Werewolf XXVI: The Thing - GAME OVER! THINGS WIN!!!

[Blade6119]

And dubby sees what im talking about! Thanks for repaying the trust i put in you yesterday buddy! Your right on with what im thinking

[WVUFAN]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

I'll happily offer myself to be tested....after Blade and you.

So, you're cool with being tested -- two rounds from now.

Funny -- both Blade and I are willing to be tested THIS round. Again, if we were Things, would we be so willing to be tested, whereas you've just shown that hesitation we would normally pounce on in most WW games.

[Blade6119]

Dola, Dubb...did you ever see the move "Dreamcatcher?" The hero is a guy named dubby, hence why im calling you it(its a movie about alien invasion in a frozen wilderness that the aliens take over bodies..just like the thing, but crappier)...fyi

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

So, you're cool with being tested -- two rounds from now.

Funny -- both Blade and I are willing to be tested THIS round. Again, if we were Things, would we be so willing to be tested, whereas you've just shown that hesitation we would normally pounce on in most WW games.

Ding Ding, tell him what he has won!

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

Anyway buddy, make your decision...you know how my personal life is more busy nowadays(UTR my ass, im still top 3 last time i checked)...if you think im bad, vote me. I wont mind, i know who to look at tomorrow night when we waste a scan

Top 3 now...not top 3 back then.

What I'm confused about you is that you seem inordinately preoccupied with me. I did not cast the first vote against you, nor the second. This is all because I said that you were tied for MY #2 choice for being a Thing BASED ON VOTING PATTERNS ONLY. I still think we need to check you out because of your reactions and vaporous arguments today.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

So, you're cool with being tested -- two rounds from now.

Funny -- both Blade and I are willing to be tested THIS round. Again, if we were Things, would we be so willing to be tested, whereas you've just shown that hesitation we would normally pounce on in most WW games.

I repeat. A big reason I came out today was to avoid everyone piling on someone I scanned clean last night. Why should I offer myself to be scanned today, which wastes the vote today, just like it woulda done had I NOT shown my ass.

[hoopsguy]

This is mostly directed at Blade and Dubb. It is rare that I'm this far off the same page on a game as these guys are so I hope we can talk through this scenario in the next few posts.

Lets try and work through the Raiders/Warlord scenario here logically ...

1. Are you guys working with the assumption, as I am, that Qwikshot was a Thing and was killed on Night 1? If not, then why aren't you going after Barkeep?

[st.cronin]

I was convinced Blade was a bad guy BEFORE his crazy last minute vote fiasco. He's done nothing to convince me otherwise.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

So, you're cool with being tested -- two rounds from now.

Funny -- both Blade and I are willing to be tested THIS round. Again, if we were Things, would we be so willing to be tested, whereas you've just shown that hesitation we would normally pounce on in most WW games.

Increasingly I'm throwing you into the camp with Blade. You choose to ignore what is out there and is patently obvious, yet you make strange comments like this knowing that the answer to this has already been posted.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Top 3 now...not top 3 back then.

What I'm confused about you is that you seem inordinately preoccupied with me. I did not cast the first vote against you, nor the second. This is all because I said that you were tied for MY #2 choice for being a Thing BASED ON VOTING PATTERNS ONLY. I still think we need to check you out because of your reactions and vaporous arguments today.

You base your argument(which others like anxiety) are following off the fact you state you are a villager and include that in your numbers. I literally lead a charge onto you(a very uncleared person who makes perfect sense for a night one convert) and off a now tested clean villager and suddenly i have a horrid voting record? I stated pre-game i wouldnt be around much the first day(that friday/weekend) but would get back into the groove later...have i not? You have been so out there this whole game, its amazing...im hung up on you becuase you make sense as a thing. Your play makes sense if your a thing. Not some vote that conversions screw over, not your post count.


What more do i have then my gut to go off of?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

This is mostly directed at Blade and Dubb. It is rare that I'm this far off the same page on a game as these guys are so I hope we can talk through this scenario in the next few posts.

Lets try and work through the Raiders/Warlord scenario here logically ...

1. Are you guys working with the assumption, as I am, that Qwikshot was a Thing and was killed on Night 1? If not, then why aren't you going after Barkeep?

