channelsurfing.net

[jbergey22]

Appear to be in trouble. Surprised they got away with this as long as they did.

Blackout! Popular streaming sites seized by government - Turf Show Times

Rough day for NFL fans. First, a ruling gives the league and owners much better positioning at the bargaining table by ruling that the lockout insurance is legit, and now two popular online video streaming sites have been seized by the U.S. Government.
Channelsurfing.net and Atdhe.net were sites that linked to broadcasts of NFL games and plenty of other television shows. I'm not sure if this applies to Atdhe.net or not, but Channelsurfing.net did not actually host copyrighted material, it embedded from other sites that did so.
Yes, both of these sites operate in a gray area of broadcasting copyright law, "gray area" probably being a little generous. Nevertheless, lots of people used those sites, not that we would ever endorse such behavior, but it is notable and worth comment given just how popular they were.
It's nothing more than coincidence, but what a coincidence it is that these two services get shutdown the same day the NFL won a big decision regarding its own broadcast revenues...and just a few days after the Egyptian government cut off internet access to unsuccessfully quell a peaceful revolution in their country, not popular uprising against tyranny is the same as popular ways around the tyranny of blackouts.

[MJ4H]

http://atdhenet.tv/

edited to update to new atdhe address.

Of course, channelsurfing.net is now channelsurfing.eu

[bronconick]

I'm glad "Homeland Security" has solved the whole terrorism problem already. We can leave the Middle East now, right?

Less than ten years for an idea to run completely shit crazy and be doing something completely unrelated to their original stated goal. I'd be impressed, but nothing the government does in the name of its corporate masters is all that surprising anymore.

Edit: I'd be less annoyed if it was the FBI or US Marshals doing this sort of thing, but if DHS has the time and manpower to be doing piddly little stuff like this, let's slash their budget in half, since there's not enough terror threats to justify their bloated carcass of a bureaucracy.

[MJ4H]

ATDHE.Net - Watch Free Live Sports TV

[BishopMVP]

channelsurf.eu

It wasn't just DHS... it was a joint effort with ICE (customs) *shurg*

[Sun Tzu]

Damn...

[Lathum]

It amazes me that the government clowns who run operations like this, and spend our hard earned tax dollars, don't realize that the people who run these sites will find a work around in about 5 seconds.

[M GO BLUE!!!]

Just as I had canceled cable. Well, at least there are no football games coming up...

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Lathum

It amazes me that the government clowns who run operations like this, and spend our hard earned tax dollars, don't realize that the people who run these sites will find a work around in about 5 seconds.

For most (all?) of them, they already had multiple domain extensions (.org/.eu/.com/.ru etc), and have switched traffic over to the ones the US can't reach even under these flimsy connections.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Lathum

It amazes me that the government clowns who run operations like this, and spend our hard earned tax dollars, don't realize that the people who run these sites will find a work around in about 5 seconds.

It's more the telcos and media companies that don't understand this. The government just does what they are paid to do by them.

[Matthean]

I don't have cable. Fox for the longest time came in, but as of late it hasn't so I was likely going to be watching the Super Bowl via online. I'll be using the other site listed.

[wade moore]

Put me in the "amazed it took this long" camp.

This is so clearly illegal it's not even funny.

[Icy]

On a related note, and what could cause international legal troubles, the US gov has also seized rojadirecta.com that is the biggest Spanish live soccer streaming site (over 1 Million daily visitors).

The main problem is that the .com can't be reached now by any surfer worldwide (a default page from the USA Homeland Security Investigations is shown instead), and while streaming sports is not allowed in USA, it is in Spain as long as it's not done for a profit, in fact the website owner recently won a related lawsuit against the major Spanish TV stations. So while USA would be right on closing access to the website for their citizens, it's not legal to close it for the Spanish citizens.

It puts in question who "owns" the generic domains (.com, .org, .net), that are supposed to be worldwide owned, but at the end seems to by only owned by USA and it's domestic laws.

Full article in English:

Homeland Security Seizes Spanish Domain Name That Had Already Been Declared Legal
from the international-incident dept
It appears that Homeland Security's Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) division, and their incredibly sloppy domain seizure operations, have moved on to the next phase -- as was promised by both ICE boss, John Morton, and IP Enforcement Coordinator, Victoria Espinel. The timing on this one is particularly bizarre -- and politically stupid.

