Alright boyz, here we go!!! Baseball Mogul 2007 First Impressions

[LastWhiteSoxFanStanding]

I have always wanted to do one of these.

So what if nobody is going to like the game. SO WHAT! Let me have my one moment of glory.

Here is the link to purchase for those of you brave enough to buy.

http://sportsmogul.com/orders/orderbaseball2k7.htm

[DaddyTorgo]

wow. BM2007 is out already??

do THEY have a demo?

[cuervo72]

Seriously...considering the 2006 season hasn't even started, it's pretty damn backwards that a game sports a 2007 label.

[DaddyTorgo]

dola

no demo yet

call me back when there's a demo, although BM ranks third or 4th in my mind initially and would have to literally knock my socks off to be the game i purchase.

but at least a demo would let me see what kind of progress has been made.

[bbor]

What's the refund policy?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by bbor

What's the refund policy?

clay actually posted on the forum (i was looking for demo information) that he will issue refunds to anyone who purchased it who was unhappy, but the demo should be ready by the end of the month so if you have doubts to wait for that b/c he'd rather be working on the game then issuing refunds all day long

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

clay actually posted on the forum (i was looking for demo information) that he will issue refunds to anyone who purchased it who was unhappy, but the demo should be ready by the end of the month so if you have doubts to wait for that b/c he'd rather be working on the game then issuing refunds all day long

It's going to be that bad?

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

It's going to be that bad?

See Baseball Mogul 2006

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

It's going to be that bad?

That was my read.

Maybe Clay and Jennifer Winters need to be melded into one sane text sim marketing genius.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

It's going to be that bad?

huh?? i don't follow how you got that from what i said.

but i have no idea how good or bad it is going to be. i havn't followed the development at all or anything (cept in the thread on here about it) and like i said, it's definately way down there on my list of games i would buy.

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

jb...did your body get taken over by the spirit of a dead comedian? You are just firing beautiful one-liners one after the other my man!

Thanks

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

See Baseball Mogul 2006

jb...did your body get taken over by the spirit of a dead comedian? You are just firing beautiful one-liners one after the other my man!

[Dutch]

jb's also pychic.

[Franklinnoble]

I think jb really *IS* HellAtlantic.

Or DeanHouston.

i got nothin...

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Dutch

jb's also pychic.

nice one, i noticed the time stamp error and then saw your joke...the original joke didnt work with me(JBs) but yours cracked me up

[sabotai]

I'm going to wait for Baseball Mogul 2011, which should be available next year.

[Fouts]

Hmm 20 bucks for a text sim. Has anyone played it yet? I suppose if someone bought and posted something good they would get torn to shreds on here, so I'm not holding out hope for a review.

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by Fouts

Hmm 20 bucks for a text sim. Has anyone played it yet? I suppose if someone bought and posted something good they would get torn to shreds on here, so I'm not holding out hope for a review.

To be fair in its earliest versions, BM was a lot of fun to play.

[Ben E Lou]

Actually, given Clay's past history, I'd consider this to be a pretty stand-up post:

Baseball Mogul 2007 Launch

---

Yes, we will begin selling the download version of Baseball Mogul 2007 on March 22 for $19.95.

Some beta testers have commented that the last version of the beta had several bugs in it. We have fixed the majority of these bugs since the final beta version, and we are continuing to do so.

I'm now about to say two partly contradictory things:

1) My number one priority is happy customers. So if you buy the Baseball Mogul 2007 download from us, and decide you hate it and you want your money back, I'll issue a refund.

2) However, it's a hassle to do this and I'd rather be working on the game itself. So please read other feedback and try the demo (which should be ready before the end of March) if you have any doubt.

Baseball Mogul 2007 should also be in retail stores before the end of March. I believe Wal-Mart and Sam's Club have signed on. I'm not sure about other stores -- but please check your local game retailer and let me know as it sounds like Enlight is doing a good job of getting the game distributed.

I expect there to be a significant patch released in April. This will fix any bugs that slipped through and perhaps add some features or changes that we weren't able to get to.

Clay

The problem with last year's Mogul wasn't that it was poorly structured; the problem was that it was never finished. To the contrary, it had a very nice framework. This one also appears to have the nice framework, but the guts of the game have got to work properly.

The best news I've heard about this game is that Clay started on it quite a bit earlier than past versions. It has become crystal clear that he's going to release his BMxx right around the vernal equinox, no matter what state it is in. I guess for $19.99, that business model is working for him, but it sure doesn't work for those of us who demand a polished game. Hopefully, with the longer development cycle, he'll get this version up to snuff before he has to start working on Football Mogul, (or he'll just abandon that series altogether; BM has much more promise).

