Alright boyz, here we go! FM 2010 first impressions thread

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by whomario

For anyone afraid of the learning curve and everything : The Assistan Manager this year seems vastly improved to the point that his recomendations now make a ton of sense even for staff members Plus placing job adverts now works splendidly, the guys that apply are decent enough for your team most of the time in lower levels and sign for an amount of money you can afford, unlike when you search for staff and have them ask for too much
Plus actually usefull advice in terms of player roles, tactics and so forth.

Can´t wait ...

Yeah, the Assman\backroom staff are actually useful now. That along with the tactics wizard have made the game more newbie friendly. To be sure you still have a lot coming at you if you are new to the game but the tools to handle it are so much better.

[whomario]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

Will he even recommend a new assistant manager?

I think that would be considered a conflict of interest "You know, boss, there really isn´t anyone out there for this position. But i´ll stay if you insist"

[dbd1963]

Originally Posted by whomario

Putting the pressure up should work as well as closing down on the other teams defensive players. Those 2 will result in more long and high passes from defenders/defensive midfielders as opposed to a structured short-passing attack.
Of course, if your guys aren´t any good at closing down and the other team very good at passing (decicion making as well) than look out and beware.

Basically do not try this when you the clear inferior team ...

The other way (with a weaker team) might be to play your defensive line very deep and put your "width" team instruction towards "narrow" , forcing the other team to cross the ball in high from the outside instead of short passing through the middle.

It's lack of this kind of intimate knowledge of soccer that always puts me off this game. If only SI would make an American football game. I wouldn't need real licenses.. sigh.

I mean, if the DE is blowing past the LT, I know I have to keep a back in or set the TE to chip on that side -- I know what the problem is and what can be done about it. With soccer, I see all the little guys running around and I have no idea what they are doing, what they are supposed to be doing, or whether they are doing what they are doing well, or blowing it.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by dbd1963

It's lack of this kind of intimate knowledge of soccer that always puts me off this game. If only SI would make an American football game. I wouldn't need real licenses.. sigh.

I mean, if the DE is blowing past the LT, I know I have to keep a back in or set the TE to chip on that side -- I know what the problem is and what can be done about it. With soccer, I see all the little guys running around and I have no idea what they are doing, what they are supposed to be doing, or whether they are doing what they are doing well, or blowing it.

alternatively you could just view the entire match, save it and upload it for us to take a look at it and we could talk you through it.

it's somewhat similar...if your guys aren't good at passing the ball then you probably want to have them make fewer passes before shooting - thus a long-passing game. if your defenders are slow they should play back fruther so there's less room in behind them. if they're constantly out of position chasing guys then get them some help - have your midfielders drop back to help defensively a bit.

[DaddyTorgo]

ugh - so of course i draw Inter in the CL Quarterfinal. God...at least give me a different team!

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

alternatively you could just view the entire match, save it and upload it for us to take a look at it and we could talk you through it.

it's somewhat similar...if your guys aren't good at passing the ball then you probably want to have them make fewer passes before shooting - thus a long-passing game. if your defenders are slow they should play back fruther so there's less room in behind them. if they're constantly out of position chasing guys then get them some help - have your midfielders drop back to help defensively a bit.

Is there a way to know this. There are a lot of ratings and such but it would be nice for a scout to say "we aren't a good passing team" or something along those lines. My problem is that I get some feedback from my assistant but don't know what to do. For instance, I'm always told that our tackling sucks. Should I be less aggressive with it then? Is there some kind of tactic I can change to help with that?

I'm in a similar situation as dbd. I like the game, understand 50% of the tactics and such, but confused with the rest. There is just so many things to tweak that I don't really know if it's right or wrong.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Is there a way to know this. There are a lot of ratings and such but it would be nice for a scout to say "we aren't a good passing team" or something along those lines. My problem is that I get some feedback from my assistant but don't know what to do. For instance, I'm always told that our tackling sucks. Should I be less aggressive with it then? Is there some kind of tactic I can change to help with that?

