Pro Wrestling Discussion Thread **Spoilers Possible** - Page 5

Deattribution · 07-23-2006, 02:13 PM

Hah, yeah well that's not too bad of an idea either... Although they have a ton of talent, they have no idea what to do with any of them.

Wrestling is in a pretty sad state, especially compared to the days where WWE couldn't afford to mail in a PPV (Monday night wars era).

It isn't the wrestlers fault, they all work really hard but they have NOTHING to work with.

General Mike · 07-23-2006, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Big Show is the best wrestling big man around

Depends on your definition of Big Man.

saldana · 07-23-2006, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by General Mike

Depends on your definition of Big Man.

i agree, because it also depends on how you are assessing him...i consider Batista to be a 'big man' and if you consider his ring work, his mic work, and how well he gets over, i think he is far superior to big show.

EagleFan · 07-23-2006, 03:13 PM

Wrestling is soooo yesterday. UFC baby!!!!!!! No scripts, assinine interviews or fake injuries.

And yes, I used to watch it for the quasi-entertainment factor but that gets used up very quickly when it's the same crap over and over.

Toddzilla · 07-23-2006, 03:54 PM

Khalil's gonna kill you....

molson · 07-23-2006, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saldana

i agree, because it also depends on how you are assessing him...i consider Batista to be a 'big man' and if you consider his ring work, his mic work, and how well he gets over, i think he is far superior to big show.

You can't really compare Big Show with very many other guys (do people expect him to be able to do planchas and stuff?) It's hard to imagine someone of Show's size being any more capable in the ring that he is.

As long as the internet has been around, people have people have been complaining about wrestling. Even at the industry's peak, the tone on the internet has always been negative. You'd think people would just watch something else. I think the WWE product has been relatively solid for a while now - coherent stories, long-term planning, a greater emphasis on wrestling than at any other time in the company's history. Go watch some tapes from the early-mid 90s, or even 2000-2001 - the current product is pretty good.

molson · 07-23-2006, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Wrestling is soooo yesterday. UFC baby!!!!!!! No scripts, assinine interviews or fake injuries.

Thery're definitly becoming a player, but it's interesting that fake fighting still has 3 times the TV audience of real fighting.

Deattribution · 07-23-2006, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molson

As long as the internet has been around, people have people have been complaining about wrestling. Even at the industry's peak, the tone on the internet has always been negative. You'd think people would just watch something else. I think the WWE product has been relatively solid for a while now - coherent stories, long-term planning, a greater emphasis on wrestling than at any other time in the company's history. Go watch some tapes from the early-mid 90s, or even 2000-2001 - the current product is pretty good.

Big difference of opinion here, the stories and long term planning has been terrible. The only people who get any effort put into anything done for them is two or three guys at the top (guess who). At best, it's background noise anymore... so predictable and half-hearted.

Not exactly a coincidence that the only two factions in the last 5 years(which I always thought were a GREAT way to get some guys over) both involved one guy who didn't need any help getting over anymore - Triple H.

Joe · 07-23-2006, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deattribution

Big difference of opinion here, the stories and long term planning has been terrible. The only people who get any effort put into anything done for them is two or three guys at the top (guess who). At best, it's background noise anymore... so predictable and half-hearted.

Not exactly a coincidence that the only two factions in the last 5 years(which I always thought were a GREAT way to get some guys over) both involved one guy who didn't need any help getting over anymore - Triple H.

At least it helped establish Batista and Orton

Deattribution · 07-23-2006, 07:33 PM

Dola

And the problem I see with the UFC is they've yet to really have a big money match that has lived up to the hype... Huge hype over Ortiz-Shamrock, Hughes-Gracie and the matches lasted a combined 3 minutes.

Their PPVs are like 75% commercial and 25% fighting. They were big for a while in the 90's and fizzled out, and it wouldn't surprise me if it happens again within the next year.

Deattribution · 07-23-2006, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George W Bush

At least it helped establish Batista and Orton

Yeah, in the case of Evolution it did - but my point was that they're under utilized. Even with Evolution, it was kind of dumb since they didn't have another faction to fight with. It was simply shoving them down peoples throats.

molson · 07-23-2006, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deattribution

Yeah, in the case of Evolution it did - but my point was that they're under utilized. Even with Evolution, it was kind of dumb since they didn't have another faction to fight with. It was simply shoving them down peoples throats.

If the internet as we know it today was around in the 80s, they'd be saying this same thing about the four horseman.

