SWAT raid on Missouri family

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

i don't know what to say. but the sound of that dog hurts my soul.

source

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Um, you might want to warn people if animals are being killed in that video.

I didn't actually watch but read the story earlier today.

edit: I guess it does say "Cop shoots Pet" in the title.

[digamma]

I can't watch the video, but my guess it was officials from the Big Ten doing due diligence?

[digamma]

Umm...ok, nevermind.

[albionmoonlight]

This is the natural and inevitable consequence of our "tough on crime" and "war on drugs" policies and rhetoric.

If just 5% of the "get government off our backs" crowd that is all in vogue right now could turn its focus away from slight changes to marginal tax rates and toward armed government agents storming homes with no regard for civil liberties, it would be a really, really good thing.

I believe that our country has gone so far down the road of exchanging liberty for the illusion of security that things like this will be really really hard to undo. And that really, really, really fucking sucks. Maybe one of the worst things about living in America now as opposed to at another time in history.

And, with that, I'm leaving this thread. Civil liberties mean a lot to me, and there is no way that I could stand reading FOFC's take on this without getting legit pissed at some of you.

So I'll go find some thread about boobs.

[the_meanstrosity]

I just read about this case yesterday. What a mess. They charge into the guy's house while the mother and daughter are home. They then shoot the dog while in SWAT gear with the child still in the house. They do all of this hoping to prove the guy is distributing marijuana. Instead they find enough for an individual to use and that's it. A SWAT raid for a guy using marijuana? And what makes this worse is that they now want to get the mom and dad for child endangerment. Which is more dangerous? Mom and dad with marijuana or the SWAT coming in armed and shooting the family dog? Just nuts.

[Subby]

Is there a news story associated with this?

I wonder if there are any legal issues with killing that poor dog.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Hard for me to get upset with cops encountering a pit bull while conducting a drug raid & taking it down. Pity they didn't take out the suspect as well.

[path12]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

And, with that, I'm leaving this thread. Civil liberties mean a lot to me, and there is no way that I could stand reading FOFC's take on this without getting legit pissed at some of you.

So I'll go find some thread about boobs.

I find myself agreeing with this viewpoint more and more. Yay boobs!

[Subby]

Originally Posted by Subby

Is there a news story associated with this?

I wonder if there are any legal issues with killing that poor dog.

Nevermind - I should have just waited for the replies.

I am with albion on this one.

Disgusting.

[Ksyrup]

Ironically, if word got out that there was a thread about boobies here, we'd likely see the FOFC SWAT team shoot all of our dogs in an attempt to shut it down.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

This is the natural and inevitable consequence of our "tough on crime" and "war on drugs" policies and rhetoric.

If just 5% of the "get government off our backs" crowd that is all in vogue right now could turn its focus away from slight changes to marginal tax rates and toward armed government agents storming homes with no regard for civil liberties, it would be a really, really good thing.

I believe that our country has gone so far down the road of exchanging liberty for the illusion of security that things like this will be really really hard to undo. And that really, really, really fucking sucks. Maybe one of the worst things about living in America now as opposed to at another time in history.

And, with that, I'm leaving this thread. Civil liberties mean a lot to me, and there is no way that I could stand reading FOFC's take on this without getting legit pissed at some of you.

So I'll go find some thread about boobs.

great post

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Hard for me to get upset with cops encountering a pit bull while conducting a drug raid & taking it down. Pity they didn't take out the suspect as well.

The only problem I have with that is they were in SWAT uniforms which included kevlar. I don't know how much damage a pitbull is going to do to an officer in that gear.

[Subby]

GOOD THING THEY SHOT THE FEROCIOUS CORGI, TOO!

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

I don't know how much damage a pitbull is going to do to an officer in that gear.

You don't know ... but there's no good reason for them to have to find out either.

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Hard for me to get upset with cops encountering a pit bull while conducting a drug raid & taking it down. Pity they didn't take out the suspect as well.

you're right. they should have 'cleansed' the whole community with fire. why take chances that their degenerate seed might contaminate future generations.

goddamn hippies.

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

You don't know ... but there's no good reason for them to have to find out either.

Subby is right. I had heard there was a corgi that was shot as well, but I wasn't certain if that was true or not. If so then would you be more concerned or still have the same answer?

[DanGarion]

They should have shot the kid as well, if he bites it could lead to an infection...

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

They should have shot the kid as well, if he bites it could lead to an infection...

Zombie apocalypse?!

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by Subby

Is there a news story associated with this?

I wonder if there are any legal issues with killing that poor dog.

Here Video of SWAT Raid on Missouri Family - Hit & Run : Reason Magazine and then it links to others as well.