I'm in a similar situation as dbd. I like the game, understand 50% of the tactics and such, but confused with the rest. There is just so many things to tweak that I don't really know if it's right or wrong.

there is in a sense - your coaches backroom meeting before the game will tell you "oh we're better passers than them" or "oh we're taller than them." what I guess that whole idea is missing is a button to press to say "take advantage of this" that would then say "we're taking advantage of this by changing our tactics to deemphasize tackling". Maybe that's the next step in it (MV are you listening)?

if your being told that your tackling sucks then i'd venture to say you're probably picking up a lot of yellow cards and giving away a lot of free kicks - maybe resulting in a lot of goals? yeah...if my tackling sucked i'd tell my team to tackle less (if you click on the pitch on the "tactics creater" screen and then go down there's a setting for tackling "easy/default/hard" - and i'd probably also start looking for guys with better tackling ratings.

if you're going to tackle less you might want to pressure more though, and maybe play with a deeper defensive line (both can be changed after clicking on the pitch on the tactics creater screen - although defensive line you have to click "go advanced") in order to try to first keep some pressure on the other team so they don't have all day to pick you apart, and a deeper defensive line so there's less room behind it (deeper defensive line might help, but might not necessarily).

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Is there a way to know this. There are a lot of ratings and such but it would be nice for a scout to say "we aren't a good passing team" or something along those lines. My problem is that I get some feedback from my assistant but don't know what to do. For instance, I'm always told that our tackling sucks. Should I be less aggressive with it then? Is there some kind of tactic I can change to help with that?

I'm in a similar situation as dbd. I like the game, understand 50% of the tactics and such, but confused with the rest. There is just so many things to tweak that I don't really know if it's right or wrong.

one thing I might recommend if you're in a situation like this guys - invest a little bit of time to have a "tester" game - replay the same matches with different tactical tweaks (while watching the whole match - at least a chunk of it if you don't watch the whole thing...i don't think you need to watch it all), in order to see how the different tactical choices actually affect your players on the pitch.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

there is in a sense - your coaches backroom meeting before the game will tell you "oh we're better passers than them" or "oh we're taller than them." what I guess that whole idea is missing is a button to press to say "take advantage of this" that would then say "we're taking advantage of this by changing our tactics to deemphasize tackling". Maybe that's the next step in it (MV are you listening)?

if your being told that your tackling sucks then i'd venture to say you're probably picking up a lot of yellow cards and giving away a lot of free kicks - maybe resulting in a lot of goals? yeah...if my tackling sucked i'd tell my team to tackle less (if you click on the pitch on the "tactics creater" screen and then go down there's a setting for tackling "easy/default/hard" - and i'd probably also start looking for guys with better tackling ratings.

if you're going to tackle less you might want to pressure more though, and maybe play with a deeper defensive line (both can be changed after clicking on the pitch on the tactics creater screen - although defensive line you have to click "go advanced") in order to try to first keep some pressure on the other team so they don't have all day to pick you apart, and a deeper defensive line so there's less room behind it (deeper defensive line might help, but might not necessarily).

That's the other part of my problem, when I get the advice, I just don't know what settings to change. It would be nice to have a learning mode of some sort built in so that when my assistant gives advice, in parenthesis next to it, the game can let me know the potential settings that would effect this. Doesn't have to say "2 clicks to the left" or let me know what's most important, but just a list of what I can do to fix it in a general sense.

For instance in baseball, if I get advice that we are getting killed on bunts, it would tell me to play the corners in, maybe substitute a better fielding 1B/3B/P/C, etc.

[Toddzilla]

Foz - can you email me your edited PLA file? I'd like to make a few more changes and post that as the latest on the SI forums.

open source FtW

[RainMaker]

And none of this is a knock on the game as I'm having a blast with it. I'm just having trouble knowing what certain settings do and what teams they benefit. Like what teams would play a more direct passing route. What is the advantages/disadvantages to free roaming style of play? What situation is it best for zone or man marking?

[SirFozzie]

Sure thing, Todd.. What's your email?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

That's the other part of my problem, when I get the advice, I just don't know what settings to change. It would be nice to have a learning mode of some sort built in so that when my assistant gives advice, in parenthesis next to it, the game can let me know the potential settings that would effect this. Doesn't have to say "2 clicks to the left" or let me know what's most important, but just a list of what I can do to fix it in a general sense.

For instance in baseball, if I get advice that we are getting killed on bunts, it would tell me to play the corners in, maybe substitute a better fielding 1B/3B/P/C, etc.

I agree - it would be helpful if it said that to an extent. then again keep in mind that we all know baseball and would know to do that because we grew up playing it. in the rest of the world they've grown up playing soccer, so that's just natural to them.

i think a "tester" game is the way to go to try to learn what different tactical instructions affect. and you don't need to learn them all necessarily. if you can find one setup that gets you 0-0 draws against better teams then odds are that's a good "super defensive" set of instructions you can use anytime...and as you gradually get more comfortable with the tactics you'll tweak it a little.

i do feel for you though. i wonder if there's not a good website with a summation of soccer tactics sorta?

