That was quite a hit....

MrBug708 · 06-07-2005, 01:23 AM

Anyone see Darin Erstad level Estrada of the Braves? Darin hits pretty damn hard for a former punter. Estrada was knocked out and Erstad was lucky he didn't separate his shoulder. The Braves bench was pretty pissed and while it could have been avoided, it was clean.

sovereignstar · 06-07-2005, 01:24 AM

Is Estrada from California?

MrBug708 · 06-07-2005, 01:48 AM

Younger Cousin I believe

Chief Rum · 06-07-2005, 02:01 AM

I'm an Angels fan. I'm a big Darin Erstad fan. I think he's terrific.

That all said, I think that play was just unecessary. Estrada was giving Ersty the outside of the plate, and a clear shot to score (although probably unintentionally).

I know Erstad plays hard-nosed and tough, but I think he decided too soon that he needed to go to the full collision, and then lacked the control to pull out of it when he might have seen it wasn't necessary.

I wouldn't be against seeing Darin sat down for a few days for that one. I hope Estrada is okay.

CR

korme · 06-07-2005, 02:44 AM

It's part of the game. Deal with it. Erstad was just playing the part of Pete Rose. Estrada was an average impression of Ray Fosse.

MacroGuru · 06-07-2005, 08:38 AM

Honestly, if the catcher can't take the shot, he shouldn't be playing the position.

Balldog · 06-07-2005, 09:36 AM

I agree with Julio Franco here:
"...I don't mind the hit, I mind the location of the hit. He could have hit lower, that's fine with me. Hitting a guy like that, in his face, could cause major damage to his health."

I'm thinking Erstad is going to get drilled before this series is over. More than likely it wasn't intentional but Estrada is lucky to be moving.

JonInMiddleGA · 06-07-2005, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shorty3281

It's part of the game. Deal with it.

I'm with Shorty on this one.

Buzzbee · 06-07-2005, 11:15 AM

A lot of radio talk show fodder for today. From listening during my drive in, most seem to think it was a clean hit and part of the game. Yet they are still calling for retaliation.

If it was a clean hit, why retaliate?

The hit is over. Now the question becomes - do the Braves retaliate? If so, how?

My opinion, the first time Erstad comes up, throw it at his feet. I never agree with throwing at the head. Plunking him in the ribs would send a clearer message, but would also probably result in the Angels retaliating. A toss at the feet sends the message that the Braves didn't like it, but it might allow things to die down rather than escalate.

What are your thoughts? Should the Braves retaliate, and if so how?

Logan · 06-07-2005, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buzzbee

My opinion, the first time Erstad comes up, throw it at his feet. I never agree with throwing at the head. Plunking him in the ribs would send a clearer message, but would also probably result in the Angels retaliating. A toss at the feet sends the message that the Braves didn't like it, but it might allow things to die down rather than escalate.

It also sends the message that the Braves pitcher is a pussy who couldn't deal with Erstad charging the mound if he got hit by a real pitch.

Fastball into the ribs = clear message sent. End of disagreement.

Fastball at the head = invitation for much more to go down.

Ramzavail · 06-07-2005, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balldog

I agree with Julio Franco here:
"...I don't mind the hit, I mind the location of the hit. He could have hit lower, that's fine with me. Hitting a guy like that, in his face, could cause major damage to his health."

I'm thinking Erstad is going to get drilled before this series is over. More than likely it wasn't intentional but Estrada is lucky to be moving.

Lower? If he went lower and took his knees out, THEN, I'd be a dirty play.

I just don't understand that.

Balldog · 06-07-2005, 11:35 AM

If Erstad gets drilled anywhere besides in the head area both benches will be warned and everything will likely be over.

Balldog · 06-07-2005, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramzavail

Lower? If he went lower and took his knees out, THEN, I'd be a dirty play.

I just don't understand that.

He drilled him right in the face, typically the contact is in the chest area.

Ramzavail · 06-07-2005, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balldog

He drilled him right in the face, typically the contact is in the chest area.

Don't catchers wear masks?....next time wear it, don't complain and be sure nobody will try to hit you in your face or they will break their wrists.

