Afghanistan - part deux (or Obama's war now)

[flere-imsaho]

Yes, I understand that. I'm just responding in anticipation to those who think this will be the death knell for the Taliban because their military commander was captured. Not quite, but for many other reasons both tactical (the moves over the weekend) and strategic (Pakistani intelligence is cooperating with U.S. intelligence), it is good news.

In other news, it should be noted that the NYT apparently found out about the operation on Thursday but agreed not to publish until given the green light by the WH (who did so when it became clear that word has spread in the region).

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

In other news, it should be noted that the NYT apparently found out about the operation on Thursday but agreed not to publish until given the green light by the WH (who did so when it became clear that word has spread in the region).

Yeah, it was good to see that the media thought better of publishing the story right away. That wasn't always the case in the past.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

These guys are living right. Holy moly.

U.S. Marine Walks Away From Shot to Helmet in Afghanistan - WSJ.com

[Dutch]

That's one hell of a way to get a story of a lifetime.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Yeah, it was good to see that the media thought better of publishing the story right away. That wasn't always the case in the past.

I think when given specific reasons on why to delay a story the media has been very accommodating to the government. When the government demands that not run a story at all or refuses to acknowledge it is when conflicts arise.

[Edward64]

Another one caught. These seem to be higher quality "leaders".

Another Taliban Leader Captured in Pakistan - Declassified Blog - Newsweek.com

Another leader of the Afghan Taliban has been captured by authorities in Pakistan working in partnership with U.S. intelligence officials. Taliban sources in the region and a counterterrorism officials in Washington have identified the detained insurgent leader as Mullah Abdul Salam, described as the Taliban movement's "shadow governor" of Afghanistan's Kunduz province.

Taliban sources told NEWSWEEK's Sami Yousafzai that Salam was grabbed by Pakistani security forces in the city of Faisalabad about a week ago—close to the same time that Pakistani forces, again with American support, captured the Afghan Taliban's No. 2 leader, Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar, in Karachi

[JonInMiddleGA]

On a personal note, while we await my friend's return in March, I loved his Facebook status update this morning

3 Taliban + 1 Hellfire missle = 0 Taliban, It's just simple mathmatics!!!!

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

On a personal note, while we await my friend's return in March, I loved his Facebook status update this morning

3 Taliban + 1 Hellfire missle = 0 Taliban, It's just simple mathmatics!!!!

I have no clue if this was related, but I saw something similar on NBC Nightly News last night. They called for two 500 lb. bombs to be dropped and you see this huge explosion. Despite that, they still were getting some sporatic sniper fire. So a guy puts a rocket on his shoulder and BOOM........no more sniper fire.

[molson]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

On a personal note, while we await my friend's return in March, I loved his Facebook status update this morning

3 Taliban + 1 Hellfire missle = 0 Taliban, It's just simple mathmatics!!!!

He should aim for more next time - those hellfire missiles can be expensive.

[Flasch186]

in the meantime they lit up a convoy of civilians and while I know that there are unintended casualties of getting the job done it doesnt change the suck. Karzai came out and lambasted NATO again for it but he needs to know his role at this point that he's lucky to have a job. Im happy that were finally getting the job done right, I hope we dont pull the plug too soon, and then we can frickin' come home already.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

in the meantime they lit up a convoy of civilians and while I know that there are unintended casualties of getting the job done it doesnt change the suck. Karzai came out and lambasted NATO again for it but he needs to know his role at this point that he's lucky to have a job. Im happy that were finally getting the job done right, I hope we dont pull the plug too soon, and then we can frickin' come home already.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

in the meantime they lit up a convoy of civilians and while I know that there are unintended casualties of getting the job done it doesnt change the suck.

War. War never changes.

Marines in Afghan Assault Grapple With Civilian Deaths - NYTimes.com
To the Marines of Company K, and an embedded reporter accompanying them, one thing seemed clear: the company had not ordered a rocket strike on that house. At the time they were taking fire from many houses in the area.

“The original target of the two rockets was a compound where insurgents were delivering accurate, direct fire on an Afghan-ISAF joint team,” according to a Sunday news release by the NATO-led force, the International Security Assistance Force.

That team was Company K, with an Afghan Army unit attached to it. “The compound that was hit was not the one we were targeting,” the company commander said that day.