[SirFozzie]

Actually, here it is. It can only be downloaded 10 times before only paid accounts can download, can someone re-host?

RapidShare: 1-CLICK Web hosting - Easy Filehosting

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

And none of this is a knock on the game as I'm having a blast with it. I'm just having trouble knowing what certain settings do and what teams they benefit. Like what teams would play a more direct passing route. What is the advantages/disadvantages to free roaming style of play? What situation is it best for zone or man marking?

keep asking questions too - that's a good way of learning. and we're less assholey than the SI boards in general i'd say.

i'll refrain from posting the in-game description of what the different tactical instructions do, because you can read those, and instead offer general advice.

if you're the stronger team (or a skilled team in general) you might look to play more direct passes as your players will have the ability to put more pressure on the opposition defense that way. that can lead to more goals scored by you.

if on the other hand you have a lot of talented passers all over the pitch and prefer to build possession slowly before your shots on goal, you would opt for a short passing game.

free roaming is good for your most talented players (think if you had like a Kaka or a Ronaldinho). It's basically giving them liberty to go all over the pitch to try to make an impact - the disadvantage (and the reason you can't give it to too many players) is that it can end up with them way out of position defensively.

[SirFozzie]

MrRight on SomethingAwful has uploaded the file to his RapidShare account, which means everyone can download it without waiting, without limits.

http://rapidshare.com/files/303327702/SummerMLS.xml

[Toddzilla]

Word!

[DaddyTorgo]

i might have to give this a shot

[Toddzilla]

There's another PLA change that I want to make but just dont have the time, so if anyone is interested, here goes:

For both the Promotion MLS and the PLA, the developmental league teams should be arranged into geographic divisions. There is a way to tie the teams to these divisions so, should a team from Maine get promoted out of the "Developmental League - New England" division, when they get relegated they will go back to the same.

In the editor, you go to a club, click their competitions page, then click the Regional divisions tab and add competitions as appropriate.

e.g. In England, Truro City would only ever play in the Blue Square South - so you'd click 'Add', Level = 6, competition = Blue Square South.

EDIT - I schould mention in the PLA where there are 6 divisions in the Dev League, I've defined geographic boundaries that work for mthe most part, but the editing above makes it rock solid.

[path12]

So where do I put the PLA file?

[GoldenEagle]

Quick question for the editor. Is there anyway I can force Sir Alex into retirement and have Martin O'Neil take the job at Man Utd?

[DaddyTorgo]

WOOOO!!!!

1-1 tie away at Inter in the CL Quarterfinal.

WAXED them 4-0 at the Stadio Olimpico in Turin in the return leg. Absolute domination (I switched from "Defensive" to "Counter" and let my defensive line go a bit higher). Then I got the best draw for the Semi's - Girondins de Bordeaux. The other Semi is Real Madrid vs. AC Milan.

Just my luck I'll play AC Milan in the finals and then play them again in the Italian Supercup at the beginning of next season (I'd say Italian Cup Finals, but I've already been bounced from that by Sampdoria).

[RainMaker]

I just played as the US National Team. It started at the begin of the 3rd round of qualifying.

Finished 2nd in the group but had to win my last game against Costa Rica to ensure that (I could have finished as low as 5th). Trinidad was abysmal and Mexico dominated. It was tense once I blew a 1-0 lead in Honduras which resulted in a tie and put me in the must-win. I did beat Costa Rica soundly 3-0.

The draw I got for South Africa was OK. Germany, Portugal and South Africa. Germany beat me 2-0 in the first game which did put some pressure on me in the Portugal one. I played more aggressive and got down early and ended up losing 2-1. Made the South Africa game meaningless although I did smoke them 3-0.

I should have played the Portugal game much more defensively and been happy with a tie. Would have allowed me to pile it up on South Africa and get into the knockout stage.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by path12

So where do I put the PLA file?

in your documents/Sports Interactive/Football Manager 2010/editor data folder

(depending on your OS it may be My Documents instead of Documents, but once you get there, it'll go fine)

[GoldenEagle]

That is a pretty tough draw. Germany and South Africa should have been seeded though, so I wonder what happened there.

[Blade6119]

Why would South Africa be seeded?

