WW CLVI - Clue: Master Detective - GAME OVER! MURDERERS WIN! (Post 1817) - Page 38

PackerFanatic · 03-09-2013, 10:45 AM

Wow! Fun game CW. Surprised by the result - although with so many conversions, I guess I shouldn't be

Danny · 03-09-2013, 11:20 AM

Wow! I am as surprised by this result as anyone. After Jag died I figured there was one murderer left and was secretly hoping it was Lathum. No idea there were so many possible conversions.

Chubby, I duked to you because you were the person I was most sure was a villager. WIth all of the crazy stuff, the last thing I wanted to do was duke to another murderer, especially one who was converted and had trust.

Danny · 03-09-2013, 11:22 AM

I definitely think this turned out to be stacked against the village.

But it was fun none the less.

Jag, why were you so quiet? If I hadnt been on your side I would have brought up day 2 how ridiculously under the radar you were playing.

Danny · 03-09-2013, 11:23 AM

I do appreciate the wolves picking off all the players that were at or above my post count level.

britrock88 · 03-09-2013, 11:24 AM

Man, I should have converted when I had the chance...

PackerFanatic · 03-09-2013, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

I do appreciate the wolves picking off all the players that were at or above my post count level.

lol - ditto! 4th most posts in a game is pretty good for me

JAG · 03-09-2013, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

Jag, why were you so quiet? If I hadnt been on your side I would have brought up day 2 how ridiculously under the radar you were playing.

It was a combination of game-related and real-life related things. Game-related due to having to debrief and work with a new partner at the start of every day (I probably should've had a boilerplate written), the timing of the night deadline (usually early morning is my best time for writing / thinking about the game, but I don't usually post much during night phases), and trying to be careful about what I posted since I was the only decently hid wolf among the actual killers (I believe Wednesday I had one point of writing 5-6 posts and then deleted them because I didn't like how they sounded). Real life intervened Tuesday+Wednesday (shoveled snow for a good chunk of the morning and felt out of it the rest of the day, daughter got sick Tuesday evening, stayed home Wednesday to care for her). I was surprised I wasn't called out on it and sorry I wasn't much help to you. By the time I got a partner that was reasonably trusted, the jig was up for me so I couldn't communicate it to you.

By the way, I was amused by your "You can trust me!" comment D1 (I am pretty sure you weren't aware I started off the game knowing who you were, right?) after the last game where you were killed by your wolf partners. Thanks for getting the vote off me, though I was afraid that was going to come back to haunt us. The first two days I had a duke ability similar to the way yours worked if I had been the lynch.

I'm interested to know if bhlloy had figured either of us out or if he was mostly flying blind this game.

bhlloy · 03-09-2013, 02:19 PM

heh, wow. To answer that question JAG I had absolutely no idea about you, and Danny was my "most likely to be a wolf" from the remaining players so I was trying to keep any suspicion of of him, but really I figured it was just DQ and I through the end. I felt pretty good about Katy, Sal and Mau being villagers and just tried to keep the conversation and my votes there.

I had a few real WTF moments this game:

Day 2 pushing the lynch on bullet after coming up with a plausible theory that he was Miss Scarlett and then that being true (sorry Bullet)

Night 2 I tried to convert Font because who reveals their exact role and conversion mechanic and then actually continues to work towards their conversion, right? Thankfully my mechanic didn't fail it just wasn't used as I witnessed her become the murderer, and I tried to direct suspicion off font the next day but it was a futile task at that point

Night three I was genuinely torn between Lathum and Danny ironically - DQ looked like he was getting lynched and I wasn't sure if everyone was just going to jump on Lathum and finish off the last big six the next day, so I was ready to pick out who from the late arrivers I wanted to attach to. Then DQ did his reveal and duke, and it was a no brainer who to convert, although I didn't think it would actually work for a while.

My strategy really was play as a villager until I got my power out there and then try and misdirect, but even after I used my power I figured if I died and my power was revealed that would look really bad for DQ and people might start looking at him again. I hoped DQ knew who I was and I wouldn't be a NK candidate but I wasn't sure. So mostly my game was trying to be as villager as possible and stay alive as long as possible and not do anything controversial.

Fun game that definitely could go both ways but once there were conversions in the first few nights, there was very little chance the village was going to win. Did both big six (font and bullet) just get lucky to find their informants or was there some other mechanic at play?

hoopsguy · 03-09-2013, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Also keep in mind there were basically 3 variations of seer available as well.

Brit just got bad luck. Miss Scarlet had an awesome power, but converted early. Rusty could do a seer power if the person he followed took an action.

Unlucky targeting for those three.

Sure, but could still only lynch one wolf per day. And the wolves seemed to be able to pick up both conversions + kills each day. So it was a sinking ship in terms of trying to catch up, no matter how successful the seers might be.

