If Trump Loses In November, What Do You Think Happens Next

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Butter

So, you think we should just let what happened yesterday go without comment or consequence?

Of course not, but I one hundred percent always operate under the assumption that politicians are doing what’s best for them, not what’s right. He should be removed. But I don’t think the Democrats want him removed.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Upon further thought, unless they think he’s going to fire off a nuke or something, why would the Democrats want to remove him at this point? Don’t they want him around screwing up the ‘22 and ‘24 primaries? I’m thinking this is all just posturing and grandstanding.

In what way will him being removed prevent him from being around to screw up the 22 and 24 primaries?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Just because it was poorly organized and executed doesn't make it any less of a coup.

This is a good point. If these people had planned to do something serious, they could have wiped out most of the legislature easy.

I am a little surprised that this isn't a bigger deal. Politicians are grandstanding but we haven't seen anything like this since the Civil War. The head of the Executive branch told his supporters to take out the legislature.

Anyone in the cabinet with a shred of dignity should invoke the 25th Amendment. The House and Senate should pass through impeachment and removal immediately. Cruz and Hawley should be expelled. Everyone who entered the Capitol yesterday should be charged with a felony.

The issue isn't "it's only 2 weeks, lets ride it out". It's that if you don't stand up, the next time it will be worse. You can't embolden insurrectionists, terrorists, fascists, whatever you want to call them without repercussions.

[Butter]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Of course not, but I one hundred percent always operate under the assumption that politicians are doing what’s best for them, not what’s right. He should be removed. But I don’t think the Democrats want him removed.

They at least want to force a vote of some kind. This is an unbelievable winning strategy for future campaigns. "Hawley supported Trump's coup... can you trust him in the White House?"

[albionmoonlight]

My cousin just posted that limiting mail-in ballots will solve everything b/c then people will have faith that elections are fair.

The thing is, I am 100% sure he believes that. He’s a good guy.

[JPhillips]

While Ben brings up a good point, I'm comforted knowing that Trump couldn't possibly win in 2016 and the GOP couldn't possibly survive in 2020. Pelosi clearly understands electoral politics.

[Ben E Lou]

That’s a fair point. I would just think they want the chaos of him actually running in 2024. Because if he is not impeached and banned, you know he will start running like three weeks from now.

[Brian Swartz]

Him being impeached doesn't stop him from running in 2024.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

When even Rand Paul, a man who has never met a cause he won't grandstand meaninglessly for (just like dad), is like "this is stupid", you know this is stupid

SI

I'm going way, way back to early this morning, but let's not give Paul a whole lot of credit here. The day before yesterday, this was an email that was sent out for fundraising on the 4th. He doesn't really have a leg to stand on.

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Anyone in the cabinet with a shred of dignity should invoke the 25th Amendment. The House and Senate should pass through impeachment and removal immediately. Cruz and Hawley should be expelled. Everyone who entered the Capitol yesterday should be charged with a felony.

The issue isn't "it's only 2 weeks, lets ride it out". It's that if you don't stand up, the next time it will be worse. You can't embolden insurrectionists, terrorists, fascists, whatever you want to call them without repercussions.

I agree with all of this except impeachment, because there just isn't time to do impeachment properly. The 25th should be invoked and he should be removed that way, arrests and charges made, all the rest of it, and setting the precedent to 'just let it go' is wrong also.

[RainMaker]

I should point out that protesters at Trump's inauguration were rounded up and arrested by the hundreds. They charged many with conspiracy and other crimes because they were in the vicinity of where some windows were broken. This included journalists and a couple nurses who stopped to help. They faced over 60 years in prison for this.

The fact that the US government made barely any arrests while people bragged on camera about committing multiple felonies should tell you about justice in this country.

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Him being impeached doesn't stop him from running in 2024.

The Senate can vote to disqualify someone from holding future office as part of an impeachment process.

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by cartman

If I'm understanding the process correctly, Congress has to rule on the outcome of the 25th amendment petition within 21(?) days. It was a length of time that allowed them to basically run out the clock and not have to do anything until after Jan. 20th.

