Which is more offensive/derogatory

[Dr. Sak]

I am interested in hearing some opinions on this matter. I understand this may be a touchy subject with some of the word(s) used in it so if the MODs think it should be deleted, I understand but I am going to try to keep it as PG as possible.

I was at the Pirate game on Saturday (not my idea...it was a 30th birthday party/tailgate) and one of my friends was going on about the language used at hockey games and how it needed to be cleaned up. He said how he is tired of hearing "our" fans yell (insert opposing team player's name) is a f*g, and went on a 10 minute lecture and tirade on how it is classless and offensive.

Fast forward 2 hours to the game. This same guy start yelling at one of the Indians players "F*CK YOU (Indians player), F*CK YOU!!" So I said "Hold on here, you think it is okay to yell that but yet you lectured all of us about the use of the word fag. What you are saying is worse."

Well that set him off even more, he told me that there is a HUGE difference. What he said isn't that bad but saying the word fag is a hate crime (this guy is a lawyer) and offensive. We exchanged a few more debating words back and forth but in the end agreed to disagree.

What do ya'll think? I understand that I am a bit more crude than most, so am I way off on all of this?

[Honolulu_Blue]

I agree with the other guy.

F*ck you is totally generic.

F*g is definitely more offensive.

[tyketime]

I would also agree that just on the merit of the colorful language, calling someone a f*g is much more offensive. FU is an expression (unless spoken directly to the person) whereas f*g is a specific attack/insult.

[Dr. Sak]

Understood. I guess my annoyance came from him just screaming foul language after his previous lecture on how he hated it.

[RPI-Fan]

You didn't ask whether his behavior was Ok though. It wasn't. The answer to your question, though, is clear - the first thing is more offensive.

[Greyroofoo]

We need some South Park commentary in this discussion

Language NSFW

[Landshark44]

as someone who often takes young children to phillies games....

both are unacceptable to me. there's kids everywhere. its a family environment. no one wants to hear someone screaming profanities at a player, when they are sitting with their kids, trying to enjoy a game.....

tell your friend he's an a**h***....

[lungs]

That guy sounds like a douche bag.

[Dr. Sak]

I should have put friend in quotes cause he is more of a friend of a friend but anyway...I appreciate the responses. I don't get offended easily that's why I wanted to ask ya'll what you thought. Almost half of my ethnic background is middle eastern, but I would take less offense with someone shouting a slur of that kind at me than saying FU to me. I'm not saying I am correct, but that just how I feel.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by lungs

That guy sounds like a douche bag.

You are pretty spot on. He was throwing his weight around using terms like hate crimes and backing it up with how he is a lawyer. Then he went and smoked a joint and did some shrooms.

Like I posted earlier, I will fully admit that I was in the wrong in the argument sake, but I will also admit that I just wanted a reason to pick a fight with him.

[lungs]

There are plenty of ways to heckle the opposing team without using profanity.

[lungs]

dola

Don't get me wrong, amongst friends I swear like a sailor.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by lungs

There are plenty of ways to heckle the opposing team without using profanity.

[JetsIn06]

Guy sounds like an asshole, but I have to agree that the first one is much more offensive.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

Like I posted earlier, I will fully admit that I was in the wrong in the argument sake, but I will also admit that I just wanted a reason to pick a fight with him.

I know this will be a minority view on this...but I'm not sure I agree with the whole "f*g is more offensive than FU". More offensive to who? They are both offensive to public decency and to people who are trying to watch the game with their kids.

I'm not debating the "hate crime" legality of it as I think that's a slippery slope we shouldn't even go down when it comes to language. Just pointing out that I think there is a distinction between "less politically correct" and "more/less offensive".

IMHO...f*g is less politically/socially acceptable whereas being more/less offensive is a purely subjective thing for everybody. I'm not personally offended by either word in and of themselves...but neither word should be used or encouraged due to their past uses and ability to offend a significant amount of people.

[SteveMax58]

dola, but yeah...the guy is definitely an ass.

[Honolulu_Blue]

And, yes. While I agree with the guy's premise, he definitely sounds like a douchebag.

As a lawyer myself, I believe anyone whoever throws out "I am a lawyer..." to back up an argument outside of a legal setting, is probably a douchebag.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Landshark44

as someone who often takes young children to phillies games....

both are unacceptable to me. there's kids everywhere. its a family environment. no one wants to hear someone screaming profanities at a player, when they are sitting with their kids, trying to enjoy a game.....

tell your friend he's an a**h***....