After the Marines saw children stream out of the ruined house, the company commander immediately ordered a cease-fire. With Taliban snipers still trying to pick them off, his men raced across the flat, open expanse between their positions and the house, where medics rendered what first aid they could.

They initially counted 11 dead, because one woman was still alive. Marine Corps medics worked to stabilize her condition, although she had lost three limbs. A helicopter came in to evacuate the wounded, but took so much Taliban ground fire that it had to lift off again before the wounded could be loaded on board. The woman died, making the death toll 12. ... In the mud-brick charnel house where the Afghans were killed, Hajji Karim, the local elder, took up Colonel Christmas’s offer of assistance on Tuesday.

The victims had already been dead for more than two days. Muslims believe in prompt burial, but the family had no way to carry the bodies through the battlefield to the provincial capital of Lashkar Gah, 17 miles away. Would the Americans take them?

Within hours, a Marine Corps Osprey, a transport aircraft that can take off and land like a helicopter, put down nearby, taking enemy fire as it came in, and the Marines grimly loaded the bodies aboard for the trip to the cemetery.

[flere-imsaho]

NPR's Morning Edition had an excellent report this morning from a reporter embedded with India company. I'll try to link it when they put up the transcript tomorrow.

Anyway, one part of the report kind of underlined how hard this is for NATO forces. They had a company of Marines that was pinned down by Taliban snipers who were sheltering in houses and the Marines were witholding fire for over an hour while figuring out whether or not civilians were in the houses. Eventually they determined that no, there probably weren't any civilians in the houses and called in helicopter gunships.

Well yep, there were civilians in the houses.

Given that the Taliban will gladly sacrifice innocent civilians (including children), it's easy to see how difficult these decisions are for our soldiers on the ground.

[flere-imsaho]

Here it is: Taliban Resistance Strong In Southern Afghanistan : NPR

Here's an excerpt:

Rules governing when Marines can fire at militants are another problem.

For example: they can't fire at a suspected Taliban fighter who has fired at them, unless they see him with a weapon. Also off limits are militants who lay down their weapons.

The goal is to protect civilians as much as possible given how quickly and easily militants blend in here.

But the rules have spawned a lot of confusion.

Take this radio transmission between Marines during the offensive: "If operator sees him with a weapon take the shot, break. If they lose tail on him and he reappears without a weapon they can't take the shot, right now.
Copy?"

That prompted this sarcastic exchange from several Marines listening in: "To shoot a guy that is shooting at you now, you need permission."

"Roger.

This guy shot at me and I'm hit in three places and he is still shooting at me, can I engage?"

"Not anymore, he hid behind a wall."

"Ow, he just shot me again. I'm shot four times. Do I have permission to engage?"

"He changed clothes."

"Can we get a grid on where he shot you at?"

Checking and rechecking circumstances happens even when Marines are pinned down in a gunfight.

On a recent afternoon, at least four militants firing from compounds had members of India Company in a tight spot for more than an hour in northwestern Marjah, while they tried figuring out whether any civilians were in the buildings.

One Marine was shot through the leg during the attack. Eventually, officials gave the nod for Cobra helicopter gunships to strike the compounds and free the Marines.

Despite the Marines' best efforts, it turned out there were civilians inside.
Nine were killed or wounded — many of them children.

Survivors said they'd been forced to stay in their compounds by the Taliban.

[JonInMiddleGA]

"Can we get a grid on where he shot you at?"

Yeah, he shot me in my ass you stupid &%()&)#%&()@&$_!&$ !!!

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Yeah, he shot me in my ass you stupid &%()&)#%&()@&$_!&$ !!!

If you get a chance, listen to the audio from the report. It's pretty amazing.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Just a personal update here ... got an email a few minutes ago from the wife of our family friend (heck, I dunno what to call him really, regulars know who I mean) ... he's now cooling his heels at Bagram Air Base, awaiting a flight to Manis AB sometime in the next few days, and that would be followed by the multi-leg trip home.

Not out of the woods quite yet since Bagram gets some rocket fire every few days but a vast improvement over his recent deployment so far in the boonies that he went more than a month without a shower. Thankfully (mostly for the guys in his unit) that streak was finally broken a few days ago

[JPhillips]

Good to hear. Here's hoping he makes it back safe and sound.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Good to hear. Here's hoping he makes it back safe and sound.

