10-15-2018, 10:02 PM   #440
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CJ Beathard to the Giants?
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Old 10-15-2018, 10:19 PM   #441
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CJ Beathard to the Giants?

If I was a very casual fan seeing him play for the first time, I would think he's a top 5 pick who has been sitting and learning.
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Old 10-15-2018, 10:33 PM   #442
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If I was a very casual fan seeing him play for the first time, I would think he's a top 5 pick who has been sitting and learning.

I watched him at Iowa. The guy has a swagger to him. He is a gamer and has a real strong arm.
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Old 10-16-2018, 12:23 AM   #443
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The call on Sherman that extended the last drive was weak sauce. That kind of contact happens on nearly every play. I'm so sick of watching games get decided by officials.
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Old 10-16-2018, 05:39 AM   #444
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I missed the replay of the illegal contact, but it just seemed too convenient
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Old 10-16-2018, 09:10 AM   #445
Ksyrup
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As Rodgers was scrambling to his right and being sacked, Adams (on the left side) switched direction to back across the middle and Sherman briefly reached out and contacted him. Didn't look like it had anything to do with the play, but I never saw it frame-by-frame with where Rodgers was at the time of the penalty. In the end zone, when guys are scrambling around, you see that kind of contact on nearly every receiver and it's not called all that often. But 3rd-and-long deep in GB territory, flag just had to come out.

By letter of the law, it was a penalty, but he barely impeded him and he was still open after the penalty. What I didn't see was the synch-up between when the foul occurred and what Rodgers was doing - if he was in the process of being sacked, it's even more of a BS call and IMO, those types of flags should be waved off. But I also think it's stupid to penalize a receiving team for holding on a fair catch or punt/kick-off that's not even returned.
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Old 10-16-2018, 03:29 PM   #446
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Umm ... he only played in 2 games the year before. And only 1 the year before that (the broken jaw season). In both of those years AND his stint with the Giants, his QBR was lower than Eli's is in 2018, as was his completion % and his TD:INT ratio.

Sorry, but no, at no point in his entire NFL career did Geno Smith ever reach -- in a single season nor cumulative -- being as good as 2018 Eli Manning. THAT is how bad Geno Smith sucked as a QB.

Ok, he seemed to turn a corner in 2014 after getting benched, last 5-6 games of that season plus the smattering of other games after that he wasn’t great. But he also wasn’t hopeless. Turnovers down, I’m not arguing he was spectacular but he wasn’t super shitty Geno anymore.


Im not using advanced stats

Last edited by stevew : 10-16-2018 at 03:31 PM.
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Old 10-17-2018, 11:35 AM   #447
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By letter of the law, it was a penalty, but he barely impeded him and he was still open after the penalty. What I didn't see was the synch-up between when the foul occurred and what Rodgers was doing - if he was in the process of being sacked, it's even more of a BS call and IMO, those types of flags should be waved off. But I also think it's stupid to penalize a receiving team for holding on a fair catch or punt/kick-off that's not even returned.
As a Packer fan, we've seen "questionable calls" impact two games and directly cost us one (Minnesota). I think it was a pretty weak penalty, but so were the two defensive holding calls against GB that gave the 49ers first downs earlier in the game. I think what happens is the one official is tasked with watching the CB/WR battle and doesn't really see the rest of the play. So, whether it made an impact or not, if that official sees something - he calls it. Along with holding on a fair catch, I'd throw in holding on the opposite side of the line in a big run. A vast majority of the time, that hold has nothing to do with the gain. It would be nice if there was a "relevance" aspect to the penalty - almost like if the ball is catchable for PI.

All that said, this Packer team is extremely flawed. I don't understand how McCarthy can't figure out a capable offense with Rodgers. You look at the other elite QBs and their coaches (Mahomes-Reid, Brees-Payton, Goff-McVeigh, Brady-Belichick and even what Shanahan has done with his QBs) and all seem to have an aspect of explosiveness to their offense. Outside of the last two minutes when Rodgers is basically running everything, Rodgers looks like he is playing in quicksand. There are no schemes to get guys open and it seems like every play is "Rodgers avoid the rush for 4-5 seconds and buy time until a someone can get open". At some point, McCarthy needs to be held accountable for this. I just can't imagine an offense with Rodgers, Adams, Graham, capable 2nd/3rd WR, a solid young RB in Jones and a pretty good OL would struggle like this if Reid, McVeigh, Shanahan or Payton were the coach. There is just no creativity in this offense.
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Old 10-17-2018, 11:59 AM   #448
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Ok, he seemed to turn a corner in 2014 after getting benched, last 5-6 games of that season plus the smattering of other games after that he wasn’t great. But he also wasn’t hopeless. Turnovers down, I’m not arguing he was spectacular but he wasn’t super shitty Geno anymore.

Im not using advanced stats

I love how poor Geno Smith somehow became the super villain of the Eli Manning saga. I haven't followed him closely or anything, but I remember him being considered an OK young QB who was getting better when he got punched out that time. And now he hasn't really placed since. I didn't even realize that he was with San Diego. It'd be interesting to see what he could now for a game or two with that offense.

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Old 10-17-2018, 12:25 PM   #449
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Geno Smith sucks. He sucks because he punished RU for years being a good college QB, then he sucks because my Jets drafted him thinking he would actually be good.
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Old 10-17-2018, 12:40 PM   #450
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Originally Posted by Arles View Post
As a Packer fan, we've seen "questionable calls" impact two games and directly cost us one (Minnesota). I think it was a pretty weak penalty, but so were the two defensive holding calls against GB that gave the 49ers first downs earlier in the game. I think what happens is the one official is tasked with watching the CB/WR battle and doesn't really see the rest of the play. So, whether it made an impact or not, if that official sees something - he calls it. Along with holding on a fair catch, I'd throw in holding on the opposite side of the line in a big run. A vast majority of the time, that hold has nothing to do with the gain. It would be nice if there was a "relevance" aspect to the penalty - almost like if the ball is catchable for PI.


Putting my conspiracy hat on for a minute, it does feel like there is a massive increase in the number of penalties called that really affect the game and keep drives going late on when the game is close . I'm not sure I'd go as far as saying there's a directive out there that the NFL wants to increase dramatic late drives and hero QB narratives, but I'm not saying there's definitely not either.

With that being said, if any team deserves to not get griped at for a questionable late call it's the Packers, so meh. It all evens out eventually. I was expecting a flag to come out on Clay Matthews on that late sack, and I think everyone's head would have exploded.
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