Werewolf 40,000: The Horus Heresy CHAOS DEFEATED; MUTANTS SURVIVE

[RealDeal]

Originally Posted by saldana

i always wanted to say this.....Paternoval Envoy checking in

just fyi, my work schedule is a bit screwy this week because one of the people in my office is on vacation. as a result, i wont be around in early afternoon, but should have no problem around the deadline

that said...i am going to deviate from my normal vengance on day one plan and vote for someone who has already set the Imperium back with a foolish reveal that has already cost us an asset.

vote realdeal

I disagree Saldana. I am a bigger asset by revealing my invulnerability early than I am by hiding this. Having a confirmed good guy who is invulnerable to bad guy attacks is very valuable early game.

If I had a scan or protect ability, I agree that an early reveal would be foolish, but this is exactly the type of ability it is wise to reveal early. The only way I can die is if the good guys mistakenly lynch me. So why not get this out now when it is credible than waiting later in the game and pulling this out when it will seem like I made it up.

[Blade6119]

Dola,

UNVOTE CHIEF RUM

VOTE ST. CRONIN

Found this nifty site:
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Main_Page

Read over most of the roles in the game to get a better understanding. What makes me vote cronin today is one line in his roles bio: "Most significantly, the Adeptus Mechanicus follow a different religion from the Imperial cult and its derivatives."

Its day one, and thats good enough for me today

[SirFozzie]

Real: You'll forgive me if I find your role reveal a bit too convenient? "Oh I'm a good guy and I can't be killed at night, so the only way this good guy dies is if you lynch me?"

You might be telling the truth, but just remember, there are folks who may not take it at face value.

[RealDeal]

I know Fozzie. That's why I said that it makes sense for me to get scanned early by whoever has that ability.

[BrianD]

If true, the reveal seems to help Real more than the rest of us. You can avoid getting accidentally killed, but you ensure that the Chaos won't waste an attack on you. Wasted attacks give the rest of us more chance to find them.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by BrianD

If true, the reveal seems to help Real more than the rest of us. You can avoid getting accidentally killed, but you ensure that the Chaos won't waste an attack on you. Wasted attacks give the rest of us more chance to find them.

Thats what my point was. By his coming out now, it saved them 1 night action possibly.

[RealDeal]

The value of having a confirmed invulnerable good guy early in the game is much higher than the value of wasting one night action. They can only beat us if they get a 1:1 ratio, and the bad guys probably don't have more than 2 or 3 members. So a relatively low number of confirmed good guys is a powerful core early in the game.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by RealDeal

I disagree Saldana. I am a bigger asset by revealing my invulnerability early than I am by hiding this. Having a confirmed good guy who is invulnerable to bad guy attacks is very valuable early game.

If I had a scan or protect ability, I agree that an early reveal would be foolish, but this is exactly the type of ability it is wise to reveal early. The only way I can die is if the good guys mistakenly lynch me. So why not get this out now when it is credible than waiting later in the game and pulling this out when it will seem like I made it up.

how is giving away the chance to have a kill free night an even exchange for an unverified "good guy reveal"?? we have no idea what your role really is, and we dont even know if we have a seer by the conventional sense of the word to help us find out. rememeber, tangle has said that the game is supposed to be nebulous at the start....wouldnt surprise me one bit if that translates into not having a black vs. white seer role. the only way your reveal does what YOU say it does is if all of us blindly choose to believe it...which would be incredibly stupid on our parts. as far as begging to be scanned, your play right now SCREAMS "cunning wolf".

[saldana]

Originally Posted by RealDeal

The value of having a confirmed invulnerable good guy early in the game is much higher than the value of wasting one night action. They can only beat us if they get a 1:1 ratio, and the bad guys probably don't have more than 2 or 3 members. So a relatively low number of confirmed good guys is a powerful core early in the game.

stop saying you are confirmed....you saying that you are a good guy is NOT confirmation of anything....you are currently at top of my suspects list, not at the top of my trust list, so please stop acting like you just won the game

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by RealDeal

The value of having a confirmed invulnerable good guy early in the game is much higher than the value of wasting one night action. They can only beat us if they get a 1:1 ratio, and the bad guys probably don't have more than 2 or 3 members. So a relatively low number of confirmed good guys is a powerful core early in the game.