Buzzbee · 06-07-2005, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logan

It also sends the message that the Braves pitcher is a pussy who couldn't deal with Erstad charging the mound if he got hit by a real pitch.

Fastball into the ribs = clear message sent. End of disagreement.

I'm not so sure it would be the end of the disagreement. It wouldn't seem far-fetched to think that plunking him in the ribs would lead to the Angels throwing at Braves players.

However, one thing that migh help is that the Braves don't have anybody worth throwing at. Chipper is on the DL and Andruw Jones would probably swing and miss.

MacroGuru · 06-07-2005, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balldog

He drilled him right in the face, typically the contact is in the chest area.

A catcher is taught to take the shot like a RB would, drop the shoulder. I always leaned into it when the runner came in, I was able to block the entire plate, but only give the runner a shoulder, or knee to run into....

Estrade was in the process of dropping into position when he took the shot, it wasn't illegal, it was a hard hit, and Estrada, pure and simple, couldn't take it.

Balldog · 06-07-2005, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramzavail

Don't catchers wear masks?....next time wear it, don't complain and be sure nobody will try to hit you in your face or they will break their wrists.

If Erstad goes into the collision with his hands yes, but he went shoulder first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by indoorsoccersim

Estrade was in the process of dropping into position when he took the shot, it wasn't illegal, it was a hard hit, and Estrada, pure and simple, couldn't take it.

So basically Estrada is a pussy. Ok.

I'm not a Braves fan by any means, but I doubt there is ONE catcher in baseball that could have taken that hit.

I'm not saying it was illegal, it was legal but it was dirty...with intent or without intent.

DeToxRox · 06-07-2005, 01:08 PM

Estrada didn't give up anything but his head and legs. He crouched do low that Erstad couldn't hit him in the ribs without spearing him down. Either way, it happens.

MacroGuru · 06-07-2005, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Balldog

I'm not a Braves fan by any means, but I doubt there is ANYONE in baseball that could have taken that hit.

Fixed it for you.

Solecismic · 06-07-2005, 01:19 PM

Fair enough. Now, let's say, the Braves sign Ray Lewis to pinch run, kind of an ersatz Herb Washington.

Lewis on third... here's the pitch... and Lewis is stealing home. The pitch beats him home by 40 feet. Lewis lowers his shoulder, and...

Seems like this is a rule that needs to be changed. If the catcher has clear possession of the ball before contact is initiated, then he should not be required to maintain possession after a legitimate tag.

John Galt · 06-07-2005, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shorty3281

It's part of the game. Deal with it. Erstad was just playing the part of Pete Rose. Estrada was an average impression of Ray Fosse.

I'm of the mind that it really isn't part of the game. The rules expressly bar these collisions that occur at the plate. At one time, the rule was actually enforced. Now, however, it has become normal to allow a player to block the plate without the ball and I think it has created a lot of unnecessary injuries. And for the rare instances when the catcher actually has the ball (which usually wouldn't be set up the way they are if they kept catchers off the line until the ball arrives), the rule should be more explicit. Imagine the outcry if a 3rd baseman and runner just collided full speed 10 feet down the line to 2nd base. Why it is "part of the game" because a catcher has pads has always confused me.

heybrad · 06-07-2005, 01:21 PM

Yep... I've never understood why the catcher is fair game. If thats the case, why not blast the player at any base.

CHEMICAL SOLDIER · 06-07-2005, 01:29 PM

Pix please.

VPI97 · 06-07-2005, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solecismic

Seems like this is a rule that needs to be changed. If the catcher has clear possession of the ball before contact is initiated, then he should not be required to maintain possession after a legitimate tag.

Exactly. Plays like this are the part of the game I hate the most. The fact that a play at the plate has evolved into a question of whether that catcher can survive a hit is ridiculous. Nowhere else in the game is contact like this allowed and it's beyond me how it has become an accepatable part of the sport.

How is Erstad knocking the ball away from Estrada any different than Alex Rodriguez trying to slap the ball out of that Red Sox pitcher's hand last year? Yet Erstad is "playing the game like he should" and A.Rod is called a wuss? If Rodriguez would have lowered his shoulder on his way to first and jacked up the pitcher, would that be legal? How is a play at the plate any different?

