WW CVI: Evil Star Trek--GAME OVER!! (Results in Post #643)

[The Jackal]

i'm keeping my eye on you danny

[DaddyTorgo]

i guess - to avoid a tie and for that reason

VOTE KWHIT

[JAG]

VOTE KWhit

A rather disappointing day unless he turns up wolf.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

i'm keeping my eye on you danny

*shudders

[DaddyTorgo]

fyi i'm stating now that should i live through the night i will be out of touch a vast majority of the day tomorrow. we have a 2-4pm meeting at work, coffee with an investor at 4 and then drinks with our lawyer at 6...probably away from internet from 2pm-whenever I get home. I hope to be on before deadline though, that's for sure.

[Lathum]

why the fuck do people use these abilities on day 2 when they are completely taking shots in the dark and are just as likely to kill a villager with a role as they are a wolf.

Jesus Christ J23, you had 2 votes on you, would have made a lot more sense to reveal, I guess screwing the village even more is better then dying with your power unused...

[The Jackal]

i think that belongs in the rant thread

[Chief Rum]

All right, checking in. I'm getting caught up, and will have results up soon.

[Chief Rum]

Day Two Vote Count

KWhit (7)-- Darth Vilus (238), PurdueBrad (282), Schmidty (339), Telle (340), The Jackal (349), DaddyTorgo (352), JAG (353)
hoopsguy (4)-- KWhit (243), dubb93 (244), lerriuqs (288), Danny (348)
lerriuqs (1)-- hoopsguy (309)

This is the vote count I have. Unless anyone has an objection, I will do the writeups.

[KWhit]

Sigh.

What a backward ass reason to get lynched.

[Chief Rum]

After all of the excitement and dismay from J23 taking out Lathum, the village got back on track to the business of putting someone in the brig.

It was a toss up most of the day, but in the end, it was a runaway. KWhit is from thge Good Universe, insisted the village.

KWhit again protested his innocence, but the village was having none of it today. Security is called in and KWhit grabbed.

KWhit laughs maniacally at the gathered crew members, "You have no idea what you're up against! My man will save me. He will win the day, win back this ship, and he'll take me to a universe where you don't have to look over your shoulder for assassins or officers with Agonizers! You just wait and see!"

With a sharp turn of her shoulder and a fling of her hair, KWhit--aka Lieutenant Marlena Moreau, walks off staunchly to the brig, the scurity team following closely behind her.

KWHIT WAS LT. MARLENA MOREAU!!!

A friend of the wolves has been vanquished.

[Schmidty]

Well, that was good!!

[The Jackal]

Well he was still a villager so we haven't netted a wolf but at least we dont have to worry about a convert

[Schmidty]

Not great. But good.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Well he was still a villager so we haven't netted a wolf but at least we dont have to worry about a convert

Yeah, I didn't realize that he counted as a villager.

[Danny]

That's a pretty good result. Not sure this gives us any voting record at all though since the wolves did not know who she was. That means as far as the wolves knew, they were lynching a regular villager in Kwhit.

[KWhit]

I roll my eyes in your general direction.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Danny

That's a pretty good result. Not sure this gives us any voting record at all though since the wolves did not know who she was. That means as far as the wolves knew, they were lynching a regular villager in Kwhit.

The reverse (KWhit knowing the wolves) could potentially yield something.

[Danny]

Kwhit voted Ntn day 1 and Hoops Day 2

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by JAG

The reverse (KWhit knowing the wolves) could potentially yield something.

yep that's what we have to look at instead

still have to wait for the NK though

[Chief Rum]

Alarm claxons rang out in the night. Those not on duty awaken from slumber and come running to see what all the hubbub is.

A pale redshirt stands at the doorway of Lieutenant Sulu's quarters, where he had just triggered the alarm.

"I was just returning to let the Lieutenant know how the security detail was going, and I found this..."

"This" was the torn up quarters of Sulu, where it is clear, a vicious battle between two trained combatants took place.

Alas for the ship, Sulu was unable to withstand his attacker. He lies on the floor of his quarters, strangled to death.

PURDUEBRAD WAS LIEUTENANT SULU!!!

An awful loss for the ship's crew today.

The next daily deadline is Thursday, 9 p.m. EST/6 p.m. PDT.