The key question is the same one as last year: will Clay support this product long enough to get it up to snuff? That, in the words of the late, great Gordon Solie, remains to be seen. I appreciate Clay being honest in letting people know that the release contains known bugs. (Most text sims do, but it is normally like pulling teeth to get them to admit it.) I'll be watching the tech support forum and paying particular attention to the "significant patch released in April" before I pull the trigger on this one.

[Ksyrup]

Yeah, BBM's first couple of games were my first real introduction into text sims and what lead me to FOF. Since then, though, either through stubbornness, limited resources, limited ability, or a combination of all of those factors, the game just hasn't progressed to where I consider it to be a viable option when there's OOTP and Puresim (even given those games' flaws). It's too bad, but I will say that the first BBM was a blast.

[Fouts]

I paid the $20 to check it out. I didn't buy last years version. My early impressions so far;

Pros
Very fast sim speed
Every player imported in first pro year
Franchises move as in real life
Contract negotions are done well

Cons
Financials don't match time period ($15 mil contracts in 1901)
Deadball era isn't really deadball
A team clinched based on 140 games, but the schedule had 154 games.
In year 2, my payroll budget (among others) dropped by half (big problem after signing players already)
In year 2, every teams rotations turned into 2 man rotations despite being set to 4 man (end of that career for me).

Note: I could be missing something I need to do in order to make the financials and stats portray the time period. I'll update this as I play on.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Fouts

I paid the $20 to check it out. I didn't buy last years version. My early impressions so far;

Pros
Very fast sim speed
Every player imported in first pro year
Franchises move as in real life
Contract negotions are done well

Cons
Financials don't match time period ($15 mil contracts in 1901)
Deadball era isn't really deadball
A team clinched based on 140 games, but the schedule had 154 games.
In year 2, my payroll budget (among others) dropped by half (big problem after signing players already)
In year 2, every teams rotations turned into 2 man rotations despite being set to 4 man (end of that career for me).

Note: I could be missing something I need to do in order to make the financials and stats portray the time period. I'll update this as I play on.

If you get a chance and it isn't too boring to you, I'd be very curious to hear about fictional play in 2006 and beyond.

[hoosiergoody]

BBMogul has frequently had troubles re-creating from 1900 on... until the other bugs are worked out, I would recommend starting at least in the 1980's

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by Fouts

A team clinched based on 140 games, but the schedule had 154 games.
In year 2, my payroll budget (among others) dropped by half (big problem after signing players already)
In year 2, every teams rotations turned into 2 man rotations despite being set to 4 man (end of that career for me)

These things - particularly the last two - bother me a LOT. I hope there's some explanation for this and a fix, otherwise I can't even consider this game.

[Celeval]

Completely side note... but I'm much more likely to give BBM a shot again at $20 than MFB at $40.

[Fouts]

Originally Posted by Pumpy Tudors

These things - particularly the last two - bother me a LOT. I hope there's some explanation for this and a fix, otherwise I can't even consider this game.

Me too, not realistic or worth playing those seasons now. I'm going to try another time period and see how it goes.

[DanGarion]

I'll buy it, 2006 was entertaining regardless of flaws, I enjoy having a quick sim engine to just play with and look at stats.

[Ramzavail]

losing 9-3, bottom of the 8th, 2nd and 3rd, 1 out, groundball to 2nd, out at first, runners don't advance - ugh.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Fouts

I paid the $20 to check it out. I didn't buy last years version. My early impressions so far;

Pros
Very fast sim speed
Every player imported in first pro year
Franchises move as in real life
Contract negotions are done well

Cons
Financials don't match time period ($15 mil contracts in 1901)
Deadball era isn't really deadball
A team clinched based on 140 games, but the schedule had 154 games.
In year 2, my payroll budget (among others) dropped by half (big problem after signing players already)
In year 2, every teams rotations turned into 2 man rotations despite being set to 4 man (end of that career for me).

Note: I could be missing something I need to do in order to make the financials and stats portray the time period. I'll update this as I play on.

The unrealistic Deadball Stats kill it for me. No game has really gotten that right that I have tried. OOTP can be made realistic with a lot of tweaking but I would rather have the game just adapt itself to that era.

I haven't tried Puresim, anyone have feedback on how it handles this time period?

[lynchjm24]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

I haven't tried Puresim, anyone have feedback on how it handles this time period?

There is a thread right now on the board where it looks like some have luck with the batting stats. I doubt you'll get the pitching to work right though.

[Galaril]

I resurrect thid thread to say the demo is out and I am shocked to say it is quite fun and entertaining after a short play of the game. I don't think the demo goes beyonfd one season so no idea what happens for multiple season careers. But initially it is a HUGE improvemnt over the previous game. I t really doesn't feel like the old game anymore to me especially with the new pitcher batter interface. If this works well I can see in the future Clay adding the rest of the players in a simpler 2d depiction like he has for the pitcher hitter.

http://www.sportsmogul.com/

[QuikSand]

Originally Posted by lynchjm24

There is a thread right now on the board where it looks like some have luck with the batting stats. I doubt you'll get the pitching to work right though.

