2014-15 NFL Offseason Thread (Non Draft Edition)

[stevew]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

I wonder if Schwartz now gets a second shot as an NFL head coach?

As a kinda Bills fan, I hope the hell not.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

Wait.....what?


Doug Marrone opts out of contract with Buffalo Bills - ESPN


Marrone just quit as HC pf Bills?

Asked for an extension. Pegulas said no.

[Matthean]

Bills feel like a team on the verge too. You have to figure they could be in position to take over the AFC East once Brady is done.

[stevew]

Rex Ryan to the Bills seems like it would be amazing.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Bills feel like a team on the verge too. You have to figure they could be in position to take over the AFC East once Brady is done.

As long as the NFL bans the Quarterback position in the next few years, sure

[Thomkal]

Just enough time to add Marrone to the 2014 list of "Worse Decisions made". You've just had the first winning season for Buffalo n what 10 years or so, you just beat New England for the first time in even longer, and you try to use leverage on the new owners to get more money and job security? You are Doug Marrone not one of the best coaches of all time. Though you could have been on the way to being one of the best Buffalo coaches ever possibly if you had stayed and built on that good season. It sounded like Frank Reich (former Bill) was all set to come in as QB coach and/or OC too. To me it looked like things were looking up in Buffalo despite the loss of a 1st round pick this next year.

Wondering with the Buffalo fans on the board here, what they felt about Marrone if this contract option had never existed-a lot of excitement? people calling for him to be fired? Buffalo fans will vilify him if he ends up going to the Jets now, and rightly so.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Wondering with the Buffalo fans on the board here, what they felt about Marrone if this contract option had never existed-a lot of excitement? people calling for him to be fired? Buffalo fans will vilify him if he ends up going to the Jets now, and rightly so.

I'm not a Bills fan but I'm not sure I'd vilify him. They turned down his request for an extension and it looks like the same front office is going to be back and the team lacks a QB and a first-round pick.

If I was Marrone, I'd have jumped too.

[molson]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

If I was Marrone, I'd have jumped too.

Especially considering he's STILL getting Bills 2015 salary if he gets the Jets job.

[Chief Rum]

I know it's weird what you remember, but I have never been a Marrone fan on a personal level because he threw his old college QB Nassib under the bus in the days leading up to the 2013 draft. He was harsh about Nassib's prospects when rumors came around that Nassib might end up a first rounder (ironically, only EJ Manuel was picked in the first round).

Putting aside whether or not it was a fair evaluation, I was really surprised Marrone would be so critical of his own former college QB, and to me was a window into who Doug Marrone is. I.E. Kinda of a jerk.

So I am not sad to see him leave the Bills, and I hope they get someone better (and a QB for fuck's sake--maybe the Giants will trade them Nassib lol).

[BillJasper]

Frank Reich to Buffalo?

Report: Frank Reich “top target” in Buffalo | ProFootballTalk

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I know it's weird what you remember, but I have never been a Marrone fan on a personal level because he threw his old college QB Nassib under the bus in the days leading up to the 2013 draft. He was harsh about Nassib's prospects when rumors came around that Nassib might end up a first rounder (ironically, only EJ Manuel was picked in the first round).

Putting aside whether or not it was a fair evaluation, I was really surprised Marrone would be so critical of his own former college QB, and to me was a window into who Doug Marrone is. I.E. Kinda of a jerk.

So I am not sad to see him leave the Bills, and I hope they get someone better (and a QB for fuck's sake--maybe the Giants will trade them Nassib lol).

I was trying to find the pre-draft comments about Nassib that you are referring to, and my google fu can't find them, just the post-draft ones where he's asked about not taking Nassib a lot. Which ones, pre-draft, are you referring to?

[Buccaneer]

All I remember is that there the usual media hype that such a pairing would be cool (as in how often had that happened). But the organization apparently had Manuel above Nassib and went with that. Perhaps it was the media that had the outcry of how you could pass over your own QB?!? I still follow Nassib on the Giants.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

Frank Reich to Buffalo?

Report: Frank Reich “top target” in Buffalo | ProFootballTalk

He'll only coach in the second halves of games they are losing.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

All I remember is that there the usual media hype that such a pairing would be cool (as in how often had that happened). But the organization apparently had Manuel above Nassib and went with that. Perhaps it was the media that had the outcry of how you could pass over your own QB?!? I still follow Nassib on the Giants.