The next Trivia Contest deadline is Thursday, 4:30 p.m. EST/1:30 p.m. PDT. The prize to be won is a Phaser--setting stuck on Stun.

[KWhit]

YAY!

[The Jackal]

Damn, BG out

[Danny]

Since there was the convert, that indicates 3 starting wolves, so we are likely 7-3 now. I think if our seer has a wolf he has to reveal

[Chief Rum]

A little bit of some unfortunate news.

Due to circumstances entirely out of her control, Telle had to be removed from the game. It was an unfortunate accident that I can't go into details on at the moment, and won't after the game unless the parties involved want me to.

Just one of those unfortunate "crap happens" sorta things, and I feel really bad for Telle. I am hoping she will continue to read along and cheer for her side.

In her place, claphamsa has agreed to come aboard. He will take on Telle's spot in the game.

So please welcome claphamsa.

[The Jackal]

clap!

[hoopsguy]

Reading along with this, that was the best possible result that I thought we were going to get. I was convinced that we were getting hosed with a villager on KWhit and I was going to have to dance tomorrow for being on him two straight days.

I'm fine with that at this point because we got the convert today and because I'm now just about 100% convinced that DT or Lerri is a wolf (same logic as I used with vote today) since the wolves thought they were free-rolling on D1 and D2 with the way the votes went down.

Both of those guys, going from memory, seemed very willing to lock in on "Hoops or KWhit" without actually grappling with the issues I was trying to discuss publicly.

[Danny]

I agree Hoops and some of DT's posts have seemed off to me. My vote will likely go in that direction as well.

[PurdueBrad]

JERKS! Kick their ass village!

[Danny]

I just realized Jackal basically revealed as Doctor Mccoy with his eye on me statement.

[Danny]

Or was that coincidental?

[lerriuqs]

Originally Posted by Danny

I just realized Jackal basically revealed as Doctor Mccoy with his eye on me statement.

Oh?

[JAG]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Reading along with this, that was the best possible result that I thought we were going to get. I was convinced that we were getting hosed with a villager on KWhit and I was going to have to dance tomorrow for being on him two straight days.

I'm fine with that at this point because we got the convert today and because I'm now just about 100% convinced that DT or Lerri is a wolf (same logic as I used with vote today) since the wolves thought they were free-rolling on D1 and D2 with the way the votes went down.

Both of those guys, going from memory, seemed very willing to lock in on "Hoops or KWhit" without actually grappling with the issues I was trying to discuss publicly.

Agreed with that as our best percentage play unless someone has something else to add.

Just a random thought from looking at the rules, we have to keep in mind is if the wolves have the Good Scotty:

Good Scotty Masquerading as the ship's chief engineer. One time per game, Scotty can sabotage the ship engines. Dealing with this emergency will take all ship's personnel, so no lynch will happen that day.

That means that if we get to within one of the wolves (4-3, 3-2, etc...), we could potentially lose the game with them canceling the lynch and executing their NK with us having no BG to block it.

BTW, welcome clap!

[JAG]

Meant to put that in quotes, not bold it.

[hoopsguy]

DT, if you are going to be around for a few tonight I'll start railroading you now rather than tomorrow when your schedule is busy.

Seriously, I'm going to start looking for you vs Lerriuqs decision points right now so hopefully you have time to chime in on this line of thinking.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Darth Vilus

I'm not sure where Hoops is going with this but there's a reason why the wolves don't like him. I'll go with this for now since i'm at aloss and have to leave

VOTE KHWIT

Originally Posted by KWhit

WHAT!?!?!?

That is possibly the most ridiculous thing I've heard.

"I don't understand his argument, but I'll agree with it anyway!!"

Seriously?

Originally Posted by KWhit

I'm not liking the Hoops / DV doubleteam on me.

And since Hoops initiated it.

VOTE HOOPSGUY

OK, not one of the two guys I want to focus on, but this caught my eye right away. My logic in targeting KWhit was obviously off-base, but he knows I'm a villager.

If you are KWhit, do you vote for me (legitimately trying to work through things in thread) or Darth, who tagged along with my vote and even misspelled his username? Seriously, KWhit knew the wolves and he voted for me (villager) here and never once appeared to give thought to voting for Darth as far as I recall. Now back to post diving ...