I agree that you are not confirmed yet, but I see your point. It is hard for them to get a 1:1 ratio if the CAN'T kill you and we DON'T kill you. It isn't a strategy I would have gone with (assuming you are telling the truth), but I understand it. You'd better hope that someone can confirm what you say, otherwise you will be high on the suspect list.

[Fouts]

I don't think one of the bad guys would make the move realdeal has made so early in the game.

BTW, reading everyone's title confuses the hell out of me.

[RealDeal]

I haven't said I was confirmed. I said I needed to be confirmed.

Just generally, I think it is dumb to keep non-critical information to themselves for big chunks of the game. I've played in 5 or 6 WW games and read pretty much all of them and over and over you see the first few turns wasted and important roles killed because people are just guessing in the first few turns.

I'm not a seer or a bodyguard. If I were, then I wouldn't be revealing turn 1. But in this game, my only real value is that I can't be killed at night. The value from that comes in revealing it early, and giving people some sort of info to work off of instead of pissing blind for three or four turns.

[Fouts]

I grow tired of the wolf icons, plus I don't like his role as an assassin.

vote bulletsponge

[BrianD]

Just to get the paranoia rolling...Saldana, why are you so vocal about RealDeal "revealing" his role? Could it be that you are trying to get us to lynch him since you believe you won't be able to kill him?

[saldana]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Just to get the paranoia rolling...Saldana, why are you so vocal about RealDeal "revealing" his role? Could it be that you are trying to get us to lynch him since you believe you won't be able to kill him?

not at all brian, and i have no problem with you asking....i think it was a foolish move and will most likely hurt us in the end because it has shrunken the list of targets for the wolves....they want to kill the seer, they want to kill the bodyguard, assuming we have those roles on our side...when realdeal comes out 3 posts into the game and says he cant be killed at night, and he bets the other people with the same title cant either, that just narrowed down the list of targets from 12 or 14 to a smaller number...he helped the wolves by revealing, not us.

[saldana]

dola, i am out for work, i will be able to get back on around 6.

[GoldenEagle]

I am here to kill off all versions of Chaos and keep the Imperium alive. I have already proven this claim with the slaying of Daddy Torgo.

I will be voting later today.

[twothree]

I am casting my vote by using a random selection on the first day. It seems to be about as effective as any other day 1 voting strategy.

vote Anxiety

[Swaggs]

Vote for Bulletsponge

There is rarely anything concrete on day 1 and I hate to hold people's roles against them, but I am going with bullet today.

I won't really hold Real Deal's reveal (whether true or false) against him, because he is probably just trying to put that out there to save his own behind and give the wolves something to think about should they attack him tonight. He could be bluffing and be the seer or bodyguard or whatever. It was probably a selfish move, but it will probably also keep him from getting attacked tonight, so, although I wouldn't have done it, good play in my book.

[BrianD]

I agree that RealDeal should get a pass tonight to give any possible seers a chance to act. I don't know if I agree that the Assassin should get knocked off right away. It seems like that could be a position with some cool abilities and we might be weakening ourselves. Of course cool abilities in the wrong hands wouldn't be so cool.

[kingfc22]

Vote Mustang

No reason. Just the title of his role sounds evil. So he must be evil right?

[bulletsponge]

Originally Posted by Fouts

I grow tired of the wolf icons, plus I don't like his role as an assassin.

vote bulletsponge

odd, i feal my role would seem most likely a villager role, not a wolf. and you dont like my wolf gifs?


damn o forgot who i was going to vote for.

ohh yea Vote Chief Rum

first hand experience tells me not to trust him

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by path12

I am here to faithfully serve the Emperor.