The cultists not counting for murderer ratio would have helped a lot, I think, in terms of giving the village a better shot at winning. Also, I like the incomplete communication in play for the wolves/cultists in this one.

hoopsguy · 03-09-2013, 04:21 PM

Based on the pushback against Brit by Chubby and Bholloy on Day 2, I had one of them pegged as full-blown seer who thought they were in a role conflict with Brit, thus accusing him of bluffing at the role as a wolf. I wanted to say in thread "there are probably a couple of partial seer roles, relaxing and stop outing yourselves" but didn't want to draw any wolf attention your way ... oops.

hoopsguy · 03-09-2013, 04:24 PM

From what I can tell, several villagers either played badly or unluckily with their roles.

I didn't realize my seance was a one-time power, so basically ended up wasting it on Night 1.
Chief Rum ran into his Big 6 guy, essentially killing himself and causing a conversion.
NTN ran into his (revealed) Big 6 guy, essentially killing himself and causing a conversion.

I'm sure there are others as well, just bringing these up to somewhat soften my thoughts on game balance. Better play would have led to fewer conversions, better information flow on catching (non-converted) wolves.

Coffee Warlord · 03-09-2013, 04:41 PM

There was definitely some bad luck / bad decisions on the village's case. But, still, even I can say in retrospect the balance was off. At the very least, looks like people have fun regardless. Was a fun one to run, with all the craziness.

Danny · 03-09-2013, 04:55 PM

If I was a villager, they would have won

(if I wasnt nked night 1 or 2!)

KatyLied · 03-09-2013, 05:11 PM

Super fun game! I hope next time I'll have more time to think a bit more strategically, especially now that I've been through one full game. Thanks to brit for introducing me.

DQ_BOY1000 · 03-09-2013, 05:59 PM

Speaking of the next game...

CW, when does the next one start?

bulletsponge · 03-09-2013, 06:03 PM

even when i lose i win!

Lathum · 03-09-2013, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DQ_BOY1000

Speaking of the next game...

CW, when does the next one start?

We rotate mods and there is a sign up list so whoever is up next will post sign ups soon.

Autumn · 03-09-2013, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

If I was a villager, they would have won

(if I wasnt nked night 1 or 2!)

Remember folks, if Danny's alive he's a wolf. That's where you went wrong.

mauchow · 03-09-2013, 08:28 PM

Much like the game a month or two back when jag was still alive I don't want to play meta-gamey and choose to lynch him because he's still alive and that meant he's a wolf. No, I choose to intentionally let the game play out and base it on whats in front of me not with meta game feelings. I certainly thought about it two days ago for Danny when i brought up the question but as i said, i think its unfair.. Danny or jag or hoops don't deserve to get lynched because of the question "how are they still alive..." I think they deserve better than that.

hoopsguy · 03-10-2013, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autumn

Remember folks, if Danny's alive he's a wolf. That's where you went wrong.

The crowd (at least at hoopsguy's house) boos this logic.

JAG · 03-10-2013, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mauchow

Much like the game a month or two back when jag was still alive I don't want to play meta-gamey and choose to lynch him because he's still alive and that meant he's a wolf. No, I choose to intentionally let the game play out and base it on whats in front of me not with meta game feelings. I certainly thought about it two days ago for Danny when i brought up the question but as i said, i think its unfair.. Danny or jag or hoops don't deserve to get lynched because of the question "how are they still alive..." I think they deserve better than that.

I think that's just smart play because it can happen. I've made it to the last few players as a villager at least as many times as a wolf, off the top of my head once with tyke / Chief / Jackal (though tyke suicided before we could have the last day) and once with you and the Juggler in the Dr. Who game. I can think of a few games Danny made it to the end as a villager too.

britrock88 · 03-10-2013, 12:57 PM

Haven't seen Jackal in ages...

Danny · 03-10-2013, 02:17 PM

So who is the one who hit me the non voting ability?

Lathum · 03-10-2013, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

So who is the one who hit me the non voting ability?

me

03-09-2013, 10:45 AM	#1851
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	Wow! Fun game CW. Surprised by the result - although with so many conversions, I guess I shouldn't be __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

03-09-2013, 05:59 PM	#1865
DQ_BOY1000 Mascot Join Date: Mar 2013	Speaking of the next game... CW, when does the next one start? __________________ "... as if there were 999 before you." "There were."

