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View Poll Results: If Trump Loses In November, What Do You Think Happens Next
Normal transition of power. He meets with Biden, stays until 1/20, comes to inauguration, etc. 5 5.56%
He doesn't fight the result, but resigns prior to the inauguration. 2 2.22%
He fights the result but gives up shortly before the inauguration (let's define "shortly" as "some time after the EC meets on 12/14") 30 33.33%
He fights the result all the way to January 20th. Has to be physically removed. 12 13.33%
He fights the result for a short time, but gives up and resigns before the inauguration 6 6.67%
He fights the result for a short time, but gives up an then we have a normal transition as per option 1. 30 33.33%
Other. (You know you gotta specify this one.) 5 5.56%
Voters: 90. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-21-2021, 12:55 PM   #3401
bronconick
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That was the plan all along.
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Old 07-21-2021, 01:23 PM   #3402
albionmoonlight
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For 8 years of Obama, the Dems tried to reach out and compromise. They negotiated against themselves and took less than they wanted in order to reach out in a real bipartisan way.

And they got called radical and socialist and partisan and overly political.

So, having learned that no matter what they do, the GOP will call them radical (and the media will dutifully repeat the line), the Dems have (it seems) decided to start doing what they think will result in the best policy outcomes.

The GOP brought this on themselves. They have somehow managed to make the Democrats--the Democrats--into semi-competent politicians.

Had they been willing to throw the Black President half of a bone now and then, they'd have the Dems as the GOP-lite party. But they couldn't even do that.
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Old 07-21-2021, 01:40 PM   #3403
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The GOP is now saying they won't support a debt limit increase.
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Old 07-21-2021, 01:45 PM   #3404
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Nobody should be supporting a debt limit increase without immediately cutting the deficit.
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Old 07-21-2021, 01:57 PM   #3405
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We should get rid of the debt limit.

If we don't want debt, we should tax more and spend less.

Requiring a post-hoc vote to raise the limit *after* we've cut taxes and increased spending does nothing to raise taxes or decrease spending. It just makes our bonds slightly more risky. Which ends up increasing the deficit by increasing the cost of borrowing.
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Old 07-21-2021, 02:00 PM   #3406
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lol. Being reported McCarthy pulled all his nominations for the committee. What a bitch.

If you're putting Gym Jordan on a panel, you aren't taking the process serious in the first place.
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Old 07-21-2021, 02:09 PM   #3407
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This is the guy that smashed the window Ashli Babbitt tried to climb through. Still insane he didn't get a felony murder charge but not surprising based on his skin color.

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Old 07-21-2021, 02:19 PM   #3408
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Pretty sure that has more to do with what they think they can reasonably secure conviction on, it's not always about skin color. But, yeah, he is a douchebag and deserves pretty much the maximum of whatever he gets charged with and should be held in contempt.
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Old 07-21-2021, 02:19 PM   #3409
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The level of privilege these people think they are entitled to is staggering. Saying the prosecutor isn't doing her job by not offering a deal. Unreal.
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Old 07-21-2021, 02:22 PM   #3410
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The level of privilege these people think they are entitled to is staggering. Saying the prosecutor isn't doing her job by not offering a deal. Unreal.

Yeah, this guy is broken and will always be a menace, he learned absolutely nothing from this.
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Old 07-21-2021, 02:49 PM   #3411
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Originally Posted by albionmoonlight View Post
For 8 years of Obama, the Dems tried to reach out and compromise. They negotiated against themselves and took less than they wanted in order to reach out in a real bipartisan way.

And they got called radical and socialist and partisan and overly political.

So, having learned that no matter what they do, the GOP will call them radical (and the media will dutifully repeat the line), the Dems have (it seems) decided to start doing what they think will result in the best policy outcomes.

The GOP brought this on themselves. They have somehow managed to make the Democrats--the Democrats--into semi-competent politicians.

Had they been willing to throw the Black President half of a bone now and then, they'd have the Dems as the GOP-lite party. But they couldn't even do that.

