Werewolf XXVI: The Thing - GAME OVER! THINGS WIN!!!

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by path12

Going through that list, maybe it's just me but it really looks like Coffee's play changed from day 2 to day 3.

Uh, duh?

Prior to role reveal, I was attempting to subtly hint at my role, while not being too aggravating to anyone. Don't exactly need to do that now.

[Barkeep49]

And now we have our friend Dubb, who thankfully I have already partially recapped.

Dubb
95 -- Asks to be tested
96 -- Realizes only 1 test a day so thinks we shouldn't test him
100 -- Throws out first overall vote for saldana
111 -- Finds out that vote for saldana doesn't count
120 -- Attempts to vote for saldana
121 -- Really votes for saldana
183 --

Actually I think this hurts you a little in my book Hoopsguy. If you don't quite get the "brilliant" blurb, that leads me to believe you didn't get a simliar PM to what some of the rest of us got. It refers to us as simple, but brilliant . I didn't want to bring that up, but since it is already out in the open I see no problem with it.

What you quoted has nothing to do with that.

191 -- Reminds us all what a bitch it is to edit versus write
198 -- Finds my post stating that I am going to kill someone funny and wonders what everyone else is supposed to do
201 -- Tells me that I'm the man
220 -- Wonders if I'm in the game
223 -- Thanks Schmidty for confirming I'm in the game
254 -- Votes for JeeberD
271 -- Says it's a wasted vote to go after him. Jeebs is more likely convert.
280 -- Hates tornados (I am not making that up, I promise)
281 -- Tells us about the bad storm
382 -- Wants to get an original thing and thinks hoops is it
423 -- Wonders about testing today
424 -- Has the exact same wonder about testing today
425 -- Calls the board "Nothing but trouble"
433 -- Votes for hoopsguy with no explanation
439 -- Asks if I still am saying Qwik was a thing
442 -- Is not convinced by my logic
467 - "We haven't converted since Saldana just died."
470 - Understands a point Blade was making about a conversion of Raiders
497 - Responding to the use of "we" in 467 and explains that he was referring to all the players in the game. Compares voting for him to voting for a Green Party candidate
511 - Believes that either hoops or I is a Shitface. Ends with "Test me, show your stupidity."
513 - In response to mckerny thinking he has been converted

worst call in werewolf history. , have fun being wrong.

515 - In response to hoops

Actually I made my call to vote you early and figured everyone would see Saldana. Most of they day I wasn't checking in the werewolf thread so I didn't know what the vote count was until late in the day after the deadline.

Call it revisionist, call it what you want, but I tend to think the group as a whole is smart enough to pick up on post 185 where he made himself sound like a complete idiot.

Would I have changed my vote if I came back and saw it was close? Yes, but when I did come back I didn't take the time to dig through posts, and to be honest I'm playing this game very much on the fly which is not how I normally play so forgive me if I'm making bad judgement calls.

With all that said, I probably won't defend myself anymore today b/c if the group wants me tested I'm more than happy to be tested, it just won't get us anywhere. I think the best way would be to test either Barkeep or Hoops. One has no evidence to back up his claims and the other has cleared himself by using a certain term out of context.

555 - Claims Jeeber doesn't want to be tested, but that he doesn't care if he is
563 - Wishes the brilliant thing was never brought into play
564 -

whatever you think. I won't be changing my vote, if I was a thing I would have reason to change my vote so I don't get tested. I have nothing to hide, please do vote for me, RA and McKerney are convinced I'm a thing.

I find this interesting considering when it was close and he was in the thread he did NOT change his vote
567 - Thinks RA maybe was converted on N1
584 - Thinks the day has been wasted (this is on D2 pt 2)
603 - Says he wasn't really paying attention around deadline (post deadline pre-result on D2 pt 2)
604 - Realizes he messed up
607 - Says how crazy late voting was
613 - Says he's clean
620 - Says he's a scientist and would say more but Schmidty said not to
637 - Dubb revealed to be clean during testing
667 - Believes an analysis raiders posted is flawed. Votes for Raiders
711 - Leaving votes on RA. Believes CW might already be converted. Says how hard it is to trust people this game
794 - Believes RA would've been voted for sure w/o CW coming out. Thinks Blade is innocent as he voted for dubb only to break a tie
796 - Believes CW was the seer at one point and is now converted
799 - Believes again CW is trying to buy time with his reveal
862 - Speaks about his knowledge with fake reveals. Believes now would be a good time for CW to do so if RA was a Shitface
870 - Believes RA wants to go in worthless circles
878 - Thinks voting record is over rated. Says it is easy to have a great voting record as a wolf. My limited study of this last game confirms that having a bad voting record on Days 1 and 2 is no predictor of being a wolf.
882 - Thinks there have been 2 conversions
892 - Disagrees with st.cronin who says voting record has been useful in last two games. Says the wolves have been playing poorly
897 -

And if you must know, that is the reason I was voting for hoops earlier. He does play the role right and it was risk/reward. I thought everyone would catch on to saldana, but I wanted to show that hoops was the biggest threat. I thought i caught him, which I've changed my mind on that now, and if I did catch him, he knows how to play the role.

913 - Says that voting record for Day 2 pt 2 don't completely reflect people's feelings because of the crazy last minute voting
921 -

Again, I have no problem with the concept that CW was the seer, but I believe that either Blade, CW, Hoops, or Barkeep, or myself were converted last night. Of those CW has played today the most different and we have to believe the things are down to 2 and if RA is a thing he would have been the bandwagon today. That would have cut them to 1. If CW was the convert most likely it buys both of them a couple of days, and if one of them is killed they can always claim, "He was converted after the scan" or, "He was converted after the reveal."

What makes me not believe the reveal even further is the way it is revealed....

So if he is converted he is going to rat on them? Bullshit, sugar coat it a little more to make people buy it.

Also, later in the day he says with 100% knowledge that he wouldn't know if RA was converted last night. BS, I doubt Schmidty would tell you, or even allow a seer role where you could scan someone on night 2 and them be a thing on day 3 and you not know it. Again, he is trying to position himself incase the bandwagon slips to RA.