I am neither blade nor dubb but are you asking why is Barkeep not a suspect?

[JeeberD]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

Dola, Dubb...did you ever see the move "Dreamcatcher?" The hero is a guy named dubby, hence why im calling you it(its a movie about alien invasion in a frozen wilderness that the aliens take over bodies..just like the thing, but crappier)...fyi

Read the book, the movie was crap.

And it was Duddits, not Dubby...

[hoopsguy]

Cronin, re: post #808:

Why would a scientist both trying to move votes from one scientist to another like that? We know that Dubb was clean yesterday based on testing. The Warlord is saying that Raiders was clean last night based on his seer abilities.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I was convinced Blade was a bad guy BEFORE his crazy last minute vote fiasco. He's done nothing to convince me otherwise.

The last minute charge off a villager you mean? Yah, thats totally the play a thing would make...

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by JeeberD

Read the book, the movie was crap.

And it was Duddits, not Dubby...

It sounded like dubby in the movie, so dubby he shall be

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by JeeberD

Read the book, the movie was crap.

And it was Duddits, not Dubby...

I was going to say the same. It was Duddits (Douglas, but he couldn't pronounce that).

The book was crap, too.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

You base your argument(which others like anxiety) are following off the fact you state you are a villager and include that in your numbers. I literally lead a charge onto you(a very uncleared person who makes perfect sense for a night one convert) and off a now tested clean villager and suddenly i have a horrid voting record? I stated pre-game i wouldnt be around much the first day(that friday/weekend) but would get back into the groove later...have i not? You have been so out there this whole game, its amazing...im hung up on you becuase you make sense as a thing. Your play makes sense if your a thing. Not some vote that conversions screw over, not your post count.


What more do i have then my gut to go off of?

Well, let's get somewhere with this. Do you think you have a horrid voting record?

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I was going to say the same. It was Duddits (Douglas, but he couldn't pronounce that).

The book was crap, too.

Actually, I thought the movie wasn't too bad until the end.

[JeeberD]

The end of the movie TOTALLY pissed me off. The book wasn't a classic by any means, but it was decent.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

This is mostly directed at Blade and Dubb. It is rare that I'm this far off the same page on a game as these guys are so I hope we can talk through this scenario in the next few posts.

Lets try and work through the Raiders/Warlord scenario here logically ...

1. Are you guys working with the assumption, as I am, that Qwikshot was a Thing and was killed on Night 1? If not, then why aren't you going after Barkeep?

I make the assumption as far as the things are like this:
Qwikshot(killed night one)
Saldana(killed day 2)
RA(convert night one)
CW(convert night 2)

I assume qwikshot was a thing until i see another night kill happen(possible tonight). If it doesnt happen again, it means it was a one time power, and i assume it belonged to barkeep. Do i trust him, not one bit. If qwik was good, replace him with barkeep on the list. I voted for him and pushed for him on day 2 when others went to saldana, so i obviously dont trust him.

Im working under the conditions it doesnt matter if hes a thing, as if he is you can merely swap him in for qwik on that list.

[Swaggs]

I have got to say that I believe that CW is the seer, but damn if he didn't throw a big old wrench into this game. I was kind of on board with the other "brilliant" folks like myself, but now I am not sure if I trust anyone in this game.

[hoopsguy]

Cronin, I'm just wondering how people are making their decisions. I'm trying to work out how Raiders and Warlord are ganging up on people as Things. Because intuitively I don't see that being a solid long-term play.

I want Blade/Dubb, or whoever wants to advance the argument that this is our two-Thing combination, to build that case. Best case scenario is that we have two Things tying themselves to each other here and that we end the game with back-to-back votes. But at the moment I don't see it ...

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Well, let's get somewhere with this. Do you think you have a horrid voting record?

Day one i voted for jeeber(the first vote for him, a random vote for my fellow mod)...sucks he turned out bad, but you can hold against me if you want to. Day 2-1 i vote barkeep, who is still very unclear to me...so 1-1 there...day 2-2 i vote you who i think is a thing...so in my mind in sitting on 1 villager, 1 unknown, and 1 thing(technically an unknown to be fair)...i would call that pretty good.

