new 2k fooball game?

[Bobolini]

Quote: Originally Posted by drae2

What's up Whart!! And you're right, because I'm part(and you) of that argument that believes it is better. Let's face it. Madden is going to sell not because of quality, but because of the name Madden, as proof of that bs they put out this year that made all that loot. Let's remember the only reason TT sold 2K5 for $20 was so people who would normally not purchase 2K would at least take a look at it and even compare it to Madden. I've said it all along that if TT would bring out a game, even if it's not fully customizable, that it would sell because the sim masses are tired of all the empty promises from EA.

Your right, if TT did bring out a game whether it was fully customizable or not, I would buy it with the hope of a different and maybe better experience.

[DIEHARD STEELERS #1]

Quote: Originally Posted by Bobolini

Your right, if TT did bring out a game whether it was fully customizable or not, I would buy it with the hope of a different and maybe better experience.

Hell Im gonna check out blitz on the 360. just to see if the game is playable

[jrivera34]

Didn't the first few madden games not have a license? 2K should use the same approach they did. Use all of the team's cities and colors, and just eliminate the logos. They would have to make the rosters fully customizable to succeed as the majority of sim gamers are roster freaks.. Actually, "fully" is probably the wrong word. I would be happy if I could change the players name, number, height, weight, skin tone, and years in the league. Anything else would be gravy.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by drae2

What's up Whart!! And you're right, because I'm part(and you) of that argument that believes it is better. Let's face it. Madden is going to sell not because of quality, but because of the name Madden, as proof of that bs they put out this year that made all that loot. Let's remember the only reason TT sold 2K5 for $20 was so people who would normally not purchase 2K would at least take a look at it and even compare it to Madden. I've said it all along that if TT would bring out a game, even if it's not fully customizable, that it would sell because the sim masses are tired of all the empty promises from EA.

The only problem is the sim masses dont make up a large number of people. What most people want is an NFL football game. Most consumers will have a choice......1.)buy Madden which already has nfl players, stadiums and logos for 60 bucks or 2.) buy the 2k game (which I think will be cheaper),either add the players, logos and stadiums yourself or buy a memory card (30 bucks) and a Datel device (20 bucks), and then try to find a website that will host a save that has all the NFL features already created.

And before you go thinking that finding a website will be easy, I'm hear to tell you that you are wrong. OS and most major websites wont host the file for a couple of reasons. One, EA will send out a cease and desist letter to any site hosting a NFL game save and Two, Most game sites wont risk being cut off by EA over hosting a game save.

I cant wait for the 2K game but lets not go crazy and think this game will be an automatic success just because the sim community prefers it.

[mercalnd]

Quote: Originally Posted by jrivera34

Didn't the first few madden games not have a license? 2K should use the same approach they did. Use all of the team's cities and colors, and just eliminate the logos.

At that time, even if logos had been licensed, you would not have been able to see them on the uniforms and there were no authentic stadiums in video games either. The lack of logos would stand out much more in this day and age, although I would buy the game either way.

[wwharton]

What's up, Drae? Been a while, right? I'm poking my head around a little more these days.

A lot of you seem to be giving these major companies very little credit. Just think, none of us are big time game programmers. If we are then we either work for VC and won't say a word or we work for someone else and hope every other company including VC fails. None of us run video game companies (see the last example).

Anything that you can come up with that starts something like "Why don't they just..." you should probably assume that they already thought of that and a million other things and decided not to do it. Now we can discuss why they decided not to do it... may be more difficult than people seem to think. May be too risky legally due to the EA exclusivity deals. May not project to make much of a profit.

Speculations can go on to eternity but there's a reason why every example given doesn't make sense. The last thought that Madden sold without an NFL license, when was that again? What other games were in competition with Madden? Which of those games had the NFL license, making a game without it less attractive?

The big one is that if they just do it the game will sell "enough" even if it doesn't compete with Madden. What's enough? There's a reason every game focuses on highlight reel plays, shoe colors, graphics, etc. and it's not to please the sim community. We're a drop in the bucket, and there are even those among us that say they don't care about playing with real teams but are lying to themselves.