923 - In response cronin points out that CW has said he wouldn't know if RA was converted
924 - Doesn't buy CW's reveal
926 - Willing to vote for CW or RA if the numbers are there
931 - Votes for CW
939 - Gives examples of how he believes CW has given the "Worst role reveal ever"
940 - Points out that he took all the examples from CW's psots
942 - Points out that if dubb has been converted since yesterday there is no way for CW to know it and thus doesn't buy CW's reveal
947 - In response to CW saying that he asked schmidty about the order of night actions

I've always known people running the game to give inside information that could effect the outcome of the game to certain players and not the whole group. How convenient for you make up another rule where schmidty can't clarify if he gave you inside information.

948 - Believes CW was a seer at one point but has been converted
949 - Clarifies 948 to say he has no doubt (reflected in my summary of the post)
953 -

vote me please, test me again, hell, test me the rest of the game, show how easily fooled you guys are. I love big circles. I would love for the bodyguard to reveal who he protected last night as long as it is either blade/hoops/dubb/coffee/barkeep, those are the 5 where I think the conversion came from. Seeing as how blade is thinking like me I'm confident it wasn't him, but coffee is pouring on the sugar coating like no other. Now I'll wait for RA to reveal he is the bodyguard....

956 - Asks about CW calling himself different names (geneticist vs scientist)
959 - Meaningless post
963 - Wants hoops to make his vote count

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

In all seriousness, I'm hoping that whether or not you have finished that process that by mid-afternoon or so you will be willing/able to talk about your impressions of yesterday.

One trend I would look for is people who's general tenor of their posts change, as I believe both wolves right now are converts. So if you are able to establish some kind of baseline for the candidates on Day 1 and then look for shifts in voice/direction/purpose after the night action. If you are taking that approach then I think the total post capture is potentially very useful.

Well I am finding it once again very insightful and yes looking for tenor changes is one of the things I am trying to acomplish. I am finding that looking at individual people rather then simply rereading the thread to be a gigantic help. This proved true with saldana and while I have no firm conclusions yet, I'm finding it helpful again.

[Barkeep49]

Also a note about my schedule: I am pretty free this morning but this afternoon I will only be able to do quick peeks at the thread before I am around consistently again for the last 2 hours before deadline.

[Barkeep49]

And we're onto Raiders.

[Barkeep49]

Which I see is 123 posts so it'll likely be an hour or so before I'm done so if I'm in the thread and not posting, that's why.

[Barkeep49]

Yawl know that you can post as I am doing my recap's right?

[Swaggs]

How is the voting now and who has not voted?

[hoopsguy]

Here is what I have on votes, as of Post #1008:

Blade - Anxiety (696), Raiders (710), Cronin (722), mckerney (771)

Coffee - WVUFAN (741), Blade (895), Swaggs (930), Dubb (931), Path (985)

Tanglewood - Hoopsguy (922)

Dubb - Coffee (946), JeeberD (952)

Not Voted: Barkeep, Tanglewood

I'm expecting to move my vote since there doesn't seem to be any consensus behind one of the four primary people being discussed.

[hoopsguy]

Er, "beyond", not "behind" ... basically, I think my vote will be wasted for all intents and purposes if it isn't on one of the guys who have been the topic of conversation over the last 24 hours.

[Barkeep49]

Hoops I am definetly moving in a direction that would have me vote outside "The 4".

[Barkeep49]

123 -

Simple, but extremely brilliant scientist checking in.

127 - Meaningless post
137 - Tells Anxiety not to delete posts
145 - Votes for saldana for using the word regular
147 -

For the past few games, yeah, I've tried to lay low. FWIW, I never put too much stock in the second vote. I'm more of a third, fourth, etc. vote type guy

155 - Sees voting as win-win, though admits that a person is cleared for only Day 1.
158 -

Yeah, that is a problem. If I were one of them I would definitely target one of the people who was cleared. I wouldn't think there would be only one of them; I would guess two. If there were only one of them, it would be a pretty quick game if we got lucky on day 1. Any more than two and it tilts the odds too much in their favor.

163 - Asks question about how the second vote in a day mechanic works
164 - Says he can't determine when we get a second vote
165 - Believes if we can use a second vote after checking a scientist the second vote should go to clear somebody
167 - Asks how the second pick is made
174 - Feels as good about blade as he does bad about saldana. No feel for hoops.
227 - Doesn't like saldana's regular statement but didn't mind WVU's "clean" statement
237 - Doesn't take too much stock of starting PMs
238 - Says hoops is a good choice to convert; also says Jeeber is a good choice
240 - Agrees we should try and find a starting rather then converted Shitface
241 - Believes the game is unbalanced if Shitfaces could convert every night
251 - Wonders if since there was no description of the conversion that we can still trust Jeeber
257 - Not sure what to make of dubb and cronin
265 - Going to rent the movie
268 - Thinks conversions are silent.
276 - Glad vote was delayed
287 - Says movie is inconclusive about whether noise is made upon conversion
291 - Discusses movie plot points with Qwik (who is dead, I'll add)
307 - Wonders if we can test Qwik's remains to see if I'm telling the truth
310 - Thinks we should test me. Wonders if there is a "doctor" role in the game that could test dead bodies
315 -

Thoughts about the game vs. movie:

Schmidty said he was going from memory on this game, so I don't think we can equate the game to the movie. That being said, I highly doubt there was a conversion on night 1. It didn't sound as if there was one, and I would guess that the Thing(s) would have a shot at doing it on Night 2.

If the game is different from the movie, then there is a possibilty (not probability) that the Original Thing(s) could be the only ones that could infect others. In that respect, I think it's more imperative to go after an original Thing and much easier to snag one as opposed to a converted person.

I doubt Jeebs and Barkeep are Things because of the arguments already made. I'd focus on Barkeep's posts #289 and #292 and pick someone from his list.

325 - Meaningless post
374 - Says he worded posts about saldana incorrectly. Was less sure then he appeared at the time. Only sure enough for a D1 vote.
375 - Votes for saldana. Claims it is because he does not agree with saldana voting for me
394 - Meaningless post
396 - Doesn't believe hoops is casting more suspicion then anyone else
398 - Questions saldana about being the first to place a second vote on D1, when saldana has just been critical of such a person
399 - Realizes Jeeber cast the first second vote on D1
409 - Believes either outcome from testing is a good thing
477 - Corrects hoops (saying he voted for saldana both days)
478 - Questions dubb about his use of we in reference to conversion (see dubb post 467)
479 - Tries to match my character up to the movie
481 - Votes for me in order to validate what I've done
482 - Claims he'd switch his vote to himself to avoid a tie. Beleives whoever gets the second vote on Day 2 pt 2 is a huge target for conversion
504 - Says based on voting chart dubb pops out at him. Votes for dubb
518 - Believes dubb's defence is similar to saldana's defense
519 - Says that if dubb isn't bad he'll still have a good voting record
522 - Points out that we don't know if they can convert everday. If they cannot was somebody converted D1
531 - Doesn't consider saldana an archenemy. Feels more strongly that I am good then dubb is bad which is why he switched votes
532 - Believes it possible for a thing to have changed their vote from saldana without suspicion until later on
538 - Says Blade's activity has been low
556 -

Statements like this make me think the opposite.

