Werewolf XXV: A long time ago...game over, Sith win,full role listing at 2030

[Barkeep49]

I think if it was a blessed he/she should come forward since the wolves already have that info. If it was the bodyguard the wolves might not know this and they should lie low.

Just did RPI's quick since he was nice enough to include who voted for who at lynch time. Just 1 of 5 people who voted for 2 villagers in that game was a badguy bring our overall total to 9 of 19.

[Barkeep49]

So the farther back in time I go the less it seems to hold up, even when only looking at games that lynch villagers on the first two days. I have now done 3 more games and 13 of 30 were wolves. I'm going to do about 5 more and see how it holds up, going back further if it looks like it'll be fruitful.

[Barkeep49]

Dola: BTW all werewolf numbers have been off for a while. This is actually game XXV (25) as RPI accidently used a number twice.

[hoopsguy]

His opponent is wielding a shimmering blade of the brightest azure any of you have ever seen, which is appropriate, because his swordsmanship is greater than that of any Jedi you have ever seen. Each thrust and swing of his blade forces the Sith back, the scarlet blades just barely countering each deadly azure blow.

This sounds like a bodyguard to me, except that I had initially thought that Lathum was the bodyguard based on this description:

Remember our years at the Jedi Academy, was I not always the strongest of us in the Force, always seemingly ahead of all of you in progress through on out Path. I was always the paragon of the Jedi Code

I don't think they can both be bodyguards, so how was Lathum the strongest in the force while the person last night was the greatest swordsman? Last night I put out the idea that there could be a role for the head of each school (Post #455).

Guardians: Bodyguard
Consular: Seer
Sentinels: Duke

The light saber last night was azure, which is a blue color. Blue is associated with the Guardians, who are the warrior class of the Jedi. So I think last night involved a bodyguard, not a blessed.

Of course, that would make Lathum a seer, duke, or some other kind of special role. Still, his light saber doesn't match any of the other groups (green for Consulars, Yellow for Sentinels, Pink for Lathum). Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but this is usually the type of information that a moderator is trying to give the players. And Saldana's two games have been very story-driven universes. So I do think there is something to this train of thought.

[hoopsguy]

Barkeep, the concept of wolves voting for villagers on the first two days intuitively makes sense. They have the advantage of knowing who the villagers are from the outset. The villagers are, to some extent, getting lucky if they vote for villagers on the first two days.

As a related note, the wolves are more forced to vote for villagers in games where there are tight races on the first two days. In those cases, they may have to move votes to save their own. For example, in the Lost game one of the wolves was under the gun on each of the first two days. In that case, they are more likely to vote for villagers because they can't risk a "wasted" vote on a wolf quite as readily.

The problem with testing this theory is that we don't know who the villagers are. But as I noted in Post #485 there are only 4 people currently who have not voted for at least one now-dead Jedi in the first two days.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

So the farther back in time I go the less it seems to hold up, even when only looking at games that lynch villagers on the first two days. I have now done 3 more games and 13 of 30 were wolves. I'm going to do about 5 more and see how it holds up, going back further if it looks like it'll be fruitful.

Well, what are you looking at? Whether they voted for innocent villagers, or whether they were part of the lynch crew? I'm not sure how relevant it is.

In the first two days, there's so little information to go on that wolves can easily hide themselves in the crowd with their votes, so it makes sense that during the first two days, their voting would follow that pattern.

It would be a bold play to vote for a wolf early AS a wolf to buck the trend, but if they did that and got lynched later, wouldn't the first instinct be to check who's still alive from the wolf's votes, to see if he was trying to obscure anybody from inspection?

[SackAttack]

Stepping out for a little bit. I have to umpire two games today, and then I'm going to attempt to cover the COC/Mt. SAC basketball game in Walnut. I'll be back to catch up tonight.

[Barkeep49]

And I'm done. After examing 8 or 9 games I've found that only in 16 of 47 cases did people who voted for villagers on the first two days turn out to be a wolf. As such I'm going to follow through on what I said I'd do and vote for hoops as soon as I can put together what of his posts in this thread struck me as odd.

