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Old 07-28-2020, 12:20 PM   #1
Kodos
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Official 2020 College Football Thread

All FBS schools cleared to start season as early as August

I don't think they'll get very far into the season, but let's hope for the best.

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Old 07-28-2020, 12:28 PM   #2
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For a counter point...if you are going to attempt herd immunity...what better populace than healthy young men who are essentially quarantined anyway away from elders (excluding coaches)

The kids I know playing college football think this whole thing is a "nothing burger" and arent even concerned about getting it. Thats a direct quote btw from a D1 P5 player this weekend.
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Old 07-28-2020, 12:30 PM   #3
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I don't think herd immunity is really an option, unless we want to bury a whole bunch more people.
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Old 07-28-2020, 12:34 PM   #4
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For a counter point...if you are going to attempt herd immunity...what better populace than healthy young men who are essentially quarantined anyway away from elders (excluding coaches)

The kids I know playing college football think this whole thing is a "nothing burger" and arent even concerned about getting it. Thats a direct quote btw from a D1 P5 player this weekend.
I know HIPAA likely prevents it, but considering how many players at the major schools contracted it or were quarantined because teammates contracted it it'd be lovely to hear that 100% of them are perfectly fine and cleared 2 weeks later. Or if it's not 100% that would also be useful to know, but I think that would have been reported by now...
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Old 07-28-2020, 12:39 PM   #5
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I don't think herd immunity is really an option, unless we want to bury a whole bunch more people.

Dude, I think you are over blowing it.
It isn't affecting these kids.

My son's team has had 11 confirmed cases...the kids dont even know they have it. No fever, no cough, nothing. Just asymptomatic confirmations.

This weekend we had him, 2 of his teamates and 2 kids who play for Clemson (1 he went to HS with and that kids roomate) at our farm shooting skeet. The universal opinion was "I wish I could go ahead and get it so they wouldnt have to keep sticking my nose anymore"

Maybe they are all wrong, but I am starting to wonder whats real and whats fear at this point
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Old 07-28-2020, 12:52 PM   #6
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Young people aren't known for being great at assessing risk levels. Especially in football circles, they likely tend to think they are bulletproof.
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Old 07-28-2020, 01:01 PM   #7
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Young people aren't known for being great at assessing risk levels. Especially in football circles, they likely tend to think they are bulletproof.
I agree that there is no way to let just them be exposed and prevent community spread, there is some risk so it's not something players should be trying to get, but there are much more dangerous risks to the players short and long term health from playing tackle football than COVID.

So far I've seen one player in any sport that has had a serious enough aftereffect he was pulled from competition - Jules Heningburg Exits PLL Bubble Citing Cardiac Issue Since Recovering from COVID-19 | Inside Lacrosse - and as much as people like to say colleges/NFL teams don't care whatsoever about their player's long term health they (or at least the doctors involved) do actually care, or Justyn Ross would still be playing this fall.
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Old 07-28-2020, 01:06 PM   #8
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I actually agree that the risks to college football players are pretty low. But they are in contact with a lot of older coaches, staff, and family members who may not fare as well. I fully acknowledge that I am a risk-averse person. To me, it is not worth it to play football this fall and expose a whole bunch of people to more risk than is necessary. Obviously, what I think won't affect anyone who is making these decisions.

On a selfish side, IU appears to be positioned to have their best team since I was in college back in the nineties. I'd hate to lose that opportunity. But it's not worth people dying to me.
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Old 07-28-2020, 01:21 PM   #9
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I was mildly optimistic about Kansas this year

I mean like "3 wins" mildly optimistic, not like a bowl game

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Old 07-28-2020, 04:01 PM   #10
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For a counter point...if you are going to attempt herd immunity...what better populace than healthy young men who are essentially quarantined anyway away from elders (excluding coaches)

Herd Immunity Faces Big Challenges. Here’s Why

Might be behind a paywall.
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Old 07-28-2020, 04:09 PM   #11
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Fwiw I don't think what CU Tiger (or more accurately, many Clemson/Alabama/LSU/Ohio State players) are thinking is really "herd immunity" it's more "intentionally infecting themselves with the disease now" instead of waiting for a vaccine that could do the same in a safer way.
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Old 07-28-2020, 04:39 PM   #12
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To be fair I wasn't insinuating true societal herd immunity but I guess micro community herd immunity.

Football players are pretty dadgum isolated during season. Yeah I know they are student athletes and around NARPs, but during summer camp...not so much.