557 - Says he's out for the night
624 - Wants to catch up and respond to last minute events
625 - Responds to Blade's accusations that Raiders sounded like we knew we were going to hit a villager stating that the odds were that we were going to hit a villager
626 - Points out that hoops and blade " "conveniently" missed the deadline"
629 - Says he didn't want to be tested so as to avoid becoming a JeeberD target. Found all the vote switching strange
630 - Tries to correct some mistakes hoops has made about him by quoting old posts of his own.
631 - Defends vote for dubb
634 - To hoops who has defended what he's said to Raiders

Those posts weren't meant to illustrate you "hampering my position". They were meant to illustrate how you've missed stuff all game. I can understand work intruding in on the game, but it seems as if you're not as sharp this time around...whether it's on intentional or not remains to be seen.

638 - Wonders about wording of schmidty's flavor text
643 - Admits that everyone was a convert, some just were before the game started
644 - Tries to get clarification from schdmity about flavor text
654 - Posts a vote count (wants it checked)
656 - Wants to be clear that he was not around during the deadline
665 - Believes there to be a silent conversion. Top 3 suspects are Jeeber, CW, and Blade. Gives thoughts on all players.
670 - Responding to blade who feels that his analysis in 665 is misleading asking Blade to state what was misleading
671 -

Maybe because you can't.

672 -

Also, facts are facts. They're immutable unlike your pseudo-arguments.

677 - Defends list of suspects partly based on the fact that he knows he is a scientist
678 - Finds it funny that people think he led the charge against dubb
679 - Corrects blade's misposting of the vote count
683 - Says suspects were based on voting patterns and only on the final votes
685 - (Post CW seer reveal)

Okay. Coffee Warlord slipped down my list of suspects a lot.

689 - Accuses Blade of trying to get schmidty to give Blade the answer that Blade wants
693 - Believes according to voting patterns the top 2 suspects are Blade and Jeeber
694 - Believes Blade is ignoring facts
697 - Criticizes Blade for complaing about schmidty
708 - Feels Blade "shopped" for the answer he wanted. Says voting record still proves Blade voted for a scientist
709 - Defends lack of response as his going home
710 - Votes for Blade
712 - In reference to his 708 post

Misdirection is always key when you're on the other side.

715 - In response to dubb

I'm glad that you are questioning CW. I thought the same thing when looking at my voting spreadsheet. Based upon what I know, I believe him. But looking at it not knowing for sure I am a scientist I see four possibilities:

1. He's a Thing, I'm a Thing. For him to come out like this to "save" me would mean that our situation is dire or the endgame is in sight. I don't think either is the case.

2. He's the Seer, I'm a Thing. This doesn't make any sense unless I'm a Thing that when viewed, am viewed as a Scientist. This is a possibility.

3. He's a Thing, I'm a scientist. Again, I don't see the play here for him to do this, other than gain your trust for one day...and the tradeoff isn't worth it.

4. He's the Seer, I'm a scientist. This is the most likely scenario as he's stated his reasons for coming out at this point.

Scenarios 2 and 3 I throw away. The only one I would be worried about is scenario 1, which I don't see happening numbers-wise. There are 14 of us left. For this gambit to work, I would guess that there would have to be at least 4 things out there.

717 - Has Blade as top suspect and resposts who he has voted for
718 - Thinks checking CW is a wasted day
720 - Says that CW's actions are consistent with CW checking him out
733 - Posts why Blade voted for me. Then this

There are two things in here that ring some alarm bells. Anyone who knows what I know will think the same.

734 - Believes if we vote for CW it is guarenteed he will be converted
736 - Believes that CW as a Shitface doesn't make sense as it only buys him a small amount of time
740 - Again points out we can only trust somebody cleared for 1 day
745 - Too drunk to argue with Blade
753 - Suggests WVU is playing under the radar (UTR)
756 - Explains what UTR is
760 - Feels this is the perfect game to play UTR
765 - Meaningless post
767 - About Blade

The post count prior to day 2 was pretty low for him which would've been UTR for him.

805 - Believes Blade is preoccupied with him. Originally said Blade was a suspect ONLY because of voting patterns
809 - Believes WVU is ignoring what is out there
817 - Asks Blade what Blade thinks of his (Blade's) own voting record
818 - Movie post
831 -

Perhaps because it isn't possible? As a correction, for the scenario that we are both Things to occur, it would have to mean that there are at least five Things in the game.

7-5 Scientists.
After the voting goes for a Scientist, it would be 6-6 Scientists and the Things win.
Anything less than five Things and this isn't a winning gambit. Let's say it's four Things out there.
8-4 Scientists.
After the voting goes for a Scientists, it would be 7-5 Scientists.
The next day, you take out me and CW. That would make it 7-3 Scientists.

It just doesn't make any sense.

*Disclaimer: This isn't taking into account Barkeep's alleged skill and blessed/bodyguard roles.

836 - Believes Blade's voting record is worse then Blade does
842 - Wants to know if he and CW are Shitfaces what their victory strategy is
846 - Frustrated with blade
852 - Likes how Blade used "throwing other players under the bus" no sarcasm intended
859 - Posts a tenative vote count
861 - Believes Qwk's posting was night right
863 - Clarifies that I meant post not vote count
868 - Believes dubb is misled and not a thing
871 - Tries to get Blade to admit Blade's voting record is horrid
875 - Says conversion of CW doesn't make sense
880 - Says the throwing under the bus refers to an FOFC phrase about Peyton Manning
891 - Glad Blade admits Blade has had a bad voting record and reminds Blade that his post about Blade's voting record is what set Blade off
902 - To dubb

I agree with you completely. I had a horrible voting record many games and that was what killed me. For the seventh time, I posted that message based on voting records according to me...nothing else. It was other people who spun it out there. hoops asked for an analysis of voting records previously and I did it. Of course, I'm going to put my two cents in because I know I'm a scientist and I'll put that information out there.