[illinifan999]

Drug raid inquiry is ongoing | ColumbiaTribune.com

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by path12

I find myself agreeing with this viewpoint more and more. Yay boobs!

See the thread I just created. Although it's SFW.

[Masked]

Seems like a case where no one was right - the parents had illegal drugs in the house and the police appeared to grossly overreact; however, we don't know what information the police were acting on (other than it was wrong), so it's hard to say how bad their response was (for example, did they have solid evidence that the suspects were heavily armed). Their actions, while wrong in the end, may have been justifiable. The only thing we know for sure is that there were illegal drugs in the house. There is no justification for having drugs in a house with a 7 year old kid.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by the_meanstrosity

Subby is right. I had heard there was a corgi that was shot as well, but I wasn't certain if that was true or not. If so then would you be more concerned or still have the same answer?

Is the dog sitting in the corner or acting in a threatening manner in the process of the arrest?

[the_meanstrosity]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Is the dog sitting in the corner or acting in a threatening manner in the process of the arrest?

The corgi was probably angry as hell.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Is the dog sitting in the corner or acting in a threatening manner in the process of the arrest?

The dog doesn't know what the hell is going on, just that scary looking people are walking through their house. Ultimately it's the idiot that got his ass arrested fault, but they should have made more attempt to not shoot the dogs.

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

is it sop to tape these things? wouldn't this be a tape the pd accidently 'misplaces'?

-what should i do with the tape chief?

-uhh, why don't you give it to a liberal media blog then file it under 'moral outrage'

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

FWIW reason.com is far from a liberal media blog.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Is the dog sitting in the corner or acting in a threatening manner in the process of the arrest?

Yeah, c'mon guys, screw that dog. It clearly should have been literate enough to read SWAT on the uniforms to determine that these were officers of the law and not armed intruders. It's his problem for being ignorant and illiterate.

[Tigercat]

You do not SWAT raid a family home over pot, unless you are 100% sure the house is growing it or storing mass quantities.

Would a SWAT team night raid a family home, guns blazing, of a white collar guy who is suspected of heavy corruption? Just on the off chance of finding felony evidence? I don't smoke pot, never will, but some police offices need to get a grip on the current social seriousness threat that pot places on the American public. The answer? Low threat. Not SWAT team worthy unless a sure thing and no risk to family members. That should be god damn obvious.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

Ultimately it's the idiot that got his ass arrested fault

This.

And this is what matters, not some fucking pit bull & some fucking piece of shit pothead.

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

FWIW reason.com is far from a liberal media blog.

all media is liberal.

Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive

goddamn hippies.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

This.

And this is what matters, not some fucking pit bull & some fucking piece of shit pothead.

Yes, because pot is so bad...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Tigercat

You do not SWAT raid a family home over pot, unless you are 100% sure the house is growing it or storing mass quantities.

They were sure enough to satisfy a judge & get a warrant, so what level of proof would satisfy you? Or how many dead cops does it take before you can use SWAT?

Sorry, but I've mourned the death of too many officers I knew who found themselves in a situation where the manpower was insufficient for the situation to ever worry for a second about who/what they send to get the job done.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

Yes, because pot is so bad...

I'd like nothing more than to see these fucking criminals executed on their second possession arrest. They're less than vermin afaic & I've got no real use for those who try to excuse their behavior either.

[Masked]

Originally Posted by Tigercat

You do not SWAT raid a family home over pot, unless you are 100% sure the house is growing it or storing mass quantities.

Would a SWAT team night raid a family home, guns blazing, of a white collar guy who is suspected of heavy corruption? Just on the off chance of finding felony evidence? I don't smoke pot, never will, but some police offices need to get a grip on the current social seriousness threat that pot places on the American public. The answer? Low threat. Not SWAT team worthy unless a sure thing and no risk to family members. That should be god damn obvious.

Information is rarely 100% accurate - the police must make the best decision given the information they have. We don't know what evidence they were acting on other then they had reason to believe there was a large amount of drugs (which was wrong). The outcome doesn't mean their decision was wrong, just the information they were acting on was bad. We don't know enough to judge yet.

Your second point should really be directed to the lawmakers rather than the police. The police's job is to enforce the law, and the law basically says that drug users are serious criminals who must be stopped at all cost.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by SteveBollea

Yup, pot is evil, but instead try these fine pain relievers from Johnson & Johnson!

Or a couple shots of Jack Daniel's...

[Tigercat]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

They were sure enough to satisfy a judge & get a warrant, so what level of proof would satisfy you? Or how many dead cops does it take before you can use SWAT?

Sorry, but I've mourned the death of too many officers I knew who found themselves in a situation where the manpower was insufficient for the situation to ever worry for a second about who/what they send to get the job done.