So who's pitching to the batters (who have realistic stats) if not the pitchers (who apparently don't)? Is the problem pitcher usage and workload, or something of that sort?

Just curious.

[QuikSand]

Originally Posted by Clay

Baseball Mogul 2007 should also be in retail stores before the end of March. I believe Wal-Mart and Sam's Club have signed on. I'm not sure about other stores -- but please check your local game retailer and let me know as it sounds like Enlight is doing a good job of getting the game distributed.

This is potentially great news for the genre, in any event.

[FBPro]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

This is potentially great news for the genre, in any event.

I wonder if those who make the buy will say the same once they get it home

[LastWhiteSoxFanStanding]

That pitch by pitch mode is so close to being good.

I don't know how they cannot show the rest of the field or track the flight of the ball.

Stupid, stupid, stupid.

[amdaily]

I haven't and won't touch the PbP mode, but the rest of the game has come together very nicely. Most of the exisiting beta issues were cleared up by the latest patch and unexpected new features (better stat control, "mentor" pitchers teaching prospects pitches, etc) keep showing up in new patches as well.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

This is potentially great news for the genre, in any event.

I bought football mogul at wal mart a long time ago.

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by amdaily

I haven't and won't touch the PbP mode, but the rest of the game has come together very nicely. Most of the exisiting beta issues were cleared up by the latest patch and unexpected new features (better stat control, "mentor" pitchers teaching prospects pitches, etc) keep showing up in new patches as well.

Can those of us who wasted money on last year's version get the v2007 patch for free?

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Galaril

I resurrect thid thread to say the demo is out and I am shocked to say it is quite fun and entertaining after a short play of the game. I don't think the demo goes beyonfd one season so no idea what happens for multiple season careers. But initially it is a HUGE improvemnt over the previous game. I t really doesn't feel like the old game anymore to me especially with the new pitcher batter interface. If this works well I can see in the future Clay adding the rest of the players in a simpler 2d depiction like he has for the pitcher hitter.

http://www.sportsmogul.com/

I d'loaded the demo today out of curiousity and have already removed it. The demo does let you save your progress but you can only resume your save if you buy the game. Are you kidding me? To see the game I have to spend uninterupted hours? Hell put in a time limit, let me play
one season or at least to the all-star game for God's sake.

Sorry, I don't have the time or inclination to play continuously to try to see what kind of depth the game has. I'll pass.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

If you get a chance and it isn't too boring to you, I'd be very curious to hear about fictional play in 2006 and beyond.

Alcohol and a winning streak at poker caused my judgement to be impaired. I took the 20 dollar plunge. . .

Fictional Rosters and Stadiums. Everything else to to default. I simmed through 2100.

The Good:

The title winners have been varied a bit. I didn't tweak financials at all. Yes, the Yankees went to a ridiculous amount of playoffs and WS titles, but they had off stretches as well. This included a five year perior where they didn't finish higher than 3rd in the division. The Blue Jays even had a dynasty from 2070 to 2080, they won 6 titles. They followed that up by missing the playoffs for 7 straight seasons. New York made the playoffs 81 times and won 23 WS titles.

Statistics aren't unreasonable to me. There was a guy who cranked out 904 HR in his career, but he's the exception to the rule. And with fluctuating HR totals, who the hell knows? He never hit more than 71 in a season, so it's not like he had a couple of 95 HR years to destroy things. He just happened to come up young and stayed remarkebly healthy. I think this could be fixed with a quick change to the injury tab if that's what someone wanted. It doesn't bother me. As for pitchers, only a handful made it to 300.

For active player in the career in 2100: Hits leader has 2895. HR leader has 692. (he's 36, so he could really add to that total). Next highest HR guy is at 636, followed by 536 and then nobody over 500. For pitchers, 3 active guys are above 250 wins, with the highest being 287.

Despite heading into ridiculous debt, the small market teams still keep their payroll near 40 million most years. I haven't seen any team take the Marlins 13 million rout.

Watching a game with the new interface is actually half way decent. I didn't coach, just watched, but it was actually kind of fun.

Sim speed is still there. I simmed the 100 seasons in 18 minutes. Yikes.

The Bad:

The Rockies had 7 seasons in the run of games where they lost less than 100 games. Their average record was 50-112. They are currently 573 million in debt. They had the greatest player of all time start his career with them and he left after three years. (Detroit Tiger fans were very, very happy). The small market teams get destroyed without tweaks. Only six teams are in debt in the league. And the Rockies are by far and away the worst case. But teams with low payroll budgest are just screwed. The mid level guys can win on occasion, but the low level teams just can't seem to scrape their way up. *I'm going to run a 100 year test with all markets equal to see how that ends up.* I'll post feedback here. One of the things that kills these teams is that once they go into debt, their farm system, scouting and medical staff all go to ZERO. Ouch.