Thanks JP, I won't relax until I see him back in the States with my own eyes but Bagram is hella safer than where he's been.

[JPhillips]

I recently read Krakauer's book on Pat Tillman and it was an eye opening read on the terrain and operational difficulties for the average Ranger. I'm happy for every service member that makes it back with both their body and mind intact.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I recently read Krakauer's book on Pat Tillman and it was an eye opening read on the terrain and operational difficulties for the average Ranger.

On behalf of the various Ranger friends I've been privileged to know over the years, I'm obliged to point out that there's no such thing as an "average" Ranger

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

On behalf of the various Ranger friends I've been privileged to know over the years, I'm obliged to point out that there's no such thing as an "average" Ranger

Amen (Also glad to hear your friend is on his way home and safe)

JR, regarding the terrain. I hear quite a bit from a friend of mine in the Marines over there, he says it borders on hellish most of the time, especially with the rules of engagement they are forced to follow. He told me those rules directly cost him a friend.

[flere-imsaho]

Glad to hear he's on his way home, Jon.

Saw this in today's NYT: The Shrine Down the Hall - Bedrooms of America's Young War Dead - Slide Show - NYTimes.com

[JonInMiddleGA]

Not much of an update but since the GOOD news has me sitting here crying with relief, I figured I'd share it anyway.

Got an email late last night from our friends wife (our former intern turned employee turned de facto family member) ... there's a chance that Dan will be on a flight landing in Georgia (the US one) tonight.

I say "a chance" because, as of 930pm Tuesday, the family coordinators had not received a manifest telling them which individuals were actually on that plane. Whenever the troops do arrive, they are tentatively scheduled to be reunited with their families on March 30th after roughly a week of demobilization processing.

Basically, he ain't home quite yet, but it's getting awfully close.

On an even more personal note, I'm virtually certain I'll say this again but I want to say it now too: I appreciate both the support that's been expressed here as well as just the opportunity to talk about it at times. It's almost hard to do here at home since we're all dealing with it in our own way, tough enough just to deal with our individual worries without adding each other's to the pile too often. Having had this outlet has helped me cope (and Lord knows coping skills aren't something I have a surplus of) and I appreciate it.

[JPhillips]

Buy him a beer and put in on FOFC's tab.

Good to hear he's almost home.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Buy him a beer and put in on FOFC's tab.

Good to hear he's almost home.

Heh, that reminds me, I ain't ever actually gotten drunk with that boy. After everybody gets done celebrating his return, I may have to correct that oversight

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Happy for you, Jon!

Just as a side note, I figure this is just as good a place to post this as anywhere else. Read a great article about Warthogs over in Afghanistan at Michael Yon's site if anyone is interested.

Warthog

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Not much of an update but since the GOOD news has me sitting here crying with relief, I figured I'd share it anyway.

That's GREAT news, Jon! I know how I felt when I heard that Ben had landed in Kuwait (prior to Germany and then the U.S.). The feeling of relief was immense.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Buy him a beer and put in on FOFC's tab.

Hell yeah. I'll paypal you money for that beer, if necessary.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Just as a side note, I figure this is just as good a place to post this as anywhere else. Read a great article about Warthogs over in Afghanistan at Michael Yon's site if anyone is interested.

Warthog

Heh
Watching Air Force missions and all the checklists is reminiscent of watching space launches. Checklist after checklist of obscure terms. Occasionally they say things normal people might recognize, like “brakes.”

Good stuff, thanks for the linkage.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Michael Yon's

Nice to see he's still reporting. Has he gotten a Pulitzer yet?

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Nice to see he's still reporting. Has he gotten a Pulitzer yet?

Nope, not yet. He was nominated in 2005-2006, but didn't received an award.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

On an even more personal note, I'm virtually certain I'll say this again but I want to say it now too: I appreciate both the support that's been expressed here as well as just the opportunity to talk about it at times. It's almost hard to do here at home since we're all dealing with it in our own way, tough enough just to deal with our individual worries without adding each other's to the pile too often. Having had this outlet has helped me cope (and Lord knows coping skills aren't something I have a surplus of) and I appreciate it.