That's fine if you don't like the product, but it's possible you've just outgrown it. The current WWE isn't as good as it was in 97-98, and possibly 86-87 (though the wrestling now is way better than it was then), but I think it holds up against any other era. Just my opinion of course.

Joe · 07-23-2006, 09:49 PM

All Hail King Booker -- New Champ. Guess he's a transitional champ to get it back to Batista.

Schmidty · 07-23-2006, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George W Bush

At least it helped establish Batista and Orton

Orton is the biggest fraud-ass piece of crap wrestler I've seen in 10 years. And no, I don't mean his gimmick. He just plain sucks.

Schmidty · 07-23-2006, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molson

If the internet as we know it today was around in the 80s, they'd be saying this same thing about the four horseman.

I grew up on 80's wrestling in the south (central FL), and the 4 horsemen had charisma. Orton has nothing other than a gimmicky arm-raised thing, and a shitty "finishing move".

JonInMiddleGA · 07-23-2006, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molson

Go watch some tapes from the early-mid 90s, or even 2000-2001 - the current product is pretty good.

Umm ... I suspect a lot of those (including me) who aren't impressed very often now weren't impressed much then either.

On the other hand, I just finished reading a recap of last night's NWA-Anarchy (formerly NWA-Wildside) show. The conclusion to a long-running feud involving the promoter ended with him on the wrong end of a bloody beatdown, complete with an ambulance crew taking him away to the hospital. When the ambulance arrived, there were some 70 people (of 225 in attendance) waiting there to see if he was going to be okay.

Now THAT'S getting an angle over.

molson · 07-23-2006, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Orton is the biggest fraud-ass piece of crap wrestler I've seen in 10 years. And no, I don't mean his gimmick. He just plain sucks.

He's got a ways to go before he can be the main eventer the WWE obviously wants him to be. But, he's still really young, he's had some excellent matches with Benoit (so he can be carried), and he has that prick/rapist aura about him that can make him a legit heel (as oppossed to a "cool heel"). I think he'll be OK in time. .

jbmagic · 07-23-2006, 11:20 PM

Kennedy injured at The Great American Bash
July 23, 2006

At The Great American Bash, Mr. Kennedy was busted open during his match with Batista when he was rammed into the steel ring steps.

When examined in the locker room, he was found to have a severe laceration of the scalp that exposed his cranium. According to WWE physician Dr. Ferdinand Rios, Kennedy required more than 20 stitches to close the wound.

jbmagic · 07-23-2006, 11:25 PM

King Booker added some new bling by pinning Rey Mysterio to become the new World Heavyweight Champion. Booker was victorious thanks in part to Chavo Guerrero, who shocked the world by nailing supposed friend Mysterio with a chair.

duckman · 07-24-2006, 01:44 PM

Triple H is about to become a daddy:

hxxp://www.411mania.com/wrestling/news/43237/More-WWE-News:-Big-Changes-for-Raw-Tonight.htm

Quote:

Stephanie McMahon has reportedly gone into labor. Vince McMahon and Triple H made the call to head back to Connecticut to be with her, thus causing a lot of craziness backstage and changes for tonight's show. It is not known what exactly will be changed, but tonight if they go to further the DX vs. McMahons angle it looks as if it will be up to Shane McMahon and Shawn Michaels.

Credit: PWInsider.com

duckman · 07-24-2006, 02:23 PM

Looks like the DX/McMahon angle is on hold tonight:

Quote:

As reported earlier, Stephanie McMahon has gone into labor and both Vince McMahon and Triple H have decided to be with her and thus won't be on RAW tonight. Some speculated earlier than if WWE wanted to continue the McMahons/DX angle tonight on RAW, it would be up to Shane McMahon and Shawn Michaels. However, it appears Shane McMahon is also not at RAW tonight.

Credit: PWInsider.com

Toddzilla · 07-24-2006, 03:41 PM

I swear, if she gives birth to a rubber hand, I'm never watching wrestling again

DeToxRox · 07-24-2006, 04:49 PM

Super Crazy was to face Gregory Helms at the Great American Bash PPV last night, but has also been taken off the road due to issues with his liver.

Kid Kash is expected to be suspended and taken off of the road after tomorrow's Smackdown tapings. The reason is not known, but is speculated to be because of an infraction against the Wellness policy.

JonInMiddleGA · 07-24-2006, 05:09 PM

Okay, one elevated liver enzyme is kinda unusual.
Two liver issues in one week is rather odd.

But THREE?

WTF, is there a hepatitis outbreak in the lockeroom or something?

duckman · 07-24-2006, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Okay, one elevated liver enzyme is kinda unusual.
Two liver issues in one week is rather odd.