That's because the the domain seizure is for the Spanish streaming site Rojadirecta. Yes, ICE seized the domain name of a foreign company. And it gets worse. Rojadirecta is not just some fly-by-night operation run out of someone's basement or something. It's run by a legitimate company in Spain, and the site's legality has been tested in the Spanish courts... and the site was declared legal. The court noted that since Rojadirecta does not host any material itself, it does not infringe.

So, a full-on trial and legal process that took three years in a foreign country, and involved a series of appeals leading to a final judgment.... all totally ignored by a bunch of US customs agents.

You might think some folks in Spain would have a pretty serious issue with this move.

And the timing is especially ridiculous, given that the US has been pushing very, very hard for Spain to implement a new copyright law, driven in large part by Hollywood. With many in Spain already furious about US meddling in their own copyright laws, I can't imagine that having US customs agents reaching across the Atlantic to just out and out seize a Spanish company's domain name is going to go over very well.

Imagine if a Spanish law enforcement agency did that to a US company? How quickly would we see American politicians screaming about this "international incident." Yet, here we have Homeland Security reaching out to seize the domain name of a foreign company that has been explicitly declared legal, after going through a lengthy trial and appeals process in its native country. And, in typical Homeland Security fashion, no one bothered to contact the company and let them know or express its concerns. Instead, it just seized the domain.

I would imagine that doing so may upset Spanish citizenry even more than the attempt to rewrite copyright laws in Hollywood's favor.

And of course, it appears that, despite the serious questions raised about the last domain seizures, in particular of blogs with substantial non-infringing uses, ICE has also seized another blog, called StrikeGently, which appears to have included lots of other content. Yes, it did also include some links to downloads hosted on other sites, but did not host any content directly itself, and appears to have included plenty of other content beyond the links to downloads. Once again, no one is saying that the site is clearly legal. It may, in fact, be liable for inducement. However, that's something that's supposed to be determined at trial, and not after the government steps in with no notice whatsoever and takes the domain name away.

Apparently, Homeland Security and ICE have decided that the mistakes it made last time are so minor that it will repeat them again and again, even if it involves shutting down protected speech and interfering in international relations.

[Ksyrup]

Where can I stream ESPNU if I can't get on ESPN3 at work?

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by Icy

On a related note, and what could cause international legal troubles, the US gov has also seized rojadirecta.com that is the biggest Spanish live soccer streaming site (over 1 Million daily visitors).

The main problem is that the .com can't be reached now by any surfer worldwide (a default page from the USA Homeland Security Investigations is shown instead), and while streaming sports is not allowed in USA, it is in Spain as long as it's not done for a profit, in fact the website owner recently won a related lawsuit against the major Spanish TV stations. So while USA would be right on closing access to the website for their citizens, it's not legal to close it for the Spanish citizens.

It puts in question who "owns" the generic domains (.com, .org, .net), that are supposed to be worldwide owned, but at the end seems to by only owned by USA and it's domestic laws.

This gets into international commerce in general it would seem to me. If a foreign company is not following US laws in what it imports into the US, how do you handle that? Seems like the onus was on them to block US access to their service by IP (like many others do), and what got them in trouble was essentially exporting illegal goods to the US.

As for the NFL angle, this is why I put up an antenna after I cut the cable TV cord...

[Icy]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

This gets into international commerce in general it would seem to me. If a foreign company is not following US laws in what it imports into the US, how do you handle that? Seems like the onus was on them to block US access to their service by IP (like many others do), and what got them in trouble was essentially exporting illegal goods to the US.

In that case they can block the access to USA citizens, like China does with the sites they want, but not to Spanish citizens as they are not doing anything illegal in Spain, and USA doesn't not own the generic tld domain names, those are owned internationally and USA is just who admins them, so it's international laws what apply to them, not USA ones.

Not sure if the sample is a good one, but it's like if USA intercepts a ship in Spanish waters because they carry stuff illegal in USA but legal in Spain. They can intercept it in USA waters, not outside.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Icy

In that case they can block the access to USA citizens, like China does with the sites they want, but not to Spanish citizens as they are not doing anything illegal in Spain, and USA doesn't not own the generic tld domain names, those are owned internationally and USA is just who admins them, so it's international laws what apply to them, not USA ones.

Not sure if the sample is a good one, but it's like if USA intercepts a ship in Spanish waters because they carry stuff illegal in USA but legal in Spain. They can intercept it in USA waters, not outside.