[Barkeep49]

Dola: My methodolgy was I looked at who was a bad guy on days 1 and 2. I then looked at who voted for whom on those days. Anyonw who voted for a person who was a good guy on Days 1 and 2 were noted. I then looked to see how many of those were bad guys. In the end 16 people (34%) who were bad guys voted for villagers on days 1 and 2. 31 people (66%) of people who vote for villagers on days 1 and 2 were villagers. While the 34% is greater then the percentage of wolves typically found in a game, which normally runs from 1/5 to 1/3, it is not so much so as to be either statistically significant OR an indicator of who we should look at in this game.

[hoopsguy]

Post #452 from Barkeep

Hoops has been doing what he does best as a wolf: making lists that cast suspicion all the while not acting on the suspicion.

Post #508 from Barkeep

And I'm done. After examing 8 or 9 games I've found that only in 16 of 47 cases did people who voted for villagers on the first two days turn out to be a wolf.

Just checking, but this kind of felt like you were making lists and not acting on them

We've got four dead jedi and no smoking gun at this point. Given that we have a 36 hour cycle to work with, I'm going wait for a little while to see if any new information comes to light about what happened last night or anything involving a seer scan.

[Barkeep49]

Now part of why I am suspicious of hoops comes from the fact that we have discussed werewolf at length with each other. One strategy that all wolves try to employ is looking like they're helping when they're not. I have seen hoops use the look critically upon a wolf, but then go somewhere else, on a few different occasions. He's very good at this tactic and I think he's done as much here.

In post 131 he suggests that there might only be 2 sith. That seems asburd to me, especially considering saldanas comment that this will be a basic game. Someone of hoops experience should expect more wolves then that given the size of this game.

Post 318 is the next one that strikes me as suspicous. In it he looks at Qwikshot, Grammaticus, SackAttack, and Ardent as last minute voters. He then votes for Qwik despite his last minute vote being the most understandable. Again he likes to throw names out there, but unlike Blade he never seems too determined to put heat, just to provide later cover of having looked at the person?

In post 353 he incorrectly says "Alan T laughs at Barkeep's request not to be scanned. I'm guessing the two of them know that they are linked, so is this an attempt to create some separation between them in the thread?" How do we know we're linked? Unfounded speculation and this is the post that initially got me looking at hoops.

It's post 402 that really made me think of hoops as a baddie. He lays out the two scenarioes, seemingly great. Except it says nothing. I mean ANYONE could put together that list. It seems to say a whole lot while saying nothing. That's what I latched on to.

Now I've said before and I'll say it again: I am much better at seeing who's human then seeing who's a wolf. So I could be off base but I'm going to

Vote hoopsguy

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Post #508 from Barkeep

Just checking, but this kind of felt like you were making lists and not acting on them

I made a list to see if there was anything to act on. There wasn't. Rather then just say "let's look at people who voted for 2 villagers" I gathered some empircal data to see if that was worthwhile. I think it's not. So I am indeed acting off my list by voting for you rather then one of the people on your list of those who have voted for 2 villagers. :P

[hoopsguy]

OK, and to quote Samuel L. Jackson (a Jedi, I might add), "allow me to retort"

Post #131 - only the Sith know how many Sith there are. But the longer the game goes on without us catching one, the more likely I am to believe that this game adheres strictly to the Star Wars mythology and has a master/student relationship. Furthermore, wouldn't the bad guys want you to think they have stronger numbers to intimidate, rather than indicating that they have weaker numbers? This argument strikes me as the weakest of the bunch you list.

Post #318 Qwikshot was not a last minute voter. The other three people moved away from Qwikshot. I want to know why. I think that learning whether Qwik is Sith/Jedi was a very good strategy on Day 2 because it would give us a roadmap either way. Please re-read this post again because I really think that you didn't get my argument the first time, despite the fact that I reiterated it a couple of times throughout the day.