I think this is all spot on. No matter who the Democrats line up, whether Biden or Bernie or Marx or they will be labeled a communist, socialist, and Antifa (still not sure why being anti-fascist is seen a bad thing, but here we are). The Democrats best pathway to retaining and growing their majority and their value is to demonstrate that government can still function. Today's Republicans seem like their top priority is to break the government so that they can say that the government is dysfunctional and does not work. I think Sherrod Brown, a few months ago, said that the best way to regain the goodwill of the people is to govern well. Most of the Republicans currently in power are not interested in seeing that happen right now.
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Old 07-21-2021, 03:19 PM   #3412
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Pretty sure that has more to do with what they think they can reasonably secure conviction on, it's not always about skin color. But, yeah, he is a douchebag and deserves pretty much the maximum of whatever he gets charged with and should be held in contempt.

They use felony murder charges all the time when someone dies during a crime. Store owner shoots a robber and the getaway driver gets charged with felony murder.

This guy was literally breaking the window and helping her through it when she was killed. There is no better example of felony murder than what took place.

Like I said, felony murder is only used against certain criminals.
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Old 07-21-2021, 04:03 PM   #3413
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I think this is an interesting article on that subject.

Felony Murder and the Storming of the Capitol - Lawfare
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Old 07-21-2021, 06:06 PM   #3414
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https://mobile.twitter.com/RealCanda...86513651568648

They always come this close, then apparently their system reboots.
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Old 07-21-2021, 06:07 PM   #3415
BYU 14
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Originally Posted by RainMaker View Post
They use felony murder charges all the time when someone dies during a crime. Store owner shoots a robber and the getaway driver gets charged with felony murder.

This guy was literally breaking the window and helping her through it when she was killed. There is no better example of felony murder than what took place.

Like I said, felony murder is only used against certain criminals.

I know how it works my friend, but they also as a practice won't apply a charge that likely won't stick regardless of what the criminal looks like, you can't broad brush everything, it doesn't represent the full picture. He broke the window, but it would be hard to tie her actions, in trying to enter, to what he did. Again, the guy is a POS and hopefully gets every years of his 40 year max sentence after his behavior, but I really doubt they would have gotten felony murder to stick.
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Old 07-21-2021, 07:00 PM   #3416
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Originally Posted by NobodyHere View Post
Nobody should be supporting a debt limit increase without immediately cutting the deficit.

OK Boomer...That mindset was jettisoned in the 80's, it's just that the world didn't realize it yet and only kept it around to sound smart. That argument also lost any sort of validity the moment that the previous congress and administration passed that tax overhaul that gave away a trillion a year in good times. We saw the economy collapse and the only out was more spending. It only amplified the concept as stated above, that deficits don't matter and won't ever again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BYU 14 View Post
I know how it works my friend, but they also as a practice won't apply a charge that likely won't stick regardless of what the criminal looks like, you can't broad brush everything, it doesn't represent the full picture. He broke the window, but it would be hard to tie her actions, in trying to enter, to what he did. Again, the guy is a POS and hopefully gets every years of his 40 year max sentence after his behavior, but I really doubt they would have gotten felony murder to stick.

Just wait until the next trump-like president blanket pardons every. single. one.
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Old 07-21-2021, 07:01 PM   #3417
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Originally Posted by albionmoonlight View Post
For 8 years of Obama, the Dems tried to reach out and compromise. They negotiated against themselves and took less than they wanted in order to reach out in a real bipartisan way.

And they got called radical and socialist and partisan and overly political.

So, having learned that no matter what they do, the GOP will call them radical (and the media will dutifully repeat the line), the Dems have (it seems) decided to start doing what they think will result in the best policy outcomes.

The GOP brought this on themselves. They have somehow managed to make the Democrats--the Democrats--into semi-competent politicians.

Had they been willing to throw the Black President half of a bone now and then, they'd have the Dems as the GOP-lite party. But they couldn't even do that.