Does that channel exclusively show Spanish-produced TV sports? If that's true, I think that argument works, but if they're stealing ESPN-produced TV sports (or American movies), I think it's a stretch.

[Icy]

Originally Posted by molson

Does that channel exclusively show Spanish-produced TV sports? If that's true, I think that argument works, but if they're stealing ESPN-produced TV sports (or American movies), I think it's a stretch.

If not sure about that as to tell you the true, i'm not an user of that site. They are famous for Spanish soccer, but maybe they had also other sports streams linked in there.

The lawsuit they won in Spain was because they do not stream or host any content, they just have links to p2p sites where to watch it, and linking to copyright infringement sites in Spain is not a crime (else Google would be guilty too, as you can find it in google like you can find drugs or even underage stuff).

[Icy]

Dola, as the .es is active : ROJADIRECTA

I saw they have links to all kind of sports, not only Spanish produced, but as you can see in the site they do not host anything, just link to it acting as a search engine (and as i said, that is how they won the lawsuit here).

Let's see how does this end, the guy for sure had big nuts when he fought in court against the biggest sports networks here, when similar sites closed as soon as they were asked to, and everybody thought he was crazy and would have to pay them and the lawyers millions of euros.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Where can I stream ESPNU if I can't get on ESPN3 at work?

channelsurfing still works, it just has a .eu now instead of a .net. Not sure if they will be streaming ESPNU. You can also try justin TV

[Lathum]

hmmm, the .eu address isn't working for me now

[MJ4H]

It's Watch Online TV, Sports, News and Entertainment for FREE at Channelsurfing now.

[Lathum]

they took the ing off the end

[sovereignstar v2]

I see that King Fuckface Dana White went out of his way to thank the white knights today. Probably having a beer with Metallica as we speak.

[RainMaker]

Not that I think this is what Homeland Security and ICE should be spending their time on, but I'm not sure why you would be mad at Dana White. People are stealing his product. I understand wanting a freebie, but not sure how that makes him a fuck face.

[sovereignstar v2]

He has been a fuck face for a long time for many different reasons. This just makes him look like a douchebag, not unlike Metallica for their very public stance against Napster. He doesn't care though, so I understand.

[fantom1979]

Its 2011, people want media options, not restrictions. Just look at Itunes, streaming video (like netflix), and Hulu. A few great success stories that can find their roots from illegal sources (Napster and other files sharing networks). If channelsurfing was that big, then maybe the sports leagues will realize that their is money to be made by offering options.

I am a Jets fan living in Detroit. My options are to dump my cable provider for Direct TV, use an illegal website, or not watch the game. Can the NFL get on the ball and sell online team subscriptions? Or even figure out a way to make it free with ads? You are starting to see some progress with the NCAA basketball, Sunday night football, and MLB, but it is not progressing fast enough or with enough options. Until they get this right, there will always be a channelsurfing type website.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

I am a Jets fan living in Detroit. My options are to dump my cable provider for Direct TV, use an illegal website, or not watch the game. Can the NFL get on the ball and sell online team subscriptions?

One of the problems here is that enough folks are willing to pay big bucks to get it the way it is. When enough folks stop being willing to shell out money and viewership declines, then they'll open up.

I bought an OTA antenna to watch football and just accept that I'll only get to see the Pats a few times during the season.

Note that the NFL has Game Rewind which will let you stream the games after they complete. So if you're willing to wait 3 hours, you can watch it then.

And of course there is always the Sports Bar option.

[cuervo72]

Hrm, Pats in Carolina might be challenging on some weeks, but at least the Pats are on national broadcasts a decent amount because they're good.

I actually thought about dropping Sunday Ticket last year, and might have if they didn't make HD standard. Why? I can see the Eagles so darned often anyway.