This game is not soccer, folks. The average American soccer gamer doesn't know the real names of players, team logos, etc. A generic soccer game can please both fanbases... sim (with tight gameplay and graphics) and casual (don't know much about specific teams and players anyway and just want to play). This isn't true with football. Football casual fans care more about the name and logo on the jersey than the accurate attributes. And to please the sim fans who want to customize the attributes would have to be completely on point for every single player which has never happened. Many are good, some are great but knowing the name and team has made us happy when we thought the overall rating of the player was close to accurate.

Then there's the matter of complete costumization which is also probably much harder than many think. My problem with the Create-A-Play function is that all the code for these games run together and is tested but if you're creating your own plays, the code could be broken. Now we're talking about assigning individual attributes and trying to come up with teams that play close to their real life counterparts. It's more difficult than you may be thinking.

So they do all of that and make it all work perfectly for us small group of caring people and they'd have to charge a good amount to make a profit b/c of the reduction in the target audience meaning even less people will buy the game. To think that all this will happen perfectly for a price of $20 or $30 is more than wishful thinking.

[thejackal25]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

Speculations can go on to eternity but there's a reason why every example given doesn't make sense. The last thought that Madden sold without an NFL license, when was that again? What other games were in competition with Madden? Which of those games had the NFL license, making a game without it less attractive?

Just to answer your question...Madden 64 for Nintendo 64. The game didn't have the NFL license, but it's competition, NFL QB Club on N64 did. These were the first generation of N64 football games, and if I recall correctly, Madden beat QB Club in sales. QB Club had better graphics and audio, but Madden won out because it had better gameplay, if I remember correctly. That year people opted to buy a Madden game w/o an NFL license as opposed to a very good looking NFL licensed game with the NFL's then poster boy, Brett Favre on the cover possibly because reviews and the word on the street was that Madden was better even w/o team names, logos, etc.

[DIEHARD STEELERS #1]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

What's up, Drae? Been a while, right? I'm poking my head around a little more these days. A lot of you seem to be giving these major companies very little credit. Just think, none of us are big time game programmers. If we are then we either work for VC and won't say a word or we work for someone else and hope every other company including VC fails. None of us run video game companies (see the last example). Anything that you can come up with that starts something like "Why don't they just..." you should probably assume that they already thought of that and a million other things and decided not to do it. Now we can discuss why they decided not to do it... may be more difficult than people seem to think. May be too risky legally due to the EA exclusivity deals. May not project to make much of a profit. Speculations can go on to eternity but there's a reason why every example given doesn't make sense. The last thought that Madden sold without an NFL license, when was that again? What other games were in competition with Madden? Which of those games had the NFL license, making a game without it less attractive? The big one is that if they just do it the game will sell "enough" even if it doesn't compete with Madden. What's enough? There's a reason every game focuses on highlight reel plays, shoe colors, graphics, etc. and it's not to please the sim community. We're a drop in the bucket, and there are even those among us that say they don't care about playing with real teams but are lying to themselves. This game is not soccer, folks. The average American soccer gamer doesn't know the real names of players, team logos, etc. A generic soccer game can please both fanbases... sim (with tight gameplay and graphics) and casual (don't know much about specific teams and players anyway and just want to play). This isn't true with football. Football casual fans care more about the name and logo on the jersey than the accurate attributes. And to please the sim fans who want to customize the attributes would have to be completely on point for every single player which has never happened. Many are good, some are great but knowing the name and team has made us happy when we thought the overall rating of the player was close to accurate. Then there's the matter of complete costumization which is also probably much harder than many think. My problem with the Create-A-Play function is that all the code for these games run together and is tested but if you're creating your own plays, the code could be broken. Now we're talking about assigning individual attributes and trying to come up with teams that play close to their real life counterparts. It's more difficult than you may be thinking. So they do all of that and make it all work perfectly for us small group of caring people and they'd have to charge a good amount to make a profit b/c of the reduction in the target audience meaning even less people will buy the game. To think that all this will happen perfectly for a price of $20 or $30 is more than wishful thinking.

man can I ask you one question? why is midway putting out a generic blitz football game then. Think about this what if midway hires 2k programmers and copies 2k football game play? cuzz ya know $ talks