I didn't put too much stock into it, but I also was going to keep it in the back of my mind. When you and Blade overreacted to it that was all you. Blade kept coming back to it and attacking it, so I felt as if he had something to hide. Remember that I didn't vote for him right away even after he was arguing.

Also, you never said why you felt as if that analysis was flawed. Why, and why did you feel as if it was flawed?

905 - Believes everything Blade did that day had no substance
908 - Going to bed
987 - Thinks there's no reason for dubb to think he's the bodyguard
988 - Wonders why hoops would vote if he revealed as bodyguard
990 - Agrees with Anxiety that Blade talks too much fluff. Claims he throws stuff out there and sees what sticks and ignores the other side of arguments
991 - Understands why hoop made the comment about him and the bodyguard
992 -

A few thoughts before I get ready to head to work:

1. After re-reading some of the posts, I agree that CW's post about his seer reveal makes it seem as if I'm legit today. It only came out later that he wouldn't know if I were converted Night 2. I gave him a bye initially since I knew I was a scientist and that's what he said. I think some of you are reading a little too much into his posts. It's not like other people haven't misposted. For example:

Post #467

It sounds as if dubb is a Thing. I asked "Who's we" and he responded not to read anything into it. I find it ironic that he's doing the same thing to CW.

2. There is a possibility that dubb is still a Thing and the test won't work on him (damn if I can't remember that role right now). Frankly, I think that's a very slim possibility, but it might be considered. I'm trying to think how it would be balanced in the game. Barkeep's power, perhaps? That would be the only way to kill him. I just don't think that this is something to think hard about, but perhaps consider with any testing we do.

3. The more and more I think about it, I agree that Blade is just a loquacious stubborn individual and not a Thing. I also am not sure that dubb is converted either. Finally, I don't think CW is a Thing. I know I'm not a Thing. In a way, I think that the Thing(s) are sitting back and watch the four of us go at each other while we argue about testing four scientists. I'm going to try to step back a little to observe a little more (plus I have quite a bit of work today).

[Barkeep49]

For the record that post is Raider's post recap. I have to admit that this did raise some eyebrows with me.

In particular posts 374 and 375. In 374 he is backing off his D1 vote and says he didn't feel strongly about it. Suddenly 10 minutes later he's voting for saldana. What happened in those 10 minutes Raiders?

Also you asked for a scenario that makes you and CW things. It's quite simple.

Original things: Qwik & Saldana
N1: Convert You
N2: Convert Coffee

With you going after saldana perhaps they figured that made you a good target for conversion. Then by voting for saldana, despite the utter contradiction in your posts you seem to be clear. That is only further helped by CW's seer becoming on the thing side.

That said I don't think you are a thing but I would like you to respond to the 374 and 375 issue.

[Barkeep49]

So as I start Blade's recap do not expect me to finish it until around 3 eastern. Also I am still leaning towards saying all 4 of the suspects today are scientists and would like to seriously look at Tangle, Swag, Anxiety, and WVU who have all been under the radar.

[Barkeep49]

Oh I've completely forgotten about Jeeber. Yeah he's on that list along with the quiet 4. Shows how well he's gone UTR>

[Barkeep49]

I ahve to say how pleasant it's been to basically post to myself this mornign. Very little disagreement from the rest of you cocksuckers.

[hoopsguy]

I was wondering where the profanity had gone.

I'm hoping to get home a little early this afternoon after working some very long hours over the last week. If you don't have something up on the quiet players I'll be happy to take a stab at them. I don't think it will take as long as the post captures you are doing but if you want some collaboration instead of this just being a solo project let me know.

So if you want to look at those five guys, does that imply that you have trust (for today, at least) in the people I'm listing as "not defined"? Obviously it is easier to look at a smaller group, but I would put mckerney (for example) into a classification of quiet.

1. JeeberD - quiet
2. st.cronin - not defined
3. tanglewood - quiet
4. Raiders Army - group of 4
5. Blade6119 - group of 4
6. dubb93 - group of 4
7. Swaggs - quiet
8. path12 - not defined
9. saldana - dead Thing
10. Qwikshot - presumed dead Thing
11. Barkeep - the person defining the terms here
12. mckerney - not defined
13. Coffee Warlord - group of 4
14. Anxiety - quiet
15. hoopsguy - not defined
16. WVUFAN - quiet

[Raiders Army]

First off, nice analysis. I don't think I'd have the patience to do all of this.

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

For the record that post is Raider's post recap. I have to admit that this did raise some eyebrows with me.

In particular posts 374 and 375. In 374 he is backing off his D1 vote and says he didn't feel strongly about it. Suddenly 10 minutes later he's voting for saldana. What happened in those 10 minutes Raiders?

Unfortunately, when you're looking at so many posts sometimes you can't see the forest for the trees. Post 374 was why I voted for him on Day 1. Post 375 was my vote for him on Day 2. I can't remember what happened in those ten minutes. Boss came into my office? What I read in that is that I explained why I voted for him on Day 1 in the first post which was totally separate from the next post where I voted for him on Day 2. Obviously a lot happened between Day 1 and Day 2.

[JeeberD]

I'm labeled quiet after my drunken tomfoolery last night? Weird...

Actually, I'm labeled quiet every WW game I'm in so it's not really so weird.

[Raiders Army]

Another thought on Barkeep's role. He could be the wildcard in all of this. Remember he didn't receive a role in the beginning. What might be the easiest role to give out? A third party role where he has certain conditions that he can win under. He's not on the side of scientists and he's not on the side of Things. I don't think that's been brought up, but I just remembered those roles.

[Barkeep49]

Raiders here's the thing I don't understand: You apologize, essentially, to a shitface in 374 for voting for him on D1. Then all of a sudden you've turned the hell around and are doing it again in 375. I mean Godamn! That's some multiple personality shit going on right there. Still doesn't ring right with me.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Another thought on Barkeep's role. He could be the wildcard in all of this. Remember he didn't receive a role in the beginning. What might be the easiest role to give out? A third party role where he has certain conditions that he can win under. He's not on the side of scientists and he's not on the side of Things. I don't think that's been brought up, but I just remembered those roles.

I'm just a fucking cocksucking scientist. I got the role that penny would have had if he had been around. Schmidty didn't go and change the balance of the game on d1.

[Barkeep49]

Hoops: Well when you put it that way I realize how little trust i have of so many of these cocksuckers.

