Werewolf CXXXIII - The Dark Knight - MOBSTERS WIN

[dzilla77]

If you want to lynch me, a vanilla villager, I hope you learn something.

[dzilla77]

unvote hoops
vote lathum

self defense, still think hoops is a wolf

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

My vote was cast prior as a means of prodding you to talk about your votes, which you've yet to do, yesterday and today. Please enlighten us.

I'll tell you what. Unvote me for today and I'll tell you all about my votes after the deadline.

[Lathum]

unvote abe
vote dzilla

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I'll tell you what. Unvote me for today and I'll tell you all about my votes after the deadline.

Hmm.. Okay. I'll take that.

Unvote Lathum

[Abe Sargent]

Why is dzilla in front, I don't get it? Was there something in thread I missed?

I'd rather J23 and not a random person from The Joker if we don;t have anything on dzilla. I'd also like top keep it close for spying shenanigan purposes.

[Abe Sargent]

Although I;m not a super fan of voting someone who hasn;t been that wolfy after yesterday.

[Abe Sargent]

Maybe I'm talking myself out, I don;t know. I've been going back and forth all day - J23, but not J23. I was surprised Tyrith was sensitive enough to pick up on it.

[Autumn]

This is Gotham Live.

The hunt is on for the individual the Joker calls J23. The infamous clown faced criminal has ordered Gotham City to find this individual and kill him. Police are on the lookout, hoping to find the protect the Gotham City resident, whether from The Joker or fearful citizens. Meanwhile it seems the people of Gotham have found the Joker's games distasteful. While yesterday cell phone towers flashed with texts in Joker's' murder game, today the streets are quiet and citizens seem more interested in the hunt for fugitive mob members. Still, fear clouds the city tonight. Will the Joker carry out on his terrorist threat if J23 is not found and killed? News at 10:00.

[Thomkal]

Well I loathe to play the Joker's game again, but in the end I think we need to play it one more day. So sorry about this but

vote J23

[dzilla77]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

Why is dzilla in front, I don't get it? Was there something in thread I missed?

I'd rather J23 and not a random person from The Joker if we don;t have anything on dzilla. I'd also like top keep it close for spying shenanigan purposes.

Cause the the three votes for me are either asshats or mobsters.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by dzilla77

So lets look at hoops' voting record:
Day 1 late switch to bhlloy (from Danny)
Day 2 J23
Text Mau (after my vote)
So hoops votes for a known roled villager late on Day 1 yet criticizes my vote on Zinto suggesting it should have been on Danny (after he switched from Danny)
He then votes the same lynch canidate as me on day 2
He also votes for the same text kill candidate as me *after* I did and calls my "late" vote suspicious.
　
This just screams wolf
Vote hoops

It probably isn't fair for me to expect others to apply context to my votes when I didn't have time to go through the Day 2 vote/unvote stuff earlier this morning, but this Day 2 stuff doesn't accurately depict how events went down. I had TEXT KILL MAU and VOTE BHLLOY prior to the reveals. After there were two reveals, I unvoted each of them and continued asking questions in the thread. I votes for Mauboy on both counts, and only switched to J23 at the deadline in a failed attempt to keep Harvey Dent alive. All of this stuff is there to see in the posts near the deadline last night.

Honestly, I've got to vote for someone and it gets old when every person I vote for responds with "Hoops screams wolf". I'm right some of the time and wrong some of the time, just like every other villager out there, but I'm almost always giving a reason for my votes and willing to discuss them. But I'm less likely to be enthusiastic about the process, or to change my mind without a really good reason, when the response to a vote feels shrill like this.

So lets try to have discussions about the votes and the logic rather than reflexively respond, OK? Sorry to be picking on you for this, it just happened to be the last in a line of these type of posts that I've read that have ended up increasingly rubbing me the wrong way.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by dzilla77

Cause the the three votes for me are either asshats or mobsters.

And this came out while I was posting my response ... perfect.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

And this came out while I was posting my response ... perfect.

At least he added a smile

[Abe Sargent]

Vote J23

I'm open to someone convincing me otherwise. I'm very tentative of this vote compared to my usual confidence.

