2006-07 Soccer Thread

[Critch]

Originally Posted by Jari Rantanen's Shorts

As a Leicester fan almost all of that description of O'Neill's sides is bollocks - the one bit I'll agree with is he likes the 'more physical' type of centre half: when we had Walsh, Taggart, Elliott and Prior to choose from it's a wonder any of the opposition dared to even mount an attack, let alone have a shot

Well he must've changed then, because he was well known for longball and "rugged" defenders with Celtic.

edit - actually putting "long ball" and "martin o'neill" into google show's it's a split camp. Celtic and Leicester fans think they played good football, everybody else thinks they were long ball teams with fast wingers

He'll be more directed and successful than O'Leary was at Villa.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by Katon

It was, though. If they had been judged completely innocent, they would have been declared champions for both 04/05 and 05/06. Instead, one of those titles is vacant and the other belongs to Inter - who were almost certainly a worse team than Milan last year even under neutral refereeing. Does being stripped of two titles sound a bit more like it?

Nah, who cares, honestly? Do you think Milan supporters would have taken to the streets to celebrate their "championships?" It's similar to winning the Tour de France after the race is over.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Nah, who cares, honestly? Do you think Milan supporters would have taken to the streets to celebrate their "championships?" It's similar to winning the Tour de France after the race is over.

Also, if they were deemed unworthy of the replacing Juve as champions in 05/06, that means they cheated. If they cheated, why in the world should they qualify for the CL?

[Desnudo]

http://football.guardian.co.uk/rumou...837327,00.html

Friday's rumours

Today's nonsense will work for furniture

Georgina Turner
Friday August 4, 2006
Guardian Unlimited


Gravesen hits out at news that Newcastle are in for him. Photograph: Felipe Sevillano/AP.

As 20,000 unemployed Geordies gather at St James' Park to watch the squad weave between small plastic cones, news reaches Rumours HQ that Michael Owen has been trying to persuade Thomas Gravesen to choose Newcastle. Now, we don't have access to this fascinating conversation, but we imagine the postcard reads something like: "Dear Tom, I had to leave Real after a nightmare year too. I was kind of hoping Liverpool might want me back but now I'm really glad that no one was inclined to top Fat Freddy's fat offer. I missed most of the season crocked but they still paid me huge wads of cash every week. It's a nice supplement to the income I make from bets with Wayne Rooney, you should try it." Gravesen also has Manchester City, Bolton or Galatasaray to choose from, apparently.

Article continues

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Heading south, Manchester United have been offered £10m plus Roberto Ayala for Cristiano Ronaldo by Valencia. The Spaniards say they won't give up on the deal until United have said "no, no and no again". The Mill suggests they're more likely to get a "no, no - will youse lot just feck off, you're nae gettin' him and if ah see youse around here again so help me God you'll wish ah hadnae", but there's just no telling some people.
This summer's chief mall-dwellers Internazionale don't want their credit card to go cold, and are in for Luca Toni, it says here. They fancy pairing him up with Hernan Crespo, but they'll have to get past self-styled Don Mourinho first.

Robert Huth's move to Middlesbrough has stalled because they want to try and renegotiate a lower price. Blackburn's masked man Mark Hughes is snickering nearby, waiting to hijack the whole thing.

An expensive mistake for Kevin Blackwell at Leeds: he shouted "new barrel" after downing a bad pint of Stella and has had to cough up £2m for portly Spurs reject Andy Reid.

West Ham are convinced that they can succeed where virtually every other club in the entire country has failed and get a season-long loan deal for Shaun Wright-Phillips.

And, much as we hate to put you through this, we must mention the words "William" and "Gallas". Word is he could find his way out of Stamford Bridge if Arsenal can convince Chelsea to include him as part of a deal for Ashley Cole. Don't worry, it'll all be over soon. All you'll feel is a small scratch...

[Butter]

My friend tells me that DirecTV is testing out Sky Sports One on channel 9995 and a couple other Sky channels as well. Would be interesting to see a wider variety of international sports if they pick it up full time. For those of you who have DirecTV, of course. I, sadly, do not.

[Critch]

spoiler alert for anybody who has tivo set to record the Man Utd v Porto game on Setanta this afternoon
.
.
.
.
Rooney got himself sent off again in a pre-season friendly v Porto and could well end up starting the season with a three game suspension. And he won't even be able to blame Ronaldo this time.