Going to lunch now; hope to finish Blade at the end of lunch, but otherwise will not be around much starting now.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I'm just a fucking cocksucking scientist. I got the role that penny would have had if he had been around. Schmidty didn't go and change the balance of the game on d1.

There's your profanity hoops!

Makes sense to me what you said, but just saying that it's a possibility.

[path12]

I appreciate the analysis since it's been a busy week for me. I'm still pretty comfortable with my vote, but am interested in seeing other opinions/reactions/etc.

I'll be very interested in seeing any recap of Anxiety's posts. I've been meaning to do that.....

[Barkeep49]

And here we go with Blade

Blade
110 - Says how brilliant he is (1st to use the magic word)
117 - Meaningless post
118 - Shows Anxiety how to vote
119 - Votes for Jeeber since Jeeber already said he was going to vote for him
224 - Points out that nothing can be done to stop my kill. Says he included brilliant because schmidty hadn't made it against the rules
225 - Is glad that there are other parts of the PM which haven't been mentioned
226 - Meaningless post
228 - Agrees with hoops that unique roles did not get the brilliant PM
231 - Doesn't want me to kill him
232 - Blade points out that the PM is only good until after the first night cycle
282 - Votes for me
283 - Believes that I was a conversion target or orginal Shitface by announcing my kill. Believes we should focus on original Shitfaces
286 - Reposts peoples first post. On a side note his wanting me to say that I killed Qwikshot, a thing, in basically those words looks even more rediculous upon reflection then it did when he first redrew my attention to it.
308 - Thinks by testing me we find out the truth about Qwik.
309 - Criticises my avoiding of his question
335 - Still wants me to answer his question
336 -

I see three scenarios:
1.No conversion last night, they can only do it every other night for balance reasons(doesnt mean they couldnt still kill last night cough cough barkeep)
2.Conversion last night, can do every night(would have had to start with 2 id say...if qwik was converting it kind of makes sense why he was in the kennel)
3.no conversion becuase qwik was going to do it and he got killed by barkeep\

am i missing anything? Of those 3 im currently hung up on #1, but yes i dont think people should discount a conversion last night. The thing is, people think they have better odds looking for an original and not a convert(they say less targets with original, making it easier)....(i say its barkeep and hoops pushing, and their #1/2 on my suspect list so i dont like it one bit)

339 - Wonders why I am only mean to him
342 - Responds that my asking him why he hasn't voted for me that he did vote for me
344 - Doesn't like my list since hoops and I aren't on it
350 - Believes that taking a shot in the dark is worse then confirming that I am good and killed Qwik
354 - Wants to make it clear that voting for me isn't to clear me as much as to convict Qwik
356 - Asks why hoops and I are not on the list of six
357 - Thinks that I was overeager to put hoops off the list. Feels that shitfaces would attempt to convert a quiet one like Anxiety or WVU
359 - Wonders how going after a member of the list that day is better then in a future day
362 - Understands that I'm just trying to play the odds
379 - Says to saldana that we're using his list in reference to brilliant
404 - Is happy with saldana or me but prefers me
463 - Votes for Raiders
465 - Thinks Raiders was doing what he and hoops did in the treasure hunt game by trying to clear himself by being the one to put a shitface under pressure
466 - Referring to RA

dola, he was one of the cleared, he was the one most against saldana, and hes a vet...all 3 would be great criteria for a convert if saldana was an original...do you not think so?

468 - Believes if saldana is an original shitface RA is a logical convert target
471 - Explains precedent from X-COM for converting a vocal critic of a bad guy
475 - Wants to be talkative and asks if people are around
516 - I can't figure out the context of this post

Damn you raiders, i had cronin and mckerney with me for like 5 minutes and now they abandon me...if dubb isnt bad, damn you

520 - In response to RA saying D2 pt 2 voting is a win-win

No, but if/when we miss today then they get another person added to their team. Its not just oh well, we missed. It must be viewed as either we kill a thing or they double in #s(assuming qwik was a thing, which i am still very uncertain of)

524 - Believes shitfaces can convert each night. Feels strongly that saldana was killed without too much of a fight and so there will be a fight over this vote.
526 - Explains that he voted for me in the first part of the day to find out about Qwik but now thinks we can win and so he wants to try and find a shitface
530 - Believes that a vote for saldana doesn't necessarily clear someone
534 - Points out that 1 vote shift from saldana to me tests me
535 - Points out to Raiders that any time a person swaps from top to other top it creates suspicion
539 - Asks why a shitface would sacrafice himself when on nobody's radar to save another shtiface
541 - Defends his lack of posting
542 - Thinks having a Shitface stepout to save anotehr shitface is a gigantic risk
544 - Again emphasizes that a switch would not have created a tie between me and saldana
546 - Tells cronin he's not backing down
550 - Corrects hoops vote total
552 - Meaningless post
560 - Asks about the deadline
566 - Doesn't think dubb is a shitface
568 - Strongly believe RA is a conversion. Emphazes post where RA seems to know we're going to vote for a villager.
573 - Is willing to jump to RA if the votes are there
576 - Responds to me about testing vs dying in this game
578 - Wants dubb to switch his vote
583 - Wants CW to switch to prevent tie
586 - Asks dubb again to switch
588 - He's going to switch to prevent a tie
592 - Gives dubb 45 seconds
594 - Votes for dubb
597 - Says hoops vote shouldn't count because he unvoted incorrectly
599 - Says he'll "laugh his headoff if dubb is bad"
601 - Says dubb should be tested and is amazed at his silence
606 - Says how fun the last minute voting was
610 - Pages WVU
611 - Asks dubb if he's clean (this is after vote deadline but before shcmdity posts the results)
614 - Meaningless post
615 - Is upset we didn't win on Day 2 pt 2. Thinks we are in good shape for D3.
618 - Says how results won't be up that night
619 - Says he doesn't have a helpful role
668 - Says he isn't converted and votes for RA
669 - Agrees with dubb that RA's analysis is misleading
673 - Defends the difference between his official vote and who he wanted to vote for
674 - Says RA is twisting facts
680 - Defends having RA as a suspect despite RA's vote on saldana
681 - Asks schmidty about where his vote was on D2 pt 2
684 - Doesn't like CW's reveal. Feel it allows him to lie in future days.
686 - Argues RA's list of final votes in innaccurate
688 - Wanted to trust CW but feels this makes him a conversion target and so he cannot trust anything that is said
691 - Says he isn't shopping for facts but the truth in response to RA
695 - Thinks that perhaps schmidty made a mistake in response to RA
699 - Encourages RA to "bring it"
701 - Thanks schmidty for posting the vote count
702 - Asks schmidty how he is ignoring facts now that there is an official vote post
706 - Asks why RA is silent
782 - Says he is basically going to stop posting [i]If only that were true [/u]
783 - Asks if a N1 Raiders N2 CW conversion makes sense
785 - Says he edited a post to change a typo
789 -

