TPB: Amazing Career Turnaround

[Comey]

(This is x-posted from GreyDog. Just thought I'd share it here, as I've never truly seen this in a text sim before.)

I was posed the question the other day if I saw any second-round players turn into something solid.

Well, just a second ago, I found Tom Emanuel of the Portland Pioneers. He hasn't been around long, and is much older...but his story appears to be worth finding out.

He was taken in the second round (29th overall) of the 1952 draft, by the Philadelphia Stars (this is a 20-team fictional league). He never made it on the team, and drifted from league to league for years, it would appear. Finally, in January 1957, Portland signed him to a deal. He still didn't do very well, averaging 3.5 points in only 10 minutes.

But next season, he averaged about 18 a game. In 1960, he averaged 23.4 a game.

He's never been recognized by any awards, other than being a rookie game participant in 1957 (which I found odd). But he's a five-star player, and the top free agent in the 1962 season.

Just thought I'd share. I thought it was really something. When I can get a screenshot or two, I'll post it/them.

[MizzouRah]

That's interesting! TPB is quite a good sim.


Todd

[Comey]

The most shocking thing is that he didn't play for ANYONE for that amount of time. I figured he'd retire...but he stuck it through.

It kind of makes it tougher, to unearth those kinds of players. I'm going to go back through the years 1953-56 and look at his ratings, and see if he just blew up or if it was gradual and he just went unnoticed.

[Zippo]

cool!

[Eaglesfan27]

I find the response to this news interesting. I like variability in text sims, and I like TPB and have recently gotten back into it. However, I find this sort of variability to stretch credibility. I just couldn't ever see a situation like this happening IRL in the NBA where a guy is completely unable to produce for years and then over the course of three years (presumably when he is either in his late 20's or early 30's) he becomes an MVP type player.

[JeeberD]

Bah, that's what I'm going to do, EF27! After not playing organized ball since my sophomore year of HS, I'm announcing soon that I'll be entering next year's NBA draft, a sure lottery pick...

[Comey]

There have been late bloomers in sports. This guy was just never on a roster. It's very possible that he was one of those boom players, and it got picked up late.

[condors]

it happens in the NBA alot with the kids getting drafted (18 19 year olds) and are not ready to play yet.

They were talking about the 3 wise men on Washington were together in Dallas and were terrible but they needed time to get better as players.

Ben Wallace took a while before he became the player he is today.

Dalembert on the Sixers is better today than he was 2 years ago but still has some work to do.

Anyways on the TPB front i love that players have work ethic and personalities. I am big on getting 2 locker room guys. Great personalities who never complain about never playing. When you get one you can usually sign them 6 years at league min. While they don't play get 1 guy who wants minutes and watch as 3 or 4 guys are demanding trades and the team never reaches its potential. Course i try to get 10 guys (2 at each postion) that play defense and play them all for about 24 minutes at have them play at breakneck speed on offense and defense to wear out the other team.

[Arles]

Damon Jones is another similar story. A great example of this is Ricky Davis, Look at his first 5 seasons in the league:

98-99: 12.1 MPG, 1 start, 4.5 PPG
99-00: 11.9 MPG, 4 starts, 4.7 PPG (changed teams after)
00-01: 10.0 MPG, 1 start, 4.6 PPG (changed teams after)
01-02: 23.8 MPG, 8 starts, 11.7 PPG
02-03: 39.6 MPG, 76 starts, 20.6 PPG

So, in his 5th season and on his third different team, Davis became a 20-point scorer after riding the pine in limited minutes for other teams.

[Huckleberry]

Is it simply playing time and not skill?

Looking at Ricky Davis, he seems to have hit about 1/2 point per minute in his second or third season and stayed there. Waiting for the playing time to get him to 20 ppg.

Just curious as I don't follow pro basketball and don't plan on purchasing any sims thereof. I'm wondering more for the impact on other text sims.

[MizzouRah]

Yeah, I'm back into TPB as well with my St. Louis Clippers.


Todd

[Arles]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

Is it simply playing time and not skill?

Looking at Ricky Davis, he seems to have hit about 1/2 point per minute in his second or third season and stayed there. Waiting for the playing time to get him to 20 ppg.

I think that playing time is certainly a factor, but you also have to be in a position to earn minutes. Davis hadn't done that for 4+ seasons. So, was it the case that he was always a similar scorer? Or was it that he hadn't shown the ability to adapt his game to an NBA system but was able to get decent production in the helter skelter of mop-up time.

It's a tough question, but I'm not sure it matters as the point is he was never viewed as a good enough player to get time (much like the TPB example above). Now, whether either guy could have excelled with higher minutes early on is debatable, but I tend to take the stance that both players were probably too raw to be all that productive for 40 minutes a game early on.

[jbmagic]

i am back.
playing a fictional league.

i sim three years for history and took the first available job that was open. The Oakland Spartans came in last 3 years in a row in there division. i hope i can turn them into a winner. so far i am 2-1

[Eaglesfan27]

None of those examples have become MVP type players. I'm not saying guys can't become productive, but from the description this guy was out of the NBA for a few years and is now a 5 star MVP type player. That is different than just being a fringe player who became servicable (ala Damon Jones, Dalembert, etc.) As far as Jones great year, I think that is highly Shaq dependant and I doubt anyone would argue that Jones is a "5 star player."

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Arles

Damon Jones is another similar story. A great example of this is Ricky Davis, Look at his first 5 seasons in the league:

98-99: 12.1 MPG, 1 start, 4.5 PPG
99-00: 11.9 MPG, 4 starts, 4.7 PPG (changed teams after)
00-01: 10.0 MPG, 1 start, 4.6 PPG (changed teams after)
01-02: 23.8 MPG, 8 starts, 11.7 PPG
02-03: 39.6 MPG, 76 starts, 20.6 PPG

So, in his 5th season and on his third different team, Davis became a 20-point scorer after riding the pine in limited minutes for other teams.

Yeah, but the 02-03 Cavs also only won 17 games. And Davis was on fire at the end of 01-02 season as well(roughly the last month). Davis left college after his freshman year, so he was quite young the first year.

[Arles]

Yeah, I'd say Ben Wallace is probably the best example of this type of phenominon. But, as in real life, it should be rare in TPB (as I think it is).