[SirFozzie]

home team gets a 1 seed automatically

[path12]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

in your documents/Sports Interactive/Football Manager 2010/editor data folder

(depending on your OS it may be My Documents instead of Documents, but once you get there, it'll go fine)

Thanks. Now to decide where to start.

[Big Fo]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

Quick question for the editor. Is there anyway I can force Sir Alex into retirement and have Martin O'Neil take the job at Man Utd?

Yeah. Just delete Ferguson's contract with Man Utd (or delete him from the game entirely if you want) and switch O'Neill's contract over to Man Utd if you want it like that from the start.

If you want that to happen a year or two into your career then I don't know if that is possible.

Hopefully Man Utd get someone else to succeed SAF in real life.

[GoldenEagle]

I think if Ferguson kicked over right now, it would be either O'Neil or Hughes. Mourinho would be a dream hire, but I don't see that happening.

I am really looking forward to game on Sunday.

[Big Fo]

Of anyone in the Premiership I'd bet it'd be Moyes. Sunday's game will be a tough one.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

Yeah. Just delete Ferguson's contract with Man Utd (or delete him from the game entirely if you want) and switch O'Neill's contract over to Man Utd if you want it like that from the start.

If you want that to happen a year or two into your career then I don't know if that is possible.

Hopefully Man Utd get someone else to succeed SAF in real life.

One tip is to change Ferguson's date of birth to sometime in the 1800s so he's so old he retires.

[GoldenEagle]

I thought he was born in the 1800s?

[RainMaker]

I have no idea on the WC seeding. That's just the pool I got thrown into. My crappy qualifying record dropped me to 22 in the World Rankings although I did pick up a 3-0 in a friendly vs Faroe Islands before the World Cup (USA! USA!).

[GoldenEagle]

Are there any kits or cut-out face packs available yet for 2010? Can you use the 2009 versions?

[GoldenEagle]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Go to database size, select custom, there is an option for load all players from a given nation/continent in there.

It looks like they made it easier to load players. I am assuming that if I load a continent, it picks up all the players in those countries.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

Are there any kits or cut-out face packs available yet for 2010? Can you use the 2009 versions?

Here's a link to the 2009 cutout mega-pack thread at SI Sports Interactive Community. 2009 facepacks will work but the 2010 cutout pack is due to be released on Nov. 9 so you may want to wait.

Sounds like this is the "Rolls Royce" of facepacks with both quality and depth. I didn't use this one last year(never saw the thread for it) but from reading that thread there are ~50,00 faces in the 2009 pack that include most of the lower leagues in Europe. There are updates to it released throughout the year as better photos are found or players are transferred. Not sure if I'll use it or not as, I believe, it's all or nothing with this pack (you can't just d'load the leagues you want) all of the faces have to be in one folder as there is one xml(new one released with each update) that controls the whole thing.

[pbot]

If 'the gap between attack and midfield is too big' what types of settings should I be adjusting? This is a consistent message I'm seeing in game when I check the feedback screen during games.

[samifan24]

Part of the reason why I haven't purchased this year's game is because I spent the last couple of versions trying to decipher the game's instructions on why I was losing. This like what pbot just posted, "the gap between attack and midfield is too big," would just drive me nuts. I'd switch to a diamond midfield so I could have DMC act as a link between the defense and the midfield and it still wouldn't make a difference. It's just one example but I wish FM made it easier to understand how players are supposed to fix these problems. I've played FM for many years and have only been really frustrated playing the last couple of versions.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by pbot

If 'the gap between attack and midfield is too big' what types of settings should I be adjusting? This is a consistent message I'm seeing in game when I check the feedback screen during games.

you need some players that go back and forth betwen the two. your midfield players should largely be "support" and your mentality should be "balanced" or even "fluid" so that they can transition back and forth between defense and attack. a "deep lying forward" or "trequartista" or "attacking midfielder" role on players will also help that as they'll move between the two easier

[Big Fo]

For about 20 seconds this game made me pretty angry just now. I'm up 3-2 over Arsenal in the 84th minute and need a win to maintain a six point lead with six rounds left in the league season. After Almunia makes a save the rebound falls to Rooney who is standing on the six yard line. Instead of tapping it in to clinch the three points he boots the ball out for a throw in so Song can receive treatment for an injury. Sportsmanship is nice and all but c'mon. I know Paulo di Canio did something similar once but he was on the edge of the area and might not have even gotten onto the cross. Rooney was six yards in front of an open net, I bet 99% of the guys in real life take a shot.