RA was going down until that CW made his move it appeared...now both are out of danger...seems a fair play to me, that if even they delay it today and get a 3rd convert thats a plus. Then tomorrow, its certainly not set RA or CW will be tested..they dont claim to know im a thing...makes all the sense in the world to me..RA was on the block, CW came to his rescue. And if you review voting records RA couldnt afford to swap to barkeep with how close it was and the lack of voting at the end...he wouldnt have had a plausible reason, and then would have been suspect#1..

Anyway buddy, make your decision...you know how my personal life is more busy nowadays(UTR my ass, im still top 3 last time i checked)...if you think im bad, vote me. I wont mind, i know who to look at tomorrow night when we waste a scan

791 - Thinks that CW's reveal allows CW and RA to skate without suspicion
792 - Thanks schmidty for understanding why he edited his vote
798 - Argues a post of CW is proof that CW is trying not to get tested
801 - Is happy that dubb is seeing his point of view
803 - Explains why he's calling dubb dubby
804 - Quotes a WVU post pointing out that WVU and he are both willing to be tested now, not later
810 - Defends voting record as being off a gut and with his having no way to know that Raiders is an innocent
814 - Thinks a shitface would never had tried to do the last minute vote change
815 - Meaningless post
820 -

I make the assumption as far as the things are like this:
Qwikshot(killed night one)
Saldana(killed day 2)
RA(convert night one)
CW(convert night 2)

I assume qwikshot was a thing until i see another night kill happen(possible tonight). If it doesnt happen again, it means it was a one time power, and i assume it belonged to barkeep. Do i trust him, not one bit. If qwik was good, replace him with barkeep on the list. I voted for him and pushed for him on day 2 when others went to saldana, so i obviously dont trust him.

Im working under the conditions it doesnt matter if hes a thing, as if he is you can merely swap him in for qwik on that list.

823 - Thinks his voting record is pretty good
828 - Says his final vote was on RA and he caused no tie, that it was CW who had to switch back and forth to avoid a tie
834 - Talking about RA in response to a hoops' post

Yes, he wasnt around...and if he had been on the saldana vote there was no viable reason i saw that he could have used to swap if it he wanted to. If he had, he most likely would have hung himself and when that happened saldana as well. This way, they lost just saldana(good move in my mind). He goes after CW, one of the group that led the charge off dubb, a vet, and a fairly trusted person WHO NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT BRILLIANT(implying it likely he has a special role)...bodyguard has no idea who to protect and doesnt do CW, CW goes over and they start talking. Day 3 starts immediately i resume my push for RA, and it gains initial momentum. CW steps out claiming seer and clears RA and himself of danger for today, and by the way their playing it tomorrow as well at the minimum. Makes sense to me, as by the time we get around to test them they have 2 more converts(hell, prob. me and a quiet person realistically).

835 - Explains how he RA became the last minute target
837 - Wonders where RA is getting 5 shitfaces
838 - Thinks RA is just building up a case against him by pushing Blade
841 - In response to an accusation about a low post count by cronin points out that he is the #1 poster in the thread
844 - Argues that RA is doing just enough to get others killed and himself not tested which is a classic wolf strategy
845 - Asks if there are any other questions of him
850 - Once again says he's tired of defending himself and is going to let things fall where they may
853 - Wonders about the under the bus thing
864 - Believes shitfaces think they can ride CW as seer the rest of the game
867 - Wants hoops to read a post by dubb
869 - Wonders why RA says that there has been no discussion about the conversion target
877 -

Not in my mind, but if you make your assumptions about your own innocence then sure. I admit whatever you want. What other meaningless points do you want me to concede, becuase im happy to. Make a list real quick and ill admit to being the 20th hijacker if it makes you happy. Doesnt change what i think of the situation today.

My suspect list:
1.CW
2.RA(RA could be clean and CW, a thing, clears him...dubb did it a few games back, so we spend 2 days killing me or RA, then the other when they come up clear)
3.Barkeep(still dont know about the qwikshot kill, very possible third thing)
4.Dubb(despite his support of me, or maybe inspite of it...a possible convert, and is playing my support to earn my trust which ALAN T proved was oh so easy)

886 - Says that schmidty's writeup contains no clues
895 - Says he is working from his gut without allies. Votes for CW
898 - Argues that a post by Raiders is wrong by "official standards"
900 - Says that cronin shouldn't take offense at the crap he will give cronin after the test
901 - Asks hoop if a seer reveal makes sense if he is a human at this time
910 - Glad RA isn't taking their argument personally
912 - Is asking schmidty to end the day
914 - Argues that since hoops and I picked up hints about CW as seer shitfaces might have as well
919 - Meaningless post
925 -

I dont get that...in my mind we might have started with saldana/qwikshot(possibly barkeep). Night one they convert RA for all the same reason i converted you in X-com(so far has had the exact same results too). Night two, RA is either alone or with barkeep, and they pick up on CW's seer hints and convert him. Why convert tangle when he is never around to help them. RA made it clear he doesnt consider death then team victory a victory. Tangle would be the best choice for team victory, not for solo. It all makes sense to me, and i implore you to think long and hard about your direction you take after the test clears me.

And with that, i bid you all adeiu...sweet dreams you finger cutting pricks

927 - Doesn't think there will be enough of a swing to save him
928 - Questions why I was in and out 4 times without posting
929 - Thanks dubb for helping him
976 - Laughs that he has been criticised for not posting and for posting too much
977 - Thinks I might be a bad guy assassin
978 - Feels double vote days are key
979 - Refers people to his suspect list (post 877)
981 - Thinks double votes can overwhelm the conversion factor
982 - Thinks the comparison of the death sequences suggest I am a good guy
986 - Asks me for the name of my role

Just for the record Blade claimed 3 times that he was done posting and 3 times he lied

[dubb93]

I sure hope RA comes around, because after both Blade and I pointed out that his voting breakdown/discussion didn't allow for any discussion of who the late switch guys wanted to vote for compared to who they HAD to vote for in order to not get a tie, he seems to have just dropped that discussion all together.