I've seen far to many rookie of the years have horrible numbers. It's not uncommen for a hitter to win the award with a .215 batting average with 12 HR.

OVERALL IMPRESSION:

I'm a little scared here. I haven't put it a ton of time with the game yet. Just the quick sim session. But my initial thought is that I'm going to keep the game. I think with just a bit of micro-management, this game can be pretty darned good. Essentially, I'm just talking about every 5 years or so going into the really weak cash flow teams and giving them an infusion of cash. Maybe tweak the injury slider a tad.

Will it be my baseball sim of choice? I doubt it. I'd be stunned if either OOTP or Pure Sim wasn't a better game. Yet I think I'll get my 20 bucks worth out of it.

Keep in mind, this IS BBMogul and these are early impressions. Usually the deeper you dig, the more problems you find. Still, early impressions are favorable. Take that for what it's worth.

[watravaler]

I purchased the game a few days after it came out and thought it was a fun play. With each now patch, the game is improving exponentially. Well worth the $20.

[Shaun Sullivan]

Yea, this one is really good. I purchased it and was super-impressed.

Its incredibly fast, and it seems like this year's version has really made some big strides.

Shaun

[TroyF]

OK, simmed through 2021 with all cities equal, fictional players and staduims.

Only 5 teams didn't make at least one playoff appearance. 10 different champions. (Kansas City the most with 4)

I still don't see anything ridiculous with the statistics model. Is it perfect? No. Still a few to many 38 year olds with great numbers, (most have low health though, I still think tweaking the injury slider a bit will fix this).

The big problem is with the financial aspect. A team gets behind the 8-ball, they just have no way to recover. Their scouting, health and farm system all go to hell, which decreases revenue further. . . it just sends them on a downward spiral from which they can't get back.

I'm thinking of starting a career where every 5 years I take the bottom 5 teams (record wise) and give them an influx of cash. They'll still have a crap roster at the start, but they'll have the ability to scout, develop and keep players healthy.

I think with that fix, this thing may actually have a chance. And I can easily see myself putting this thing on my slow laptop fo fool around with on occasion. All in all, I'm anxious to see if I can relive a bit of the glory days today and take on a serious dynasty with it.

[cuervo72]

Maybe a scout/minor league cost floor can be put in to prevent these teams from doing this?

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Maybe a scout/minor league cost floor can be put in to prevent these teams from doing this?

I'm not sure. all I know is that any team who has a really bad run and starts bleeding money has no shot to recover without a users help now.

This may not bother some people. The real economics of baseball ensure that you have teams who lose for decades on end. We can count quite a few teams in real baseball who have been nothing more than an afterthought in the last 15 years. The problem is when you equalize cities and it still happens.

This just shouldn't be the case.

All that said, I've started up my dynasty and I'm having fun. And if going in every five or six years and tweaking the crap teams of the league to give them a chance is all the tinkering I have to do, I'm going to be very happy with my purchase.

[Young Drachma]

I like that Mogul is fast. It always serves a purpose. I got 2006 on a whim and from what I hear, '07 might tide me over because it seems like despite preorder OOTPBM, i'm going to get to play it much before I leave for the summer, unless I go make an ill advised purchase on a new laptop before then.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by Fouts

A team clinched based on 140 games, but the schedule had 154 games.
In year 2, my payroll budget (among others) dropped by half (big problem after signing players already)
In year 2, every teams rotations turned into 2 man rotations despite being set to 4 man (end of that career for me).

Were these things addressed in patches? I've got $20 pretty much just sitting around, and I'd be happy to put it toward this game, but these are big problems.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Pumpy Tudors

Were these things addressed in patches? I've got $20 pretty much just sitting around, and I'd be happy to put it toward this game, but these are big problems.

I don't play in the dead ball era or with historical players at all.

But I haven't seen ANY teams payroll budget drop by 1/2 in any of my tests. I have yet to see a two man pitching rotation. (league leader in starts had 35 in my last game)

And it handled the clinchings perfectly with a 162 game schedule. Each team who clinched the division or WC was announced in the news page on the correct day.All the way to the one game playoff between Pitt and Arizona for the WC spot in the NL.

[Barkeep49]

How hard is it to do a cash infusion? And by hard I mean how long would it take you to do that every 5 years? If that's the only flaw in the financials, then with its blazing fast sim times I could easily see myself as a purchese.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

How hard is it to do a cash infusion? And by hard I mean how long would it take you to do that every 5 years? If that's the only flaw in the financials, then with its blazing fast sim times I could easily see myself as a purchese.

true. especially if that's patchable or a workable solution (if someone could run a long-term test on that to see if it actually works i mean).