+1

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

Heh...all that to nominate Garland. Never mind...

I was down about the pick but I did read that Garland has extensive history in prosecuting domestic terrorism cases. Probably a good thing with what is likely coming.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by britrock88

The Senate can vote to disqualify someone from holding future office as part of an impeachment process.

Yes, this is the only reason I see to consider impeachment, given the timing. If they can continue the process even after he is out of office, and ban him from office, that would be a useful outcome. Let him go start his news channel or whatever. It's a useful outcome to the Republicans at least, so you would think they might consider it. Otherwise, they continue to have to negotiate with this guy and his followers.

[CrimsonFox]

The woman who was shot:

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I was down about the pick but I did read that Garland has extensive history in prosecuting domestic terrorism cases. Probably a good thing with what is likely coming.

I think Jones or Yates would've been good, but the ability to fill a seat on the D.C. circuit is hard to pass up.

[RainMaker]

Here is the president watching and cheering for insurrectionists from the White House yesterday.

pic.twitter.com/jullodommO

— Nathaniel O’Dell #BLM (@ODell_Nathaniel) January 7, 2021

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

just added another "highlight, right click, search google" word to my list.

The Beer Hall Putsch is the one you're looking for.

SI

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Yes, this is the only reason I see to consider impeachment, given the timing. If they can continue the process even after he is out of office, and ban him from office, that would be a useful outcome. Let him go start his news channel or whatever. It's a useful outcome to the Republicans at least, so you would think they might consider it. Otherwise, they continue to have to negotiate with this guy and his followers.

That’s what I’m getting at. I really think forbidding him to hold office helps the Republicans more than it does the Democrats. He lost in 2020, has lost a few more folks by his actions since the election, and by the way, the Republican Party lost the presidency, Senate, and house on his watch. He’d lose by more in 2024 if he won the nomination, and if he didn’t, his presence in the primary field assures continued chaos in the Republican Party.

[CrimsonFox]

THIS genius wore his work badge and then they took it from him

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Him being impeached doesn't stop him from running in 2024.

It's the other punishment that can happen:

Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

That’s what I’m getting at. I really think for bidding him to hold office helps the Republicans more than it does the Democrats. He lost in 2020, has lost a few more folks by his actions since the election, and by the way, the Republican Party lost the presidency, Senate, and house on his watch. He’d lose by more in 2024 if he won the nomination, and if he didn’t, his presence in the primary field assures continued chaos in the Republican Party.

I think there' a lot of truth to that, but it ignores the effect of letting Trump' base have a collective tent to take political shelter & identity under for four more uninterrupted years.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

That’s what I’m getting at. I really think forbidding him to hold office helps the Republicans more than it does the Democrats. He lost in 2020, has lost a few more folks by his actions since the election, and by the way, the Republican Party lost the presidency, Senate, and house on his watch. He’d lose by more in 2024 if he won the nomination, and if he didn’t, his presence in the primary field assures continued chaos in the Republican Party.

Not sure about that. We just saw how Trumpism without Trump doesn't bring out the same turnout. While Trurmp may still lose in 2024, those low propensity voters can help the GOP in Congressional races just like in 2020. If he can't run, whoever he supports will still be tainted by Trump association, but the party won't have the same turnout benefit.

[cuervo72]

Bah, if he's banned he just runs Ivanka.

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Here is the president watching and cheering for insurrectionists from the White House yesterday.

pic.twitter.com/jullodommO

— Nathaniel O’Dell #BLM (@ODell_Nathaniel) January 7, 2021

If I were Laura Brannigan I would sue!

[ISiddiqui]

I can't see how anyone who was around in 2016 can say well if Trump runs he'll just sow chaos and lose big.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

My cousin just posted that limiting mail-in ballots will solve everything b/c then people will have faith that elections are fair.

The thing is, I am 100% sure he believes that. He’s a good guy.