[hoopsguy]

Abe, I laid out the logic on page 22, starting with post 1086. The posts are pretty long, so I'm not going to quote the whole thing but:
- had a particularly bad vote on Day 1 if you buy into idea that Zinto is a villager (a theory I do subscribe to at the moment)
- I'm assuming Day 2 was a Joker/Dent/villager runoff (J23 as unknown right now) so the wolves had free reign to split their votes up among candidates
- I trust the "Danny" voters more than the J23 voters, despite being one myself. Reasons for trusting many of those guys falls in post #1086
- Working through the J23 voters, dzilla was the one who seemed most likely to be a wolf for me. Later movement onto TEXT KILL MAUBOY combined with vibe was what pushed him above other candidates at the end.

[hoopsguy]

And, of course, being a mobster/asshat

included

[J23]

I'll likely put my vote out there as self-defense by the end of the night. I figure that if the majority opinion is to lynch me by the end, my one vote won't swing it

[Chubby]

I'm not against moving my vote but disappointed nobody else is lookig at PF/Schimidty (who i don't think has even said 1 peep yet).

I'm certainly not against a dzilla lynching, I just don't see any need to move my vote right now.

[Chubby]

can anyone explain danny's vote on J23? he wants J23 killed that badly that he doesn't want a lynch AND a random kill?

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I'm not against moving my vote but disappointed nobody else is lookig at PF/Schimidty (who i don't think has even said 1 peep yet).

I'm certainly not against a dzilla lynching, I just don't see any need to move my vote right now.

I think part of it is psychologically waiting for Schmidity to arrive.

[Autumn]

Suspects on the Loose In Gotham

4 dzilla77 - hoopsguy (1096), zinto (1171), chief rum (1192), lathum (1204)
1 packerfan/schmidty - chubby (1131)
3 J23 - danny (1180), thomkal (1210), abe sargent (1215)
2 lathum - tyrith (1186), dzilla77 (1202)

[The Jackal]

Well see the question is, do the people on dzilla feel strongly enough about him being a wolf that they're willing to tack a random kill on top of it?

I'd like to vote for PF/Schmidty here but it seems like whoever is playing that person right now hasn't been in the thread and so if they were to have a role or some such they wouldn't be able to tell us about it, nor is there a ton to go on besides PF barely posting at all. I would've liked to have seen some earlier traction there, I guess I could have done that before Jeopardy but oh well.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I think part of it is psychologically waiting for Schmidity to arrive.

I mean, I get this but PF wasn't exactly contributing either.

I think it is something to look at tomorrow for sure especially if no new developments.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I think it is something to look at tomorrow for sure especially if no new developments.

I agree with this, doesn't seem like it's of use at the moment.

[The Jackal]

I understand not wanting to play the Joker's game and seeing what mechanics will unfold, even though I'm fairly certain we'd get a random kill. I don't care about dying myself but I'd hate for a random kill to fall on a useful role.

I suppose this is the point where we inject moral roleplay into what should be a werewolf decision? Narcizo was questioning me on the village not wanting more kills yesterday, but I still feel like a random kill hurts the village more than helps it. Of course, it could hit a wolf and then luck's your friend, but we've already taken one out, and I'm pretty sure the Joker isn't going to take himself out.. though if we -are- sticking to the movie, he'd have to be involved in his little game.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Chubby

can anyone explain danny's vote on J23? he wants J23 killed that badly that he doesn't want a lynch AND a random kill?

I'm pretty sure he'll move his vote if necessary to ensure as much chaos as possible.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Chubby

can anyone explain danny's vote on J23? he wants J23 killed that badly that he doesn't want a lynch AND a random kill?

which brings me back to this...

anyone? anyone? bueller?

[Thomkal]

Yeah Chubby, it sucks that there hasn't been much of a contribution from the PackerFan side of the duo, but given that PF apparantly wasn't able to play as much as he thought he would before handing it over, I'd like to be fair to Schmidty and see what he has to say when he takes over. If his posts are few and far between, then I'll be more interested in voting for him just because we will have next to nothing on them.

[Chubby]

heh, too slow for The Jackal

tho I don't see Danny in the thread currently...

[Zinto]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

And this came out while I was posting my response ... perfect.

I agree with this. I am not a fan of the quick defensive vote or reaction especially one that does't respond with why they are villagers.