This.

Neither are ok.

SI

[Drake]

I don't find "fag" to be particularly offensive. It's not a word I use, but I don't find it offensive.

I have become aware, however, that attitudes on the defcon level of that particular word has escalated over the last ten years or so. My kids tell me that in their school setting, it's considered on par with calling someone a nigger.

All I know is that I typed "nigger", deleted it, then "n-word" like four times in the previous sentence. I didn't do that with fag, though I considered it for a second. I'd never do either of those with a good "fuck you."

YMMV

[Lathum]

F*g is definitely more offensive. That is a derogatory term for someone of a certain sexual orientation. IMO it is pretty much the same as calling someone a racial slur. It tags on an insult to the fabric of what someone is.

[MikeVic]

I like fans that think of something clever to yell. Yelling fuck you or fag or whatever is boring, and yeah not very good for the kids in the crowd.

[Lathum]

It's a Pirates game, shouldn't he have been yelling FU at the home team?

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

...I like fans that think of something clever to yell..

+1 Still my favorite one of all time, overheard at a high school basketball game:

"Ref, if he called you what you is, you were RIGHT to give him a technical!"

[lungs]

Back when I did my fair share of heckling at Brewer games (especially out in the bullpen when guys were warming up) I aimed to keep all my heckling centered around the on-field play.

I'd stand above the bullpen and heckle a reliever warming up and never hear anything from the usher also standing there while other guys would come along and say something personal to the pitcher about his mother or something and would immediately be asked to leave. Find something creative to say or don't say anything at all.

That all said, I'm getting older and heckling isn't my thing anymore.

[EagleFan]

To be honest, what does f*ck you really mean?

Does it mean the person saying it wants to perform the act? In that case didn't you just call yourself a fag and potentially a rapist?

Does it mean the person saying it wants to see that person get f*cked? In that case the person saying it has closet vouyeristic homoerotic tendencies.

[EagleFan]

To be honest, what does f*ck you really mean?

Does it mean the person saying it wants to perform the act? In that case didn't you just call yourself a fag and potentially a rapist?

Does it mean the person saying it wants to see that person get f*cked? In that case the person saying it has closet vouyeristic homoerotic tendencies.

[EagleFan]

Not sure why the double post. Posting on my phone, maybe hit the post button without realizing.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Does it mean the person saying it wants to perform the act? In that case didn't you just call yourself a fag and potentially a rapist?

Not necessarily.

NSFW

[Ben E Lou]

OK, maybe a rapist.

[headtrauma]

Originally Posted by Lathum

F*g is definitely more offensive.

Really, you can't type "fag"?

For what it's worth, if I took my 2-year-old to a sporting event, I'd much rather hear the word "fag" than "fuck"...although I'd rather my kid hear neither.

[johnnyshaka]

Never much of a heckler, myself, but I certainly do enjoy the more creative guys out there.

Regarding the actual topic, fag is definitely worse but I don't care to hear either from drunken idiots at a baseball game.

[boberot]

Originally Posted by Landshark44

as someone who often takes young children to phillies games....

both are unacceptable to me. there's kids everywhere. its a family environment. no one wants to hear someone screaming profanities at a player, when they are sitting with their kids, trying to enjoy a game.....

tell your friend he's an a**h***....

+1

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by headtrauma

Really, you can't type "fag"?

For what it's worth, if I took my 2-year-old to a sporting event, I'd much rather hear the word "fag" than "fuck"...although I'd rather my kid hear neither.

I typed it that way because that is how Sak typed it originally, as did almost every other person responding.

I would also rather my son hear fag than FU because of the acceptance level of the words. But honestly, how is fag any different than the N word or any other derogatory term for a group of people?

[headtrauma]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I typed it that way because that is how Sak typed it originally, as did almost every other person responding.

I would also rather my son hear fag than FU because of the acceptance level of the words. But honestly, how is fag any different than the N word or any other derogatory term for a group of people?

Watch the South Park clip. They make a good point about the notion that "fag" (when used among Gen-X'ers, anyway) has nothing to do with homosexuality. It's a generic insult meant to denote lameness. At least whenever I was called that as a kid, it resonated about as deeply as being called a "butthole" or "asswipe".