But THREE?

WTF, is there a hepatitis outbreak in the lockeroom or something?

It could be caused by pain killer abuse which would be likely with all the bumps these wrestlers take on a weekly basis.

saldana · 07-24-2006, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Okay, one elevated liver enzyme is kinda unusual.
Two liver issues in one week is rather odd.

But THREE?

WTF, is there a hepatitis outbreak in the lockeroom or something?

iirc, Creatine can do very nasty things to a persons liver....theoretically, these guys would eat the stuff by the bucketful since its still legal and presumably not banned by anyone but the IOC

duckman · 07-24-2006, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saldana

iirc, Creatine can do very nasty things to a persons liver....theoretically, these guys would eat the stuff by the bucketful since its still legal and presumably not banned by anyone but the IOC

If you keep yourself well hydrated, you usually don't have these problems. I don't see that as a problem for most of these guys. I'm going to stick with my pain killer theory.

saldana · 07-24-2006, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duckman

If you keep yourself well hydrated, you usually don't have these problems. I don't see that as a problem for most of these guys. I'm going to stick with my pain killer theory.

i actually missed that theory (post)...i could buy that theory as well...i cant imagine these guys arent in perpetual pain

SirFozzie · 07-24-2006, 05:40 PM

right now, I'm sure that Vince (well, when not worrying about his daughter in labor) wishes he never heard the word "Wellness Program"

saldana · 07-24-2006, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saldana

i actually missed that theory (post)...i could buy that theory as well...i cant imagine these guys arent in perpetual pain

dola, we posted at the same time, thats why i missed it...like i said though, i could easily see either of these things as the wide spread cause of the issue...i am sure NSAID's are in the bucket right next to the Creatine in the weight rooms.

Deattribution · 07-24-2006, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Anabolic steroid use is often associated with an increased plasma activity of liver enzymes, according to SportsSci.org.

That little bit was from a LoP column, it sounds plausible (especially in Lashley's case) although I don't know how relevant it is.

saldana · 07-24-2006, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deattribution

That little bit was from a LoP column, it sounds plausible (especially in Lashley's case) although I don't know how relevant it is.

i totally agree its plausible (probable)...i was trying to come up with alternative options in the hope that the Wellness Program is actually doing some good. i have noticed a lot of physique changes since eddie died, so i was working from the probably naive position that these guys are off the roids.

Deattribution · 07-24-2006, 06:45 PM

I think regardless what the issues are caused from, this is a great sign because these guys were going to continue doing whatever they were doing and also wrestling without the wellness program.... actually kind of crazy they've went on this long without some sort of bi-monthly phyiscal or something.

General Mike · 07-24-2006, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deattribution

That little bit was from a LoP column, it sounds plausible (especially in Lashley's case) although I don't know how relevant it is.

100% relevant. If you don't think Khali or Lashley are on the juice, I've got a bridge to sell you.

saldana · 07-24-2006, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by General Mike

100% relevant. If you don't think Khali or Lashley are on the juice, I've got a bridge to sell you.

is it a pretty bridge.....i guess what i should have said above was that i think there are certain people that definitely stopped juicing...not that i think it is gone from the sport.

DeToxRox · 07-24-2006, 08:24 PM

"The main concern right now is that the wrestlers testing with high levels (Great Khali, Bobby Lashley) may have Hepatitis C, a high-contagious incurable condition that is easily spread, which is why contact between anyone testing positive with high liver enzymes and other wrestlers is not allowed.

Great Khali's test level was very minimal over the normal level, and he was re-tested earlier today, so if that test comes back normal, he could be back in the ring as soon as this week as long as everything else checks out.

The others who have tested with high levels have been "off the charts high," according to once source, and further tests are being done on them."

SirFozzie · 07-24-2006, 09:38 PM

Oh my god. This is why WWE never wants to give John Cena a microphone and tell him to say whatever's on his mind.

The promo had no purpose, but god was it funny.

duckman · 07-24-2006, 11:18 PM

Looks like I'm wrong about the pain killer theory:

Quote:

- There is concern in WWE right now that the wrestlers testing with high enzyme levels could possibly have Hepatitis C which is incurable and easily spread. This is why guys like Bobby Lashley, Super Crazy, and the Great Khali were all pulled from wrestling right away after testing high.

- The Great Khali's test level was apparently only slightly over the normal level and he was apparently re-tested today. If that test comes back OK, he could return to the active roster as early as this week.