Post #353 is probably a case of me not doing a good job of conveying what I meant. Alan and Eaglesfan were linked, not Alan and you. Eagles was begging to be scanned and you came out not asking to be scanned. I think Alan was trying to separate himself from Eagles, not trying to tie himself to you. Alan did not want to be publicly tied to Eaglesfan because he understood the ramifications of their "lovers" role.

Post #402 - um, no one put together that scenario. Saying that anyone could have done it is certainly not accurate. What I want to make sure I understand here is that you are criticizing me for trying to put together risk/reward model for Qwikshot vs Lathum? Those type of risk models served me very well in the Spawn game where you moderated. They continue to be a big part of how I play the game every time out.

Bottom line, I didn't vote with you yesterday in lynching a Jedi in Lathum. If you didn't like my argument in Post #318 that is fine but I'm a little surprised that you didn't understand it.

In your collection of posts here I see a series of what I would consider strange assumptions, but I at least appreciate you providing post numbers so other people can look them up for themselves and draw their own conclusions.

I'm not saying (yet) this makes you a Sith, but your persistent efforts to discredit me are a little unnerving. You can be certain that I'll spend some more time reviewing your posts over the course of today looking for evidence that you are Sith, instead of just misguided.

[Barkeep49]

Look away. I think there's evidence there. It's wrong, but there's evidence. I'll help you:
In my first post once the game started I said not to scan me. I said it because it would waste a scan. But surely you could say it's because I'm a sith.

I appreciate you taking the time to respond though. I'm very bored at work and your response has provided me something to do .

[Barkeep49]

Dola:

In post 402 you provided a whole bunch of questions and didn't bother to answer them. Just asking theoretical questions does nothing. I'm glad you responded yourself to them but well I'm not a big fan of just posting questions for no reason.

I said from the start that it was a feel more then anything. I tried to explain how I got that feel, but understand if others can't follow it.

[cartman]

Wow, there's obviously a lot more depth to this game than I thought! Even after two days, it doesn't seem clear who is who, except those who are dead. And there is some subtlety to these different roles that I have no clue on how to read.

[Vince]

:Popcorn:

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by cartman

Wow, there's obviously a lot more depth to this game than I thought! Even after two days, it doesn't seem clear who is who, except those who are dead. And there is some subtlety to these different roles that I have no clue on how to read.

It's hard as a new player cause there isn't a whole lot of rules infomration to jump into. Has there been anything game wise that's confusing that I could try and clear up?

Your point about not knowing anything is one that hoops has also been making a big deal out of. He felt yesterday that lynching Qwik would gather information. I disagreed as I'm pretty sure he's a Jedi and lynching him would prove little.

[Qwikshot]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

It's hard as a new player cause there isn't a whole lot of rules infomration to jump into. Has there been anything game wise that's confusing that I could try and clear up?

Your point about not knowing anything is one that hoops has also been making a big deal out of. He felt yesterday that lynching Qwik would gather information. I disagreed as I'm pretty sure he's a Jedi and lynching him would prove little.

I will go with this thought process...Hoops has been very analytical but hasn't yielded any substantial gains...generally those that guide the flock are the most dangerous....

vote Hoops

[Barkeep49]

Qwik you should realize that in fairness I have been among the first to vote for both you and Lathum. Just so you factor that in to your decision making.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Dola: BTW all werewolf numbers have been off for a while. This is actually game XXV (25) as RPI accidently used a number twice.

That's a lot of research.

[hoopsguy]

Barkeep, do you think that a Sith would have moved their votes off of Qwikshot over to Superman=#54 on Day 1 if they were both Jedi? What was in it for them with that move?

Qwik, I'm not surprised that you would think I'm up to something if you are a Jedi. Or that you would vote for me if you are a Sith. Bottom line, you coming in as the 2nd vote against me makes perfect sense either way. But I would be happy to have you answer the above question as well.

I'm a little surprised to be alive on Day 3 to even be having these conversations, so I guess if I'm looking for a bright side that is it. But I think that I'm a pretty strange choice for the target today when TWELVE PEOPLE voted for Lathum yesterday and I wasn't one of them.