[Swaggs]

Sorry if this has already been asked, but can we run test after test and hold off the night action, as long as we are killing a Thing each time? If so, we could knock things out in a hurry if someone had any good, reliable information.

[JeeberD]

We have a max of two tests at a time, Swaggs...

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Cronin, re: post #808:

Why would a scientist both trying to move votes from one scientist to another like that? We know that Dubb was clean yesterday based on testing. The Warlord is saying that Raiders was clean last night based on his seer abilities.

Blade, if I understand correctly, moved his vote to break a tie. He may have moved his vote onto somebody he was hoping to convert. Either way, he broke a tie to vote for a villager. Remember, it was between RA and dubb. Dubb tested clean; RA was scanned as clean last night. Either way I don't see how it clears Blade.

One monkey wrench: If RA was converted and scanned last night, would CW know? I don't have any idea.

[hoopsguy]

OK, so on Day 2 we have Saldana and Raiders as the Things. By mid-afternoon Saldana finds himself accumulating votes in a manner that puts him in danger. But Raiders, who has his vote on Saldana, doesn't move it. To the best of my knowledge (going from memory) he didn't log in during the last couple of hours while the only other remaining Thing was being lined up. He then knows he is on his own for the next day, having to avoid a vote so he can attempt to conversion that night. Which, I'm guessing, isn't automatic with bodyguard/blessed/roles unknown.

He barely escapes being the 2nd man voted off (nearly ending the game), goes for his conversion, and chooses Coffee Warlord, who happens to be the seer and is unguarded. They conspire and immediately agree that they have to save Raiders today, rather than just passing the Thing torch on to Warlord to eke out another day like Raiders did at the end of Day 2.

Does this make sense to you? Am I missing some important point in here?

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Blade, if I understand correctly, moved his vote to break a tie. He may have moved his vote onto somebody he was hoping to convert. Either way, he broke a tie to vote for a villager. Remember, it was between RA and dubb. Dubb tested clean; RA was scanned as clean last night. Either way I don't see how it clears Blade.

One monkey wrench: If RA was converted and scanned last night, would CW know? I don't have any idea.

I broke no tie..my final vote went to RA, the person i voted for all day. CW, your seer, cast the vote that damned dubb to testing

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

One monkey wrench: If RA was converted and scanned last night, would CW know? I don't have any idea.

No. Which sucks.

However, RA had pretty good odds of being tested today after last night's insanity. Hell, we TRIED to do it last night. I doubt the Things woulda converted him, knowing that.

[WVUFAN]

Question to schmidty: Is there a vote tonight?

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Cronin, I'm just wondering how people are making their decisions. I'm trying to work out how Raiders and Warlord are ganging up on people as Things. Because intuitively I don't see that being a solid long-term play.

I want Blade/Dubb, or whoever wants to advance the argument that this is our two-Thing combination, to build that case. Best case scenario is that we have two Things tying themselves to each other here and that we end the game with back-to-back votes. But at the moment I don't see it ...

Perhaps because it isn't possible? As a correction, for the scenario that we are both Things to occur, it would have to mean that there are at least five Things in the game.

7-5 Scientists.
After the voting goes for a Scientist, it would be 6-6 Scientists and the Things win.
Anything less than five Things and this isn't a winning gambit. Let's say it's four Things out there.
8-4 Scientists.
After the voting goes for a Scientists, it would be 7-5 Scientists.
The next day, you take out me and CW. That would make it 7-3 Scientists.

It just doesn't make any sense.

*Disclaimer: This isn't taking into account Barkeep's alleged skill and blessed/bodyguard roles.

[hoopsguy]

Cronin, Blade was definitely looking to build a coalition for someone besides Dubb last night. Again, I'll be happy to go look up posts if someone wants to go that route.

This seems to speak well of him, as Dubb was tested and shown to be a scientist.

That can be your answer for why he would do it, but it draws unnecessary attention if you are a Thing and know that you are already going to advance. Unless he wanted to convert Dubb last night, and thought testing Dubb would get him more leeway today. But I think the exact opposite is true, as the tested guys would seem more likely to draw the bodyguard that evening.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Cronin, I'm just wondering how people are making their decisions. I'm trying to work out how Raiders and Warlord are ganging up on people as Things. Because intuitively I don't see that being a solid long-term play.