Yeah, his post-draft pick questions and such are okay. He's not throwing Nassib under the bus or anything.

For example, this is his answer to one of teh questions asked about the draft and why not Nassib:


"In one sense, you study all the quarterbacks and you get the one you believe is the best one, and you're happy. You're ecstatic," Marrone told King. "In another sense, you're hurting about Ryan. And it did hurt. ... It was very difficult after what we did together. It hurts. It definitely hurts. He's a special kid. Unbelievable worker. So smart. Very, very good quarterback with all the intangibles. He will win games in this league."




That's from SI and Peter King. I'm trying to find pre-draft criticism though, as CR Mentioned. But my Google searches have never really keen that skilled.



Another article:

Doug Marrone thinks 'media really pumped up' Ryan Nassib connection - CBSSports.com

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Just enough time to add Marrone to the 2014 list of "Worse Decisions made". You've just had the first winning season for Buffalo n what 10 years or so, you just beat New England for the first time in even longer, and you try to use leverage on the new owners to get more money and job security? You are Doug Marrone not one of the best coaches of all time. Though you could have been on the way to being one of the best Buffalo coaches ever possibly if you had stayed and built on that good season. It sounded like Frank Reich (former Bill) was all set to come in as QB coach and/or OC too. To me it looked like things were looking up in Buffalo despite the loss of a 1st round pick this next year.

Wondering with the Buffalo fans on the board here, what they felt about Marrone if this contract option had never existed-a lot of excitement? people calling for him to be fired? Buffalo fans will vilify him if he ends up going to the Jets now, and rightly so.

I wonder if there was a struggle where he wanted to play Orton because he felt he would give them a better chance to win. Management said no and they aren't going to pay Orton. Orton retires rather than trying to find yet another job. Coach realizes he doesn't control his future if he can't choose what QB he wants and bails.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Bills feel like a team on the verge too. You have to figure they could be in position to take over the AFC East once Brady is done.

Still have to find a QB.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by rowech

I wonder if there was a struggle where he wanted to play Orton because he felt he would give them a better chance to win. Management said no and they aren't going to pay Orton. Orton retires rather than trying to find yet another job. Coach realizes he doesn't control his future if he can't choose what QB he wants and bails.

I think some were pissed that he didn't play EJ in the last game against the Pats.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

Still have to find a QB.

"Well, duh." They have time to do so. I just don't see the need to bail on a team that obviously could be in a great position if invested in unless there is something else going on.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I was trying to find the pre-draft comments about Nassib that you are referring to, and my google fu can't find them, just the post-draft ones where he's asked about not taking Nassib a lot. Which ones, pre-draft, are you referring to?

I actually think I heard about it on talk radio, probably the DP Show or Turd on my morning drive. They would have referenced where they got it at the time, but of course, I don't recall that. I just know there was a lot of QB talk leading up to that draft (as usual), and most of it was about whether Geno Smith was worthy of a first rounder. There was a period where Nassib was talked up by the "experts" and from what I heard Marrone was asked about Nassib and basically talked him down, said he wasn't worth a first round pick.

The Bills kinda backed Marrone up, too, by picking Manuel instead of Nassib (not that Nassib deserved it--or Manuel for that matter).

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I actually think I heard about it on talk radio, probably the DP Show or Turd on my morning drive. They would have referenced where they got it at the time, but of course, I don't recall that. I just know there was a lot of QB talk leading up to that draft (as usual), and most of it was about whether Geno Smith was worthy of a first rounder. There was a period where Nassib was talked up by the "experts" and from what I heard Marrone was asked about Nassib and basically talked him down, said he wasn't worth a first round pick.

The Bills kinda backed Marrone up, too, by picking Manuel instead of Nassib (not that Nassib deserved it--or Manuel for that matter).

And you think those comments went beyond your normal pre-draft smokescreen? I wish I could find them somewhere, I'd like to take a look at them and see. I didn't recall them when you mentioned it, and I thought, maybe there's more to this guy that I recall, so I'm just trying to see if I can get a good eye on him, you know?

[stevew]

I remember thinking that Maronne fueled the rise of Nassib up the draft boards and it was surprising that he fell all the way down to the 4th round. It was legit in play that the would go Nassib in the first round pre-draft.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

And you think those comments went beyond your normal pre-draft smokescreen? I wish I could find them somewhere, I'd like to take a look at them and see. I didn't recall them when you mentioned it, and I thought, maybe there's more to this guy that I recall, so I'm just trying to see if I can get a good eye on him, you know?