[hoopsguy]

Qwik, who has yielded substantial gains?

Neither of the people I voted for as of this time have been the decision for the lynch, so I'm not sure how I am supposed to yield "substantial gains". In fairness, my Eagles choice on Day 1 was obviously not a good one.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

It's hard as a new player cause there isn't a whole lot of rules infomration to jump into. Has there been anything game wise that's confusing that I could try and clear up?

Your point about not knowing anything is one that hoops has also been making a big deal out of. He felt yesterday that lynching Qwik would gather information. I disagreed as I'm pretty sure he's a Jedi and lynching him would prove little.

Nothing sinister or dirty to what is confusing. If I'm reading it right, it is all part of the game.

I guess what has me confused a bit is the lack of discussion today about Qwikshot. He garned a lot of votes the first couple of days, but today I haven't seen much at all written about him, the early focus seems to be on Hoops. I guess I haven't played attention to WW enough to see what statements people might that might be clues to their motivation.

[hoopsguy]

Well, part of it is that schedules are a little different on the weekends. Which changes the dynamics a little bit.

In terms of discussion on Qwik, I've already said my piece. But no one else seems to be interested in doing so. The fact that we didn't lose anyone last night makes me feel that going down this path still has some merit, but each day this is not resolved the arguments for doing so become less substantial. We should have more information to work with on Day 3 than Day 2. Better voting patterns, more chances for special roles to help provide direction, etc.

I'm hoping that someone has some real information from last night, because right now I don't have a good sense for where to go. But without that I'll probably have to fire on the guy leading a charge against me tomorrow. And I'm trying real hard to give him the benefit of the doubt as Barkeep is a guy that I've played with a few times and I haven't talked myself into believing he is a wolf. Just like he feels like he has insight into how I play, I also feel the same way about him. I don't think he is angle-shooting as a wolf here; I just think he is thinking too hard here, looking for reasons for me to be a wolf.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

I'm hoping that someone has some real information from last night, because right now I don't have a good sense for where to go.

Agreed. Although there's definitely benefit from not losing someone, not know who was attacked leaves us basically right where we were yesterday. There are the voting patterns, and although I believe that those who voted for two confirmed villagers should be looked at, I'm guessing at best one of them is a sith and not sure which one of those I'd suspect.

So with nothing more to go on, I think cartman has a good point about there not being any discussion on qwik today, and I suppose there's probably still something to learn from him being in the running in the lynch vote, so for now I'll stay with yesterdays vote:

VOTE Qwikshot

[pennywisesb]

I'm going to hold off voting until more evidence is brought forth. I didn't listen to hoops analysis the last couple of days and got Lathum killed so I might be leaning towards a Qwikshot vote at this point but this is definately subject to change.

I agree that if it was the blessed who was attacked last night they should step forward. If it was in fact the bodyguard, then I think they should continue to stay low (which I'm hoping is the case and that Lathum wasn't the bodyguard).

[Qwikshot]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Qwik, who has yielded substantial gains?

Neither of the people I voted for as of this time have been the decision for the lynch, so I'm not sure how I am supposed to yield "substantial gains". In fairness, my Eagles choice on Day 1 was obviously not a good one.

I'll tell you who has yielded substantial gains...the Sith. I have to reread things, but our seer better get his butt in gear.

unvote hoops

[Qwikshot]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Agreed. Although there's definitely benefit from not losing someone, not know who was attacked leaves us basically right where we were yesterday. There are the voting patterns, and although I believe that those who voted for two confirmed villagers should be looked at, I'm guessing at best one of them is a sith and not sure which one of those I'd suspect.

So with nothing more to go on, I think cartman has a good point about there not being any discussion on qwik today, and I suppose there's probably still something to learn from him being in the running in the lynch vote, so for now I'll stay with yesterdays vote:

VOTE Qwikshot

So I finally not vote for myself but it is still good enough to condemn me...

Vote Mckerney

[TazFTW]

I was not involved in last night's fighting.