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Reading along with this, that was the best possible result that I thought we were going to get. I was convinced that we were getting hosed with a villager on KWhit and I was going to have to dance tomorrow for being on him two straight days.

I'm fine with that at this point because we got the convert today and because I'm now just about 100% convinced that DT or Lerri is a wolf (same logic as I used with vote today) since the wolves thought they were free-rolling on D1 and D2 with the way the votes went down.

Both of those guys, going from memory, seemed very willing to lock in on "Hoops or KWhit" without actually grappling with the issues I was trying to discuss publicly.

like i said i won't be around tomorrow afternoon very much at all - although i will be in the morning, so let me address my D1 and D2 votes since it's come up a bit.

D1 - I voted for Kwhit to keep it close (actually I tied it up) earlier in the evening. Standard procedure for me on D1, to keep things close and try to see what we could get out of the vote record as things wound down to deadline. I was then away from the thread having dinner and off at the bus station picking up my mom from the airport the rest of the night. Then again it was good/good on D1 so neither of the people I voted for would look good on my record. I'm not sure why my D1 vote (which was on one of the two viable candidates that day and was placed at the time it was placed out of necessity) is worthy of any suspicion frankly.

D2 - I stated multiple times particularly as we grew closer to deadline that I didn't feel especially great about either a vote for you or a vote for kwhit hoops. I had a busy day getting ready for a client-meeting tomorrow and wasn't able to spend tons of time evaluating your argument vs. kwhit's argument, and what little i did see of both of them and manage to process they seemed like more of a wash.

so i sat there as we approached deadline and i said "okay people are already talking about voting me...so what effect will my votes have on that."

and frankly, whether i voted for you or i voted for kwhit they both looked equally bad on me.

another vote on kwhit and it'd be "you voted twice for the same villager." a vote for you and you'd go on the same crusade since you know you are a villager - and as i said i believed as much. so really i was damned if i did and damned if i didn't. i chose to vote for kwhit with very little time left on the clock to make sure that the possibility for a tie and a no-lynch wasn't there.

i have NEVER been afraid to tie things up in order to get folks to make decisions, or to cast late votes, whether i'm a wolf or a villager - that much should be clear after how many games i've played, so i am a bit frustrated at what you're trying to tie to it.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by JAG

That's not at all what I was saying actually, although since you brought it up...in my limited WW experience I do think people hold them in an overly high regard than they should be. Maybe it's just because I've been a villager in a couple games recently (soccer, Nazi) where voting record did not help in finding the last wolf, or like the Scooby game where I was a villager with the worst voting record towards the end of the game and lynched for it. Wolves know how to be sneaky, especially most of the people here who are extremely experienced and know the same general wisdom everyone else knows.

Anyway, to get back from waxing philosophically, I don't see myself voting for hoops or KWhit because I feel they're both villagers. Despite what I said earlier, seeing that I have little else to go on at this point (believing we were v-v D1), I find myself drifting towards what Danny said regarding wolves wanting to set candidates. That being the case, let's look at the opening voting:

82 - Dubb votes JAG (1-0)
85 - Lathum votes Telle (1-1 JAG/Telle)
87 - PB votes Darth (1-1-1 JAG/Telle/Darth)
88 - Dubb unvotes JAG (1-1 Telle/Darth)
91 - Hoops votes KWhit (1-1-1 Telle/Darth/KWhit)
106 - Darth votes NTN (1-1-1-1 Telle/Darth/KWhit/NTN)
109 - Danny votes J23 (1-1-1-1-1 Telle/Darth/KWhit/NTN/J23)

So Dubb opens voting on me (though he takes it back), Lathum adds another candidate but in my experience it's not unusual for him to vote early either wolf or villager, PB votes Darth, Darth votes ntn, and (ironically) Danny introduces J23. Later we get this:

112 - J23 votes NTN (2-1-1-1-1 NTN over Telle/Darth/KWhit/J23)
117 - Lerri votes KWhit (2-2-1-1-1 NTN/KWhit over Telle/Darth/J23)
125 - Dubb votes NTN (3-2-1-1-1 NTN over KWhit over Telle/Darth/J23)
129 - DT votes KWhit (3-3-1-1-1 NTN/KWhit over Telle/Darth/J23)

Very quickly, we moved away from Darth / J23 / Telle as potential candidates. Maybe that's a coincidence, but if one of them is a wolf, one of the group that voted 2nd / 3rd on KWhit / ntn could be in cohoots with them.