Let's kick the discussion off. Who needs protecting most? I have a two person high security cell for use at night.

Offhand I believe st cronin is the only one who knows the entire procedure for keeping the Emperor alive and it seems to me would be a prime candidate for security. I have to go through the roles again but want to get anybody elses thoughts about protection and who most needs it.

This is somewhat true, but my role pm makes me think I'm pretty expendable. What would be the ramifications of the emperor dying, anyway?

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

This is somewhat true, but my role pm makes me think I'm pretty expendable. What would be the ramifications of the emperor dying, anyway?

The complete and utter breakdown of our society?

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Vote Mustang

No reason. Just the title of his role sounds evil. So he must be evil right?

*L*

Well, off that, we should be nominating BrianD because he is head of the Space Wolves and they do have the 13th company which is a bunch of werewolves.

Although.. way too conventient so, no way I'd vote BrianD. Just surprised no one has jokingly brought this up.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

This is somewhat true, but my role pm makes me think I'm pretty expendable. What would be the ramifications of the emperor dying, anyway?

True believers of our faith would be willing to sacrifice their own lives to save the emperor just as he saved humanity if the cause would come up. All on our side owe him eternal debt, so the thought of letting him die should not even be entertained.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by Mustang

*L*

Well, off that, we should be nominating BrianD because he is head of the Space Wolves and they do have the 13th company which is a bunch of werewolves.

Although.. way too conventient so, no way I'd vote BrianD. Just surprised no one has jokingly brought this up.

I tried to head that off earlier.

[st.cronin]

I agree with saldana that realdeal's reveal was a poor move. The right way to play that role (if it's true) is to try and get the bad guys to attack you at night. If you're not a badguy, there's no way they attack you now. Which is bad for the village; we want the bad guys wasting attacks.

VOTE BRIAND

No real reason.

[bulletsponge]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

This is somewhat true, but my role pm makes me think I'm pretty expendable. What would be the ramifications of the emperor dying, anyway?

i bet the ramifications are hidden. but as a loyal servent i am willing to die for you, or more importantly assassinate for you my lord. just point your finger at someone and one of my leathal assassins will get to work

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Alan T

True believers of our faith would be willing to sacrifice their own lives to save the emperor just as he saved humanity if the cause would come up. All on our side owe him eternal debt, so the thought of letting him die should not even be entertained.

I am not talking about letting him die - I am wondering what the ramifications might be if he were to die. Would chaos immediately win?

[bulletsponge]

Originally Posted by bulletsponge

i bet the ramifications are hidden. but as a loyal servent i am willing to die for you, or more importantly assassinate for you my lord. just point your finger at someone and one of my leathal assassins will get to work

dola, i meant fouts. wait... fouts wants me dead!!!

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I am not talking about letting him die - I am wondering what the ramifications might be if he were to die. Would chaos immediately win?

If he dies, we are crippled forever. As far as I know though, they will be unable to get to the emperor as long as our numbers remain sufficient enough to prevent them from storming the throne.

[tanglewood]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I am not talking about letting him die - I am wondering what the ramifications might be if he were to die. Would chaos immediately win?

If the Emperor dies, Chaos wins the game.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I am not talking about letting him die - I am wondering what the ramifications might be if he were to die. Would chaos immediately win?

I think he dies if the chaos wins, and he lives if the chaos is defeted. His life isn't at play during the game.

Edit: So he can die during the course of the game? I guess I'll have to re-read the game rules again.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I am not talking about letting him die - I am wondering what the ramifications might be if he were to die. Would chaos immediately win?

No one person is the Emperor. If they were, they would be very very quiet. The Emperor has been hooked up to the Golden Throne for ages.

[GoldenEagle]

It is my job to protect the Emperor at all times. I will not let the Emperor die. It is also my job to stomp out all of the evil Chaos.

I can smell a Chaos. There is one among us right now as we speak....

[tanglewood]

Originally Posted by BrianD

I think he dies if the chaos wins, and he lives if the chaos is defeted. His life isn't at play during the game.