I am surprised that after two night actions, hoops, barkeep, dubb, and ardent are still alive. Isn't it the usual play for the wolves to get rid of the vets early? Yet, there they are, still alive.

[stkelly52]

I am in the same situation as Cartman. I am trying to read into the posts of everyone, and I have concluded that I know that I am a Jedi, and little else.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by TazFTW

I was not involved in last night's fighting.

I am surprised that after two night actions, hoops, barkeep, dubb, and ardent are still alive. Isn't it the usual play for the wolves to get rid of the vets early? Yet, there they are, still alive.

Actually I would second this. I have no clue why Hoops and Barkeep are around at this point. I assume the reason I'm still around is b/c I haven't played in a long while, and I have a pretty good feeling about why Ardent is around.

Can anyone look at these first few days and honestly say Ardent has played his normal game? On day one he switches off of Qwik late to vote for Superman with the explanation, "I'll gamble." Obviously we have no clue of Qwik's role, but it seems fishy to me. His vote came in exactly 2 minutes before the deadline.

In post 262 at the end of his post he says this....

Better to vote me out than one of the jedi with something important going on. I'll take the martyr's role like qwik.

Then in post 266 after Superman comes up clean Ardent adds...

Well, that sucks. I'll take the heat.

Obviously this is far from his normal play. He is trying a different playing style, but if you are a villager why? After being a bad guy in several games recently THAT may be reason to break out a new play style.

He then trys to defend his comments in post 262 and 266 to Alan T.

On day 2 he is very quiet. Yet he has time to visit the thread and say...

Word.

In post 363. In posts 425, and post 427 he adds...

1 hour 15 minutes till the deadline, correct?

and

Thanks hoops.

After hoops tells Ardent how much time is left to the deadline. Why is this important? It is important b/c Ardent was here during the day, and was well aware of the deadline, yet his voting post says....

I didn't review the evidence on him to be honest, but enough of you seem to believe he tripped up. I doubt it myself, as he would likely have changed his vote to qwik by now if that were the case. I find the barkeep argument interesting myself.

Vote Lathum

It should be noted Ardent voted Lathum 1 hour and 30 minutes before the deadline without reviewing the evidence even thought he finds it interesting that Barkeep could be a wolf AND doesn't think Lathum is bad. Could he be trying to save face when Lathum comes up a villager?

Also, despite not reviewing the evidence he is well aware that many of us thought Lathum tripped up. OK, that makes some serious sense.

Ardent then goes on to make a post a half hour later, 3 minutes after a Barkeep post. How did he not have time to review the evidence against Lathum, yet know exactly what the evidence was when he was obviously watching the thread? And why would you vote someone if you haven't seen the evidence against them or even buy the fact that the evidence you haven't seen points to the fact that that guy is a sith? Sounds about like his day 1 vote. It had no rhyme or reason to it at all.

He has also been the last to cast a final vote in both of the first two days. All of this is out of character for Ardent in these games. With all of that said I think it should be obvious which way I'm going with this vote...

VOTE ARDENT

[Grammaticus]

Originally Posted by saldana

and Lathum was destined for the bright pink lightsaber as soon as he signed up

Okay, I see we may get a non standard light saber color. I don't want to be Mr. Pink.

[Barkeep49]

Well dubb if ardent is a wolf knowing him I think that with my declaration that I was going after hoops that he'd leave us both alone for the day to see what happens. I have to think over your list some more, but on first glance it's certainly more of a logical one then my gut against hoops.

[SackAttack]

I have driven 200 miles in the last 5 hours, potentially for nothing, and I am entirely too pooped to make any sense of the posts since I left. I'll look it over in the morning and see if I can figure out what's going on.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Actually I would second this. I have no clue why Hoops and Barkeep are around at this point. I assume the reason I'm still around is b/c I haven't played in a long while, and I have a pretty good feeling about why Ardent is around.

Can anyone look at these first few days and honestly say Ardent has played his normal game? On day one he switches off of Qwik late to vote for Superman with the explanation, "I'll gamble." Obviously we have no clue of Qwik's role, but it seems fishy to me. His vote came in exactly 2 minutes before the deadline.