I think one thing most everyone here can agree on is, despite politicial, religious or personal beliefs, most have been touched by this conflict in the middle east in some way. FOFC has always demonstrated strong support for the Troops and those whose lives have been impacted in one way or another, and it is good we can all put differences aside for things like this.

Happy to hear the good news Jon and thank your friend for all us.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Well, a few more days at this point shouldn't be the end of the world. Just got copied the following from Dan's wife.

The dates for my flight out of manas just got pushed back and we will be home on the 28th. Shits going crazy and our company is having a hard time believing that people have been working on our return home all year and yet they are totally incompetent.

edit to add: I believe we could probably add something to the Fallout 3 signature voiceover ...
"War ... War Never Changes ... And Neither Do Problems With Military Logistics"

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

"War ... War Never Changes ... And Neither Do Problems With Military Logistics"

"Amateurs study war. Professionals study logistics."

Or something like that.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

"Amateurs study war. Professionals study logistics."

Or something like that.

I think our amateurs may be better at their jobs on most days

Hey, I'm just happy to be able to joke about it at this point.

[Dutch]

Very cool news indeed, I'll pitch in for that beer fest.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Good news here. It now takes a Gitmo resident 4 months or less to return to the ranks of the Taliban once they are released........

Former Gitmo detainee targeting Afghan charities - The Long War Journal

[flere-imsaho]

If you read the article, you'll note that it takes a Gitmo recidivist (of which the current rate is maybe 20% - depending on how you measure) an average of 18 months to return to the Taliban.

John Brennan, who is President Obama’s chief counterterrorism adviser, confirmed in a Feb. 1 letter to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi that the recidivism rate for former Gitmo detainees had risen to 20 percent. This figure included both “confirmed” and “suspected” cases documented by the Pentagon in a regularly updated analysis of recidivism.

Brennan argued that all of the recidivists had been transferred or released during the previous administration. “I want to underscore the fact that all of these cases relate to detainees released during the previous Administration and under the prior detainee review process,” Brennan wrote. Brennan cited “significant improvements to the detainee review process” that had been made by the Obama administration.

Brennan added that the Pentagon’s updated recidivism “report indicates no confirmed or suspected recidivists among detainees transferred during this Administration, although we recognize the ongoing risk that detainees could engage in such activity.”

Abdul Hafiz’s recidivism highlights that risk. He was transferred to Afghanistan just a few months ago and has already assumed a leadership position within the Taliban’s ranks once again. By some estimates, it takes an average of one and a half years for Gitmo recidivists to rejoin the fight.

Stop making stuff up.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

If you read the article, you'll note that it takes a Gitmo recidivist (of which the current rate is maybe 20% - depending on how you measure) an average of 18 months to return to the Taliban.

Stop making stuff up.

That obviously wasn't the case with this guy. Sounds like they're improving the turnaround time.

Either way, I'm surprised that anyone would make the argument that it's OK because

a) it takes an average of 18 months
b) only 20% of them go back in

[miked]

I don't think anyone was making that argument, I think Flere was pointing out that you obviously didn't read the article because your hastily posted editorial was incorrect and you continue to be intellectually lazy by making another stupid comment. You either need to learn reading comprehension or get off the nut sack medicine.

[JPhillips]

Nobody is making the argument it's okay. The argument is that you're making shit up.

[gstelmack]

Looks like the Administration is getting serious about fighting the Taliban:

U.S. bases in Afghanistan say goodbye to Whoppers, DQ – Afghanistan Crossroads - CNN.com Blogs

[Greyroofoo]

How the hell can a soldier be expected fight w/o Orange Julius!!!!!!!!

[JonInMiddleGA]

I don't think I've ever seen any out of focus picture I liked better than this one




He's back on US soil as of about an hour ago, apparently they've already found a restaurant. We're due to go down to Savannah to meet them on Thursday/Friday with him likely to be finished with the demob on Saturday or Sunday.

Thanks again to all here for their prayers & support.
And I thank God for seeing so many prayers answered.

[JPhillips]

Wish him our best.

Gotta say, though, that picture looks Photoshopped.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Gotta say, though, that picture looks Photoshopped.

Nah, just a crappy picture taken under crappy light with a phone, then uploaded via FB mobile.