I'm not even blaming the cops on the scene for what they did in this one, it's a fucking SWAT team afterall. They aren't put together for pleasantries. I blame the judge, and yes there are plenty of idiot judges, and the higher ups in the police department that OKed a SWAT raid on a family house when obviously it wasn't a good bet there would be a large quantity of pot there.

But there HAS to be a line. You don't send a SWAT team for every warrant, that is obvious. And you shouldn't have a warrant when you can't find close to dealer level amounts of pot in a house.

(Even enough to deal "some" pot shouldn't be SWAT raided in this situation, catch him on the street or while dealing in the house, but there wasn't even enough in the house for that apparently.)

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

i never realized how awesomely vigilant jimg was.

go hug a leaky oil well ya sissy liberal fruits.

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I'd like nothing more than to see these fucking criminals executed on their second possession arrest. They're less than vermin afaic & I've got no real use for those who try to excuse their behavior either.

Man, this post is gonna seem funny in 5 years, when Jim is hauled away to jail for stockpiling black market Pall Malls.

[RainMaker]

If you are storming a house with a group of heavily armed men in kevlar suits and have to shoot a Corgi to protect yourself. Aren't you sort of admitting to being a raging pussy? I understand that bad things can happen in SWAT raids, but do you guys really want someone who is that afraid handling a heavy firearm in your community?

[Tigercat]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

If you are storming a house with a group of heavily armed men in kevlar suits and have to shoot a Corgi to protect yourself. Aren't you sort of admitting to being a raging pussy? I understand that bad things can happen in SWAT raids, but do you guys really want someone who is that afraid handling a heavy firearm in your community?

I agree, if their procedure encourages that level of assessment of dogs. Given what SWAT teams do, however, they may be taught simply "the dog advances on you, shoot him." Which is understandable given the normal types of situations SWAT teams are put in. All the more reason they shouldn't have been near a house like this.

[illinifan999]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

If you are storming a house with a group of heavily armed men in kevlar suits and have to shoot a Corgi to protect yourself. Aren't you sort of admitting to being a raging pussy? I understand that bad things can happen in SWAT raids, but do you guys really want someone who is that afraid handling a heavy firearm in your community?

Is everyone just assuming they individually shot the Corgi? Is it possible that when they shot at the pitbull, the Corgi was hit by a stray bullet?

[illinifan999]

U.S. Government Declares Country's Marijuana Users Responsible for Fueling Mexican Cartel Violence (Latina Lista)

In a market analysis of how much revenue Mexican drug trafficking organizations earned in 2004-2005 from selling various drugs to U.S. users, it was found that marijuana netted the most money — and we're not talking pesos here.
Mexican drug cartels grossed $8.6 billion with marijuana sales alone. The next highest drug-in-demand is cocaine which netted $3.9 billion.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Aren't you sort of admitting to being a raging pussy?

I'm not going to get involved with the why's and if's as to whether this house should have been raided and whether some judgment calls might have been overdone once in there. But I don't think there's any place to call someone on a SWAT team a 'raging pussy'. These guys risk their lives on a daily basis not having any idea what is on the other side of a door/wall when they go in. They are some brave dudes.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by illinifan999

U.S. Government Declares Country's Marijuana Users Responsible for Fueling Mexican Cartel Violence (Latina Lista)

Great reason to make it legal and allow legal taxation upon the crops and sale of it.

[thesloppy]

In a market analysis of how much revenue Mexican drug trafficking organizations earned in 2004-2005 from selling various drugs to U.S. users, it was found that marijuana netted the most money — and we're not talking pesos here.
Mexican drug cartels grossed $8.6 billion with marijuana sales alone. The next highest drug-in-demand is cocaine which netted $3.9 billion.

As an aside: how the hell do they get those numbers? A "market analysis" of Mexican drug cartels and millions of individual American users? Color me skeptical times a million.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

I'm not going to get involved with the why's and if's as to whether this house should have been raided and whether some judgment calls might have been overdone once in there. But I don't think there's any place to call someone on a SWAT team a 'raging pussy'. These guys risk their lives on a daily basis not having any idea what is on the other side of a door/wall when they go in. They are some brave dudes.

If you feel this is a threat to you, then yes, you are a raging pussy.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by illinifan999

Is everyone just assuming they individually shot the Corgi? Is it possible that when they shot at the pitbull, the Corgi was hit by a stray bullet?

Pretty sure there was a time lapse between the time they shot each dog.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by illinifan999

Is everyone just assuming they individually shot the Corgi? Is it possible that when they shot at the pitbull, the Corgi was hit by a stray bullet?

I guess that would be all the more reason to be upset at the situation. Firing weapons in close quarters have risks and a stray bullet could have hit the kid too.