My boss told me basically the same thing yesterday.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

That’s what I’m getting at. I really think forbidding him to hold office helps the Republicans more than it does the Democrats. He lost in 2020, has lost a few more folks by his actions since the election, and by the way, the Republican Party lost the presidency, Senate, and house on his watch. He’d lose by more in 2024 if he won the nomination, and if he didn’t, his presence in the primary field assures continued chaos in the Republican Party.

I kind of agree that him running for President would be a loss. But he also drives turnout. Republicans haven't shown they can win when Trump isn't on the ballot.

[Jas_lov]

Yeah, especially if Biden can't run again due to age. Can Harris beat him? We need to get rid of Trump so he can't ever win again because then he'll never leave.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by RainMaker




This was in the tent before he spoke yesterday morning. What was the point of that?

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

That’s what I’m getting at. I really think forbidding him to hold office helps the Republicans more than it does the Democrats. He lost in 2020, has lost a few more folks by his actions since the election, and by the way, the Republican Party lost the presidency, Senate, and house on his watch. He’d lose by more in 2024 if he won the nomination, and if he didn’t, his presence in the primary field assures continued chaos in the Republican Party.

Let me paint another picture: 2022 midterm brings a resurgence of MAGA because of Dems feeling like they arleady won. Multiple Trump-picked candidates beat out established Republicans and won election, while the GOP at large take over the House and Senate. Constant conspiracy investigations and "scandals" weaken the Biden presidency greatly. VP Harris wins the Democratic nomination, but is in the midst of a investigation over *insert stupid conspiracy here*. Meanwhile Trump cruises to nomination, and with the help of the GOP statehouses that have tighten voter laws to a point that many people of color are excluded from having their votes counted, we get President Trump round two.
Long shot? Sure. Extremely possible? Absolutely. That is why you impeach.

[CrimsonFox]

Chatanooga football is looking for a coach. Any takers?

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

My cousin just posted that limiting mail-in ballots will solve everything b/c then people will have faith that elections are fair.

The thing is, I am 100% sure he believes that. He’s a good guy.

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

My boss told me basically the same thing yesterday.

Then the GOP can get back to what they're good at: suppressing votes the old fashioned way

SI

[miami_fan]

So we are giving the terrorists the benefit of the doubt as to whether it was a coup or not? JFC.

[kingfc22]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...3ENZ6Z6M3NLGOU

Always the brave soul. Screw Graham. What else could he possibly want to see?

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

My cousin just posted that limiting mail-in ballots will solve everything b/c then people will have faith that elections are fair.

The thing is, I am 100% sure he believes that. He’s a good guy.

How do these folks rectify the fact that entire American states have been voting exclusively by mail since literally the last millennium?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Let me paint another picture: 2022 midterm brings a resurgence of MAGA because of Dems feeling like they arleady won. Multiple Trump-picked candidates beat out established Republicans and won election, while the GOP at large take over the House and Senate. Constant conspiracy investigations and "scandals" weaken the Biden presidency greatly. VP Harris wins the Democratic nomination, but is in the midst of a investigation over *insert stupid conspiracy here*. Meanwhile Trump cruises to nomination, and with the help of the GOP statehouses that have tighten voter laws to a point that many people of color are excluded from having their votes counted, we get President Trump round two.
Long shot? Sure. Extremely possible? Absolutely. That is why you impeach.

Republicans will probably do well in the midterms because the opposition party usually does. Plus the Democrats hate having power and will do jack shit for the next 2 years.

He has backed candidates before and it hasn't mattered. And in 4 years he'll be 77. At his weight and with his mental decline, you could be dealing with a whole different person.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

That’s what I’m getting at. I really think forbidding him to hold office helps the Republicans more than it does the Democrats. He lost in 2020, has lost a few more folks by his actions since the election, and by the way, the Republican Party lost the presidency, Senate, and house on his watch. He’d lose by more in 2024 if he won the nomination, and if he didn’t, his presence in the primary field assures continued chaos in the Republican Party.

I think if the Dems think having Trump out there in the field helps them, they're even dumber than I thought and I don't have a high opinion with them to begin with, especially right now. You impeach him now, especially if you have the Senate votes to convict because it also fractures the GOP.