- The tests on Lashley and Super Crazy were apparently "off the charts" high.

Credit: PWtorch.com

Terps · 07-24-2006, 11:22 PM

Didn't Cowboy Bob Orton have Hepatitis C back when he and Randy were feuding with the Undertaker, and they didn't make it public for a while? He got fired not too long after that.

duckman · 07-24-2006, 11:25 PM

I don't remember reading anything about it.

Deattribution · 07-24-2006, 11:31 PM

Yeah, supposedly the Undertaker got really pissed off (understandably) that they let Cowboy Bob bleed without UT knowing he had hepatitis C.

I wonder though, if Lashley gets diagnosed with HC does that effectively put an end to his career?

I'd still say it's more likely roids but...

Schmidty · 07-24-2006, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terps

Didn't Cowboy Bob Orton have Hepatitis C back when he and Randy were feuding with the Undertaker, and they didn't make it public for a while? He got fired not too long after that.

Damn, that's awful. I can't stand UT, but that would be beyond horrible if he got that disease because of Orton's irresponsibility.

Terps · 07-24-2006, 11:45 PM

This is from Wikipedia, but this was all over wrestling news sites when it happened:

Quote:

At Armageddon 2005, Orton (still holding the urn) accompanied Randy to ringside for his Hell in a Cell match with The Undertaker. He interfered in the match several times, but was ultimately unable to prevent The Undertaker from delivering a Tombstone Piledriver to both Ortons and then covering Randy for the win. Orton bladed during the match and bled on both Randy and The Undertaker; controversially, he was later widely reported to be suffering from the blood-borne disease hepatitis.
On February 13, 2006, Orton was released from WWE.

saldana · 07-24-2006, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terps

This is from Wikipedia, but this was all over wrestling news sites when it happened:

it doesnt say which form of Hep though...i know that a and b have innoculations, but i dont know if they have vaccines as well. c and d are different stories though, as they dont even have innoculants.

Schmidty · 07-24-2006, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saldana

it doesnt say which form of Hep though...i know that a and b have innoculations, but i dont know if they have vaccines as well. c and d are different stories though, as they dont even have innoculants.

Either way, if you know you have any disease that can be spread by blood, and you blade yourself in a match, you deserve to get you head stomped in. But I guess that would get the stomper blood on him, so it would defeat the purpose.

Terps · 07-24-2006, 11:52 PM

Well the story was that he got it a long time ago, and "forgot." John 'Johnny Ace' Laurenitius was the only one who knew about it though and did not tell anyone, not even Vince.

molson · 07-24-2006, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Damn, that's awful. I can't stand UT, but that would be beyond horrible if he got that disease because of Orton's irresponsibility.

It was a messy situation for a while. Apparently, Johnny Ace (one of the WWE hire ups in charge of "talen relations") knew that Orton had hep, and didn't speak up when he knew Orton would be spilling blood all over the Undertaker and Randy in that Hell in the Cell match. Undertaker took a sabatical after that, and then came back, so it was assumed he was clean.

It's amazing to me that the WWE is being so stringent about the wellness program. It's just a complete change from their treatement of wrestlers in the past. The physique shrinkage is pretty noticeable, even in the top guys (Edge is tiny, HHH has gotten pretty fat).

Schmidty · 07-24-2006, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molson

It's amazing to me that the WWE is being so stringent about the wellness program. It's just a complete change from their treatement of wrestlers in the past. The physique shrinkage is pretty noticeable, even in the top guys (Edge is tiny, HHH has gotten pretty fat).

Pretty soon everyone's going to have a gut like Jim Duggan, and bigger tits that Trish Stratus.

duckman · 07-25-2006, 08:02 PM

Here is the video of the RVD/Sabu arrest:

hxxp://us.video.aol.com/video.index.adp?mode=1&pmmsid=1680640

molson · 07-25-2006, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duckman

Here is the video of the RVD/Sabu arrest:

hxxp://us.video.aol.com/video.index.adp?mode=1&pmmsid=1680640

Liberally stolen from another site:

07-24-2006, 05:09 PM	#224
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	Okay, one elevated liver enzyme is kinda unusual. Two liver issues in one week is rather odd. But THREE? WTF, is there a hepatitis outbreak in the lockeroom or something? __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis

07-24-2006, 05:40 PM	#229
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	right now, I'm sure that Vince (well, when not worrying about his daughter in labor) wishes he never heard the word "Wellness Program" __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

07-24-2006, 09:38 PM	#237
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	Oh my god. This is why WWE never wants to give John Cena a microphone and tell him to say whatever's on his mind. The promo had no purpose, but god was it funny. __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

07-24-2006, 11:31 PM	#241
Deattribution College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2003	Yeah, supposedly the Undertaker got really pissed off (understandably) that they let Cowboy Bob bleed without UT knowing he had hepatitis C. I wonder though, if Lashley gets diagnosed with HC does that effectively put an end to his career? I'd still say it's more likely roids but... Last edited by Deattribution : 07-24-2006 at 11:31 PM.