The anger was so short lived because my guys scored right after Arsenal threw the ball back to them, Evra got the ball, passed to Rooney, he played a 1-2 with Anderson then scored from the edge of the area, making it and 4-2. So it didn't cost me anything but it was just unusual imo.

[pbot]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

you need some players that go back and forth betwen the two. your midfield players should largely be "support" and your mentality should be "balanced" or even "fluid" so that they can transition back and forth between defense and attack. a "deep lying forward" or "trequartista" or "attacking midfielder" role on players will also help that as they'll move between the two easier

thanks

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by pbot

thanks

no problem. that being said - your ENTIRE midfield doesn't need to be support...you can play a diamond midfield and have your DMC as defensive, your wingers as "support" and your AMC as "attack". you might want to have one striker set as "support" too, particularly a deep-lying one is good for that - they'll drop back into midfield to try to facilitate the linking play

[DaddyTorgo]

wow - setting up friendlies is awesome now - i just went into it to do it before my season started and it now offers sorted lists by reputation of the clubs in the countries you choose

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

The anger was so short lived because my guys scored right after Arsenal threw the ball back to them, Evra got the ball, passed to Rooney, he played a 1-2 with Anderson then scored from the edge of the area, making it and 4-2. So it didn't cost me anything but it was just unusual imo.

Whether a player does this or not depends on his current mood and personality - some will be more sporting than others, some will be happy to blast the ball into the net.

(indeed very occasionally you'll see one team kick the ball off sportingly and the other team fail to return it to them afterwards - which is the 'done' thing ...)

[TroyF]

Any word on the PSP version Marc?

[pbot]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

no problem. that being said - your ENTIRE midfield doesn't need to be support...you can play a diamond midfield and have your DMC as defensive, your wingers as "support" and your AMC as "attack". you might want to have one striker set as "support" too, particularly a deep-lying one is good for that - they'll drop back into midfield to try to facilitate the linking play

Your pointer helped...I didn't move the whole midfield to support, just fiddled with the 'center' guy and changed one of my forwards...we (Grimsby) have looked much better in the 2-3 games I've played since. I still don't know what I'm doing...hopefully I'll improve.

Appreciate the assistance.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by pbot

Your pointer helped...I didn't move the whole midfield to support, just fiddled with the 'center' guy and changed one of my forwards...we (Grimsby) have looked much better in the 2-3 games I've played since. I still don't know what I'm doing...hopefully I'll improve.

Appreciate the assistance.

glad to hear it helped - happy to help anytime. And clearly you do know what you're doing at least a little, because that helped

[samifan24]

How's the gameplay video? Anyone seeing the choppiness we encountered while using the demo?

[dbd1963]

I'm on a Mac and mine is only rarely choppy. There is a crash bug when there's a one on one with the keeper, which it can be solved by turning off the sound, but that's where the video will often skip now.

I took over Chester in the Blue Square Premier. I didn't realize they had already been deducted 25 points when I agreed to take over. My job seems to be to reduce the wage bill while still keeping us competitive enough to stay up. It's almost impossible!

Reading here and at the SI forums, and downloading the Tactical Theorems '10 docs has helped a lot. But the main problem seems to have been morale, because we were just awful to begin the season while the morale was low. Slowly I got them turned around, using team talks and working the press. I understand that part at least.

The Tactical Theorems '10 doc has been very helpful in understanding player roles inside formations. With the new feature that shows how a player rates in those roles, it has become much easier for me to figure out how to play some of my players. I have a striker that is really good at just about everyting, so I can use him as complete striker. I just brought in another who is tall and has good target man skills. Together they have become deadly. I would not have figured any of that out without the TT'10 doc, so I recommend it to anyone who is new to the game. I think there is a link to it earlier in this thread.

I still don't know what the pixel guys should be doing, but I judge them on whether they can maintain possession and put the goalie under pressure when on offense, and whether they can gain possession or intercede when on defense. Not that I can do much about it with Chester's circumstances.. I have taken the assistant manager's advice on preferred moves, and whether a guy is worth keeping around or not. I have no way of knowing about the preferred moves, but it looks like he's been spot on with the player evaluations, so I'm just going to trust him for now.

Still, we have battled back to a spot where, if we are nearly perfect, we can gain the 20th spot and avoid relegation. We are playing so well now I really think it's possible.

Anyway, even though I don't know soccer too well, I absolutely love this game. It is a work of art, and the best text sim I've ever played.