[Darth Vilus]

aww crap, i dont have much time. are we playnig the joker's game? any thoughts?

[The Jackal]

I feel like this was covered before, but is dzilla the same person as dwardzala?

[The Jackal]

I ask because I don't recall dwardzala being this defensive or critical of people voting for him in previous games, and would help me make a decision on whether or not I think it's worth taking a shot at dzilla with a random kill in tow.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Darth Vilus

aww crap, i dont have much time. are we playnig the joker's game? any thoughts?

I am Darth-hate to do it, but since J23 is saying he's a regular citizen, I think we need to play it one more day.

[Darth Vilus]

J23 you're sure the vilage wont be hurt with your death? absoloutely sure?

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Darth Vilus

J23 you're sure the vilage wont be hurt with your death? absoloutely sure?

The argument against it is that people are speculating that if we don't play the joker's game, maybe we wouldn't have to do it again tomorrow, since we played yesterday and had to play again today.

[The Jackal]

I'm about to have to leave so I need to make a decision here fairly soon. Hmm.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

Lathum, I want more info from this vote. It was 30 minutes before the deadline, and you changed without comment. Why?

If you've mentioned it later, I apologize, there's been a lot of posts. Just let us know

so this was asked by Abe, got no answer from Lathum but a quick retailitory vote...

with no traction on PF/Schimidty til tomorrow...

unvote packer fanatic/schimidty
vote Lathum

[The Jackal]

I tend to believe we are going to have to play the joker's game no matter what we do everyday until we get rid of him.

I also think there is a better chance that dzilla is a wolf than J.

However, I'm staunchest in my belief that a random kill does more harm to the village than good.

So, for now, and with likely apologies to J:

VOTE J23

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Chubby

so this was asked by Abe, got no answer from Lathum but a quick retailitory vote...

with no traction on PF/Schimidty til tomorrow...

unvote packer fanatic/schimidty
vote Lathum

Lathum said he'd explain his votes after the deadline and Abe unvoted him.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I'll tell you what. Unvote me for today and I'll tell you all about my votes after the deadline.

sigh, i'm supposed to blind trust someone who killed off Dent?

gotta see where it goes

[The Jackal]

Still, if someone could answer me about the whole "is dzilla dwardzala with a new handle" question, that'd be great.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Lathum said he'd explain his votes after the deadline and Abe unvoted him.

I guess I would like more explanation than that before trusting someone who helped off our DA.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Still, if someone could answer me about the whole "is dzilla dwardzala with a new handle" question, that'd be great.

no idea

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Chubby

sigh, i'm supposed to blind trust someone who killed off Dent?

gotta see where it goes

That's how Lathum is.. I don't fault you at all for wanting to push him on it, but it's not rubbing me as off of his playstyle.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I guess I would like more explanation than that before trusting someone who helped off our DA.

It seems unlikely a wolf would make such a bold statement, instead of appeasing Abe with gibbery gab, which I'm sure Lathum could do. Though if he's actually going to reveal something post lynch deadline that might make him a night kill target. Who knows. I guess it's worth waiting to find out, but if you think he's a wolf, like I said, go for it.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Suspects on the Loose In Gotham

4 dzilla77 - hoopsguy (1096), zinto (1171), chief rum (1192), lathum (1204)
1 packerfan/schmidty - chubby (1131)
3 J23 - danny (1180), thomkal (1210), abe sargent (1215)
2 lathum - tyrith (1186), dzilla77 (1202)

4 dzilla (tiebreaker)
4 j23
3 lathum

correct???

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

It seems unlikely a wolf would make such a bold statement, instead of appeasing Abe with gibbery gab, which I'm sure Lathum could do. Though if he's actually going to reveal something post lynch deadline that might make him a night kill target. Who knows. I guess it's worth waiting to find out, but if you think he's a wolf, like I said, go for it.

well, is he going to tell us he's the police commish? lol

[hoopsguy]

I'm of the opinion that we won't be able to stop playing Joker's scenarios until we make "the moral" choice - I thought that yesterday's writeup condemned us for playing along with Joker in the vote, even if it turned out well for us.

What happens for Day 4 when we take out J23 tonight? Is that when we draw the line and say "no way, not playing" to Joker? If there is some sort of endgame here maybe I would feel a little differently about going along with it today.