Still trying to figure out how you can vote based on voting records and claim someone has a horrible one, but not discuss the deadline craziness of D2V2.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Also you asked for a scenario that makes you and CW things. It's quite simple.

Original things: Qwik & Saldana
N1: Convert You
N2: Convert Coffee

With you going after saldana perhaps they figured that made you a good target for conversion. Then by voting for saldana, despite the utter contradiction in your posts you seem to be clear. That is only further helped by CW's seer becoming on the thing side.

While this is certainly a possibility, what is the plausibility of this scenario?

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by dubb93

I sure hope RA comes around, because after both Blade and I pointed out that his voting breakdown/discussion didn't allow for any discussion of who the late switch guys wanted to vote for compared to who they HAD to vote for in order to not get a tie, he seems to have just dropped that discussion all together.

Still trying to figure out how you can vote based on voting records and claim someone has a horrible one, but not discuss the deadline craziness of D2V2.

I didn't drop it. Blade admitted he had a bad voting record. What you guys don't understand is that

THAT VOTING ANALYSIS WAS MINE. I KNOW I'M A SCIENTIST. IT DIDN'T MATTER IF BLADE WANTED TO VOTE FOR ME OR FOR YOU. HE WAS TRYING TO VOTE FOR A SCIENTIST. DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT WAS MY POINT OF VIEW?

Holy Jesus.

[Raiders Army]

Maybe I need to just post that again for the people who don't understand that.

[Raiders Army]

Also, I voted based on not only his voting record but also his reaction to my post...which was typical Blade. I'm surprised he has you roped into it.

I'm rolling out for a while. I'll be back at least once more before the vote deadline.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

And here we go with Blade

Blade
110 - Says how brilliant he is (1st to use the magic word)

I believe I was the first to use the word "brilliant." It was in post #107.

Blade followed up with it in post #110.

RA posted it in #123 and then brought it to everyone's attention in post #174.

In between the time I brought up the word "brilliant" and RA brought it to everyone's attention, saldana (post #112) and Anxiety (post #115) both posted as scientists, but did not use the word brilliant.

My only conclusion from this is that, at the start of the game, Blade, RA, and I were all simple, but brilliant scientists without any special skills. In hindsight (and some other, more polished players picked up on it at the time, I suspect) saldana gave himself up somewhat with his post. Anxiety does not really tell me much, since he is fairly unfamiliar to the game--he could be a Thing, but could just as likely be a specialized scientist.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Maybe I need to just post that again for the people who don't understand that.

Might be best to go ahead and post it again. Still not following you, but it's more of a "here is what I want everyone to think without the need to go back and fact check" sort of way.

And until you pony up and get checked I don't think the majority as a whole buys the fact that you are clean, thus the reason the one guy that has tried to clear you is the leading vote getter at this point.

[Barkeep49]

In fairness to RA what he is saying is no different then what I did when compiling the list of six. Except I knew I was right about the list of six and am far more skeptical about him. But I do agree that we should not be saying that his list was the be all and end all as a game, but rather was merely his personal opinion.

[Barkeep49]

Ok here's my list of people I think have been UTR and would like to see recieve more scrutiny: Anxiety, Swaggs, tangle, cronin and WVU

I am not terribely excited about the group of 4 except I still have some reservations about RA which would mean reservations about CW, but well I would much rather go for 1 of the five above OR go for Jeeber who is still an interesting candidate and has hung at the perfierary for the last couple of days, whether he's been UTR or not.

The rest of the players are not really on my radar as Shitfaces today and so I would need some convincing to go in that direction.

[Blade6119]

Well hoops, ill be around for about an hour then im gone for the day...care to play?

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

After a good night's sleep (not really, I puked about 12 am) I think this is probably the most coherent post in the past 12 hours. I think Blade talks too much in terms of fluff. As it was said before in other games, he throws so much shit out there, he just sees what sticks and then throws shit on top of it. I really don't think he listens at all or he ignores the other side of the argument.

RA, not 1 day ago you were accusing me of being a thing for not talking enough and obviously trying to fly under the radar...now im talking too much? Seriously, make up your mind buddy

[Barkeep49]

Now I haven't gone through and looked at his posts, but he's around a lot without posting much, so I will do a post recap in a couple hours. But from what I do remember his posts tend to be devoid of content and since i have no feel about him from previous games I'm going to hold it against him.

Vote Swaggs

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Also, I voted based on not only his voting record but also his reaction to my post...which was typical Blade. I'm surprised he has you roped into it.

If its typical blade why would you vote for me? Would that not imply im playing my typical villager game? And if dubb is a villager, which i dont know, id assume he grabbed on to it becuase it makes quite a bit of sense. Night one saldana converts you, who during day 1 was his arch enemy and the one most onto him being a thing. Makes perfect sense...day 2, id assume you picked up on the CW hints about being a seer he put out there and made your move. Day 3 comes around and you suddenly find your as good as dead...what could possibly save you? How about a seer reveal claiming you are good? And then when we ask if that same seer will be tested he says not for at least 2 days..

No, wait, that cant make sense...because if blade says it it must just be fluff or shit im throwing on the walls.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

And then when we ask if that same seer will be tested he says not for at least 2 days.

The underlying sentiment of this makes sense though. CW came out to save RA's ass so we didn't needlessly test a scientist. If CW is who he says he is now, he's right that he should not be our first testing target.

[hoopsguy]

Yeah, I would like to play. But my early getaway from work has been cancelled so I'm going to have limited access for the next couple of hours.

Going from that list, WVU was very different than the time he was the quintessential under-the-radar wolf. He put himself out there yesterday, actually drawing the ire of some of the people he accused. I have him as the least likely wolf on that list, and this is after I was pushing for him late into Day 2 before trying to switch my vote at the end.

Tangle - I posted my thoughts on him last night when everyone was looking at the four-pack of players. I think he would have made an excellent conversion target, particularly on Night 2 when the Thing should have been feeling isolated.

The other three guys I don't quite have as strong an impression. They were the ones I was going to go back and look at posts when I got home.

Anxiety - first time player, pretty infrequent poster. I get the impression he is playing very heavily by feel at this point in the game, rather than latching on to one player or heavily scrutinizing each and every post. Just not much surface area to work with here.