[ISiddiqui]

LOL @ Gravesen at Newcastle. I doubt that'll even come close to happening. What, so they'll have two Prem level 4 man midfields and no strikers or wing backs? Or maybe they'll go for the 3-6-1 .

Not happening.

[AlexB]

Originally Posted by Critch

Well he must've changed then, because he was well known for longball and "rugged" defenders with Celtic.

edit - actually putting "long ball" and "martin o'neill" into google show's it's a split camp. Celtic and Leicester fans think they played good football, everybody else thinks they were long ball teams with fast wingers

He'll be more directed and successful than O'Leary was at Villa.

I think his first dozen or so games when we got promoted we were pretty direct, and maybe in the first year in the Prem when we were trying to consolidate, you could say we were direct, but still not long ball.

As we got more established, we were less direct, until in the final (4th year) we did indeed play some good stuff. On Sky Sports they still occasionally show the highlights when we tonked Sunderland 5-2, with Collymore scoring a hat-trick. Look out for it on ESPN Classic or similar - tell me after watching that we were long ball at that point!

If MoN had stayed, kept Heskey, Collymore and the rest of the side together, we would have had a very good chance of being a serious threat to the top 4-6 the next season - that team was very very good.

Unfortunately MoN left, Colly-wobbled, and although we sold Heskey for what now looks an excellent value £11m, we appointed Peter Taylor who fucked it all up.

However, at Villa he will be starting at least in the equivalent of our 2nd season in the Prem, or the equivalent of 18 months into his Leicester evolution, they will get the ball forward quickly, but it will not be by long hoofs, it will be by passing.

[Critch]

Originally Posted by Critch

spoiler alert for anybody who has tivo set to record the Man Utd v Porto game on Setanta this afternoon
.
.
.
.
Rooney got himself sent off again in a pre-season friendly v Porto and could well end up starting the season with a three game suspension. And he won't even be able to blame Ronaldo this time.

Just watched the incident, complete joke. Rooney was sent off for next to nothing. Scholes was sent off too, but he's got less to complain about.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Originally Posted by MIJB#19

Stripping title or missing out on European competitions, I think the fans care more about the former. Going by attendance figures, European competitions tend to not be so important to Italian soccer fans, Juventus has always had trouble to even fill half of their stadium for Champions' League matches. Either the people in charge don't care to get the stadium full, or the fans really don't care until the final stages have been reached. Coincidentally AC Milan couldn't get their stadium above 2/3rd full for games before the semifinals last CL season.

If you're going by attendance figures to determine the importance of events, then I guess Serie A matches aren't that important to Juve supporters either, since they don't come close to filling the Stadio delle Alpi. Their three highest attendances last year were 33772 (Inter), 39087 (Milan), and 56488 (Palermo, the last home match of the season). This in a stadium that holds over 67,000. Most of the time attendance was below 30,000.

Conversely, here are the CL attendance numbers:

• Rapid Vienna - 49,000
• Bayern - 19,000 (I can't explain that)
• Club Brugge - 35,000
• Werder Bremen - 43,000
• Arsenal - 50,000

For Milan, most of their Serie A matches played in front of 56,000.

In the CL:

• Fenerbahce - 75,000
• PSV Eindhoven - 69,000
• Schalke 04 - 82,000
• Bayern - 71,000
• Lyon - 80,000
• Barcelona - 85,000

It looks to me like the CL creates more interest than Serie A.

[Mac Howard]

Originally Posted by Critch

Just watched the incident, complete joke. Rooney was sent off for next to nothing. Scholes was sent off too, but he's got less to complain about.

Rooney was sent off because it was Rooney - one of the clearest cases of a reputation red card I've seen. I see a protest here if the ref reports it (because it was friendly he apparently isn't forced to do so).

Agreed on Scholes. I'm a great fan of the little man but his awful timing and decision making in tackling is a fatal flaw in his game.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

For Milan, most of their Serie A matches played in front of 56,000.

In the CL:

• Fenerbahce - 75,000
• PSV Eindhoven - 69,000
• Schalke 04 - 82,000
• Bayern - 71,000
• Lyon - 80,000
• Barcelona - 85,000

It looks to me like the CL creates more interest than Serie A.