September
DAY	DATE	OPPONENT	TIME (ET)
Sun.	12	PACKERS	4:15 PM
Sun.	19	@ Lions	1:00 PM
Sun.	26	@ Jaguars	4:05 PM
October
DAY	DATE	OPPONENT	TIME (ET)
Sun.	3	REDSKINS	4:15 PM
Sun.	10	@ 49ers	8:20 PM
Sun.	17	FALCONS	1:00 PM
Sun.	24	@ Titans	1:00 PM
BYE	31	BYE	BYE
November
DAY	DATE	OPPONENT	TIME (ET)
Sun.	7	COLTS	4:15 PM
Mon.	15	@ Redskins	8:30 PM
Sun.	21	GIANTS	8:20 PM
Sun.	28	@ Bears	4:15 PM
December
DAY	DATE	OPPONENT	TIME (ET)
Thu.	2	TEXANS	8:20 PM
Sun.	12	@ Cowboys	8:20 PM
Sun.	19	@ Giants	1:00 PM
Tue.	28	VIKINGS	8:00 PM
January
DAY	DATE	OPPONENT	TIME (ET)
Sun.	2	COWBOYS	4:15 PM

Six night games, six late games which often are designated a "national" game (which covered both WAS games, which even at 1PM I know I'm getting). I could swear I only had to resort to watching no more than 3 or 4 of these in the 700s.

[Warhammer]

That only applies if the team you follow is good. I have the poor fortune of being a Rams fan and only got to watch their last two games this season.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Hrm, Pats in Carolina might be challenging on some weeks, but at least the Pats are on national broadcasts a decent amount because they're good.

Keep in mind that since I'm OTA, I don't get the Thursday night NFLN games, or the Monday night ESPN games. Tough for NFLN and ESPN.

[Lathum]

[quote]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I actually thought about dropping Sunday Ticket last year, and might have if they didn't make HD standard. Why? I can see the Eagles so darned often anyway.

QUOTE]

Similar boat for us. We thought about getting Direct TV just for the ticket, but we get 7-8 Giants games a year, and we are in Seattle. The other 8 games we just go out for and have a fun morning out. Really no need to switch over.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

Its 2011, people want media options, not restrictions. Just look at Itunes, streaming video (like netflix), and Hulu. A few great success stories that can find their roots from illegal sources (Napster and other files sharing networks). If channelsurfing was that big, then maybe the sports leagues will realize that their is money to be made by offering options.

So long as there are people willing to pay big bucks for the other options, they have no reason to change it. It's still their content so they can do what they want. You don't like it- don't watch and hopefully enough other people will do the same so they have to change it.

SI

[Tekneek]

Right now they think there is more money to be made by controlling it with an iron hand.

I've never paid for access to NFL games and never will. I used to pay for NHL Center Ice years ago, but I'm over all of that now. If a sports league wants me to see their games, they will put it on OTA free TV. If they don't want me to see it, then I won't. I see that as their problem, not mine.

[molson]

The feds made their first arrest and filed their first criminal charges against the owner of one of these websites (in this case, channelsurfing). Can the civil suits against the users like we saw in music be far behind?

Feds target popular website they say distributed pirated events, shows - CNN.com

[Sgran]

I paid for the NBA League Pass this year to follow the Bulls and can proudly say I've easily gotten my $150 worth already.
One funny thing that happened a few weeks ago is that they made you watch a commercial for their IPhone ap every commercial break. I nearly broke my monitor I was so mad. I wrote an angry letter saying that if they don't cut that shit out immediately I am not paying for the playoffs. The commercial went away.
I think the biggest problem on the internet is that it's a pain in the ass (and expensive in some cases) to spend a small amount of money. Once these broadcasts cost what they should (a dollar? less?), like what they've done with itunes, I think the bullshit streaming sites will go away.

[kingfc22]

Is channelsurf.eu down now too?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Is channelsurf.eu down now too?

hasn't worked for me in a while. My p2p works still

[Neuqua]

So what do people use now? Was hoping to catch some Wrestlemania.

[Young Drachma]

atdhe works sometimes, depending on the link.

[PilotMan]

Took about 2 min to find it.

[Lathum]

anyone know any sites that stream baseball games?

[Sun Tzu]

mlb.tv!

[M GO BLUE!!!]

I won't use channelsurfing anymore due to the video player they make you download. It won't let you download it without installing their toolbar. I then found that even after removing the player from my system, it was still there. Next, I was getting blue screens of death associated with the video driver. Still couldn't get rid of the video player. Had to wipe the whole hard drive & start over.

[Scoobz0202]

Lathum, check your pm's. (not sure of forum rules)

[Lathum]

Channel surfing doesn't exist anymore and myp2p mostly links you to some bit torrent download that they want to charge you for.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Channel surfing doesn't exist anymore and myp2p mostly links you to some bit torrent download that they want to charge you for.

channelsurfing.ws

I haven't gotten anything like MGB is saying.