Talk to me when the filibuster is altered in such a way they actually DO something.
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Old 07-21-2021, 07:22 PM   #3418
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OK Boomer...That mindset was jettisoned in the 80's, it's just that the world didn't realize it yet and only kept it around to sound smart. That argument also lost any sort of validity the moment that the previous congress and administration passed that tax overhaul that gave away a trillion a year in good times. We saw the economy collapse and the only out was more spending. It only amplified the concept as stated above, that deficits don't matter and won't ever again.

Ok Dick Cheney. Deficits don't matter. Runaway debt never hurt any government, ever. And if the last administration increased the deficit then it was good policy right? Because that's the one thing everyone associates with the Trump Presidency, that they had good policy right?
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Old 07-21-2021, 07:48 PM   #3419
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You're arguing against the bipartisan decisions of the US government for the last 40 years. Arguably, the shit went from eh, we can manage, to fuck it and forget it, but still, it's the policy of the country. No other country is comparable in that regard to the US, because no other country is as successful as the US economically past or present and therefore comparisons are somewhat moot.
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Old 07-21-2021, 08:44 PM   #3420
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Nobody should be supporting a debt limit increase without immediately cutting the deficit.

No, the debt limit should be automatically increased depending on the yearly budget. Deficit fights should take place then, not when the country is voting on whether or not to pay the bills.
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Old 07-21-2021, 09:07 PM   #3421
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Ok Dick Cheney. Deficits don't matter. Runaway debt never hurt any government, ever. And if the last administration increased the deficit then it was good policy right? Because that's the one thing everyone associates with the Trump Presidency, that they had good policy right?
And can you tell me exactly what the deep cratering of the US economy (much less the world's) would do to help the deficit once the US doesn't pass the debt ceiling increase and defaults on its debts?
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Old Yesterday, 01:46 AM   #3422
RainMaker
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I know how it works my friend, but they also as a practice won't apply a charge that likely won't stick regardless of what the criminal looks like, you can't broad brush everything, it doesn't represent the full picture. He broke the window, but it would be hard to tie her actions, in trying to enter, to what he did. Again, the guy is a POS and hopefully gets every years of his 40 year max sentence after his behavior, but I really doubt they would have gotten felony murder to stick.

Sorry but this is horseshit. The federal government goes with heavy handed charges all the time. People who were merely in the vicinity of people causing trouble during the inauguration faced 60 years in prison.

J20 protests: All you need to know about the nearly 200 people facing 60 years in jail for protesting Trump | The Independent | The Independent

If these were Muslims or black protestors, not only would a lot of them be dead, but every person who stepped into the Capitol would have been charged with felony murder.

The DOJ went soft on these people, including the organizers who have not faced any legal consequences. Five people died, others were injured, millions in damages, and pipebombs found. Next to no serious charges filed and I doubt any suspects see more than a couple years behind bars.
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Old Yesterday, 01:51 AM   #3423
RainMaker
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You don't have to go back far to see the disparity.

America's protest crackdown: five months after George Floyd, hundreds face trials and prison | Arizona | The Guardian
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Old Yesterday, 12:20 PM   #3424
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Imagine a Muslim man violently stormed the Capitol, had extremist views on social media, a pipebomb in his residence, and ordered over 30 guns AFTER being arrested and is still out on bond. The dude would be at Guantanamo.

FBI Found IED Components in Thomas Robertson's Home: Report
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Old Today, 09:59 AM   #3425
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Old Today, 11:05 AM   #3426
Ghost Econ
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He said the loud thing out loud.
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Old Today, 11:22 AM   #3427
BYU 14
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Can you really say the blatantly obvious, in an anymore blatantly obvious fashion? They don't care about election integrity, it's about subverting democracy for power.
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Old Today, 11:56 AM   #3428
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Every county in Oklahoma went red and some in the Senate there are pushing for an audit.
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Old Today, 03:10 PM   #3429
RainMaker
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Will be very interesting to see if he just runs off to the Middle East.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/23/polit...ing/index.html
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