I think what added legitimacy to me was that the story supposedly included direct quotes from Marrone. It wasn't a rumors behind the scenes, it was a "he said this".

I don't have the first clue where to find that stuff. I didn't really think a situation would call for it to come up. I know what I heard/saw but for sure you shouldn't take it into account if you can't find anything to back it up.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by Matthean

"Well, duh." They have time to do so. I just don't see the need to bail on a team that obviously could be in a great position if invested in unless there is something else going on.

They've been trying to find one since 1997 or so:

Player Yrs W/Bills Starts
Todd Collins 1995-1997 17 2nd Round Pick
Doug Flutie 1998-2000 30
Rob Johnson 1998-2001 26 *Traded for 1st and 4th Round Pick
Alex Van Pelt 1997,2001 11
Drew Bledsoe 2002-2004 48 *Traded for 1st Round Pick
J.P. Losman 2004-2008 33 *1st Round Pick (Bills traded up to get him)
Kelly Holcomb 2005 8
Trent Edwards 2007-2010 32 *3rd Round Pick
Ryan Fitzpatrick 2009-2012 53
Brian Brohm 2009-10 2
E.J. Manuel 2013-2014 14 *1st Round Pick
Thaddeus Lewis 2013 5
Jeff Tuel 2013 1
Kyle Orton 2014 12

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I actually think I heard about it on talk radio, probably the DP Show or Turd on my morning drive. They would have referenced where they got it at the time, but of course, I don't recall that. I just know there was a lot of QB talk leading up to that draft (as usual), and most of it was about whether Geno Smith was worthy of a first rounder. There was a period where Nassib was talked up by the "experts" and from what I heard Marrone was asked about Nassib and basically talked him down, said he wasn't worth a first round pick.

The Bills kinda backed Marrone up, too, by picking Manuel instead of Nassib (not that Nassib deserved it--or Manuel for that matter).

There was a report before the draft that EJ Manuel was the guy Marrone wanted.

2013 NFL Draft rumors: Doug Marrone likes E.J. Manuel - Buffalo Rumblings

[BillJasper]

I feel Bryce Petty's draft stock sliding. That last series was dreadful.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

I feel Bryce Petty's draft stock sliding. That last series was dreadful.

He's never really impressed me much. Anyone that watched the WVU game could see that his decision making and accuracy breaks down horribly when he's pressured.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Just enough time to add Marrone to the 2014 list of "Worse Decisions made". You've just had the first winning season for Buffalo n what 10 years or so, you just beat New England for the first time in even longer, and you try to use leverage on the new owners to get more money and job security? You are Doug Marrone not one of the best coaches of all time. Though you could have been on the way to being one of the best Buffalo coaches ever possibly if you had stayed and built on that good season. It sounded like Frank Reich (former Bill) was all set to come in as QB coach and/or OC too. To me it looked like things were looking up in Buffalo despite the loss of a 1st round pick this next year.

Wondering with the Buffalo fans on the board here, what they felt about Marrone if this contract option had never existed-a lot of excitement? people calling for him to be fired? Buffalo fans will vilify him if he ends up going to the Jets now, and rightly so.

It's only the worst decision if he doesn't land in a better position.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I think what added legitimacy to me was that the story supposedly included direct quotes from Marrone. It wasn't a rumors behind the scenes, it was a "he said this".

I don't have the first clue where to find that stuff. I didn't really think a situation would call for it to come up. I know what I heard/saw but for sure you shouldn't take it into account if you can't find anything to back it up.

You had me at talk radio.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

There is zero chance that the Bears organization hires Rex Ryan. Compare that personality to Dick Jauron, Lovie Smith, and Marc Trestman. The front office has had massive Ditka backlash for the last two decades of hires. I'll expect some nameless entity who has never coached in the NFL before, and hope that person accidentally turns out to be decent.