I want Blade/Dubb, or whoever wants to advance the argument that this is our two-Thing combination, to build that case. Best case scenario is that we have two Things tying themselves to each other here and that we end the game with back-to-back votes. But at the moment I don't see it ...

Me either. It makes no sense whatsoever to me.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

OK, so on Day 2 we have Saldana and Raiders as the Things. By mid-afternoon Saldana finds himself accumulating votes in a manner that puts him in danger. But Raiders, who has his vote on Saldana, doesn't move it. To the best of my knowledge (going from memory) he didn't log in during the last couple of hours while the only other remaining Thing was being lined up. He then knows he is on his own for the next day, having to avoid a vote so he can attempt to conversion that night. Which, I'm guessing, isn't automatic with bodyguard/blessed/roles unknown.

He barely escapes being the 2nd man voted off (nearly ending the game), goes for his conversion, and chooses Coffee Warlord, who happens to be the seer and is unguarded. They conspire and immediately agree that they have to save Raiders today, rather than just passing the Thing torch on to Warlord to eke out another day like Raiders did at the end of Day 2.

Does this make sense to you? Am I missing some important point in here?

Yes, he wasnt around...and if he had been on the saldana vote there was no viable reason i saw that he could have used to swap if it he wanted to. If he had, he most likely would have hung himself and when that happened saldana as well. This way, they lost just saldana(good move in my mind). He goes after CW, one of the group that led the charge off dubb, a vet, and a fairly trusted person WHO NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT BRILLIANT(implying it likely he has a special role)...bodyguard has no idea who to protect and doesnt do CW, CW goes over and they start talking. Day 3 starts immediately i resume my push for RA, and it gains initial momentum. CW steps out claiming seer and clears RA and himself of danger for today, and by the way their playing it tomorrow as well at the minimum. Makes sense to me, as by the time we get around to test them they have 2 more converts(hell, prob. me and a quiet person realistically).

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Cronin, Blade was definitely looking to build a coalition for someone besides Dubb last night. Again, I'll be happy to go look up posts if someone wants to go that route.

This seems to speak well of him, as Dubb was tested and shown to be a scientist.

That can be your answer for why he would do it, but it draws unnecessary attention if you are a Thing and know that you are already going to advance. Unless he wanted to convert Dubb last night, and thought testing Dubb would get him more leeway today. But I think the exact opposite is true, as the tested guys would seem more likely to draw the bodyguard that evening.

I suspected RA, but when i first tried to get a group i tried to get it to be Jeeber since he already had two votes. Barkeep voted RA and then RA became the target

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

Day one i voted for jeeber(the first vote for him, a random vote for my fellow mod)...sucks he turned out bad, but you can hold against me if you want to. Day 2-1 i vote barkeep, who is still very unclear to me...so 1-1 there...day 2-2 i vote you who i think is a thing...so in my mind in sitting on 1 villager, 1 unknown, and 1 thing(technically an unknown to be fair)...i would call that pretty good.

In my mind, 2 villagers and 1 unknown.

In everyone else's mind, that's 1 villager and 2 unknowns. That's pretty shitty considering the voting records of everyone else.

You do understand that other than Jeebs, who voted for a villager twice you have the worst voting record?

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Perhaps because it isn't possible? As a correction, for the scenario that we are both Things to occur, it would have to mean that there are at least five Things in the game.

7-5 Scientists.
After the voting goes for a Scientist, it would be 6-6 Scientists and the Things win.
Anything less than five Things and this isn't a winning gambit. Let's say it's four Things out there.
8-4 Scientists.
After the voting goes for a Scientists, it would be 7-5 Scientists.
The next day, you take out me and CW. That would make it 7-3 Scientists.

It just doesn't make any sense.

*Disclaimer: This isn't taking into account Barkeep's alleged skill and blessed/bodyguard roles.

The hell, did you see my list? I think there are 2 things, possibly 3 depending on starting numbers/barkeep's kill.

Where the hell are you getting 5?

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

In my mind, 2 villagers and 1 unknown.

In everyone else's mind, that's 1 villager and 2 unknowns. That's pretty shitty considering the voting records of everyone else.