Buzzbee · 06-07-2005, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VPI97

Exactly. Plays like this are the part of the game I hate the most. The fact that a play at the plate has evolved into a question of whether that catcher can survive a hit is ridiculous. Nowhere else in the game is contact like this allowed and it's beyond me how it has become an accepatable part of the sport.

How is Erstad knocking the ball away from Estrada any different than Alex Rodriguez trying to slap the ball out of that Red Sox pitcher's hand last year? Yet Erstad is "playing the game like he should" and A.Rod is called a wuss? If Rodriguez would have lowered his shoulder on his way to first and jacked up the pitcher, would that be legal? How is a play at the plate any different?

Just playing devil's advocate.

What about trying to break up a double play? As long as the runner can reach the bag, the SS/2B is fair game.

damnMikeBrown · 06-07-2005, 01:46 PM

I once was cought in a run-down after having been picked off 1st. I went through maybe 4 throws, and decided "enough of this". I went towards second, guy takes the throw and is in my way. He's not any where near the base. I thought "it's my baseline, and he's in my way" I _plowed_ through him, and got thrown out of the game. I thought unfairly. He didn't drop the ball, I was out, but I got pitched too. I thought it was ridiculous. Did I just not know the rules of the game? I thought the baseline was mine and that anybody blocking it was ok to run over/through.

VPI97 · 06-07-2005, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buzzbee

Just playing devil's advocate.

What about trying to break up a double play? As long as the runner can reach the bag, the SS/2B is fair game.

Rule 7.09 - (g) If, in the judgment of the umpire, a base runner willfully and deliberately interferes with a batted ball or a fielder in the act of fielding a batted ball with the obvious intent to break up a double play, the ball is dead. The umpire shall call the runner out for interference and also call out the batter runner because of the action of his teammate. In no event may bases be run or runs scored because of such action by a runner.

If a runner deliberately tries to interfere with the completion of a double play, the batter should be called out.

rkmsuf · 06-07-2005, 01:53 PM

why the heck is the catcher allowed to block the plate in the first place? Seems stupid. Why can't you block 3rd or 2nd?

VPI97 · 06-07-2005, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

why the heck is the catcher allowed to block the plate in the first place? Seems stupid. Why can't you block 3rd or 2nd?

You're allowed to block any base if you are fielding the ball or making a tag. The fact that MLB doesn't enforce this rule when it pertains to catchers blocking the plate without the ball is what has made home plate collisions more acceptable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by damnMikeBrown

Did I just not know the rules of the game? I thought the baseline was mine and that anybody blocking it was ok to run over/through.

If they had the ball, they have as much of a right to be in the basepath as you did.

QuikSand · 06-07-2005, 02:08 PM

Why on earth would you quote the official rules of baseball to try to settle anything?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Official Rules

The STRIKE ZONE is that area over home plate the upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants, and the lower level is a line at the hollow beneath the knee cap. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter's stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball.

rkmsuf · 06-07-2005, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VPI97

You're allowed to block any base if you are fielding the ball or making a tag. The fact that MLB doesn't enforce this rule when it pertains to catchers blocking the plate without the ball is what has made home plate collisions more acceptable.

If they had the ball, they have as much of a right to be in the basepath as you did.

So how come you never see the third baseman knelt down in front of the base receiving the throw? I mean some tough guys should wear kevlar and do it.

VPI97 · 06-07-2005, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Why on earth would you quote the official rules of baseball to try to settle anything?

I know, I know.... I just think it's a shame when collisions at the plate are encouraged by the non-inforcement of the rules. I think back to the famous Sid Bream play in the Braves/Pirates NLCS of '91 (or was it '92?). In today's MLB, Mike Lavalliere would have just as likely been camped out in the basepath awaiting the throw and Bream would have had to level him just to get anywhere close to the plate.

DeToxRox · 06-07-2005, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

So how come you never see the third baseman knelt down in front of the base receiving the throw? I mean some tough guys should wear kevlar and do it.

Because a third basemen or second basemen gets spiked.