Saw this earlier today, seems to re-affirm the opinion I had above.
Report: Bears Have No Interest In Rex Ryan « CBS Chicago

With Dan Quinn and Adam Gase filling the role of "nameless entity" ... can't speak to how either is in a press conference but I'm guessing about 180 degrees opposite of Ryan.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Saw this earlier today, seems to re-affirm the opinion I had above.
Report: Bears Have No Interest In Rex Ryan « CBS Chicago

With Dan Quinn and Adam Gase filling the role of "nameless entity" ... can't speak to how either is in a press conference but I'm guessing about 180 degrees opposite of Ryan.

Gase interviewed but didn't make the list of coaches recommended to George McCaskey by his committee. He's only 36 and has 2 years of experience as a coordinator. That's probably what's working against him.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Saw this earlier today, seems to re-affirm the opinion I had above.
Report: Bears Have No Interest In Rex Ryan « CBS Chicago

With Dan Quinn and Adam Gase filling the role of "nameless entity" ... can't speak to how either is in a press conference but I'm guessing about 180 degrees opposite of Ryan.

Agree with you on that. I'd love Ryan here. I think he'd fit in well with the team and fans. But the Bears aren't going to bring in anyone who has a personality or could stir the pot a little. They still want complete control despite their endless failures and don't want a coach to become too powerful.

[stevew]

Steelers should (at the minimum) retire LeBeau tomorrow and seriously consider a HC change. Whomever comes in could radically overhaul an ancient defense and find an effective modern scheme that does not take 3 years to learn. And a GM change would be great but that would just give the unfireable Tomlin more power. Can't wait til we draft another dud linebacker.

[NobodyHere]

The Bills have requested to talk to the Colt's Pep Hamilton.

I'd hate to see Andrew Luck have 3 OCs in 4 years.

[stevew]

I'm sure Luck will be fine.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by stevew

Steelers should (at the minimum) retire LeBeau tomorrow and seriously consider a HC change. Whomever comes in could radically overhaul an ancient defense and find an effective modern scheme that does not take 3 years to learn. And a GM change would be great but that would just give the unfireable Tomlin more power. Can't wait til we draft another dud linebacker.

You understand you were missing the guy who accounted for over a third of your offense? You can't lose the guy your offense is completely built around, have a short week, and pretend that's not going to impact things.

They probably need to make some changes on defense but I'm not sure there's a lot to change.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by stevew

Steelers should (at the minimum) retire LeBeau tomorrow and seriously consider a HC change. Whomever comes in could radically overhaul an ancient defense and find an effective modern scheme that does not take 3 years to learn. And a GM change would be great but that would just give the unfireable Tomlin more power. Can't wait til we draft another dud linebacker.

meh

I'm glad the Giants don't make change for the sake of change. Do you really want your team to turn into the Browns or the Raiders? Thats what happens when you make coaching changes just because.

[weegeebored]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

...But the Bears aren't going to bring in anyone who has a personality or could stir the pot a little. They still want complete control despite their endless failures and don't want a coach to become too powerful.

Definitely agree with you here. Ryan and Ditka have similar coaching personalities and Bears ownership wants a quiet "Yes" man. Lovie was in Chicago five years too long because Virginia liked him a lot. Shouldn't the Bears be concentrating on a GM first anyway? The new coach isn't going to win with this roster either, so hire some low-paid schmuck for a couple/three years while the (excellent; superb; knowledgeable) GM builds it up. The current Bears organization really doesn't have any football savvy whatsoever. I know that this is probably going to lead to a "be careful what you wish for" scenario but I really am looking forward to new ownership, whenever that may happen.

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by rowech

You understand you were missing the guy who accounted for over a third of your offense? You can't lose the guy your offense is completely built around, have a short week, and pretend that's not going to impact things.

They probably need to make some changes on defense but I'm not sure there's a lot to change.

Exactly. Half of their issue in the game was their lack of a running game.

[MacroGuru]

And the rumor mill this morning is Marrone was pissed about the move to get Watkins...is it really enough to walk away from though? When Sammy was in, he played amazing and if he can stay healthy, it will be a great trade and pick.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by MacroGuru

And the rumor mill this morning is Marrone was pissed about the move to get Watkins...is it really enough to walk away from though? When Sammy was in, he played amazing and if he can stay healthy, it will be a great trade and pick.

But if you have no one to get him the ball, you might be in trouble. With Orton retiring, I think Marrone's resignation tells everyone exactly what he thinks of E.J. Manuel. Plus, with no 1st-round pick, they aren't in a position to get someone who might be ready to play.