Now that's a broad stroke of people admittedly, but it's better for me than blindly picking someone. Now I have to leave work, but I will probably aim for someone in that group after I give it some more thought.

If/when we see DT/Lerri revealed as a wolf this makes me feel a little better about JAG. As he notes, this is broad strokes but he seems to be steering away from me/KWhit and pointing at least a little attention to another group of players (J23/DT/Dubb/Lerri) that are higher likelihood of being wolves.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Danny

I just realized Jackal basically revealed as Doctor Mccoy with his eye on me statement.

that was definitely not my intention, i am not mccoy

[hoopsguy]

DT, I'm saying that I'm just about positive that the wolves would have done standard "divide votes among villagers" on the Day 1 candidates.

There were five us on on KWhit on Day 1. Two are dead villager, leaving three choices. I know I'm a villager, so for me that leaves two choices and you are one of them. I love having a 50/50, worst-case, in this scenario before even introducing the possibility of a seer-scan clearing/damning one of the candidates.

If you are a villager, you should feel the same way looking at me vs Lerriuqs.

If you are a wolf, you should be feeling a little trapped right now.

Only way this does not work is if you think that all the wolves piled together to get NTN voted off the island on Day 1. Only other outstanding vote, besides KWhit/NTN from Day 1 was Danny (going from memory). I'm discarding both of these as possibilities for today because they seem pretty low-value plays for the wolves when they felt like they were in complete control of the day.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by lerriuqs

While I have no vote count, it appears it's between hoops and Kwhit...

I think Kwhit's arguments are stronger at this point and I think it's relatively certain we were villager-villager yesterday. So I'm not going to vote Kwhit again...unless something bad comes up against him.

So based on that and not really seeing any better options at this point...

Vote Hoops

I've gotta check out again. Hopefully back before deadline.

OK, this was the post that made me have bad vibes on Lerri earlier.
1.) Feels like he wants the showdown between me + KWhit
2.) Makes statement that we were villager/villager yesterday without suggesting why he feels that way - I think Lerriuqs would normally do so as a villager.
3.) Somewhat apologetic sounding vote ... "gee, I'm forced to do this because this is the runoffs others created, even though I don't have a vote count, but I believe the one guy so the other guy is the best bet"

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I agree that lerriuqs and DT make compelling candidates if only for the fact that I doubt more than 3 wolves (and possibly/probably less) were on NTN. It would certainly help to know KWhit's allegiance, though.

If Jackal is a wolf, he is more willing than I would expect to entertain Lerri/DT conversation rather than push me back into that analysis than I would expect. Slight trust nudge from me for this.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

so what are we looking at tonight? hoops vs. kwhit?

I really need to put together the vote count at the time both this post and Lerri's were made, to see if they were artificially driving people towards me vs KWhit or if the votes actually backed this assertion.

[DaddyTorgo]

i'm pretty sure that the votes actually backed that assertion at that point - certainly the tone of the discussion from what i saw did

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

In the interest of preventing a tie, and the fact I think hoops hasn't done anything suspicious enough to not let him live another day..

VOTE KWHIT

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

i guess - to avoid a tie and for that reason

VOTE KWHIT

When it was tied DT basically waited long enough for Jackal to make the decision and then backed it.

A wolf would not want a tie if he sees a runoff between two villagers. First, he wants a dead villager. Second, he does not want the scrutiny associated with questions on why he created a tie if it possibly results in no lynch (will have to check rules on this, I don't know them off top of my head).

[DaddyTorgo]

actually hoops - fwiw i hadn't refreshed to see if jackal had voted before i voted

[hoopsguy]

DT, if you had not seen Jackal's vote then what was "that reason" in your post?

[Lathum]

[DaddyTorgo]

wasn't there another post talking about the idea of a tie? or am i confusing jackal's vote with the vote of the person who also came in and voted late?

i think i was talking about the idea of preventing a tie and a no-lynch with someboy and then voted the way i did for that purpose (and as much as you say a wolf wouldn't want a tie i don't think any villager wants to see a tie either exactly) and that's what i mentioned. i thought jackal's vote was after that, but maybe it was somebody else who voted after that.

[DaddyTorgo]

i didn't go back to look at how things went down so that's why i'm confused