Catchers are pretty immune to spikes and would do more damage to the base runner trying to slide home. There's only one way past them and that's through them.

DeToxRox · 06-07-2005, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeToxRoxDVHStyle

Because a third basemen or second basemen gets spiked.

Catchers are pretty immune to spikes and would do more damage to the base runner trying to slide home. There's only one way past them and that's through them.

I should restate: They are not totally immune to being spiked. They can still take a spike to the thigh or whatever, but they're more suited for the impact then a fielder is.

hhiipp · 06-07-2005, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Why on earth would you quote the official rules of baseball to try to settle anything?

I'd love to see the ACTUAL strikezone be called instead of the very limited area in every hitters wheel-house.

ISiddiqui · 06-07-2005, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VPI97

You're allowed to block any base if you are fielding the ball or making a tag. The fact that MLB doesn't enforce this rule when it pertains to catchers blocking the plate without the ball is what has made home plate collisions more acceptable.

And I think that is the problem. When catchers are totally blocking the base path, what is a base runner supposed to do? Pull a Willie Mays Hayes and jump over him?

Under the conventions of baseball as they have evolved with catchers blocking home plate, Erstad did nothing wrong.

Logan · 06-07-2005, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VPI97

How is Erstad knocking the ball away from Estrada any different than Alex Rodriguez trying to slap the ball out of that Red Sox pitcher's hand last year? Yet Erstad is "playing the game like he should" and A.Rod is called a wuss? If Rodriguez would have lowered his shoulder on his way to first and jacked up the pitcher, would that be legal? How is a play at the plate any different?

Because it is different. Everyone remembers Albert Belle completely decking 2B Fernando Vina after he fielded a ball and was trying to tag out Belle in the baseline. Belle not only was called out for doing it, but he was suspended.

Balldog · 06-07-2005, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by damnMikeBrown

I once was cought in a run-down after having been picked off 1st. I went through maybe 4 throws, and decided "enough of this". I went towards second, guy takes the throw and is in my way. He's not any where near the base. I thought "it's my baseline, and he's in my way" I _plowed_ through him, and got thrown out of the game. I thought unfairly. He didn't drop the ball, I was out, but I got pitched too. I thought it was ridiculous. Did I just not know the rules of the game? I thought the baseline was mine and that anybody blocking it was ok to run over/through.

I'm assuming this is high school? If it is and you "plowed through him" the ruling in OHSAA is to eject the runner. However, this year I was told by an ump that there is no baseline when a runner is in a run down to which I asked if the runner could run uptown and get something to eat and not be out of the baseline. I was told "according to the rulebook, yes."

VPI97 · 06-07-2005, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logan

Because it is different.

How?

In the rulebook, there's no distinction made between what fielder a runner is attempting to dislodge the ball from. Whether it's Belle/Vina or Erstad/Estrada, the applicable rule is the same, yet they're enforced differently...that's what I have a problem with.

damnMikeBrown · 06-07-2005, 05:27 PM

Wow, I totally thought I was within my right to the base line...to get to the base through anything that was in my way.

Oops, I'll have to start regretting the ugly things I said about that ump all that time...

MrBug708 · 06-07-2005, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heybrad

Yep... I've never understood why the catcher is fair game. If thats the case, why not blast the player at any base.

Because it's unlike any other base. It counts as a run against the team. Unlike second or third you must stay on the base which is why sliding occurs. You also don't see a second basemen standing in front of second base blocking a SB. If a catcher doesnt want to get nailed, he better be standing out of the batters box and be able to apply the tag. A hell of a lot easier said then done.

Buzzbee · 06-07-2005, 05:55 PM

Game 2 will be starting in a little while. Any bets on whether or not the Braves retaliate?

sovereignstar · 06-07-2005, 06:43 PM

Retaliation MLB-style? meh. You want to retaliate correctly, you fuck the guy's wife. If you're gay, shoot bottle rockets at the other team's dugout.

MrBug708 · 06-07-2005, 06:46 PM

I never saw Piazza doing that towards the Yankees or now, the Stros. Allegedly....