[flere-imsaho]

CHEER

[Edward64]

Approval for the Kandahar offensive from the tribal leaders (or so they say) and $1T worth of lithium deposits.

Karzai, McChrystal in Kandahar to sell military operation - CNN.com

Kabul, Afghanistan (CNN) -- Afghan President Hamid Karzai and Gen. Stanley McChrystal, the top U.S. military commander in Afghanistan, say they've secured backing from local leaders for an upcoming military operation in the province.

McChrystal took Karzai and some of his security chiefs to Kandahar, considered the heartland of Taliban country.

With McChrystal in the front row, Karzai delivered a full-court press to a group of about 300 tribal leaders Sunday, in a bid to get their support.

The group sat on carpets and cushions on the floor as they listened to Karzai passionately talk about increasing security and ending corruption.

He also had a stong message for the Taliban.

"First I call on the Taliban for peace. Do not kill your country men and children. Do not kill innocents," Karzai said. "Separate yourself from al Qaeda and the terrorists."

McChrystal and Karzai believe they got approval for the coming offensive, which has already been delayed once. About a month and a half ago, another military plan presented to locals by Karzai was rejected.

FOXNews.com - U.S. Discovers $1T in Afghan Mineral Deposits

A team of U.S. geologists and Pentagon officials has discovered vast mineral wealth in Afghanistan, conceivably enough to turn the scarred and impoverished country into one of the world's most lucrative mining centers, a senior military official told Fox News on Monday.

"There is stunning potential here," Gen. David H. Petraeus, commander of the United States Central Command, told the New York Times in a report published Monday. "There are a lot of ifs, of course, but I think potentially it is hugely significant."

Americans discovered nearly $1 trillion in untapped mineral deposits in Afghanistan, including iron, copper, cobalt, gold and critical industrial metals like lithium, according to the report. The Times quoted a Pentagon memo as saying Afghanistan could become the "Saudi Arabia of lithium," a key raw material in the manufacture of batteries for laptops and cell phones.

[flere-imsaho]

Guess we won't be leaving, then.

[JPhillips]

I love almost anything Bacevich has to say.

Endless war, a recipe for four-star arrogance

By Andrew J. Bacevich
Sunday, June 27, 2010; B01

Long wars are antithetical to democracy. Protracted conflict introduces toxins that inexorably corrode the values of popular government. Not least among those values is a code of military conduct that honors the principle of civilian control while keeping the officer corps free from the taint of politics. Events of the past week -- notably the Rolling Stone profile that led to Gen. Stanley A. McChrystal's dismissal -- hint at the toll that nearly a decade of continuous conflict has exacted on the U.S. armed forces. The fate of any one general qualifies as small beer: Wearing four stars does not signify indispensability. But indications that the military's professional ethic is eroding, evident in the disrespect for senior civilians expressed by McChrystal and his inner circle, should set off alarms.

Earlier generations of American leaders, military as well as civilian, instinctively understood the danger posed by long wars. "A democracy cannot fight a Seven Years War," Gen. George C. Marshall once remarked. The people who provided the lifeblood of the citizen army raised to wage World War II had plenty of determination but limited patience. They wanted victory won and normalcy restored.

The wisdom of Marshall's axiom soon became clear. In Vietnam, Lyndon B. Johnson plunged the United States into what became its Seven Years War. The citizen army that was sent to Southeast Asia fought valiantly for a time and then fell to pieces. As the conflict dragged on, Americans in large numbers turned against the war -- and also against the troops who fought it.

After Vietnam, the United States abandoned its citizen army tradition, oblivious to the consequences. In its place, it opted for what the Founders once called a "standing army" -- a force consisting of long-serving career professionals.

For a time, the creation of this so-called all-volunteer force, only tenuously linked to American society, appeared to be a master stroke. Washington got superbly trained soldiers and Republicans and Democrats took turns putting them to work. The result, once the Cold War ended, was greater willingness to intervene abroad. As Americans followed news reports of U.S. troops going into action everywhere from the Persian Gulf to the Balkans, from the Caribbean to the Horn of Africa, they found little to complain about: The costs appeared negligible. Their role was simply to cheer.

This happy arrangement now shows signs of unraveling, a victim of what the Pentagon has all too appropriately been calling its Long War.