07-23-2006, 02:13 PM	#201
Deattribution College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2003	Hah, yeah well that's not too bad of an idea either... Although they have a ton of talent, they have no idea what to do with any of them. Wrestling is in a pretty sad state, especially compared to the days where WWE couldn't afford to mail in a PPV (Monday night wars era). It isn't the wrestlers fault, they all work really hard but they have *NOTHING* to work with.

07-23-2006, 03:13 PM	#204
EagleFan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Mays Landing, NJ USA	Wrestling is soooo yesterday. UFC baby!!!!!!! No scripts, assinine interviews or fake injuries. And yes, I used to watch it for the quasi-entertainment factor but that gets used up very quickly when it's the same crap over and over.

07-23-2006, 03:54 PM	#205
Toddzilla Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Burke, VA	Khalil's gonna kill you....

07-23-2006, 07:33 PM	#210
Deattribution College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2003	Dola And the problem I see with the UFC is they've yet to really have a big money match that has lived up to the hype... Huge hype over Ortiz-Shamrock, Hughes-Gracie and the matches lasted a combined 3 minutes. Their PPVs are like 75% commercial and 25% fighting. They were big for a while in the 90's and fizzled out, and it wouldn't surprise me if it happens again within the next year.

07-23-2006, 09:49 PM	#213
Joe Pro Starter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Minneapolis	All Hail King Booker -- New Champ. Guess he's a transitional champ to get it back to Batista.

07-23-2006, 11:20 PM	#218
jbmagic Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2004	Kennedy injured at The Great American Bash July 23, 2006 At The Great American Bash, Mr. Kennedy was busted open during his match with Batista when he was rammed into the steel ring steps. When examined in the locker room, he was found to have a severe laceration of the scalp that exposed his cranium. According to WWE physician Dr. Ferdinand Rios, Kennedy required more than 20 stitches to close the wound.

07-23-2006, 11:25 PM	#219
jbmagic Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2004	King Booker added some new bling by pinning Rey Mysterio to become the new World Heavyweight Champion. Booker was victorious thanks in part to Chavo Guerrero, who shocked the world by nailing supposed friend Mysterio with a chair.

07-24-2006, 03:41 PM	#222
Toddzilla Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Burke, VA	I swear, if she gives birth to a rubber hand, I'm never watching wrestling again

07-24-2006, 04:49 PM	#223
DeToxRox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Michigan	Super Crazy was to face Gregory Helms at the Great American Bash PPV last night, but has also been taken off the road due to issues with his liver. Kid Kash is expected to be suspended and taken off of the road after tomorrow's Smackdown tapings. The reason is not known, but is speculated to be because of an infraction against the Wellness policy.

07-24-2006, 06:45 PM	#233
Deattribution College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2003	I think regardless what the issues are caused from, this is a great sign because these guys were going to continue doing whatever they were doing and also wrestling without the wellness program.... actually kind of crazy they've went on this long without some sort of bi-monthly phyiscal or something.

07-24-2006, 08:24 PM	#236
DeToxRox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Michigan	"The main concern right now is that the wrestlers testing with high levels (Great Khali, Bobby Lashley) may have Hepatitis C, a high-contagious incurable condition that is easily spread, which is why contact between anyone testing positive with high liver enzymes and other wrestlers is not allowed. Great Khali's test level was very minimal over the normal level, and he was re-tested earlier today, so if that test comes back normal, he could be back in the ring as soon as this week as long as everything else checks out. The others who have tested with high levels have been "off the charts high," according to once source, and further tests are being done on them."

07-24-2006, 11:22 PM	#239
Terps College Prospect Join Date: Jul 2001	Didn't Cowboy Bob Orton have Hepatitis C back when he and Randy were feuding with the Undertaker, and they didn't make it public for a while? He got fired not too long after that.

07-24-2006, 11:52 PM	#246
Terps College Prospect Join Date: Jul 2001	Well the story was that he got it a long time ago, and "forgot." John 'Johnny Ace' Laurenitius was the only one who knew about it though and did not tell anyone, not even Vince.

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