In post 262 at the end of his post he says this....



Then in post 266 after Superman comes up clean Ardent adds...



Obviously this is far from his normal play. He is trying a different playing style, but if you are a villager why? After being a bad guy in several games recently THAT may be reason to break out a new play style.

He then trys to defend his comments in post 262 and 266 to Alan T.

On day 2 he is very quiet. Yet he has time to visit the thread and say...



In post 363. In posts 425, and post 427 he adds...



and



After hoops tells Ardent how much time is left to the deadline. Why is this important? It is important b/c Ardent was here during the day, and was well aware of the deadline, yet his voting post says....



It should be noted Ardent voted Lathum 1 hour and 30 minutes before the deadline without reviewing the evidence even thought he finds it interesting that Barkeep could be a wolf AND doesn't think Lathum is bad. Could he be trying to save face when Lathum comes up a villager?

Also, despite not reviewing the evidence he is well aware that many of us thought Lathum tripped up. OK, that makes some serious sense.

Ardent then goes on to make a post a half hour later, 3 minutes after a Barkeep post. How did he not have time to review the evidence against Lathum, yet know exactly what the evidence was when he was obviously watching the thread? And why would you vote someone if you haven't seen the evidence against them or even buy the fact that the evidence you haven't seen points to the fact that that guy is a sith? Sounds about like his day 1 vote. It had no rhyme or reason to it at all.

He has also been the last to cast a final vote in both of the first two days. All of this is out of character for Ardent in these games. With all of that said I think it should be obvious which way I'm going with this vote...

VOTE ARDENT

I think the reason at least one or two of you are still around is for precisely what's happening right now, drawing attention. The hope that we'll do the job for the Sith. Since I doubt you, Barkeep, Hoops, and Ardent are all Sith it stands to reason that they value having decoys around more than eliminating
experience. Let's say that you are, just for example, a Sith. If the other three are eliminated early, doesn't the arrow point straight to you? Or else everyone is so off base at this point there is no reason to eliminate you four. It's possible that Barkeep and Hoops are both Jedi.

I would be suprised if one of the four of you wasn't a Sith since decoys are nice, but you don't need that many. Unless one of you was the person in the battle last night, which changes things.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

I would be suprised if one of the four of you wasn't a Sith since decoys are nice, but you don't need that many. Unless one of you was the person in the battle last night, which changes things.

It wasn't me in the battle last night.

[Desnudo]

Speaking of the battle, I don't think it was the bodyguard that was involved. Unless the bodyguard was protecting himself, where was the other jedi? I think two scenarios are most likely: the blessed (most likely) or we have a soldier/assassin and he attacked a Sith, but was also targeted himself.

I've also been thinking there is no real reason for this Jedi not to come forward. The Sith must know who is he. So it can only help us for him to come forward. Unless he was somehow not named to the Sith in the behind-the-scenes action.

[Qwikshot]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Speaking of the battle, I don't think it was the bodyguard that was involved. Unless the bodyguard was protecting himself, where was the other jedi? I think two scenarios are most likely: the blessed (most likely) or we have a soldier/assassin and he attacked a Sith, but was also targeted himself.

I've also been thinking there is no real reason for this Jedi not to come forward. The Sith must know who is he. So it can only help us for him to come forward. Unless he was somehow not named to the Sith in the behind-the-scenes action.

It wasn't me.

[hoopsguy]

In terms of several "vets" being around at this stage, I had actually hoped that Barkeep was throwing a night accusation at me as a way of trying to keep us both around the next day. It would be a pretty smart play, and one that initially is a little counter-intuitive, but I was hopeful that was where Barkeep was going with his actions.

It is also possible that one of them was the target last night and was either blessed or protected by the bodyguard. As I noted in Post #504, I do believe that we still have a bodyguard out there and that is what happened last night.

Dubb, I agree with your take on Ardent. Of the three people that I listed with Day 1 vote changes away from Qwik, he is the one that has me the most worried. If we had lynched Qwik yesterday and found him to be a Sith I'm just about positive that is where I would have gone next.