But that's precisely why they aren't doing it because they know they won't get the votes in the Senate and they're having to instead beg for the 25th to be used by a VP Pence who isn't going to do it. So, they can look weak and ineffective with impeachment or weak and ineffective with the 25th begging. And we're all going to be running out the clock, praying Trump, the man with loyal followers all over the military and media and a nuclear football doesn't do something stupid or just sit idly by while our enemies do something awful.

SI

[GrantDawg]

And as if on cue. We can't have too many black people voting in Georgia:

It's not just Trump or GOP members of Congress subverting democracy & enabling domestic terrorism. Georgia Republicans plan to introduce a slew of new voting restrictions on Monday after Black voters turned out in record numbers https://t.co/x31nYVVRUs pic.twitter.com/aJ5WFxOVPl

— Ari Berman (@AriBerman) January 7, 2021

[Edward64]

Trump is a cult of personality. There won't be anyone else to take his place in the eyes of his followers ... not Cruz, not Ivanka, not Don Jr etc.

But that is not to say he can't do any damage after 2020. He will influence many of the races in 2022 and if able to, he will run in 2024.

But unlike some that says let's impeach him and stop him from running in 2024, I have more faith in the American public. Trump is an aberration, he won't win in 2024 with the one key assumption that Biden/Kamala presidency isn't a total mess.

[RainMaker]

Also none of these decisions should be based on 2022 or 2024. You impeach him because he committed crimes and is a threat to the country.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

How do these folks rectify the fact that entire American states have been voting exclusively by mail since literally the last millennium?

Let me answer for my boss: he doesn't know or care.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Also none of these decisions should be based on 2022 or 2024. You impeach him because he committed crimes and is a threat to the country.

Yeah - I'm also here. There may be better political options but you have to do this because it's the right thing to do and this was too big of a thing to not do the right thing.

SI

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Republicans will probably do well in the midterms because the opposition party usually does. Plus the Democrats hate having power and will do jack shit for the next 2 years.

He has backed candidates before and it hasn't mattered. And in 4 years he'll be 77. At his weight and with his mental decline, you could be dealing with a whole different person.

I hope so. But do you know that? You have a crystal ball? I am not saying my "what if" is definitely going to happen, but it would be great if we do everything we can to not let it happen.

All this is doesn't matter anyway, because the Senate is not going to vote to convict if he's impeached.

[RainMaker]

This is a start. I still think they should be disbanded and taken over by Secret Service. Need a deep investigation into those who worked with the insurrectionists.

* SENATE DEMOCRATIC LEADER CHUCK SCHUMER SAYS HE WILL FIRE SENATE SERGEANT-AT-ARMS MIKE STENGER AFTER CAPITOL BREACH - STATEMENT TO POLITICO @Reuters @politico

— Carl Quintanilla (@carlquintanilla) January 7, 2021

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Let me answer for my boss: he doesn't know or care.

I do think there needs to be some sort of communication program leading up to the next election basically saying here's what's going to happen, here are the checks and balances, here's everyone that will be watching the counting, here's how the mail in are secured, here's the audit trail etc.

Some will still be unconvinced but it will help.

[sabotai]

This broke me. I can't stop laughing at this (edit of a video posted a few pages ago)

Animani they pushed me out and maced me : trashy

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Also none of these decisions should be based on 2022 or 2024. You impeach him because he committed crimes and is a threat to the country.

I said this earlier. But in case I wasn't clear, both chambers should have remained after the certification and booted his butt right then and there.

It is *always* my position that our leaders should do what's right, consequences be damned.

But that's not the real world. I'm just saying that I'm not convinced that Pelosi truly wants him impeached, removed, and banned from running.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by cartman

tiresomely pedantic to be honest

Yes it is quite tiresome. What we need to do is drop the 82nd airborne into the northern Michigan peninsula and any other white supremacist havens and wipe them the fuck out. Otherwise in a few hundred years this time will be viewed in history same as 376 AD in Rome.