Edit: So he can die during the course of the game? I guess I'll have to re-read the game rules again.

The goal of Chaos at all times during the game is to destroy the Emperor. If the Emperor dies the Imperium (the 'good' guys) instantaneously lose.

[Alan T]

Just a note, don't edit posts in WW games. Just do a dola and quote with whatever you want to add.

First time no harm no foul.
Second time we cut off your hands!

[st.cronin]

Better the Golden Throne than the Porcelain Throne, I suppose.

[bulletsponge]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Just a note, don't edit posts in WW games. Just do a dola and quote with whatever you want to add.

First time no harm no foul.
Second time we cut off your hands!

and you dont want to know what happens the third time. kiss your 2 best friends goodbye

[tanglewood]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Just a note, don't edit posts in WW games. Just do a dola and quote with whatever you want to add.

First time no harm no foul.
Second time we cut off your hands!

Good catch, I missed that.

No editing of posts under any circumstances is allowed. Even to correct a spelling mistake or grammatical error. Just post dola instead.

[st.cronin]

when playing werewolf it's important you pretend you jbmagic.

[Fouts]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

It is my job to protect the Emperor at all times. I will not let the Emperor die. It is also my job to stomp out all of the evil Chaos.

I can smell a Chaos. There is one among us right now as we speak....

Well, point us in the right direction.

[Fouts]

Originally Posted by bulletsponge

dola, i meant fouts. wait... fouts wants me dead!!!

I don't trust assassin types. Right now, the chance of you being chaos are as good as any. Unless I see some other information, I won't be changing my vote.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by tanglewood

Good catch, I missed that.

No editing of posts under any circumstances is allowed. Even to correct a spelling mistake or grammatical error. Just post dola instead.

Sorry about that, I had forgotten the rule against editing. I won't do it again as I'd like to keep all of my parts.

[tanglewood]

Current Day 1 Vote Count

bulletsponge 3 - AlanT, Fouts, Swaggs
Swaggs 1 - Chief Rum
RealDeal 1 - saldana
st.cronin 1 - Blade
Anxiety 1 - twothree
Mustang 1 - kingfc22
Chief Rum 1 - bulletsponge
BrianD 1 - st.cronin

Yet To Vote: SirFozzie, GoldenEagle, Greyroofoo, Anxiety, path12, BrianD, Mustang, RealDeal

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by GoldenEagle

It is my job to protect the Emperor at all times. I will not let the Emperor die. It is also my job to stomp out all of the evil Chaos.

I can smell a Chaos. There is one among us right now as we speak....

So is this a general statement that there are still Chaos in the game, or was this more pointed to say that someone in the current conversation was a Chaos?

[Fouts]

Originally Posted by BrianD

So is this a general statement that there are still Chaos in the game, or was this more pointed to say that someone in the current conversation was a Chaos?

Good question. I took it to mean that it was someone involved in the conversation when he said it. Those conversing approx the last 10 minutes before his post;

Mustang
BrianD
Tanglewood
Alan
bullet
st.cronin

[path12]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I am not talking about letting him die - I am wondering what the ramifications might be if he were to die. Would chaos immediately win?

Now that we know that the emperor must stay alive, I guess the next question would be something along the lines of: if st. cronin dies then and there's nobody else who knows the entire procedure for keeping the machine going, would that trigger a sudden emperor death or would we have a certain amount of time to get rid of the Chaos?

Unless we know one way or the other with some degree of certainty, I think we need to keep st. cronin alive and protected.

I don't like the Real Deal reveal. So for now,

VOTE REAL DEAL

First day vote, subject to change, blah blah blah......

[path12]

Originally Posted by BrianD

So is this a general statement that there are still Chaos in the game, or was this more pointed to say that someone in the current conversation was a Chaos?

I'd think even if he has some kind of seer role, that day 1 he likely doesn't have any more information than any of the rest of us and that his comment was more general. Would like to have GE clarify though.