Calling Jim J. Bullock or Tom Cruise a "fag", however, would be a whole other kettle of fish.

[boberot]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

Then he went and smoked a joint and did some shrooms.

I'm still stuck on this. Back when I did such things, the LAST thing I would want to do is hallucinate my way through a Pirates game.

[Lathum]

IMO the point isn't how the word makes a kid feel or how generic it is, the point is that it is insulting to an entire group of people.

[JediKooter]

This mother fucking thread is fucking useless without a fucking poll.

[molson]

Originally Posted by headtrauma

Watch the South Park clip. They make a good point about the notion that "fag" (when used among Gen-X'ers, anyway) has nothing to do with homosexuality. It's a generic insult meant to denote lameness. At least whenever I was called that as a kid, it resonated about as deeply as being called a "butthole" or "asswipe".

Calling Jim J. Bullock or Tom Cruise a "fag", however, would be a whole other kettle of fish.

The intent of the person saying it is only half of the equation.

Edit: Fag isn't really a "generic" insult - it's a slur that has just broadened in application. Now, it can be used to attribute sterotypically negative qualities about homosexuals to everyone. I'm not sure that cures it of all offensiveness. Not sure that makes the word OK, it actually might make it worse.

It's like if the word nigger was used as a general insult to call a member of any race violent, poor, whatever. It's be like, "you're acting as bad as a black person!"

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by headtrauma

Watch the South Park clip. They make a good point about the notion that "fag" (when used among Gen-X'ers, anyway) has nothing to do with homosexuality. It's a generic insult meant to denote lameness. At least whenever I was called that as a kid, it resonated about as deeply as being called a "butthole" or "asswipe".

Calling Jim J. Bullock or Tom Cruise a "fag", however, would be a whole other kettle of fish.

If children had been using the elephant-in-the-room slur to mean "butthole" or "asswipe" would it then be ok to use everyday, even if people didn't mean to reflect on anyone's skin color?

edit: for that matter, are you ok with people calling others "jew" when they aren't actually reflecting on their religion, but on their stinginess?

[Autumn]

I definitely agree that fag is more offensive. Fuck you just says "I'm angry at you." Calling someone a fag both attempts to insult them personally, and at the same time insults a whole societal group. That's a lot different than just hearing a naughty word.

And I"d rather my kid heard "fuck you." I'd much rather have to discuss swear words and when to use them, and why people get angry, then discuss why people would hate a group of people because of their sexual orientation. Obviously you discuss them both at some point anyway.

[MikeVic]

Isn't fag still used as a term for cigarette in England or Australia or something?

[miked]

Originally Posted by boberot

I'm still stuck on this. Back when I did such things, the LAST thing I would want to do is hallucinate my way through a Pirates game.

Why not, it worked for Dock Ellis.

[Dodgerchick]

F*g is much MUCH more offensive. There are a lot of people that use it on here all the time and I don't agree with it but, whatever. It's used as a "joking around" kinda thing but... is it really? The other guy is wrong though, cursing where there are kids around is not ok.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

+1 Still my favorite one of all time, overheard at a high school basketball game:

"Ref, if he called you what you is, you were RIGHT to give him a technical!"

That's awesome. I might have to use it (after correcting for grammar)

(...which I realize might blunt some of its usefulness)

SI

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by JediKooter

This mother fucking thread is fucking useless without a fucking poll.

Fuck you, fag!

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

Fuck you, fag!

I am not a member of the Film Actors Guild.

[johnnyshaka]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

Isn't fag still used as a term for cigarette in England or Australia or something?

Fuck is seal in French...spelled differently, of course.

Looks like we just need to some sort of "international clause" here...a Brit bumming a smoke and a Frenchman looking for Sea World shouldn't be persecuted unjustly at a Pirates game.

EDIT: mistakenly had dolphin where seal should be

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by johnnyshaka

Fuck is dolphin in French...spelled differently, of course.

Looks like we just need to some sort of "international clause" here...a Brit bumming a smoke and a Frenchman looking for Sea World shouldn't be persecuted unjustly at a Pirates game.

+1

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by Lathum

It's a Pirates game, shouldn't he have been yelling FU at the home team?

Winner of the thread.

[DanGarion]

I'd say they are both offensive. I'm stuck as to which is worse though, according to the FCC I think Fuck You is worse than Fag. Since I don't think Fag is one of the 7 words.