I'm not giving you a moral judgement or opinion, I'm telling you factually that there is the belief among college players...lets all get it now and get past it so then we cant infect others or get infected and hurt our season. Whether thats misguided, or wrong or foolish or whatever...Im not offering commentary on.

But in livestock herd immunity applies to your herd. Not the entire species.
In this case the herd is the football team bubble not the entire city/state/country.
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Old 07-28-2020, 06:00 PM   #13
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But in livestock herd immunity applies to your herd. Not the entire species.
In this case the herd is the football team bubble not the entire city/state/country.

Yeah, but your cows stay in the paddock, they don't hit the club while in town to play Florida State...
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Old 07-28-2020, 07:00 PM   #14
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As soon as the first kid dies and, statistically, there will probably be a couple - there's going to be a lot of questioning the idea of "just let them all catch it so we can get on with football"

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Old 07-28-2020, 07:35 PM   #15
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As soon as the first kid dies and, statistically, there will probably be a couple - there's going to be a lot of questioning the idea of "just let them all catch it so we can get on with football"

SI

Maybe I am a cynic, but I think we will hear the old "underlying condition" excuse from a lot of folks.
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Old 07-28-2020, 08:24 PM   #16
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And maybe I'm an optimist but I don't think a single kid will die.

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Old 07-28-2020, 08:44 PM   #17
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And maybe I'm an optimist but I don't think a single kid will die.
If it was all CFB schools I don't think I'd take that bet. If it's only P5 + bigger ones I'm more inclined to be on your side.

It's allowing all these random HS's to start football workouts that worries me so much more than high level college(/pro) sports.
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Old 07-28-2020, 09:26 PM   #18
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Almost every year a student or two dies from a previously undiagnosed heart problem. It seems pretty likely to me that that same student could be at greater risk of dying from COVID.
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Old 07-29-2020, 04:08 PM   #19
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Coming out of retirement to say that it's so John Swofford that the three teams who don't have to play Clemson in the modified ACC schedule are UNC, Duke and NC State.

Back to the cloak (follow me on twitter to see what I'm spending most of my time doing). Later all. Stay healthy.
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Old 07-29-2020, 05:02 PM   #20
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And maybe I'm an optimist but I don't think a single kid will die.

Shouldn't the biggest concern be with the coaches, though? How many Head and Assistant coaches would fall into the "at risk" category?
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Old 07-30-2020, 03:38 PM   #21
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SEC football is playing conference only and moving back the start date to 26 September.
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Old 07-30-2020, 04:04 PM   #22
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The external review that Iowa paid hundreds of thousands of dollars for just summarized all the tweets and press conference. Said nothing new. Did send 4 separate reports on specific coaches, but who knows what those will say. But our AD said no personnel changes are expected.
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Old 07-30-2020, 06:26 PM   #23
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And maybe I'm an optimist but I don't think a single kid will die.
Chances of a CFB player dying of COVID are very low, but not nil. I'm sure none of the 244 (at least) folks aged 24 or under that have died in this country of it so far figured they were at risk either.

And while the number of deaths in that age range are very low, death isn't the only negative consequence from COVID. Research out of Germany shows a many COVID survivors with inflammation in the heart and muscle lining - not good, as that could lead to serious heart conditions down the road. Some have experienced brain and neurological conditions after recovery, with headaches, dizziness, trouble concentrating or recalling things and hallucinations among the symptoms. Those that get ill enough to be intubated can experience serious lung issues.

Again, this probably won't happen to most college-aged folks that contract COVID. But it's not nothing either.

But as others have pointed out, it's not even so much about the risk to the players themselves as it is those around them - coaches, staff, family, friends - that could be at higher risk.
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Old 07-31-2020, 07:32 AM   #24
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I'm not sure if the ACC was caught by surprise by this SEC schedule, or if they knew that was coming and this makes the SEC look like the bad guy in cancelling the SEC East - ACC rivalry games.

Either way I still don't think this season will happen.

GT better not change 2021 to at UGA or at MBS.

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Old 08-02-2020, 08:08 AM   #25
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If I am a college football player (or any college athlete actually), why am I playing this year? For who? For what?
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Old 08-02-2020, 01:33 PM   #26
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If I am a college football player (or any college athlete actually), why am I playing this year? For who? For what?
Because they love the sport they play? For players that aren't yet eligible for the draft but are a prospect, to continue to hone their craft, improve and put themselves in a better position to get drafted?