The Long War is not America's war. It belongs exclusively to "the troops," lashed to a treadmill that finds soldiers and Marines either serving in a combat zone or preparing to deploy.

To be an American soldier today is to serve a people who find nothing amiss in the prospect of armed conflict without end. Once begun, wars continue, persisting regardless of whether they receive public support. President Obama's insistence to the contrary notwithstanding, this nation is not even remotely "at" war. In explaining his decision to change commanders without changing course in Afghanistan, the president offered this rhetorical flourish: "Americans don't flinch in the face of difficult truths." In fact, when it comes to war, the American people avert their eyes from difficult truths. Largely unaffected by events in Afghanistan and Iraq and preoccupied with problems much closer to home, they have demonstrated a fine ability to tune out war. Soldiers (and their families) are left holding the bag.

Throughout history, circumstances such as these have bred praetorianism, warriors becoming enamored with their moral superiority and impatient with the failings of those they are charged to defend. The smug disdain for high-ranking civilians casually expressed by McChrystal and his chief lieutenants -- along with the conviction that "Team America," as these officers style themselves, was bravely holding out against a sea of stupidity and corruption -- suggests that the officer corps of the United States is not immune to this affliction.

To imagine that replacing McChrystal with Gen. David H. Petraeus will fix the problem is wishful thinking. To put it mildly, Petraeus is no simple soldier. He is a highly skilled political operator, whose name appears on Republican wish lists as a potential presidential candidate in 2012. Far more significant, the views cultivated within Team America are shared elsewhere.

The day the McChrystal story broke, an active-duty soldier who has served multiple combat tours offered me his perspective on the unfolding spectacle. The dismissive attitude expressed by Team America, he wrote, "has really become a pandemic in the Army." Among his peers, a belief that "it is OK to condescend to civilian leaders" has become common, ranking officers permitting or even endorsing "a culture of contempt" for those not in uniform. Once the previously forbidden becomes acceptable, it soon becomes the norm.

"Pretty soon you have an entire organization believing that their leader is the 'Savior' and that everyone else is stupid and incompetent, or not committed to victory." In this soldier's view, things are likely to get worse before they get better. "Senior officers who condone this kind of behavior and allow this to continue and fester," he concluded, "create generation after generation of officers like themselves -- but they're generally so arrogant that they think everyone needs to be just like them anyway."

By itself, Team America poses no threat to the constitutional order. Gen. McChrystal is not Gen. MacArthur. When presenting himself at the White House on Wednesday, McChrystal arrived not as a man on horseback but as a supplicant, hat (and resignation) in hand. Still, even with his departure, it would be a mistake to consider the matter closed.

During Vietnam, the United States military cracked from the bottom up. The damage took decades to repair. In the seemingly endless wars of the post-Sept. 11 era, a military that has demonstrated remarkable durability now shows signs of coming undone at the top. The officer corps is losing its bearings.

Americans might do well to contemplate a famous warning issued by another frustrated commander from a much earlier age.

"We had been told, on leaving our native soil," wrote the centurion Marcus Flavius to a cousin back in Rome, "that we were going to defend the sacred rights conferred on us by so many of our citizens [and to aid] populations in need of our assistance and our civilization." For such a cause, he and his comrades had willingly offered to "shed our quota of blood, to sacrifice our youth and our hopes." Yet the news from the homeland was disconcerting: The capital was seemingly rife with factions, treachery and petty politics. "Make haste," Marcus Flavius continued, "and tell me that our fellow citizens understand us, support us and protect us as we ourselves are protecting the glory of the empire."

"If it should be otherwise, if we should have to leave our bleached bones on these desert sands in vain, then beware of the anger of the legions!"

Stanley McChrystal is no Marcus Flavius, lacking the Roman's eloquence, among other things. Yet in ending his military career on such an ignominious note, he has, however clumsily, issued a warning that deserves our attention.

The responsibility facing the American people is clear. They need to reclaim ownership of their army. They need to give their soldiers respite, by insisting that Washington abandon its de facto policy of perpetual war. Or, alternatively, the United States should become a nation truly "at" war, with all that implies in terms of civic obligation, fiscal policies and domestic priorities. Should the people choose neither course -- and thereby subject their troops to continuing abuse -- the damage to the army and to American democracy will be severe.