You do understand that other than Jeebs, who voted for a villager twice you have the worst voting record?

Well, im sure after today when you all vote for me some people will match me. But RA, keep pushing...its just building up more of a case against you when i come up clean

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Cronin, Blade was definitely looking to build a coalition for someone besides Dubb last night. Again, I'll be happy to go look up posts if someone wants to go that route.

This seems to speak well of him, as Dubb was tested and shown to be a scientist.

That can be your answer for why he would do it, but it draws unnecessary attention if you are a Thing and know that you are already going to advance. Unless he wanted to convert Dubb last night, and thought testing Dubb would get him more leeway today. But I think the exact opposite is true, as the tested guys would seem more likely to draw the bodyguard that evening.

There are a gazillion possible strategies why he would play that way as a Thing. Remember, I voted for him early yesterday - I think he's been bad from the beginning.

Barkeep's story has basically held up: There's been nothing to contradict it. So I think on day 1 there had to have been a Thing in the group voting for him. Going by memory, that's me, anxiety, and blade. That, coupled with blade's general weirdness, is why I like him. It's not just his low post count: It's the style of his posting, which has been totally out of character.

[hoopsguy]

In case it isn't clear, I'm not jumping on the Blade bandwagon just yet. But I also think that it is unlikely that CW and RA are both Things acting in concert.

In terms of last nights conversion, if the Things (well, I'm guessing there was only one of them last night) had an idea that CW was the seer then it makes all the sense in the world to go after him. But I don't think he makes sense as a random target compared to Dubb/JeeberD/Barkeep. Each of those guys has been cleared and/or has indicated a role that makes them unlikely to be blessed.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

It's not just his low post count:

You do realize i am now the #1 poster in this thread, right?

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

Yes, he wasnt around...and if he had been on the saldana vote there was no viable reason i saw that he could have used to swap if it he wanted to. If he had, he most likely would have hung himself and when that happened saldana as well. This way, they lost just saldana(good move in my mind). He goes after CW, one of the group that led the charge off dubb, a vet, and a fairly trusted person WHO NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT BRILLIANT(implying it likely he has a special role)...bodyguard has no idea who to protect and doesnt do CW, CW goes over and they start talking. Day 3 starts immediately i resume my push for RA, and it gains initial momentum. CW steps out claiming seer and clears RA and himself of danger for today, and by the way their playing it tomorrow as well at the minimum. Makes sense to me, as by the time we get around to test them they have 2 more converts(hell, prob. me and a quiet person realistically).

So if it's only two of us, how do we play this out to win??? You should know by playing the wolf before that no one wants to lose. The preference is always to win. When you're dead and your side wins, it's a hollow victory.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by WVUFAN

Question to schmidty: Is there a vote tonight?

If everyone votes before I am either A) too tired to think straight, or B) have gone to bed, then I will try to post the results tonight.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

So if it's only two of us, how do we play this out to win??? You should know by playing the wolf before that no one wants to lose. The preference is always to win. When you're dead and your side wins, it's a hollow victory.

You keep doing what your doing right now, throwing other players under the bus and not directly stating you know something. Do just enough to get someone else killed and yourself not tested. its the way wolfs win every game

[Blade6119]

5 more minutes, anyone else got a question for me?

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

The hell, did you see my list? I think there are 2 things, possibly 3 depending on starting numbers/barkeep's kill.

Where the hell are you getting 5?

Dude, I am seriously getting frustrated at your lack of understanding but I guess that's your play right now. Let me spell it out for you in 1st Grade words:

That case is a case where "we" win and that play is an end game.

I tried to use all monosyllabic words so you'll understand.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

5 more minutes, anyone else got a question for me?

Check again - The deadline is tomorrow night unless everyone votes.

[WVUFAN]

Could someone post a vote count? Who hasn't voted yet?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

You do realize i am now the #1 poster in this thread, right?

lol

I forget who said you weren't posting much, and you had some excuse why. That wasn't my point at all.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Check again - The deadline is tomorrow night unless everyone votes.

5 more minutes until im gone for the night and likely almost all of the day tomorrow. Im tired of defending myself, have said my piece, and am going to let the chips fall how they may