03-09-2013, 06:03 PM	#1866
bulletsponge Pro Starter Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: TX	even when i lose i win! __________________ the Barbarian, WW Royal Rumble Champion

03-09-2013, 08:28 PM	#1869
mauchow Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Murfreesboro, TN	Much like the game a month or two back when jag was still alive I don't want to play meta-gamey and choose to lynch him because he's still alive and that meant he's a wolf. No, I choose to intentionally let the game play out and base it on whats in front of me not with meta game feelings. I certainly thought about it two days ago for Danny when i brought up the question but as i said, i think its unfair.. Danny or jag or hoops don't deserve to get lynched because of the question "how are they still alive..." I think they deserve better than that. Last edited by mauchow : 03-09-2013 at 08:31 PM.

03-09-2013, 11:20 AM	#1852
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	Wow! I am as surprised by this result as anyone. After Jag died I figured there was one murderer left and was secretly hoping it was Lathum. No idea there were so many possible conversions. Chubby, I duked to you because you were the person I was most sure was a villager. WIth all of the crazy stuff, the last thing I wanted to do was duke to another murderer, especially one who was converted and had trust.

03-09-2013, 11:22 AM	#1853
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	I definitely think this turned out to be stacked against the village. But it was fun none the less. Jag, why were you so quiet? If I hadnt been on your side I would have brought up day 2 how ridiculously under the radar you were playing.

03-09-2013, 11:23 AM	#1854
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	I do appreciate the wolves picking off all the players that were at or above my post count level.

03-09-2013, 11:24 AM	#1855
britrock88 Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Madison, WI	Man, I should have converted when I had the chance...

03-09-2013, 02:19 PM	#1858
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	heh, wow. To answer that question JAG I had absolutely no idea about you, and Danny was my "most likely to be a wolf" from the remaining players so I was trying to keep any suspicion of of him, but really I figured it was just DQ and I through the end. I felt pretty good about Katy, Sal and Mau being villagers and just tried to keep the conversation and my votes there. I had a few real WTF moments this game: Day 2 pushing the lynch on bullet after coming up with a plausible theory that he was Miss Scarlett and then that being true (sorry Bullet) Night 2 I tried to convert Font because who reveals their exact role and conversion mechanic and then actually continues to work towards their conversion, right? Thankfully my mechanic didn't fail it just wasn't used as I witnessed her become the murderer, and I tried to direct suspicion off font the next day but it was a futile task at that point Night three I was genuinely torn between Lathum and Danny ironically - DQ looked like he was getting lynched and I wasn't sure if everyone was just going to jump on Lathum and finish off the last big six the next day, so I was ready to pick out who from the late arrivers I wanted to attach to. Then DQ did his reveal and duke, and it was a no brainer who to convert, although I didn't think it would actually work for a while. My strategy really was play as a villager until I got my power out there and then try and misdirect, but even after I used my power I figured if I died and my power was revealed that would look really bad for DQ and people might start looking at him again. I hoped DQ knew who I was and I wouldn't be a NK candidate but I wasn't sure. So mostly my game was trying to be as villager as possible and stay alive as long as possible and not do anything controversial. Fun game that definitely could go both ways but once there were conversions in the first few nights, there was very little chance the village was going to win. Did both big six (font and bullet) just get lucky to find their informants or was there some other mechanic at play?

03-09-2013, 04:21 PM	#1860
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Based on the pushback against Brit by Chubby and Bholloy on Day 2, I had one of them pegged as full-blown seer who thought they were in a role conflict with Brit, thus accusing him of bluffing at the role as a wolf. I wanted to say in thread "there are probably a couple of partial seer roles, relaxing and stop outing yourselves" but didn't want to draw any wolf attention your way ... oops.

03-09-2013, 04:24 PM	#1861
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	From what I can tell, several villagers either played badly or unluckily with their roles. I didn't realize my seance was a one-time power, so basically ended up wasting it on Night 1. Chief Rum ran into his Big 6 guy, essentially killing himself and causing a conversion. NTN ran into his (revealed) Big 6 guy, essentially killing himself and causing a conversion. I'm sure there are others as well, just bringing these up to somewhat soften my thoughts on game balance. Better play would have led to fewer conversions, better information flow on catching (non-converted) wolves.

03-09-2013, 04:41 PM	#1862
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	There was definitely some bad luck / bad decisions on the village's case. But, still, even I can say in retrospect the balance was off. At the very least, looks like people have fun regardless. Was a fun one to run, with all the craziness.

03-09-2013, 04:55 PM	#1863
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	If I was a villager, they would have won (if I wasnt nked night 1 or 2!)

03-09-2013, 05:11 PM	#1864
KatyLied n00b Join Date: Feb 2013	Super fun game! I hope next time I'll have more time to think a bit more strategically, especially now that I've been through one full game. Thanks to brit for introducing me.

03-10-2013, 12:57 PM	#1872
britrock88 Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Madison, WI	Haven't seen Jackal in ages...

03-10-2013, 02:17 PM	#1873
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	So who is the one who hit me the non voting ability?

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