Actually I think I speak for quite a few people when I say that I'm not a fan of that idea. A collaboration between Tiburon and VC would only cause headaches. If you think the QA is bad for games now, just try taking Tiburon's engine to VC for them to modify or taking VC's engine to Tiburon for them to modify w/o years of working with it. Why even talk about a collaboration that has practically zero chance of ever happening? You think that debating the prospect of a new 2k game or talking about the problems w/ a current EA game is a waste, then what is this? Dreaming of a day that this collaboration comes together is far worse than dreaming of 2k football coming back or EA football becoming solid imo.
Actually I would have cared if 2k had received the exclusive rights to football. Personally I'm just strongly against these exclusive licenses because I feel they destroy competition and create inferior products. I'm not a 2k loyalists, and was plenty upset knowing that 2k got semi-exclusive rights to MLB. At the time I felt 2k had a better football game going for it and EA had a better baseball game going for it. Had 2k been given the exclusive rights to football I'd still question if I was getting the same quality of game that would have been made had competition still been around.
Look, there are 2k fanboys and EA fanboys, but I know there are also a lot of us here that are simply die hard sports game fans and being lumped into either of the aforementioned groups isn't right. We want the best gaming experience possible, and we all know competition is the key to that, and we're the ones that would care regardless of who had the exclusive deal b/c we realize all the negatives that exclusivity brings.
Here I will agree with you. Madden doesn't represent football as well as we'd like. And yes, I agree that Madden Nation is garbage and I hate seeing how some people play the game.
I will agree with you to a point. I believe a game can only be sim if you play it sim. Every game can be cheesed on, and it's up to the player to keep that from happening. However, some games make it easier to cheese than others and certain communities have strived to be more sim than others, and I have felt that there are more 2k gamers striving to play a sim game than there are Madden gamers.
Having Performance EQ on has helped a lot of the poor DB AI, and using custom sliders can help a lot. With default sliders, yes, I've played games and had 5+ picks, but with custom sliders I've never had such a problem. 2k5 did have a lot of problems, but I think the consensus is that they were on the right track to creating an even greater football sim than ever before, which sadly cannot be said for EA's current mess.
The last football game I bought was NFL 2k5. It's been my football game of choice for the past 3 years. And I'm pretty sure a lot of people on this board have done the same, so don't point the finger at everyone.
Almost every game has bugs, not just sports games. Imo there is no way the game developers produce games with bugs and glitches intentionally. Mistakes happen and things slip past QA. The products that developers put on the shelves are generally pretty polished considering the 1 year dev cycle that sports games go through. Imo NBA 2k7, though it has its problems, is a pretty polished product. As much as I'd like to play a flawless sports game, I realize that having an unfinished product that does not match the developers' vision is largely due to the time constraints inherent in the genre. Until sports games are given the development cycle that mirrors those of nonsports titles we will see flaws and glitches, and hopefully they won't be gamekillers all the time.
I wouldn't even accuse EA of such unscrupulous tactics. I doubt developers intentionally make flawed features. If you've ever worked in the industry or tried to get into the industry you'd find that it's not easy to create a quality product with the tight time restraints, especially those found in the sports game business.
Why does a game not featuring NFL teams or logos automatically make a game not worth purchasing? Some people are actually fans of football and can think of football outside of the context of just the NFL. People that love the game simply love the game and all the intricacies of the game. For me, it's more important that WRs and DBs interact w/ each other while routes are being ran more than what name is on the back of their jerseys. For me, it's more important that a QB is encouraged to step up or slide around in the pocket in order to avoid the rush than simply keep backpedalling and make an off balanced throw. For a lot of us, we loved 2k football not b/c of how it had NFL players, but b/c it mimicked a lot of the little things in football very well. And if 2k keeps up the same standard of commentary, presentation, crowd responses, etc. then we can still have the atmosphere that made past 2k football games so immersive.
And when people say they will be happy w/ an editor, I believe they will be happy w/ an editor. Do you believe there are tons of Winning Eleven fans who say they are happy w/ the game but secretly aren't? An editor will make a lot of people happy, and can keep a lot of players satisfied if you look at the WE series, its success, and the community of its players.
I've never seen a QB in my fanchise w/ close to 50 interceptions in a season. I have CPU kicking boosted all the way up and they do fine making FGs, and I have mine at Legend level and it seems to work fine. The homemade faces didn't turn out all that great, but at least 2k tried to do something more than just leave the "no photo available" pic on all rookies. The game turned out pretty solid considering its short dev time. It would have benefited from more testing time, but I understand how they tried to beat Madden to the shelves. I don't expect a 2k football game to be flawless, but I believe that if 2k makes a new football game we will get the most sim football experience to date.
Yes, glitches and bugs happen. Until the dev cycle for sports games is extended we will continue to see problems. However, some games have done a good job of ensuring that gamekilling bugs don't exist. For instance, IMO NBA 2k7's problems are not gamekillers and a lot of gameplay deficits can be corrected w/ sliders, and I'd like to believe that's where the next generation of 2k football would be.
Most of us have not bought Madden for a couple years. And I know I won't buy a new 2k football game until after the reviews are in. You're preaching to the choir here. This stuff may be enlightening over on the EA forums or something, but this isn't news to most of us. I think it's good that you're not buying into Madden hype year in and year out, but don't judge a 2k game before it's even out and don't hold out for a completely perfect football game, or you might find yourself waiting forever.
btw, the rant about the Saints in response to jmood was off topic and pointless.
01-16-2007, 06:57 PM