Crapshoot · 06-07-2005, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VPI97

Exactly. Plays like this are the part of the game I hate the most. The fact that a play at the plate has evolved into a question of whether that catcher can survive a hit is ridiculous. Nowhere else in the game is contact like this allowed and it's beyond me how it has become an accepatable part of the sport.

How is Erstad knocking the ball away from Estrada any different than Alex Rodriguez trying to slap the ball out of that Red Sox pitcher's hand last year? Yet Erstad is "playing the game like he should" and A.Rod is called a wuss? If Rodriguez would have lowered his shoulder on his way to first and jacked up the pitcher, would that be legal? How is a play at the plate any different?

Bingo. If I wanted to see players hitting each other senseless, I'd watch the NFL.

korme · 06-07-2005, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sovereignstar

Retaliation MLB-style? meh. You want to retaliate correctly, you fuck the guy's wife. If you're gay, shoot bottle rockets at the other team's dugout.

Hell of a situation we got here. Two on, two out, your team down a run and you've got the chance to be the hero on national television... if you don't blow it. Saw your wife last night. Great little dancer. That guy she was with? I'm sure he's a close personal friend, but tell me, what was he doing with her panties on his head?

nilodor · 06-07-2005, 06:58 PM

I love how one of the articles (cnnsi or cbs-sportline) I was meantioned that he was an ex-football player several times in the article. They never meantioned that he was a punter though. Probably because it took the edge off their story.

sovereignstar · 06-07-2005, 07:09 PM

FWIW, Darin also played hockey in high school.

JonInMiddleGA · 06-07-2005, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VPI97

Rule 7.09 - (g) If, in the judgment of the umpire, a base runner willfully and deliberately interferes with a batted ball or a fielder in the act of fielding a batted ball with the obvious intent to break up a double play, the ball is dead. The umpire shall call the runner out for interference and also call out the batter runner because of the action of his teammate. In no event may bases be run or runs scored because of such action by a runner.

If a runner deliberately tries to interfere with the completion of a double play, the batter should be called out.

Umm, I don't think so because AFAIK, there's a distinction between batted ball (as rule 7.09 states) and thrown ball as in the case of your standard broken-up-double-play.

7.09 prevents the runner grabbing the second baseman & holding onto him while he's trying to make the initial play.

st.cronin · 06-07-2005, 07:57 PM

Estrada's a girlieman, getting taken out by a frickin' KICKER.

06-07-2005, 02:01 AM	#4
Chief Rum Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Where Hip Hop lives	I'm an Angels fan. I'm a big Darin Erstad fan. I think he's terrific. That all said, I think that play was just unecessary. Estrada was giving Ersty the outside of the plate, and a clear shot to score (although probably unintentionally). I know Erstad plays hard-nosed and tough, but I think he decided too soon that he needed to go to the full collision, and then lacked the control to pull out of it when he might have seen it wasn't necessary. I wouldn't be against seeing Darin sat down for a few days for that one. I hope Estrada is okay. CR __________________ . . I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.

06-07-2005, 08:38 AM	#6
MacroGuru Coordinator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Utah	Honestly, if the catcher can't take the shot, he shouldn't be playing the position. __________________ "forgetting what is in the past, I strive for the future"

06-07-2005, 11:15 AM	#9
Buzzbee College Starter Join Date: Jun 2002	A lot of radio talk show fodder for today. From listening during my drive in, most seem to think it was a clean hit and part of the game. Yet they are still calling for retaliation. If it was a clean hit, why retaliate? The hit is over. Now the question becomes - do the Braves retaliate? If so, how? My opinion, the first time Erstad comes up, throw it at his feet. I never agree with throwing at the head. Plunking him in the ribs would send a clearer message, but would also probably result in the Angels retaliating. A toss at the feet sends the message that the Braves didn't like it, but it might allow things to die down rather than escalate. What are your thoughts? Should the Braves retaliate, and if so how? __________________ Ability is what you're capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. - Lou Holtz

06-07-2005, 01:29 PM	#23
CHEMICAL SOLDIER College Starter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Henderson, Nevada	Pix please. __________________ Toujour Pret

06-07-2005, 01:53 PM	#28
rkmsuf Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2001	why the heck is the catcher allowed to block the plate in the first place? Seems stupid. Why can't you block 3rd or 2nd? __________________ "Don't you have homes?" -- Judge Smales

06-07-2005, 01:24 AM	#2
sovereignstar Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004	Is Estrada from California?