I saw first hand, while living in Milan, this phenomenon. The same 50,000 or so Milan fans are there for both Serie A and CL matches. But since San Siro is one of the largest stadiums in Europe and seats over 80,000, it is usually the best chance for visiting fans to get to see their team in action. Whenever there was a CL match, there would always be tens of thousands of opponent's fans showing up for the matches.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

If you're going by attendance figures to determine the importance of events, then I guess Serie A matches aren't that important to Juve supporters either, since they don't come close to filling the Stadio delle Alpi. Their three highest attendances last year were 33772 (Inter), 39087 (Milan), and 56488 (Palermo, the last home match of the season). This in a stadium that holds over 67,000. Most of the time attendance was below 30,000.

Conversely, here are the CL attendance numbers:

• Rapid Vienna - 49,000
• Bayern - 19,000 (I can't explain that)
• Club Brugge - 35,000
• Werder Bremen - 43,000
• Arsenal - 50,000

For Milan, most of their Serie A matches played in front of 56,000.

In the CL:

• Fenerbahce - 75,000
• PSV Eindhoven - 69,000
• Schalke 04 - 82,000
• Bayern - 71,000
• Lyon - 80,000
• Barcelona - 85,000

It looks to me like the CL creates more interest than Serie A.

That's really freaky, my source showed totally different attendance figures.

[AlexB]

Seven minutes. Seven f*****g minutes

[AlexB]

Dola,

After weeks of anticipation, finishing last season as one of the form teams of league, we play in the season curtain raiser, shown live on Sky, like a pub team. 2-0 loss to Luton, one of the relegation favourites (although I do think this under-rates Luton to be fair).

Oh well, it can only get better.

[daedalus]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

But when your defense consists of Bramble and Boumsong, I think its always the greatest need.

But at least they're not in danger of sending Pascal Cygan onto the pitch.

At left-back.

I'll be in the corner crying in fetal position, if anyone needs me.

[ISiddiqui]

And speaking of Bramble and Boumsong... there is a good chance that Craig Moore and Stephen Taylor may start ahead of both of them! Well, at least in place of Boumsong, who may be sold soon (yes there are teams on the Continent who have asked about him).

[FrogMan]

Originally Posted by Jari Rantanen's Shorts

Dola,

After weeks of anticipation, finishing last season as one of the form teams of league, we play in the season curtain raiser, shown live on Sky, like a pub team. 2-0 loss to Luton, one of the relegation favourites (although I do think this under-rates Luton to be fair).

Oh well, it can only get better.

I follow Luton a bit and yeah, they're probably in for one tough season with the rebuilding they are going through. Kevin Nicholls and Steve Howard are gone and will be hard to replace...

FM
PS: I remembered reading about you being a Leicester fan yesterday and when I saw the topic notification with your "seven ****** minutes", I immediately knew it meant good news for my Hatters

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by daedalus

But at least they're not in danger of sending Pascal Cygan onto the pitch.

At left-back.

I'll be in the corner crying in fetal position, if anyone needs me.

Flamini was fantastic there last season.

[AlexB]

Originally Posted by FrogMan

I follow Luton a bit and yeah, they're probably in for one tough season with the rebuilding they are going through. Kevin Nicholls and Steve Howard are gone and will be hard to replace...

FM
PS: I remembered reading about you being a Leicester fan yesterday and when I saw the topic notification with your "seven ****** minutes", I immediately knew it meant good news for my Hatters

Did wonder if your FM dynasty had given you a RL sympathy for Luton, or whether Iain Hume playing for Leicester would have meant the Canadian element won over. Query answered I guess!

[FrogMan]

Originally Posted by Jari Rantanen's Shorts

Did wonder if your FM dynasty had given you a RL sympathy for Luton, or whether Iain Hume playing for Leicester would have meant the Canadian element won over. Query answered I guess!

hehehe, nah, Hume is just a whiner unhappy that I kept him out of the national team for a friendly so I'm sticking with Luton

I did start following Luton after picking them to play my first ever FM career. I eventually subscribed to their BBC news feed and I keep myself informed a bit...

FM

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by Butter_of_69

My friend tells me that DirecTV is testing out Sky Sports One on channel 9995 and a couple other Sky channels as well. Would be interesting to see a wider variety of international sports if they pick it up full time. For those of you who have DirecTV, of course. I, sadly, do not.

The test is over, and they are not going to follow up on it.