I get not wanting to play the season given the circumstances. But I think a lot of them will want to play if certain minimums of safety procedures can be met.
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Old 08-02-2020, 02:01 PM   #27
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Because they love the sport they play? For players that aren't yet eligible for the draft but are a prospect, to continue to hone their craft, improve and put themselves in a better position to get drafted?

I get not wanting to play the season given the circumstances. But I think a lot of them will want to play if certain minimums of safety procedures can be met.

That makes sense. It just seems like its a close question for guys who are making literally millions of dollars to do it. Made me wonder if it shouldnt be at all a close question for people who are doing it in exchange for a scholarship (that theyll probably get to keep either way).
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Old 08-02-2020, 02:20 PM   #28
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That makes sense. It just seems like its a close question for guys who are making literally millions of dollars to do it. Made me wonder if it shouldnt be at all a close question for people who are doing it in exchange for a scholarship (that theyll probably get to keep either way).
I think the players should be demanding that there be very stringent testing and safety procedures if games and practices happen and full medical coverage if they get ill. I don't know about other conferences, but the Pac-12 has already stated players can opt out this season without risking their scholarship, though of course I'm sure there's concern that unofficially some coaches might treat those that opt-out as not team-players and work to try to push them out.

But I'm also sure a lot of them want to play if possible. For the vast majority of them, this is it, this is the pinnacle of their sporting careers and they want to get to enjoy it.
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Old 08-02-2020, 02:30 PM   #29
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(that theyll probably get to keep either way).

Worth noting that scholarships are not 4-year deals, but rather are renewable on an annual basis.
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Old 08-02-2020, 03:18 PM   #30
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Worth noting that scholarships are not 4-year deals, but rather are renewable on an annual basis.
Not necessarily true. Power-5 conference schools revised this several years ago. There are some loopholes, but in general if you sign a letter of intent with those schools and are on scholarship in your first year at the school, you get that scholarship for four years:

https://informedathlete.com/the-facts-about-guaranteed-multi-year-ncaa-di-scholarships/
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Old 08-02-2020, 03:22 PM   #31
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Oh, and per the discussion earlier with CU Tiger:

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Old 08-02-2020, 04:09 PM   #32
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Not necessarily true. Power-5 conference schools revised this several years ago. There are some loopholes, but in general if you sign a letter of intent with those schools and are on scholarship in your first year at the school, you get that scholarship for four years:

https://informedathlete.com/the-facts-about-guaranteed-multi-year-ncaa-di-scholarships/

I stand corrected, I did not realize (consciously at least) that was formalized.

Refusal to show up to play sure as hell seems like grounds to me.
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Old 08-02-2020, 04:28 PM   #33
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I stand corrected, I did not realize (consciously at least) that was formalized.

Refusal to show up to play sure as hell seems like grounds to me.

Yeah. And if I were the kid, I don't even think I'd fight it. If the team doesn't want me there, then I'll look elsewhere. As I've come to learn in life, compatibility with your job or school matters more than most everything else.

And maybe the coach's hard line plays well and you get the reputation as the tough coach who will make men out of boys, etc. and everyone wants to send their kids to play for you.

But I could also see it backfiring. If a coach's response to a kid saying he's worried about his health is to say Good Luck in D2 and don't let the door hit your ass on the way out, I could also see that being used against him by other coaches in the years to come.

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Old 08-02-2020, 04:38 PM   #34
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Refusal to show up to play sure as hell seems like grounds to me.
Maybe in theory, but in the case of this actual pandemic, no. Especially not after multiple conferences (SEC, B1G, Pac-12) have already guaranteed players can opt out this season.
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Old 08-03-2020, 01:30 PM   #35
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Old 08-04-2020, 12:39 PM   #36
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IU had an outbreak where several players got COVID-19. One of them isn't doing so well.

Mother of IU football player tells harrowing story of her son’s battle with COVID-19 – The Daily Hoosier

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From perfectly healthy to the emergency room. From preparing for a college football season to battling breathing and heart issues.

That is the story shared in a Facebook post by Debbie Rucker, the mother of Indiana freshman offensive lineman Brady Feeney.

Feeney tested negative for COVID-19 when voluntary workouts began several weeks ago. Since then, he and several other players tested positive.

Feeney battled the virus for 14 days according to Rucker’s post, and Indiana shut down the voluntary workouts for two weeks.