06-07-2005, 01:48 AM	#3
MrBug708 Head Coach Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Whittier	Younger Cousin I believe

06-07-2005, 02:44 AM	#5
korme Go Reds Join Date: May 2001 Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio	It's part of the game. Deal with it. Erstad was just playing the part of Pete Rose. Estrada was an average impression of Ray Fosse.

06-07-2005, 09:36 AM	#7
Balldog Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Macomb, MI	I agree with Julio Franco here: "...I don't mind the hit, I mind the location of the hit. He could have hit lower, that's fine with me. Hitting a guy like that, in his face, could cause major damage to his health." I'm thinking Erstad is going to get drilled before this series is over. More than likely it wasn't intentional but Estrada is lucky to be moving.

06-07-2005, 11:35 AM	#12
Balldog Pro Rookie Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Macomb, MI	If Erstad gets drilled anywhere besides in the head area both benches will be warned and everything will likely be over.

06-07-2005, 01:08 PM	#18
DeToxRox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Michigan	Estrada didn't give up anything but his head and legs. He crouched do low that Erstad couldn't hit him in the ribs without spearing him down. Either way, it happens.

06-07-2005, 01:19 PM	#20
Solecismic Solecismic Software Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Canton, OH	Fair enough. Now, let's say, the Braves sign Ray Lewis to pinch run, kind of an ersatz Herb Washington. Lewis on third... here's the pitch... and Lewis is stealing home. The pitch beats him home by 40 feet. Lewis lowers his shoulder, and... Seems like this is a rule that needs to be changed. If the catcher has clear possession of the ball before contact is initiated, then he should not be required to maintain possession after a legitimate tag.

06-07-2005, 01:21 PM	#22
heybrad Norm!!! Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Manassas, VA	Yep... I've never understood why the catcher is fair game. If thats the case, why not blast the player at any base.

06-07-2005, 01:46 PM	#26
damnMikeBrown College Benchwarmer Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Cincinnati, OH	I once was cought in a run-down after having been picked off 1st. I went through maybe 4 throws, and decided "enough of this". I went towards second, guy takes the throw and is in my way. He's not any where near the base. I thought "it's my baseline, and he's in my way" I _plowed_ through him, and got thrown out of the game. I thought unfairly. He didn't drop the ball, I was out, but I got pitched too. I thought it was ridiculous. Did I just not know the rules of the game? I thought the baseline was mine and that anybody blocking it was ok to run over/through.

06-07-2005, 05:27 PM	#40
damnMikeBrown College Benchwarmer Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Cincinnati, OH	Wow, I totally thought I was within my right to the base line...to get to the base through anything that was in my way. Oops, I'll have to start regretting the ugly things I said about that ump all that time...

06-07-2005, 05:55 PM	#42
Buzzbee College Starter Join Date: Jun 2002	Game 2 will be starting in a little while. Any bets on whether or not the Braves retaliate? __________________ Ability is what you're capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. - Lou Holtz

06-07-2005, 06:43 PM	#43
sovereignstar Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004	Retaliation MLB-style? meh. You want to retaliate correctly, you fuck the guy's wife. If you're gay, shoot bottle rockets at the other team's dugout.

06-07-2005, 06:46 PM	#44
MrBug708 Head Coach Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Whittier	I never saw Piazza doing that towards the Yankees or now, the Stros. Allegedly....

06-07-2005, 06:58 PM	#47
nilodor College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: calgary, AB	I love how one of the articles (cnnsi or cbs-sportline) I was meantioned that he was an ex-football player several times in the article. They never meantioned that he was a punter though. Probably because it took the edge off their story.

06-07-2005, 07:09 PM	#48
sovereignstar Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004	FWIW, Darin also played hockey in high school.

06-07-2005, 07:57 PM	#50
st.cronin General Manager Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: New Mexico	Estrada's a girlieman, getting taken out by a frickin' KICKER.

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