[cthomer5000]

in case anyone is interested... the Chelsea starting lineup for the MLS All-Star game:

http://www.somethingwithanh.com/ihof/chelsea_mls.jpg

[SirFozzie]

Game's on now.. yeah I know, all star colors are supposed to be garish.. but wow.

[SirFozzie]

Wow.. MLS 1-0 late.

[SirFozzie]

dola: that's the way it ended. MLS! MLS!

(yeah, I know, friendly, yadda yadda.. but I gotta say, a good end to all the friendlies MLS teams have been playing

[TazFTW]

Didn't see it but what happened to Joe Cole? The matchtracker at MLSnet says Cole came on in 46 and off in 52.

[illinifan999]

He collided with someone and it looked like his knee bent a little.

[Katon]

Not meant to be a serious injury, from what I hear, but why take chances in a preseason match?

I was at the match - got a photograph of myself with the Premiership trophy, which was the most interesting part of the day. I'm not thrilled with our performance, but not particularly worried either. We looked like it was our first match of the preseason.

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by Katon

Not meant to be a serious injury, from what I hear, but why take chances in a preseason match?

This appeared to be the case to me. I think he'd have kept playing otherwise, but no need to fool around in a friendly like this.

Nice showing by MLS overall... they didnt' really convert too many offensive opportunities into sold shots though.

[ISiddiqui]

YAY, MLS! That De Rossario guy... he's pretty good .

[Cringer]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

YAY, MLS! That De Rossario guy... he's pretty good .

YES! I forgot all about this game. I have been witout TV for a while so it wouldn't have mattered much but still......

De Rossario is the man. Stood out both Houston games I have been to and quickly became my favorite player. Big congrats to him.

[Cringer]

On a sad note, I have remembered the the Barca-America (Mex)/Houston-LA double header coming up on Wednesday. Over 50,000 tickets have been sold and I don't have even one of them. Just can't afford it right now. Sucks big too because I have to be up near Houston from later today until Tuesday for something else that is much less entertaining.

[TazFTW]

Mourinho says that Cole could have damaged knee ligaments.

[Katon]

I hope not

[Critch]

Couple of good English Championship games on Setanta this morning, feels like the season is finally here now the games actually mean something.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I turned on the MLS - Chelski match just in time to catch the halftime "show." If I wasn't a fan of the game, I would have turned it off right then. Ugh.

Anyway, once the second half started I was able to swallow again without fear of vomiting. That is until Alexi Lalas entered the booth. I liked him when he was a player, but I can't stand him now. I really wish he would shut up. Since I was jamming pencils in my ears in an attempt to rupture my eardrums, I missed most of what he was saying, but I'm pretty sure I heard him going on about how just because Chelski spends a lot of money on someone doesn't mean the player is any good. Was that what he was going on about, or did I just completely mishear him?

It was a nice win for the MLS squad, but it was obvious that Chelski wasn't anywhere near peak performance. And I really wish the ESPN announcers would have stopped with all the "Chelsea is arguably the best team in the world" nonsense. They might have the highest payroll in the world (not sure if that's true), but there's a little team in Barcelona that I hear is pretty good, and I don't know if you guys have heard or not, but AC Milan is not bad, either. Oh, and Real Madrid, too.

I know, ESPN is just trying to make the MLS look good, especially since they just signed that new TV deal. Speaking of which, I read that they're going to show Thursday night matches, which is great. Is this going to be in addition to Saturday?

Also, with Toronto FC joining next year the MLS will have 13 teams. Are they going to keep the two conferences and just have one with seven teams, or is something else in the works?

[SirFozzie]

Just Thursdays, 26 games a year. They are probably going to go with unbalanced conferences..

BTW, a bit of bad news, Toronto will not be in MLS for the next FM

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

I'm pretty sure I heard him going on about how just because Chelski spends a lot of money on someone doesn't mean the player is any good. Was that what he was going on about, or did I just completely mishear him?

I literally have no idea where he was going with the statement he made. It didn't make too much sense to me.

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

It was a nice win for the MLS squad, but it was obvious that Chelski wasn't anywhere near peak performance. And I really wish the ESPN announcers would have stopped with all the "Chelsea is arguably the best team in the world" nonsense. They might have the highest payroll in the world (not sure if that's true), but there's a little team in Barcelona that I hear is pretty good, and I don't know if you guys have heard or not, but AC Milan is not bad, either. Oh, and Real Madrid, too.