Indiana restarted workouts on Friday, while Feeney continues to battle with complications.
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Old 08-04-2020, 12:46 PM   #37
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Old 08-04-2020, 05:36 PM   #38
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Old 08-04-2020, 06:05 PM   #39
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Ahh, that's where Steve Addazio ended up!
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Old 08-04-2020, 07:20 PM   #40
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The best part is, Kansas even won one of those, adding Charlie Strong’s name to a list that includes Howard Schnellenberger, Rick Neuheisel, Dan Hawkins, Bill Callahan, Ron Prince, Dan McCarney, and most recently, Steve Addazio, formerly of Boston College.

I’ll take, “Coaches who got fired (or quote-unquote “retired”) after losing to KU, Alex.”
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Old 08-04-2020, 07:21 PM   #41
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Also, this is much worse than losing to Kansas. Fire him.

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Old 08-05-2020, 07:38 AM   #42
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UCONN cancels upcoming football season.
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Old 08-05-2020, 08:01 AM   #43
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UCONN cancels upcoming football season.

The question is whether anyone outside the program will notice. One of the lowest home attendance figures in D1 in 2019, drawing barely half what their (now former) conference average was.

They'd already lost 4 games from their cobbled together 2020 Independent schedule due to decisions made by various other conferences, the prospect of an 8 game or less season couldn't have made much financial sense for them.
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Old 08-05-2020, 08:30 AM   #44
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I remember when the Ivy League cancelled their basketball tournaments people said "It's just the Ivy League"
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Old 08-05-2020, 08:38 AM   #45
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So I dont know if this should go here, the kids leaving home thread, the Covid thread or the random thoughts thread but ...in a Last Chane U sort of way its football related so Im going here.

So for anyone who is wholly unfamiliar with the math matrinations that are D2 scholarships and also not up to speed on SC state lottery college funds and how this all intersects with Covid and college football and educator incompetence let me tell you a little story that frustrates me.

D2 football operates under total different rules than D1 regarding scholarships. Of course the number of ships is lower (36 as opposed to 85 in FBS) but the biggest difference is in FBS its all or nothing. There are no partials. Where as in D2 the dollar total is equivalent to 36 full rides. So what most of the schools do I've found is they rank kids from 1-100 on team in terms of their importance or favor or whatever. Then they distribute all the school money they can. Being a private school there are universal scholarships available for certain GPAs, certain affiliations, etc etc etc. Next they apply the state money the kids get, be it grants or what in SC is known as Life or Hope (different tiers of the lottery education funds based on your gps and success)
Then they "make whole" players from the top down and see who owes what as they near the bottom.
In essence you can end up with 70-80 full ride kids this way for the cost of only 36 within the legal limits.

Well...one of the requirements of the SC education lottery money is you need to maintain a 3.0 GPA and you must complete 30 hours per year to remain eligible. Important footnote it used to be 30 hours per year for the Life and 25 for Hope but they unified this to 30 across the board a few years ago.

My son's school limits football players to 12 hours during fall semester to accommodate practice and minimize class missed for game travel. The latter is actually the primary driver - this is small time football and in fact much of the campus holds their nose that they even have such a barbaic group of unwashed heathens in their presence. But I digress. The school actually limits students to no more than 18 credit hours a semester by school policy (allegedly to force students to need a 9th semester to graduate and maximize $$$) but...again for athletes in a very small school accumulating 18 hours that align with schedule can be difficult.

Luckily there is Summer I and Summer II to add additional hours. Until there isnt because Summer I and Summer II are cancelled due to Covid..and an academic advisor is behind the times and still thinks the requirement is for 25 hours and suddenly a week before class starts you have a mass of kids with little parental guidance being forced to fill out loan docs to find $3k/year to attend college that they otherwise now dont qualify for in education money because they only have 25-29 credit hours and aren't on path.

Now before anyone thinks I'm crying the blues here, I'm not. We are financially blessed that the $3k wouldn't alter life plans, and further blessed that my son carried AP hours over and still qualifies for his SCED $$$. But I did meet with the AD yesterday (at my request) and decline a portion of his scholarship to be allocated to two teamates who were otherwise packing their bags to head home.

This stuff just pisses me off. The school has paid people to advise these kids. Yes these "kids" are old enough to take personal responsibility, but they are still kids, and many from bad backgrounds. If sports is going to break the cycle and provide an escape we need a tour guide along the route to point the way. Dammit colleges get your crap together.

Sorry rant over.
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Old 08-05-2020, 08:47 AM   #46
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So I dont know if this should go here, the kids leaving home thread, the Covid thread or the random thoughts thread but ...in a Last Chane U sort of way its football related so Im going here.

So for anyone who is wholly unfamiliar with the math matrinations that are D2 scholarships and also not up to speed on SC state lottery college funds and how this all intersects with Covid and college football and educator incompetence let me tell you a little story that frustrates me.