Swaggs - I've played a few games with him now and my vibe has been that he is a guy who tends to come on late in games. I don't think he is all that quiet in terms of post count, but I also can't remember the last thing that he said that made me sit up in my chair and take notice. Out of this list, I think he is the guy that would worry me the most as a Thing.

Cronin - I have a different read on him every game. In this one, he seems to have pretty strong impressions when he has casted his votes. I recall him having a theory on you for Day 2 that he never shared and he seems very certain of his vote on Blade for today. I stated that I believe he started as a scientist because Qwikshot seemed happy to move his vote to him on Day 1. I don't think they would have turned around and converted him on Night 1, so if he was converted I think it is more likely on Night 2 after I published him on a trust list and he seemed to generate little suspicion the entire time.

Jeebs - obviously clean day 1. I think it would take some pretty serious cajones for the Things to go after him on Night 1 with the idea that there would be a bodyguard role in play. So I think he is a better Night 2 convert. Really need to go look at his posts ...

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

The underlying sentiment of this makes sense though. CW came out to save RA's ass so we didn't needlessly test a scientist. If CW is who he says he is now, he's right that he should not be our first testing target.

I agree with that, but if im the seer coming out on day 2 to clear one person is not a play i would ever make...i would bide my time until i found a thing, or i had enough clearings where it would be useful(if you clear 5-6 guys, at best 1-2 could have been converted by chance). I just dont see the value in his reveal today, which makes me think he did it to save RA from testing, but not to help the overall group. I can't see myself making the same move, and therefore i dont believe he did it for good reasons...just my gut.

Raiders Army, did you recieve and message on night 2 about being tested?

[path12]

OK, here's a post recap for Anxiety:

85 -- 1st game, may sit back and observe.
91 -- "supposed to claim scientist, right? Why?"
115 -- Officially declares as scientist thing, not thing scientist.
130 -- responds to Blades correction of his vote (bolding)
132 -- votes tangle -- 1st to call himself scientist, too eager.
133 -- del/repost edited vote.
269 -- vote dubb -- rocks with Jeebers reasoning.
293 -- meaningless.
294 -- "How are you guys not violating this?" references Schmidtys PM warning.
378 -- Unvotes dubb, votes Barkeep -- too abusive.
447 -- Votes tangle, complains again about people talking about 'brilliant'
676 -- Votes Hoops, reason of general unease.
696 -- Thinks RA's analysis is good reasoning, unvotes hoops and votes Blade.
970 -- "5 pages to go thru, it's high time you guys admit you haven't got an f'in clue, etc, etc, Blade talks too much". It's an interesting post to reread.

Now I've gotta get some friggin' work done.

[hoopsguy]

Blade, I can answer you on Night 1 about getting (or not getting) a message about being tested. I'll hold off for now to see what answer Raiders gives.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Blade, I can answer you on Night 1 about getting (or not getting) a message about being tested. I'll hold off for now to see what answer Raiders gives.

Thats exactly why i asked him...i orginally had it typed up for you and changed it. Was hoping you would play along and not say anything

[tanglewood]

Checking back in. I not sure if I really have a clue who could be a Thing to be honest, I'll read up a bit more and post some thought is a bit.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by Blade6119

I agree with that, but if im the seer coming out on day 2 to clear one person is not a play i would ever make...i would bide my time until i found a thing, or i had enough clearings where it would be useful(if you clear 5-6 guys, at best 1-2 could have been converted by chance). I just dont see the value in his reveal today, which makes me think he did it to save RA from testing, but not to help the overall group. I can't see myself making the same move, and therefore i dont believe he did it for good reasons...just my gut.

I direct you to the other problem with my role. If I scan someone and it's a Thing, there's a chance I am automatically converted. In my mind, there are way too many opportunities for me to be converted before I can reveal myself.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

I direct you to the other problem with my role. If I scan someone and it's a Thing, there's a chance I am automatically converted. In my mind, there are way too many opportunities for me to be converted before I can reveal myself.

I understand what you say the reasons are...im just still unsure about whether i buy them. That would make you basically the doctor from the spawn game(who did get turned). Im just saying, all your reasons considered i would never have made the move to clear 1 villager on day 2, therefore my suspicion.

[Barkeep49]

I just want to point out, though I don't really give it much credence, that CW could be covering for Hoops instead. I still don't think this makes sense as a shitface, but it would be quite the Kansas City Shuffle, so to speak.

[Swaggs]

I'm here. Playing some TCB and refreshing every half hour or so to see if anything new has happened. My post total is a little low because I didn't pay much attention over Easter weekend (had company) and then had to work a lot earlier in the week, but I have tried to contribute what I think (but admit I do not have any concrete knowledge, based on my role).

My loose thoughts:

--JeeberD seems suspicious to me. If I were on the Things team, I would have looked to convert him right after he tested clean. I voted for him last time and again this time, before changing to CW (more on that next).

--I feel confident that Blade, RA, and myself were simple scientists to begin the game. There are probably a handful of other basic scientists, but I have no idea who they might be. I would suggest that Barkeep clearly was not, and I have my suspicious, based on the way they are playing, as to some of the others, but no real knowledge.

--I think CW is probably the seer and have said so. I think it is a decent play to vote for him, though, because if he is not the seer, we can roll him and RA up and hopefully win the game in one turn. If he is, as I believe, the seer, it clears him, and probably RA and hoopsguy, and then we can really look hard at Blade and Dubb, since they seem to be somewhat aligned.

--To me, the most interesting dynamic to this game is that voting ("lynching") someone in this game is not as big a swing in the favor of the Things, since it does not reduce the overall number of players, by killing someone. In addition, I am not as worried about being wrongly lynched/tested (and perhaps that is why there seem to be a few more attack dogs in this game), since I know I won't be knocked out of the game by being tested.

--The only other slight thought I have, that is not really completely developed, but I feel is a minor point in my favor is that it makes little sense for the Things to have converted RA, Blade, or myself since it has been clear, from early on, that we were simple, but brilliant scientists. Since they know that, it would make more sense, to me, for them to try to try to convert or night kill roles that are more dangerous to them. I obviously cannot vouch for RA or Blade (I think, based on behavior, it is actually quite possible that one of these guys are Things) at this point, but that is just my line of thinking. Now, it is certainly possible the Things considered that as well, but I think if I were playing as a Thing, I would want to get rid of someone like an assassin, medic, witness, bodyguard, etc.

That's pretty much all I have running around in my head right now.