He is around the thread enough that I'll give him some time to respond before voting, but that is the direction I'm heading right now if someone doesn't come forward with info from last night or if AE doesn't have one hell of a rebuttal.

[hoopsguy]

Current votes:

Hoopsguy - Barkeep (511)
Qwikshot - mckerney (526)
mckerney - Qwikshot (529)
Ardent Enthusiast - dubb93 (532)

[Poli]

I wasn't defending or attacking. I am not a Sith. I won't offer more of an explanation.

I said before I am just a plain jedi. I did my best to find a role by looking into the Force, but there was nothing there.

That said, lynch me if it takes the heat off our fellow Jedis with a role.

As for my vote, I may end up forgetting to cast it before the deadline. So, I'll vote for the person trying to press me. It in fact isn't working, but do what you must. The fact is, I'm a plain Jedi with no role and I've chosen this game to sit back and watch. I actually haven't done much watching...or near as much as I should be, but that is neither here nor there.

I knew the argument of why the vets are still here would come up. I'm looking forward to seeing how that pans out.

VOTE DUBB93

[Barkeep49]

That was a pretty weak defense considering that passion is what I've come to expect from Ardent. I have a really hard time reading him, but I am now leaning towards him or dubb being a more likely suspect then hoops and so I will, for the time being, remove my vote from hoops.

Unvote hoops

[Poli]

It's all you're getting out me this game.

Ardent = No passion in this game. No role, no passion.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Can anyone look at these first few days and honestly say Ardent has played his normal game? On day one he switches off of Qwik late to vote for Superman with the explanation, "I'll gamble." Obviously we have no clue of Qwik's role, but it seems fishy to me. His vote came in exactly 2 minutes before the deadline.

I don't know that this necessarily makes him a Sith. This is pretty indicative of the way I've seen him play in the other games in which he and I have been involved. Lot of fly-by-your-pants and hope he's right.

It should be noted Ardent voted Lathum 1 hour and 30 minutes before the deadline without reviewing the evidence even thought he finds it interesting that Barkeep could be a wolf AND doesn't think Lathum is bad. Could he be trying to save face when Lathum comes up a villager? Also, despite not reviewing the evidence he is well aware that many of us thought Lathum tripped up. OK, that makes some serious sense.

He may not have reviewed the evidence, but there were plenty of us making mention of the fact that we thought Lathum tripped up. Even a cursory glance at the previous page or two would have revealed that.

Sounds about like his day 1 vote. It had no rhyme or reason to it at all.

That, I admit, is troubling.

[Barkeep49]

Well at least his day 3 vote is the "You're going to vote for me? Alright buddy I'll vote for you" I expect when there's a vote against ardent.

[hoopsguy]

Sack, obviously a late vote change on Day 1 makes sense to you, since you had done the same thing a few minutes earlier.

Ardent, do you have any strong opinions on the three guys with identical voting records to yours? That would be Sack, Gram, and KWhit.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Sack, obviously a late vote change on Day 1 makes sense to you, since you had done the same thing a few minutes earlier.

Not by choice. I was assigned to cover a softball game for the school newspaper, and then promptly lost my internet connection for an hour shortly after getting back from that.

I've explained that.

I would have made the same switch if not for those factors, and done so much sooner.

Further, I didn't say it "makes sense," only that on day one it doesn't necessarily mean he's a Sith.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Sack, obviously a late vote change on Day 1 makes sense to you, since you had done the same thing a few minutes earlier.

Ardent, do you have any strong opinions on the three guys with identical voting records to yours? That would be Sack, Gram, and KWhit.

Nope, sure don't.

[hoopsguy]

Well, there are either going to be a flurry of late votes or this is going to be a very sparse turnout to determine this lynch.

I'm hoping that one of these times when I look at the post that I'll see a few people in the room at the same time so there is an opportunity to actually have some conversation.

Ardent, you aren't giving us much to work with here.

For now, VOTE ARDENT ENTHUSIAST