Essentially, no QB, no 1st-round pick, an inept front office (that doesn't look to be changing anytime soon) and the team rejecting a request for an extension made Marrone decide Buffalo wasn't the job for him.

[claphamsa]

hopefully the bengals are on the hunt for a QB...

[rowech]

Originally Posted by claphamsa

hopefully the bengals are on the hunt for a QB...

Would prefer they try a new coach first. Palmer-Johnson to Dalton-Green, Rudi Johnson to Hill/Benard, defense so much better now, etc. New offensive coordinators, new defensive coordinators, and there's only one thing left to change. Yes, it could be a bad decision and send them backwards but they aren't going forward with Lewis running the team. He simply lacks the attention to detail, and the ability to get his players to pay attention to the same detail.

Today was about lacking a lot of key parts but year after year, good can't be good enough anymore. It's simply time for a change to revitalize a team and hopefully find a new spark, new ideas, etc. to get them over the hump.

Yes, it could be time for a new QB as well but I'd rather try a new coach first.

[BillJasper]

I would be absolutely shocked if either Lewis or Dalton go anywhere.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by rowech

Would prefer they try a new coach first. Palmer-Johnson to Dalton-Green, Rudi Johnson to Hill/Benard, defense so much better now, etc. New offensive coordinators, new defensive coordinators, and there's only one thing left to change. Yes, it could be a bad decision and send them backwards but they aren't going forward with Lewis running the team. He simply lacks the attention to detail, and the ability to get his players to pay attention to the same detail.

Today was about lacking a lot of key parts but year after year, good can't be good enough anymore. It's simply time for a change to revitalize a team and hopefully find a new spark, new ideas, etc. to get them over the hump.

Yes, it could be time for a new QB as well but I'd rather try a new coach first.

I think a coach change at this point removes the Bengals from wher ethey are, and in a few years of rotational head coaches, fans will begin to yearn for the ood old Marvin Lewis days, without anything to show for it.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

I think a coach change at this point removes the Bengals from wher ethey are, and in a few years of rotational head coaches, fans will begin to yearn for the ood old Marvin Lewis days, without anything to show for it.

I wouldn't be surprised by it but I'm willin to risk it at this point. My guess is that Bengals fans would be as close to being split 50-50 in the past. However, I think it's a growing sentiment that somethin has to change and his message has grown a bit stale.

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

I would be absolutely shocked if either Lewis or Dalton go anywhere.

oh for sure...doesnt mean it doesnt suck

[JPhillips]

I don't think Marvin will get the team much farther, but Mike Brown would almost certainly hire someone worse and take back a lot of personnel control.

That's the purgatory of being a Bengals fan; they aren't good enough and if they make changes they'll get worse.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by stevew

Steelers should (at the minimum) retire LeBeau tomorrow and seriously consider a HC change. Whomever comes in could radically overhaul an ancient defense and find an effective modern scheme that does not take 3 years to learn. And a GM change would be great but that would just give the unfireable Tomlin more power. Can't wait til we draft another dud linebacker.

I don't think you can expect much more out of a defensive coordinator given the "talent" in the defensive backfield. Polamalu has been a liability for the past two years. He's no longer a freak athlete and is really no better than a small, situational linebacker at this point. Mitchell has a ridiculously low football IQ. I don't know the status of his contract, but if we could shed the two starting safeties and Ike, it seems like there should be some resources available to make the DB situation average or better. I think the front 7 has enough pieces to continue being good.

We definitely need to draft another RB in the first 3-4 rounds. Then we can continue to run Bell into the ground for the next few years and let him go after his rookie deal.

[Marmel]

Re. Marrone, a lot of Cuse fans hate him for leaving. I don't. Although a little (OK a lot) conservative in his play calling, he is a tremendous game day coach. He took a college team in the bottom 10 of all of football to bowl games in just a couple years. He took a terrible Bills team to a winning record without a QB. The guy has a track record and can easily get a better job than Buffalo. Plus there was some bad blood there.

And regarding Nassib, Marrone did nothing to hurt his draft position. He is the reason there was some talk that Nassib might be a 1st round choice.

[stevew]

Mike Mitchell is among my all time least favorite Steelers ever. I hope and pray he's gone. Troy and Ike are beyond done as well.

I'm just tired of all these linebackers that get no pressure and cost high draft picks. I have heard talk that Shazier might move to SS, which seems like it could work better.