I don't think anyone is claiming this was an epic win for MLS. Not getting embarassed was the real goal. I don't think there is anything wrong with saying they are "arguably" the best. Yes, you're listing other teams that all could also be considered "arguably" the best. What are the announcers supposed to do? Not hype the matchup?

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

I read that they're going to show Thursday night matches, which is great. Is this going to be in addition to Saturday?

Yes, in addition to Saturday.

Originally Posted by Jonathan Ezarik

Also, with Toronto FC joining next year the MLS will have 13 teams. Are they going to keep the two conferences and just have one with seven teams, or is something else in the works?

The commish said 14 teams by 2008 at halftime, so I expect there will just be one larger conference next year before being evened out in 2008. I'd love to see them move to just one table eventually, but i'm not sure it'll ever happen in the US.

[cthomer5000]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Just Thursdays, 26 games a year. They are probably going to go with unbalanced conferences..

This is different than what I'd originally heard, but right you are:

ESPN2 will broadcast 26 regular-season games on Thursday nights as well as three playoff games a year. The deal also allows televised coverage of the first round of the MLS SuperDraft.

Also, ABC will broadcast the league's season opener, the All-Star game and the MLS Cup.

[ISiddiqui]

And I really wish the ESPN announcers would have stopped with all the "Chelsea is arguably the best team in the world" nonsense. They might have the highest payroll in the world (not sure if that's true), but there's a little team in Barcelona that I hear is pretty good, and I don't know if you guys have heard or not, but AC Milan is not bad, either. Oh, and Real Madrid, too.

But, as cthomer said, they are 'arguably' the best. Arguably meaning that they are in the argument. Sure Chelsea didn't go as far as they'd hoped in the CL last year, but in the meantime added Ballack and Shevchenko, who I have heard are pretty decent . Nothing wrong with saying Chelsea is arguably the best team in the world.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Nothing wrong with saying Chelsea is arguably the best team in the world.

Except that they can only claim to be the best of about 2/3rd of a small island in the Atlantic Ocean.

[ISiddiqui]

Though teams on that small island won the Champions League and came in 2nd in the last two years .

[cthomer5000]

Do people have a hard time grasping the "arguably" part of the phrase "arguably the best?"

[MIJB#19]

Chelsea is loaded with 'best players'. In position by postion talent, they could have the roster in the world. They even dominated the English Premier League for two years. But to date they haven't proven to be able to make a serious run in the Champions' League. Until that happens, I personally have a hard time to concider Chelsea to be in the discussion for best team of Europe, let alone the world.

It's like Peyton Manning's Indianapolis Colts, they win their division year after year, but have zero conference titles to prove they're the best.

[AlexB]

MIJB - Champions League does not always say who the best team in Europe is - this year to be fair it probably did with Barca winning it, but are you telling me that on your logic you consider Porto and Liverpool to be better teams than Chelsea?

And if your logic were sounder than it actually is, don't forget who actually knocked Chelsea out of the CL both of the last two years: Barca.

Personally I would say you have to say best team in Europe: Barca - won their domestic league in addition to the CL, after that I think you have to say Chelsea are probably #2.

[AlexB]

Dola,

And back to the original point, I don't think you can call someone disingenious for saying the #2 is 'arguably the best'...

[ISiddiqui]

I think it's an incredibly strange position to take to say that Chelsea isn't in the argument for best team in Europe.

[ice4277]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I think it's an incredibly strange position to take to say that Chelsea isn't in the argument for best team in Europe.

Agreed. As mentioned earlier, the CL is basically a one-off tournament. For that matter, I think there can be a difference between being the best team and being the team that wins it all. But regardless of the CL, Chelsea have absolutely dominated the Premiership the past two seasons. Any team that can dominate the way they have in what is, at worst, the third-best league in the world, has to be mentioned right up at the top.

[Critch]

Originally Posted by Jari Rantanen's Shorts

And if your logic were sounder than it actually is, don't forget who actually knocked Chelsea out of the CL both of the last two years: Barca.

Actually Chelsea knocked Barcelona out of the CL the year before last. Chelsea were knocked out by Liverpool in the semi-final.

So that's even more on an argument for Chelsea being arguably the best.