D2 football operates under total different rules than D1 regarding scholarships. Of course the number of ships is lower (36 as opposed to 85 in FBS) but the biggest difference is in FBS its all or nothing. There are no partials. Where as in D2 the dollar total is equivalent to 36 full rides. So what most of the schools do I've found is they rank kids from 1-100 on team in terms of their importance or favor or whatever. Then they distribute all the school money they can. Being a private school there are universal scholarships available for certain GPAs, certain affiliations, etc etc etc. Next they apply the state money the kids get, be it grants or what in SC is known as Life or Hope (different tiers of the lottery education funds based on your gps and success)
Then they "make whole" players from the top down and see who owes what as they near the bottom.
In essence you can end up with 70-80 full ride kids this way for the cost of only 36 within the legal limits.

Well...one of the requirements of the SC education lottery money is you need to maintain a 3.0 GPA and you must complete 30 hours per year to remain eligible. Important footnote it used to be 30 hours per year for the Life and 25 for Hope but they unified this to 30 across the board a few years ago.

My son's school limits football players to 12 hours during fall semester to accommodate practice and minimize class missed for game travel. The latter is actually the primary driver - this is small time football and in fact much of the campus holds their nose that they even have such a barbaic group of unwashed heathens in their presence. But I digress. The school actually limits students to no more than 18 credit hours a semester by school policy (allegedly to force students to need a 9th semester to graduate and maximize $$$) but...again for athletes in a very small school accumulating 18 hours that align with schedule can be difficult.

Luckily there is Summer I and Summer II to add additional hours. Until there isnt because Summer I and Summer II are cancelled due to Covid..and an academic advisor is behind the times and still thinks the requirement is for 25 hours and suddenly a week before class starts you have a mass of kids with little parental guidance being forced to fill out loan docs to find $3k/year to attend college that they otherwise now dont qualify for in education money because they only have 25-29 credit hours and aren't on path.

Now before anyone thinks I'm crying the blues here, I'm not. We are financially blessed that the $3k wouldn't alter life plans, and further blessed that my son carried AP hours over and still qualifies for his SCED $$$. But I did meet with the AD yesterday (at my request) and decline a portion of his scholarship to be allocated to two teamates who were otherwise packing their bags to head home.

This stuff just pisses me off. The school has paid people to advise these kids. Yes these "kids" are old enough to take personal responsibility, but they are still kids, and many from bad backgrounds. If sports is going to break the cycle and provide an escape we need a tour guide along the route to point the way. Dammit colleges get your crap together.

Sorry rant over.

Something that I think most people on this board understand, but most people in the general public don't, is what a business college sports is.

If COVID is going to limit college football, then we need to acknowledge just how devastating that is going to be for so many people.

How many businesses, etc. depend on those Saturday revenues? Jon pointed out in another thread how many youth groups, etc. fundraise by parking cars. How many women's volleyball teams exist b/c football funds them?

You are pointing out a whole other aspect of this with scholarship limits, hours requirements, etc. This shit gets complicated in a hurry.

Basically, it may not be safe to have college football this season. If it is not, then Congress and the state legislatures need to step in and ensure that the entire ecosystem around college football does not wither up and die during the year hiatus.
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Old 08-05-2020, 09:36 AM   #47
JonInMiddleGA
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This stuff just pisses me off. The school has paid people to advise these kids.

I hate the sheer stress for all involved, there's too much of that shit without people fucking things up and creating more.

It's not the first time I've heard someone get fucked over by unexpected Covid scenarios -- for example, things like just regular students getting into situations because their institutions chose to not issue grades for the semester and go to Pass/Fail instead ... which doesn't provide otherwise earned GPA improvement.

Just sooooo many clusterfucks out there.
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Old 08-05-2020, 09:53 AM   #48
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The question is whether anyone outside the program will notice. One of the lowest home attendance figures in D1 in 2019, drawing barely half what their (now former) conference average was.

They'd already lost 4 games from their cobbled together 2020 Independent schedule due to decisions made by various other conferences, the prospect of an 8 game or less season couldn't have made much financial sense for them.

BYU is down to 6 games with none scheduled in September right now.
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Old 08-05-2020, 07:43 PM   #49
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NCAA D-II and D-III fall championships canceled
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Old 08-05-2020, 08:32 PM   #50
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Arent a number of the playoff games held on campuses? If so, then why cancel those if youre (at this point, at least,) still planning to hold regular season games? What am I missing here?
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